Manipulation Tactics, start paying attention to behavior instead of "intentions"

Started by all4peace, August 04, 2017, 08:36:30 AM

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all4peace

In a thread about denial and lies, tommom posted a link to George Simon's writings. I spent much of one lazy day reading through a mountain of his articles. He's prolific and an incredibly concise writer.

He has a series on manipulation tactics. It was enlightening for me. I have seen manipulation as someone weasly working to get their own way. What I have not seen is that lying, excuse making, feigning innocence, claiming ignorance, etc. are all manipulation tactics.

George Simon advocates for looking at behavior instead of purported intentions. As DH and I navigate new relationships with both our families, the amount of JADEing coming from both sides is incredible. It can be so hard to wade through it. What we would refer to as being "non," Simon tends to refer to as "neurotic," and he says that "character disturbed" know exactly how to play on our weak spots--our wish to see the best in people, to believe them, to not falsely accuse...

If you read this article, then look to the sidebar on the right for further articles about manipulation, it becomes quickly very clear that when someone consistently and persistently meets us with blame shifting, excuse making, justification, argument, pretended innocence and more, we are being manipulated.

Two examples from my recent past:

Me: Set boundary with N parent: Please talk to us before making plans with my kids.
uNM: Repeatedly makes plans with my kids without speaking to me.
Me: The 2nd time (first time I had just gotten out of the hospital the day before and was in no shape to start a war with NM), I addressed it calmly and clearly.
uNM: Within seconds of me sending her the message (paraphrased) "My kid can't do xyz plans with you. I asked you to speak to me first. When you don't, you send a certain negative message to my kids. Etc", she is phone blasting me, including later in the day likely blocking her number to try to get through. Sends an email, FULL of reasons and excuses. No acknowledgement, no admitting what it might feel like from my side, no apology. Just lots and lots of explanation. This is a woman who doesn't call on birthdays, DH's hospitalizations, at this point literally ever to just see how we are. She called maybe 3 times all last year. But, hey, confront her at all and she's literally calling within 10 seconds.
Me: Calmly respond, acknowledge her written message (since I didn't answer my phone), absolutely zero engagement with her excuses.

What I realized really clearly is that her blast of "reasons" at me is to get me to go along with her version of herself. And she wanted to do it by phone. So much easier to escalate it all and bulldoze someone by phone. There is absolutely nothing about what I asked of her, what she did, how it affects my relationship with my child. Just her, her, her and more her. And somehow I'm supposed to be taken in by this.


Second scenario. Dh had 2 surgeries this year. PD parents almost completely absent despite living next door. Short visit to him 1 or more weeks later. Zero help.

uN?/enFIL: Upset and frustrated that we're not responding to their frequent requests to spend time with them. Claiming a huge wish to help us.
DH: "But you didn't."
FIL: "But we wanted to SO MUCH!"
DH: You didn't offer, you didn't ask, you didn't do a single thing.
FIL: More blah, blah, blah. Basically a very long paragraph of helplessness, good intentions, wishes for reassurance that I still saw him as a good guy, lots and lots and lots of good intentions, no explanation for inability to act on any of those intentions, blah, blah.
DH: Shrug. More shrugs. Finally ends conversation.

Again, total manipulation. None of this was about how DH was doing, how our family had coped, if there was anything FIL could do to improve the relationship. It was literally ALL about FIL trying to convince DH (and me, by proxy) that he is a good guy despite all his actions. He INTENDED so many lovely things, so why couldn't we focus on that instead of what he actually did?

If it weren't so sad it would be laughable.

Anyway, maybe some of you will find his articles helpful in sorting through the FOG. Really, over time, a person's actual behavior is what we are supposed to focus on, not their words and excuses, justifications, rationale. I found it incredibly helpful when uNM recently tried to absolutely blast me with some fresh FOG. Plus, when we come to see manipulation tactics for what they are, it helps us see the true character of the person and stop feeling so worried that we're being unfair or not giving them enough chances.

Manipulation tactics: https://www.drgeorgesimon.com/manipulation-tactics-a-deeper-look/

A list of some of the tactics:

· Diversion
A moving target it harder to hit. When we try to pin manipulators down or try to keep a discussion focused on a single issue or behavior we don't like, they're expert at knowing how to change the subject, dodge the issue or in some way throw us a curve.

· Evasion
Closely related to diversion, this is a tactic by which a manipulator tries to avoid being cornered on an issue by giving rambling, irrelevant responses to a direct question or otherwise trying to skirt an issue. A subtle but effective form of evasion is the deliberate use of vagueness.

· Covert Initmidation
Aggressors frequently threaten their victims to keep them anxious, apprehensive and in a one-down position. They are adept at countering arguments with such passion and intensity that they effectively throw their opponents on the defensive. Covert-aggressive personalities primarily intimidate their victims by making veiled (subtle, indirect or implied) threats. This way, they throw others on the defensive without appearing overtly hostile or initimidating.

· Guilt-tripping
One thing that aggressive personalities know well is that other types of persons, especially neurotics, have very different consciences than they do. They also know that the hallmark qualities of a shound conscience are the capacities for guilt and shame. Manipulators are skilled at using what they know to be the greater conscientiousness of their victims as a means of keeping them in a self-doubting, anxious and submissive position. The more conscientious the potential victim, the more effective guilt is as a weapon.

· Shaming
This is a technique of using subtle sarcasm and put-downs as a means of increasing fear and self-doubt in others. Covert-aggressives use this tactic to make others feel inadequate or unworthy, and therefore, defer to them. It is an effective way to foster a continued sense of personal inadequacy in the weaker party, thereby allowing an aggressor to maintain a position of dominance.

· Playing the Victim Role
This tactic involves portraying oneself as a victim of circumstance or someone else's behavior in order to gain sympathy, evoke compassion and thereby get something from another. Convince your victim that you're suffering in some way, and they'll try to relieve your distress. One vulnerability of the conscientious, sensitive and caring soul, is that it's easy to pay on his or her sympathy.

· Vilifying the Victim
This tactic is frequently used in conjunction with the tactic of playing the victim role. The aggressor uses this tactic to make it appear he is only responding (i.e. defending himself against) aggression on the part of the victim. It enables the aggressor to better put the victim on the defensive.

· Playing the Servant Role
Covert-aggressives use this tactic to cloak their self-serving agendas in the guise of service to a more noble cause. It's a common tactic but difficult to recognize. By pretending to be working hard on someone else's behalf, covert-aggressives conceal their own ambition, desire for power, and quest for a position of dominance over others.

· Seduction
Covert-aggressive personalities are adept at charming, praising, flattering or overtly supporting others in order to get them to lower their defenses and surrender their trust and loyalty... Appearing to be attentive to needs of approval, reassurance and a sense of being valued can be a manipulator's ticket to incredible power over others.

· Projecting Blame
Aggressive personalities are always looking for a way to shift the blame for their aggressive behavior. Covert-aggressives are not only skilled at finding scapegoats, they're expert at doing so in subtle, hard to detect ways.

· Feigning Innocence
This is when the manipulator tries to convince you that any harm they did was unintentional, or that they really didn't do something that they've been accused of doing.

· Feigning Confusion
Closely related to feigning innocence, this tactic is when the manipulator acts like he doesn't know what you're talking about or is confused about an important issue you're trying to bring to his attention.

· Brandishing Anger
A deliberate display of anger can be a very calculated and effective tool of intimidation, coercion and ultimately, manipulation. Moreover, when it comes to understanding aggressive personalities, it's a mistake to think that anger necessarily precedes aggression... Aggressive personalities use overt displays of anger to intimidate and manipulate others. They're not angry to start. They just want what they want, and they get angry when denied. Then, they'll use whatever tactics will remove the obstacles in their way. Sometimes, the most effective tactic is brandishing sufficient emotional intensity and rage to shock another person into submission.

Excerpts from "In Sheeps Clothing: Understanding and Dealing with Manipulative People" by George K. Simon, Jr, PhD. Little Rock, AR: AI Christopher & Company. Original printing, November 1996; Ninth printing, September 2007.

commongoal123

Wonderful post and excellent reminders, all4peace.  Thank you.  Objectivity is very powerful.

I wonder though... what are your thoughts on when the behaviors themselves contradict?  Like, when seeing things on this list, but then also behaviors that would contradict these things such as the PD taking responsibility by going to therapy or talking in therapy about things on your list?

Peace,
CommonGoal

Doe-Eyes

oh thank you for bringing George Simon to my attention, diving into this right now and already hooked... he has a youtube channel too.

Associate of Daniel

This is great, A4P. Thank-you for sharing it.

My pds tend to also just state, "You will do x." with no explanation as to why they expect me to do x.

I wonder what that's called?

AOD

LeeJane

Very helpful list, thank you AllForPeace for posting it.

I am now detached enough to spot which technique my uPDhub is using at the time of trying to get something from me.

I side stepped a manipulation attempt yesterday for me to arrange several healthcare appointments that are his responsibility to organise. Plus the accompanying costs for items which were a whim not a health necessity.

tryingforever

wow, Dr.Simon's work is an eye opener for me! thanks for sharing this all4peace.

I have been doing allot of inner work regarding denial, lies and authority.
And in all these threads (the 2  of yours and the one I started) people are sharing so much insights and different perspectives. It is helping me to look into the problem from different angles.

You chosen title tells it all. This is what I have been doing, a part of me has been so concerned with their intentions, trying not to be unfair, always being generous on my assumptions, not to be perceived as a troublemaker, always self-doubting, scared, ashamed.... I have been primed to all this stuff by psychosomatic uNM.

She didn't read this list, but sure she knows all of them! One tactic that I have noticed, and I think may not be in the list is the recruiting of other's opinions to shame and prove their innocence. My uNM would use this allot "x z and Y (anyone would do the pharmacist, the postman...) said they could see you are a selfish person" or "if our family knew how you treat me,wait until they all know". And recently after complaining about a member of staff I got a reply from the company saying that the person is loved by ALL clients and could not have done what I reported"!

  I do wonder how somebody who had a relative healthy upbringing deals with manipulation and lies. Their tactics leave me in speechless astonishment!

commongoal, I can relate. My partner also has many of these manipulative behaviors.
In one hand he struggles to admit and work on them but then on the other hand he works with his T ( he doesn't tell his T everything though) and goes to a peer support group, where he is very vocal about his traits. If I were to answer while in a flashback I would say, "it's all part of the manipulation!" but if I am not in one I would say "they are in an internal battle, between the fleas and the wise adult part". It is so hard if we have been deeply injured by a parent to be able to discern of all this.

DancingRain

George Simon is excellent.  I need to spend some time reading him again, because it is very eye opening.  My npdh uses every single one of these manipulation tactics. 

The behavior vs intentions has been a big argument lately.  "But, I didn't MEAN too.  So, you shouldn't be hurt by it."  Ridiculous. 

Love this:
"Really, over time, a person's actual behavior is what we are supposed to focus on, not their words and excuses, justifications, rationale. Plus, when we come to see manipulation tactics for what they are, it helps us see the true character of the person and stop feeling so worried that we're being unfair or not giving them enough chances." 

bloomie

all4peace - just seeing this excellent thread. Great list of manipulative tactics and have also found George Simon's work to be a great help in my own healing journey and awakening to these behaviors and all this entails. Thank you.

I have learned the very hard way that paying attention to what someone actually does, consistently, over time is the only way to discern their heart toward me.

I have also learned that when a PDs words and behaviors are incongruent they are most likely trying to manipulate me for their own gain.

Two of the most problematic uPDs in my life, when confronted with behaviors that would by anyone's standards be unacceptable, will almost immediately try and go into a circular discussion about their intentions and what they really meant and what they did or did not realize. :sadno: It is a desperate and often fairly effective way to divert and control what they will/will not talk about and be responsible for. A form of diversion and denial tactics. A ploy to overrun and usurp our human rights in the relationship and keep the balance of power in their favor.

I was thinking about your in laws going ghost during the tough winter months as your DH had surgeries and I see that has a form of silent treatment, invalidation, and withholding - which are all manipulative tactics. Would you agree? And then when directly confronted by the vast chasm between what your fil said "he wanted to help" and what he did... stood by and watched your entire family struggle - withholding the one thing he had that he knew you all needed, his helping hand, he seemed most intent on reconstructing and insisting that his good guy image be accepted and agreed to by you all simply because he said so. Fil seems to want the easy way to maintain his image in the eyes of your family. Through manipulation rather than having to be accountable to behave in consistently kind and respectful ways and take full responsibility for himself.

He seems to be presenting himself as altruistic, unselfish, good, kind, fair, willing.  And he may even believe this about himself to some degree, though down deep he knows he behaved badly otherwise why the elaborate excuses? He refuses to be accountable for himself and simply apologize and make appropriate amends, but kicks up enough dust to try and disguise this truth. I imagine for most of his life this has worked for him fairly effortlessly and gotten him exactly what he wanted from others because who would be so mean spirited as to doubt such a good guy? Kwim?

Your mother's blizzard of words when otherwise an ignoring type are a similar type of attempting to control the narrative and shut down your voice when you speak up and directly address her boundary busting behaviors. Refusing to address the harmful and disrespectful behaviors to us is a degree of arrogance that seems to indicate a breathtaking belief in the power of their own words over us to create, decree, declare whatever they would like truth to be. Blows my mind.  :stars:

I found this excerpt from Harriet Braiker's book Whose Pulling Your Strings very enlightening -
QuoteIf you attempt to exercise power and control - even if it is just over your own decision and behavior - the manipulator will feel threatened because she needs all the power that is around to get. If you exercise power in your own life, then from the manipulator's standpoint, you are taking power away from her. She therefore will feel compelled to take immediate retaliatory steps to regain control. Manipulators want and need to feel in control. Feeling like they are out of control or that they might be losing control in any realm evokes very high level of anxiety.
pages 56-57

Braiker also describes that from a manipulator's point of view "power is finite" there is only so much to go around and the concept of sharing or acknowledging and respecting our right to be empowered, to have control over our own lives, represents a loss of power to the manipulator.

It has been very validating to me to realize that the feelings that have had that I was in an undeclared power struggle with certain family members... sometimes it has felt like a silent, stealth, corrosive power war going on that simply defied logic to me, were not my imagination and it was a struggle to overtake my autonomy and independence, my human rights by someone who was a world class, highly skilled manipulator.





The most powerful people are peaceful people.

The truth will set you free if you believe it.

NotFooledAnymore

Wow! I needed to read this! For years, I've beaten myself up over this sort of thing. I've often thought, "am I over analyzing what they did?" "Am I too sensitive?" It sometimes "seems" like the intentions were good but then their behavior contradicts it. It now is so much clearer and helps me not feel so crazy. :) :)

Also, for every tactic All4Peace listed, I could find specific examples in my memory of when the PD's in my life behaved in these exact manners. My NMIL has done every single one of those tactics multiple times. It's astonishing.

all4peace

Quote from: commongoal123 on August 04, 2017, 06:43:43 PM
Wonderful post and excellent reminders, all4peace.  Thank you.  Objectivity is very powerful.

I wonder though... what are your thoughts on when the behaviors themselves contradict?  Like, when seeing things on this list, but then also behaviors that would contradict these things such as the PD taking responsibility by going to therapy or talking in therapy about things on your list?

Peace,
CommonGoal
Peace, I'm not an expert, but I have noticed that PDs aren't all bad, nor all good. I think it would be normal for each one to have times when they're truly trying, and other times when they're manipulating or having other bad behavior.

doeeyesThanks for the heads up on the YouTube channel!

AoD, bullying? Why mess around with a bunch of manipulation tactics that take effort and time when you can simply command someone to do your will?

LeeJane, well done! I read this the day before needing to deal with my uNM and was very, very prepared for the FOG she blasted my way. It feels great to feel less helpless, powerless and confused!

tryingforever, it has been great to have so many diverse conversations about deception and manipulation on the forum lately! My uNM has a similar tactic, which is "she read it somewhere." She presents a LOT of "facts" to us on a constant basis, based on what she has read. I think most of it is totally made up, but good luck trying to pin that down.

dancingrain, how frustrating to have that kind of "excuse" rather than a true apology!

bloomie, I love your thread about the Con/Mark also, and how much this topic is on so many of our minds lately! Lots of FOG being cleared away.
I believe my enN?fil is cycling through a vast list of manipulation techniques. What has made me sad is that people choose these rather than a simple acknowledgement, apology and commitment to doing better in the future. I believe THE point is reflecting back to him the image of himself that he needs to see, rather than trying to hold him accountable (in conversation/confrontation) for his behavior, or simply responding to his behavior with our own behavior (distance in the relationship).

I forget how George Simon explains it, exactly, but he does say that the pile of explanations are a dead giveaway that they are trying to not be held to societal standards of behavior and convince the "victim" of their rightness, despite all evidence to the contrary. If you think about it, when you haven't behaved badly, you don't need to make up a pile of excuses. You can simply say "I can't see what you mean, but I'd like to understand better/rethink this/be more careful in the future. And I'm sorry for hurting/offending/harming/confusing you." If someone has actually not behaved badly, there is actually no need for excuses/justification/over-explanation. But if that seems to be the only pattern they come up with, time after time after time, clearly their goal isn't reaching the truth or understanding. Their goal is obfuscation.

notfooledanymore, I'm so glad it was helpful to you also! It was the perfect reading for me also, as I spent SO much time and energy 100th (versus second)-guessing myself over the years! What a relief to see the truth in this article.

DJR

All4peace, thank you for this post. Its so obvious, why didn't I realise ACTIONS and not INTENTIONS are important!!! Goodness it is like a flash of understanding hit me reading that! We apply this reasoning in our normal lives, but somehow don't apply it to the PDs in our lives. I guess they have convinced us that normal social rules don't apply to them, and that (despite repeated evidence) their (pretended) intentions are more important than their actions.

The list of behaviours was also eye-opening. I've seen my NSIL manipulate others by seducing, guilt tripping, feigning innocence, brandishing anger, play the victim, projecting blame and back to seducing, in a cycle. 

Summer Sun

I've read this book before and made notes previously on these manipulation tactics, good to review again, refresh memory.

My T once said something similar to your point all4peace.  She said that I need to ask myself whether there is "congruency" between my FOO's words and actions.  For example, if a sib says they love you and then proceeds to belittle you, or, treat you with indifference, this is incongruent.  (In my case, words of love or positivity equates to can be useful at the moment). 

A different example would be myself wanting to do something kind for someone on their birthday, to let them know they are important, remembered, care for, loved.  My actions and my words are expressing congruency. 

Another thought along these lines I picked up somewhere about what people "say."  You may not remember what someone "said" to you, but you will always remember how this person made you "feel." 

SS
"The opposite of Love is not Hate, it's Indifference" - Elie Wiesel

DancingRain

"Another thought along these lines I picked up somewhere about what people "say."  You may not remember what someone "said" to you, but you will always remember how this person made you "feel." 

Absolutely!!

all4peace

DJR, this was a real epiphany for me also! It's so easy to believe people's stated intentions instead of their behavior!

summer sun, your post reminds me of when I first learned the term "cognitive dissonance," and so much of my confusion and pain made sense. I was being asked to believe words when the actions didn't match and it was so incredibly confusing and upsetting for me at the time. Now I'm learning to just believe the actions.

dancing rain, I love that quote!

all4peace

There are so many threads on the PD Parents part of the forum right now about "having talks" with parents who use a lot of manipulation techniques. I'm bumping this up for the helpful list of manipulation techniques in the first post.

heartinhand

Thanks so much for this thread and the reference to George Simon.  In reading the list you provided, it is amazing how it rings true with so much of my experience with BF.  I thought I was going nuts and was totally alone, but being back on this forum and reading and sharing has helped me tremendously.   Thanks to all of you for the info.

all4peace

I saw someone post a link about DARVO recently, and have been experiencing one PD parent physically play the waify victim after me requesting something very politely. I found this again for a new member, and to refresh myself. It has been so helpful for me to be able to pick out manipulation techniques and see them for what they are, rather than be sucked in by them. It is SO empowering!

Grahamcracker

In my early years on this site, I seem to have been in a sort of denial -- I knew my uBPDw had issues and was probably borderline, but I thought I was handling it and could somehow get out of it if I really wanted to; I was simply looking for support and to know I was not alone.  One thing I know now that I was guilty of -- presuming that those who were really entangled and suffering while trying to leave a bad relationship, presuming those folks who were suffering were simply not strong enough.

Now that I am both more aware of myself and actually in the process of untangling, I realize what tangled webs these BPs can weave.  Now that I am in it, it's so hard to distinguish truth from FOG, and hard to climb above it.  When my relationship to BPD moved from my (false) castle of serenity to real conflict, I finally understood what was, in another context, called "the fog of war."   I'm rarely sure what's going on anymore (I don't think I ever really did), I can't tell her genuine suffering from manipulation, and I know now how well she can push my buttons.

So thanks for this post. 

This is all so damned hard.  To those who I once wrongly judged as weak, I send my apologies, and my prayers that you find your way out. 

Any prayers for me would be greatly appreciated.

GC
"Wisdom's a gift, but you'd trade it for youth, Age is an honor but still not the truth"  Vampire Weekend.