Here we go again...

[bee well]

Hi All,

Here we go again.

I'm not sure where to start. The "long version of the short version" is  too long, unfortunately.

Some days ago I was in the phase of preparation for lates uPD MIL visit with self-care also planned around it, and feeling relatively grounded, and okay with it all.

Surrounding issues, in any case, have been contributing to the stress:

MIL is now in feud with relative on the FIL side of the family because of a snub/ non-invitation to a celebration after she had estended a similar one. MIL won't accept that she and this person don't get along and just leave well enough alone and I don't think the other person does either. The family stuff goes way back but thinking about it now  it  smells like a narcissistic tit-for-tat p@ssing contest to us . MIL is on a tear about this wound of hers, and looking for allies. Too much drama to describe. DH and I are not playing.

I have been dealing with health issues . (I went NC  with FOO partially due to this, couldn't take it anymore.)  After a long long time I have finally got to the bottom of what's going on with my health (yay –finally found a  good enough trauma informed MD, silver lining!) I am trying to process the physical effects of this and deal with emotions surrounding it, and its effect on life at home with DH, and elsewhere.

In the midst of all this there is a sudden death in the community of a person close my age. uPD MIL decides to play "tag you are it" in a phone call with me. Tells me so and so died and they were little more than my age and that I need to get checked (if she only  knew how much I do "get checked" her mouth would drop.) Then  she says to me "Be careful, eh!"

She then goes on a tangent about how  "the vaccine" probably caused this person's death and starts setting up her justification to not get the next dose (according to her the vaccine is cause of her gastritis, pain, itching,  peristent coughing and all the rest, never mind the fact she won't take care of herself or consistently follow her doctor's advice) "Tagging" me, a nice way to distract from her BS.

During the call I pass the phone to DH and he makes the mistake of continuing the discussion about how we enjoyed a certain activity, and she responds, "Be careful when you are out and about,  evil is a trickster!" What the actual F is this????  How pathetic and cruel that is that she can't respond positively when someone--her Son, I'm p@ssed off but nevermind me-- enjoys themself! (Not to mention that her "wise old sayings" are absurd.)

Sometimes it seems like she cannot stand the fact that we don't have constant drama in our life. It's like she is waiting for something bad to happen (We don't share our problems/life's tribulations. No fodder for gossip.)

So I ruminate on all of this for two days in the middle of doing work in house to prepare, and trying to deal with my stuff.  At the end of the second day the tension from it all results in a huge argument between DH and I,  which at the end, for the sake of our marriage, is repaired.

I note here that DH, in spite of going in and Out of the FOG, has acknowledged, sorrowfully, and more than once, that his M's behaviour is causing problems for us.

We are keeping our united front but my pain and the realization of the new diagnosis  is swirling around all of of this and making it all worse. I haven't felt this badly since NC with FOO.

DH tells me "sooner or later you ar going to have to tell MIL about this, it can't go on like this, you are in pain." In his head he knows why I will not tell her BUT he doesn't completely get why that there is no way in H@ll am I going to let her into my personal business and give her uN supply. (He tells her what he thinks she needs to hear from time to time.) I told him I will have to be on a walking stick before I tell her.

In spite of  saying well-meaning things I don't want need to hear now, like "calm down and "be stronger,"DH has been very helpful, reminding me not to overdo it and to respect my limits with respect to healt , that he accepts my decision and  will support me no matter whai I decide with his M. He is also frustrated and admittedly anesthesized to her emozional abuse, but he is making a sincere effort to walk the line between his family situation and ours. I feel sorry for him, but at the end of the day, uPD MIL is at least 51 percent his problem.

I could just up and close the door on MIL. Unfortunately, I am not strong enough at this time, emotionally or otherwise, to do another NC. There are many factors which I cannot explain here.

So I  am doing the best I can to keep my boundaries in place now. I did not take her call yesterday and have the phone silenced now.

(The cherry on the cake is MIL's bestie cannot come because of an emergency in her family--poor lady, that's another story. Now ILs will be alone in the  place DH booked for them all, MIL is still pissed off for a while about not staying with us "after all she has done for us." AND  will be feeding off bestie's crisis (MIL still hasn't had the chance to unload that trigger.)

I'm not looking for a solution here. I am writing it here because I know many of you have been in similar shoes, and I need to get it out.

(Part of me feels like an idiot for being in this situation, still taking about it after the last time I saw MIL—and she treated everyone like dirt---even if I know I  have no responsibility for that, aside from my choices. More work to be done on that.)

I want to cancel again but this time that is not going to happen this time.

I know good therapy is the healthier way to work towards a better solution, but it is not going to happen today. Hopefuly in the long-term it will be possible.

I don't know what's going to happen, or how and when it wil happen but something will change.

I cannot wait til this is over and I can rest and get back to taking care of myself (That is still planned;  it almost feels like a carrot on a stick.)

[bloomie]

bee well - I am so sorry you are dealing with health issues, physical pain, and the angst of having a drama bound mil heading your way for a visit. Yikes! that is a lot! I am glad you shared here.

Something I noticed in your post that I wanted to celebrate with you...

Sometimes it seems like she cannot stand the fact that we don't have constant drama in our life. It's like she is waiting for something bad to happen (We don't share our problems/life's tribulations. No fodder for gossip.)

This ⬆️ is a pretty good indication you and your DH are doing the wise work of gray rocking the heck out of your mil! Her frustration with the lack of drama and 'news' as my own mil calls it, may be a kind of push back and you are holding strong against it. BRAVO!!!

You are building a life you enjoy and skills to handle nonsense from your mil. You are paying attention to how this is impacting  your body and health and have strong, protective fences around your personal, medical information. That, bee well, is really good work and important ground reclaimed!! So glad you shared!

eta:
I wanted to add that with DH and myself and a mil with HPD/NPD traits who is mostly interested in attention or some 'news' about someone else's heartache or illness to draw attention to herself. We put her on an information diet and refused to enter into any of the messy, ridiculous situations she either creates or inserts herself in, and after complaining, pushing back, digging for nuggets to pass along, crying, demanding: "I have a right to know what is going on in MY family." she has pretty much lost a great deal of interest in us except for what we can do for her. It took awhile, but we are finally too boring and happy for her. Keep on keeping on! You are getting there!

[Cat of the Canals]

In the midst of all this there is a sudden death in the community of a person close my age. uPD MIL decides to play "tag you are it" in a phone call with me. Tells me so and so died and they were little more than my age and that I need to get checked (if she only  knew how much I do "get checked" her mouth would drop.) Then  she says to me "Be careful, eh!"

Truly, our MIL's must be related somehow. Mine was practically PRAYING that I had cancer a few years back, because that would make such a juicy piece of gossip. (Not to mention she could tell strangers how hard it is for her, because we're so close. HA.)

And that bit about "be careful when you're out and about." My late BIL used to describe his upbringing as, "Joy was forbidden."

I think you are absolutely right to keep her on a strict info diet relating to your health, despite your husband's protests. Does he think she's going to suddenly become self aware and capable of empathy??? I think we both know how likely that is. If anything, scenarios like this made my MIL more intrusive. She would demand to "help" in the least helpful ways possible, which was really just her putting herself in position to get more details for her gossipping.

I hope you have the means to take breaks during the visit, even if that means a prolonged bathroom break in which you read a book for a while or something.  Or perhaps, "Oh goodness, I just realized we're entirely out of milk! I'm going to run to the store real quick." (And by real quick, I mean stop and get yourself a coffee on the way...)

[bee well]

Hi All,

Bloomie, Thank you. That's a good way of looking at it. Thanks for the encouragement, and for sharing. The goal of being too boring and happy is one I like a lot. We will keep on keeping on for sure.

Cat of the Canals, Yes, they are strangely similar, I remember that from MIL bingo. And I also remember now you saying about how she behaved through that health scare. That's so beyond messed up. And yes, "Joy is forbidden."

I'm sorry for heartache both of you have gone through due to all described here. Thanks again to both of you for sharing and for the precious time spent here.

You've reminded me what we are all doing here isn't for nil. We are all in it together.

I will remember to breathe and walk away when necessary. Not going to write much more for now. This situation could benifit from some containment.

[bee well]

Hi All,

The Ils came and went and it wasn't good.

Here's what happened:

On arriving we were showing work that had been done on the house and MIL stops midway to tell DH he has ugly eyes and teeth. This is something she says with regularity.

Later we took them to lunch with a colleague of DH's and she went into her "death report" and "wise old sayiings." Attempt to diffuse MIL bringing another person in. Gone wrong. Last time DH brought ex boss, DH was humiliated, in spite of the fact that his ex-boss defended him. It happened again this time with the colleague.

After lunch we were walking to the car, and she put her hands in my hair and told me she was just trying to fix it because my hair is badly done, as some people's is. (?)

I jumped back back and told her never to touch me again. DH's  colleague turned around and said "what did I miss?" She glared at me for about an hour or so and then went back "to normal." I continued like nothing had happened as I was afraid and didn't know what to do. ( Trying to preserve dignity with colleague and/or Freeze response?)

That night she told us about her core wounds, family tragedy. DH and I listened and tried to intellectualize it all (another trauma response on our part, fawning maybe?)

The next day we took her to a tourist attraction she wanted to see. As we were leaving, she touched me again to rub out a "a spot" on my shirt. I looked down when she was doing this and saw nothing. I let it pass, even after what had happened the day before.

Later on that day, at home, after I had served lunch and had been listening to her for hours, going on about with gossip and bad mouthing family and "friends", she gets up and pulls DH's pant's up as he was standing in front of her  (yep, and he is a grown man) and proceeds to tell him how he doesn't know how to dress, etc,. etc.

That's when I lost my composure. I let it loose, told that she was a bully and how no one ever tells her about herself. That it's pathetic the way she treats people. That no one ever tells her the things she says to other people. That no one ever protests, It's all about her, and she just gets away with it. That she does that with her husband and sons, but  she won't do it with me,

MIL said he has washed her hands of me and I told her I don't care. At one point she said excuse me. I think maybe for a minute she realized she had gone too far, but then she went back into victim mode.  I'm not accepting it.

Dh called his B in the middle of all of this, passes me the phone, and I poured it all out. Mistake on my part because BIL is not safe and has his own issues with MIL. There was some vailidation there but the essence of the discussion was "she's like that and won't change, get used to it., I will take care of her..." Oh and the kicker is this, BIL has brought a new woman home and MIL is on about that. I'm worried. I feel for this woman, MIL is already bullying her, and I don't want to be in that triangle.

After that I went for a walk and when I came back MIL was in the car.

FIL begged me to go and talk to MIL before they left. He basically asked me to suck it up, again, because he has been doing this  for all his years with her.  His words. I went down there , told her I respected her but I stand my ground. She can't touch me when I tell her not to.  She wouldn't turn around to look at me and just sat there crying.

DH went back home with them as he usually does when they come here, Later on he wrote me to tell me he is proud of me, as no one has ever told her what I did. AND now she is acting like nothing happened. OK....

DH will likely be there for for a few days, as he planned vacation days around this and wants to spend time with his father and brother. I want him to come back to our home but I think he needs to work this out on his own, I am not pushing.

So, here I am, I think it's going to be no contact with MIL this time and I am wondering what this will do to my marriage.

And I need to take care of me and my health.

What to do except stay away  and get therapy I don't know. I'm really worried about that as well because I am already in NC with my FOO, and we live in a community where "family is first." I am afraid to tell someone on the outside because what I want to say will quite possibly not be well received. It's the "drip drip drip" that is hard to describe.

I'm trying to wrap my brain around the fact that this is "not my circus not my monkeys."

I don't know what else to say here but to ask in closing, have any of you ever had problems with this type of touching? Out of all the things that happen/have happened with MIL, I'm really shook by this. I've told all of them, MIL can say what she wants but I will not stand for her touching me. This is not the first time she has done this, it's an ongoing thing,

[Call Me Cordelia]

Oh my. I'm so sorry it went down like that, but GOOD FOR YOU. It is so hard to deal with this stuff with confidence in the moment. And maybe you were having trauma responses but I say so what. Even "normal" people have a hard time knowing what to do with PD people because what they do just makes no damn sense.

"Look at our lovely home!" "Your teeth are ugly." Um, what?  Exactly.

You were trying to be normal. Sounds like your DH is still trying to be normal, kind of. But there is no normal there.

Taking care of you, your health, staying away and getting therapy sounds like a fabulous plan.

[Call Me Cordelia]

Coming back to add that you don't need to announce any kind of NC ultimatum. It's enough to know you are not going to engage with her right now. You are taking a big step back for very (very) obvious reasons. MIL has conveniently washed her hands of you. It's fine to just let things be. Declaring NC might just be fighting words.

I am also NC with my FOO and IL's. In a family-focused part of the country. We moved here on purpose for that reason, but yeah, I feel your pain! But honestly, it doesn't really impact the vast majority of our relationships here. There are a surprising number of people who simply never have any reason to hear about it. Of those who do, the vast majority accept the situation without much questioning. "Unfortunately, we both come from severely abusive dysfunctional families and we have to protect our own children," covers it when it has to be addressed. I understand wanting validation in real life, but aside from a very close friend who already knows the backstory, it's probably not something to dump on someone. Dump here all you want lol.

[NarcKiddo]

What a horrible story. She sounds utterly grim. As for your husband's "ugly" eyes and teeth - well, who did he inherit them from??? Better that than her ugly mouth, though.

But - you stood up for yourself and DH is proud of you.

I cannot bear people touching me without my express consent. Even my husband. I am hyper vigilant around touch and usually manage to avoid it. I have some close friends who will pat my forearm and I grit my teeth as I know it is kindly meant and am unwilling to impose a "no touch" rule as I feel I would then have to explain why.

Personal grooming behaviour of the type you describe from your MIL I could not bear either and I would not tolerate it. My own mother touches inappropriately whenever she gets the chance and I avoid it as much as humanly possible.

I feel for you.

[Cat of the Canals]

Agree with everything the wise CMC said.

Especially that there's no need to announce any kind of NC to anyone (not just MIL). I think we sometimes think NC has to be this big loud barrier we put up, marked with the words "FOREVER AND EVER." The reality is that you can take NC a day at a time for as long as you need. And the only other person that probably needs to know is your husband, whether you choose to inform anyone else is up to you.

And for what it's worth, I don't think you were out of line, at all. This woman was in your home, repeatedly violating clear boundaries and being cruel on top of it. I'd like to say I'm shocked at her insulting your husband like that, but my PDmil used to greet BIL that way when we'd go to her house for dinner. Literally the first words out of her mouth would be some nasty comment like, "I thought you were going to cut your hair." or "I guess you're just not trimming your beard at all now?" Then she'd wonder why he avoided her for the rest of the time we were there.

My husband periodically beats himself up for falling out of GR with PDmil, but it is almost always when she has said or done something that he strongly disagrees with on a moral level (like blaming BIL's ex-girlfriend for his death). I always remind him that sometimes they cross a line too far, and that's exactly when it's correct and healthy to drop GR and make it clear that there is a non-negotiable boundary at play.

I hope you're taking good care of yourself and practicing a lot of self-care now that they're gone.

My MIL thankfully isn't a toucher, but my own PDmom is. In a rare moment of trust, I once showed her my surgical scars. (They are quite small and barely noticeable, which was in part what I was showing.) She practically lurched at me trying to touch them!  Who does that?????

As for your husband's "ugly" eyes and teeth - well, who did he inherit them from??? Better that than her ugly mouth, though.

*dies laughing*

[bee well]

Thank you. You have no idea how much of a difference it makes to talk here. Actually, I know you do know, thank you again. I'm sorry for all of the hurtful things we have been through that have brought us here.

DH and I are trying to be normal, and there is nothing normal about any of this.

I agree that there is no annoucement to make. That would create a sense of urgency and just more drama.

Reading what I dumped here--yes, that's true,  Call Me Cordelia. At a certain point it becomes dumping, unless we are willing to do something about it. It just underlines how unhealthy this is. There's a lot of work to be done.  I just need to learn to sit with all of this.

As for telling trusted enough people, perhaps the truth really does just need to be said directly and leave it at that, as you have, with out details. People will have the capacity to understand or they won't. I'm having a problem with the fact that we live in a very religious community and I don't know what the impact will be. That's a bridge to cross, and unfortunately I have already had some uncomfortable conversations about why my FOO is nowhere to be seen, I commend you for your courage in coming out with it where you are.

It's interesting how you bring up the moral issue, Cat. I just talked to DH and he says his M has no morals, he is preparing for the worst from her. He says he doen't know how she and the family will end up after she realizes what has happened this time but it's not his problem. TG he is thinking that but  I feel like this is placing a responsbility on me, even if he says he's ready to deal with it, The reason is that this event with me is now at the center. That brings us back to there not being a need to dramatize, even if what he says could be true.  Again, I feel sorry for him.

What an awful thing your MIL said about BIL's death, Cat. No one should ever have to endure that treatment, And your M lunging for your scars, wow,

I can also relate to what you said about breaking GR, and I am having a hard time with balancing this. I am not qualified to say what's going on with my MIL but I agree that consequences must be put in place when dealing with what's happening here. I beat myself up a lot when  don't get it right. At this point I just don't want to talk to her anymore. I need space to heal.

I appreciate the validation here, because in spite of the fact MIL is cruel, I find myself trying to explain it away. That's not good. I need to be reminded this is not normal.

As for what you said, NarcKiddo. about what DH inherited, that is priceless. I'm sorry about the difficulty you have around touching. I think if we discussed this elsewhere we'd be called hyper-sensitive. Well-meaning people (MIL not in this group) sometimes want to touch at inopportune moments, naturally and understandably, and it can be startling for people like us. I know what you mean about gritting your teeth to avoid explaining,

[Call Me Cordelia]

As for telling trusted enough people, perhaps the truth really does just need to be said directly and leave it at that, as you have, with out details. People will have the capacity to understand or they won't. I'm having a problem with the fact that we live in a very religious community and I don't know what the impact will be. That's a bridge to cross, and unfortunately I have already had some uncomfortable conversations about why my FOO is nowhere to be seen, I commend you for your courage in coming out with it where you are.

Thank you for that. I have had my share of those uncomfortable conversations too. Usually when people make assumptions and ask stuff like, "When are you seeing your family around the holidays?" Erm... well... Uncomfortable! Eventually I figured out the discomfort doesn't have to be absorbed by us because I (and you!) have done nothing wrong here! Our community is religious as well, but there are MANY who have serious problems with their FOOs. I think this is generally true, but perhaps there's greater than average awareness here? Who knows.

I found that these moments have become an opportunity to set the tone around my NC. It's a sad fact of life, but one I have no intention of belaboring. (In the general public, that is.) It's been really empowering to state the truth and then just not ask for feedback. Or validation. Or anything. It's kind to those who haplessly opened that can of worms. Which speaks well for you! Chances are they leave it alone going forward. Of course you don't know, but the impact of your stuff, your life situation, wholly unconnected to them, on others' opinion of you, is not your problem whatsoever.

[bee well]

Thanks again Call Me Cordelia: I'm glad to see you are not taking on shame that is not yours. There's not much awareness around here about the conversations we are having. There are lots of people with similar  situations but the general consensus is "It's your M or MIL" don't take it so seriously. Leaving the family is practically unheard of.

Going back to the current MIL situation, DH and I we agree that we don't want to see her for a while after he comes back (me I don't know if ever.) and it's his decision what to do with them. I've clearly told him this isn't a choice bertween me and his family. I want to take it day to day with decisions and not think about it in hyperbolic terms.

So........ she just called in fake friendly voice then hears my stern tone (not the norm for me), starts crying and said she wants to make peace. I was so startled when I picked up. I said I don't want to make war, then I said I had to go as there was a pot boiling.

I called her back to finish what was started and told DH to put on speaker. Before she got on I could hear her berating someone in the background..., and I said, listen I do not want war but I don't like the way you treat me and other people. I don't want to talk to you right now. I wish you a good day. Bye. She listened and replied Bye, back in her "nice" voice.

I wonder if I did not do well with my consequences. (On one hand I don't want to give supply but I am tired of running away, and walking on eggshells.)  I just told her the information and put down the phone after she said Goodbye. She didn't deserve the "I wish you a good day" but I am commited to civility. (I hope that wasn't too much of a mixed message, saying something nice after I told her what I did..) I won't be talking to her again for who knows how long.

She's likely throwing a tantrum and DH is still there. I think it would have been better to ignore the call.

In all of this DH she hasn't at all talked about what I said about her treatment of people or that she behaves poorly with unwanted touching. DH says she has not shown remorse. I just see rugsweeping and really inconsistent behaviour in all of this.

If any of you wise and patient people with experience with simillar would like to add more about consequences please do. I think I'll be doing a lot of reading today. I've heard consquences don't work with uN people but they do somewhat with uBPD. I see a lot of mixed behaviours here and not sure how to proceed other that to ignore the calls from now on.

[Call Me Cordelia]

Hey sorry for running on and on about how I handle those awkward moments!

Well done again! Ignoring the call would have been within your rights but you once again handled yourself beautifully. You took a moment to collect yourself, then said your piece on your terms, firmly and kindly with witnesses. So so smart and classy. Good on you!

Over and over again I see good and kind people on this board second guessing themselves, how they didn't adequately grey rock, how they broke NC, how they let the pwPD see them sweat a tiny bit after hours and days in their company. You are a human being! You have emotions and they will show up. You will make mistakes and do things imperfectly. You are doing so so well. You are being honest and kind and acting with integrity in the face of a whole family system that can't abide those qualities.

I'm not sure what you mean by consequences "working." But it sounds perhaps that you are still possibly hoping to control the outcome here. It's so understandable to want things to make sense, to cling to that idea of normal. Your MIL's actions and treatment of you is disordered. It's not yours to fix, even if you could do so. Which you can't. Three C's!! Whether she's got N or B or XYZ it's completely up to her if she wants to take any of what you've said and done on board.

If you've decided to ignore the calls for now, awesome. You deserve the break. It's got to be hard with your DH still with them, but this is time you have just for YOU right now. I wish you a peaceful day!

[Cat of the Canals]

I really can't imagine handling it better. Actually, I can't imagine handling it as well as you did, period. And I mean that. I am much more comfortable simply not engaging at all than speaking up for myself. Bravo.

Some really smart things you did:
1. Seeing through the "I want to make peace" fauxpology. If this were a genuine attempt at amends, I'd expect to hear something along the lines of, "I've thought about what you said, and I want to apologize for my behavior." Instead, she essentially asked you to rugsweep this whole mess with her, under the guise of "making peace."

2. Saying you don't want to make war. You're being direct about how you're not going to play the fawning game of, "Oh I want to make peace too! Let's just pretend everything is fine and dandy!" while at the same time making it clear that you aren't interested in fighting either. (Some PDs would take your refusal to accept peace and twist it into, "I offered peace but she said no! She clearly just wants to create more drama!" So it was smart to quash that before it could start.)

3. When you were startled by the unexpected call, you found a way to give yourself space by saying you needed to go attend to something in the kitchen. I don't know if that was your intention or maybe just a subconscious reflex, but I think one of the most effective things we can do when a PD springs something on us is to buy ourselves some time to think. I think they like to catch us off guard, because it can be easier to squeeze past our defenses when we're unprepared.

4. It was so smart to ask that the call be on speaker so you'd have witnesses to what was said. Who knows how she might have spun the conversation without that.

5. You stuck to your boundaries in a clear but polite way. Textbook Medium Chill. And to me, the whole point of MC is to make our boundaries clear in a way that gives as little supply as possible. Factual and concise. "I do not like this behavior." "I do not want to talk right now." These are excellent, no JADE statements.

6. Wishing her a good day and being civil is something that should be commended. I don't think we should ever second guess ourselves when we've been kind to someone, even if that person ends up abusing that kindness somehow. In fact, remaining civil even when we're upset or angry with someone is one of the core things that separates nons from PDs, in my opinion.

[bee well]

Hi all,

CMC, I don't think you are going on at all about the way you handle those awkward moments. I hope you will continue to share your insight because surviviors need to hear there are different choices, possibilities, and outcomes.

Thanks for the validation. You have really helped me.

By consequences I meant that we need to follow through with what we say. Not to say one thing and do another. Like if I say I don't want to talk, to keep that up as long as I feel it is necessary.

I'm just a bit worried about my "announcement" and the effect all of this has.

As for what works with what flavor, yeah it doesn't matter. I'm tired of sweating it out.

We'll see what happens after DH comes back and in the coming days.

Thank you again.

[bee well]

Cat of the Canals,

Thank you, I accidentally. posted that last one before I replied to you. thank you for the way you broke it all down point by point. I appreciate the validation as always because it helps keep away the self-doubt.

I did make that split second decision to put the phone down and call back and fortunately DH did hear the conversation. So she can't spin that one.

As for kindness, we can always, and should be kind and civil. It's sad when we have to think about how to measure kindness, though. as some people take it as a weakness. We know that's not true.

Have a good day every body.

[bee well]

Well, I haven't talked to MIL but now I am wondering how to go from here. I haven't made any NC annoucements (no plans to) though sh clearly knows I don't want to talk to her.

The dynamic between DH and I and his family is  changed. I don't think there's a going back to the old way, because that wasn't good.

I know, I don't want to go there for end of year festivities. I want to spend holiday with DH, alone.

I know, that if I ever go there again, I do not want to sleep or eat in her home. That's how I feel about it. I feel especially strongly about not sleeping there.

Right this moment I could be enjoying the silence but my mind has taken me to the eventual conversation wil MIL:

I see a few possibilities--

1) she will try to rugsweep again, might be very dramatic. I'm prepared for possibility there will be drama re: health-- not necessarily with me in the convo, but drama nonetheless. I'm not rugsweeping which brings me to #2..

2) I could ask her if she thinks there is a problem with her behaviour. If she says no, I can tell her what my problem with it is, and that I don't want to be around that type of behaviour. If she says yes there is a problem and I can ask her  if she plans on making any changes. If none of that works, closing on a cordial not, Something like "we agree that we disagree." Have a good day.

3) Holidays? There are always greeting cards.  Or a short call on speaker.

I'm trying to keep the three C's on repeat. We always talk in the forum about being prepared for the future as best we can. I don't know how to prepare for something like this. How can we prepare for the uncontrollable?? Put up boundaries, go back to Greyrock and MC eventually, and wait for the next episode??? That doesn't seem like a good plan.

DH says in situations like this she flips into the victim and then gets her way (I have seen it) and that's what I predict she will try but he says that he isn't going to accept it this time. We'll see.

What I want to do is fade into the distance but with DH in contact with family I don't know how that is possible.

Maybe I am going to far ahead in my mind. For now I am sticking to the no phone calls and taking care of me plan.

I guess what's different here is that  I told her. She didn't get away with it this time.

I've been really really sad about this but I am accepting that it is sad. Today I feel better, which is encouraging.

[bee well]

Yesterday I wrote:
"...I'm trying to keep the three C's on repeat. We always talk in the forum about being prepared for the future as best we can. I don't know how to prepare for something like this. How can we prepare for the uncontrollable?? Put up boundaries, go back to Greyrock and MC eventually, and wait for the next episode??? That doesn't seem like a good plan....)

No diss to the great tools of grayrock medium chill and those who use them, (often with quite some success), I am just a bit frustrated that no matter what I do, a behaviour will come up and take me off balance. More practice needed, I guess, and back to radically accepting the 3 C's-

[mustard_seed]

be well,

Your frustration makes complete sense. It is frustrating to have no clear picture of the future with these relationships. It is frustrating to bump up against the limitations of tools which are supposed to work, or which work for others, like grey rock and medium chill. It is frustrating to try to focus on your life and priorities when all of this is going on.

At least your husband seems to understand that things are different this time. He says he will not allow her to play the victim. This shows awareness and resolve on his part, which is more than many can say of their partners in these situations.

I think you say it right here: "Maybe I am going to far ahead in my mind. For now I am sticking to the no phone calls and taking care of me plan." It's hard to predict how people will react, because it seems that things are shifting in the family dynamics. You're not allowing yourself to be mistreated. You're prioritizing your own needs. How will others respond? Maybe your decisions about when/how/if you'll engage can evolve as the situation evolves?

Some of this will just have to play out over time. In the mean time, focus on what you need, what will make you feel supported and well during this time. I think GR and MC and other tools are easier to implement when we're feeling strong and balanced inside.

Hopefully you'll also get support from other members with more experience. I'm fairly new and mostly just sharing the little bits that are working for me and what others have taught me here through their examples and words.

Cheering for you--
MS

[treesgrowslowly]

Hi bee well

Here's my little essay on the 3 C's.

I call it "The 3 C's are great but..."



The 3 C's are great but they don't address the grieving once we realize / feel that the relationship with this person is probably over - in the sense that our desire to keep it going, just isn't there anymore.

The 3 C's are great but they are cognitive, they are about what to think. And as we know, the grief or anger or sadness needs a place to go too.

Just repeating the 3 C's didn't help my anger or sadness to get expressed. I had to cry enough to get to the grief of the situation, the loss of any hope that this person is ever going to make sense to me, etc...

The 3 C's are great but they don't always give us much we can use when the person is our MIL and our DH has his own relationship with this person, a relationship that has a long history and a relationship that affects you but doesn't help you when you're trying your very darn best to repeat the 3 C's.

The 3 C's give us a good starting place to look at what we've wanted and what we've lost.

The 3 C's can help us to give ourselves the hug we need, because we need to heal from the stuff we didn't cause, couldn't control and can't cure.

That's hard to do when someone is not leaving us alone. ie phoning us when we asked them not to.

The 3 C's are great but I don't think they go deep enough. Its like if i have a knot in my muscle i can stretch or go for a walk but at some point i might need some real deep tissue massage to get deep enough to get at the real source of the pain.

The pain we feel can run deep.

Seems to me that this relationship with your MIL is in a grey zone, you're not sure if you want to invest anything into it at all anymore. Or you are sure that you're done with her visits,  and you are not sure how DH and you will manage that next stage. It's OK not to know yet. And it's also OK to know that you're done with visiting with her. 

My heart goes out to you as you continue  this really important process of sorting through the options.

Do you think your DH has embraced the 3 C's as much as you have?

Trees