Love bombing

[escapingman]

This is really getting to me now, since coming Out of the FOG I find the love bombing phase really disturbing.

So, everything hit the fan a couple of days ago (details can be found in my other thread in the separating and divorce section) and I told her I had enough and we are getting divorced. She immediately told the kids I am splitting up the family and piled on a massive victim charade for the rest of the day (this was Monday, 3 days ago). On Tuesday she starts talking to me about saving the marriage and she won't give up. I told her politely it is to later and that if she wanted to save the marriage she could have tried the prior 6 months since that was when I told her she was on her last chance. She denies all abuse, of course, and says she has been nice for the last 6 months (you couldn't even have fooled the neighbours dog). She keeps being "nice" to me and also in the background makes GC to be nice to me, yes she is so manipulated that her relation to me depends on what stbx tells her it should be. After she had been nice for a few hours, her mindset has shifted so she now thinks we are back on track together again and the divorce is off. She agrees with the kids we are all going out for a meal together and then telling me she is moving back into our bedroom (she has slept in a different bedroom for 3 years). Told her no way is she moving back, so she didn't (only reason she didn't put up a fight about it is that she doesn't want to and obviously only did it for show). So yesterday she keeps telling me all these stories expecting me to engage and give her supply, getting visible distressed that I am still not engaging. I cooked my dinner and got some extra pieces of meat left over, offered it to her out of politeness, she thinks this is a sign of my love for her (it was a couple of pieces I couldn't manage for goods sake) and she tries to jump on me to kiss and hug me. I stopped her and told her to stay away. Today she is going shopping, asking me to come with, completely "forgetting" I am working (someone has to as she isn't), then getting annoyed with me for not giving her the full on "I love you, I will miss you, have a nice time etc" when she leaves (I was sitting with my head phones ready for a meeting).

Not sure how long she will stay in this phase, maybe I should just pretend I love her and all is good as that immediately will send her high on the supply and kick off the devaluation phase.   

[Simon]

I think you're in a precarious position right now e.m.

I highly suggest you don't pretend to love her, as you say.
As things stand right now, when she realises that the divorce is real, and that you mean it, she will become very malicious, and will pull out all the stops to hurt you.
If you were to pretend to love her right now, it would make it all the worse, and she would have cause to point the finger at you for "playing games", and use that to call you unhinged/a narcissist/ who know what else.

I think you really need to stay on the path of responding when you have to, without reaction.
All this "We're all going out for a meal", "let's go shopping together", etc, it's all for effect, and to get you to change your mind.
Of course, by saying NO to these things, she will make you the villain, but you may have to take that on the chin.
She's going to do that anyway.

As for offering her what's left of your food, that is a big mistake.
Any interaction initiated by you is going to look like you forgive her, and everything is fine for her again (remember, she's used to you folding for all these years, why would she think this time is any different?).
My worry is that you gave her what you couldn't eat so that she would think things were ok, and then you could stop her and tell her to go away, as some kind of validation for yourself.
You may be doing it sub-consciously, maybe not.
I wouldn't blame you.
I'd be tempted to lift my ex up, just so that I could drop her back down, even now.
But it's not healthy, and I hope that's not what you're doing.

Again, regardless of whatever else you do (it's your life and your decision), I would recommend not engaging with her any more than you have to.
If you have food left over, throw it away.
Think about any situation where your action could be seen by her as either a weakness or a sign that you want to stay together, and then don't do it, no matter how tempting.

She'll be making a mental note of everything you're doing right now, so play it cool, don't give any signs that you've changed your mind, etc.
In fact, I'd recommend you state that nothing has changed, and that you still want a divorce (if you still do), and then make sure not to give the impression that you've changed your mind by your actions.
If she says that you're all going out for dinner, and you really don't think it would be appropriate with everything that's happening, then tell her that.
Same with the shopping trips, etc.
Sounds like she's testing how much power she still has over you, and working out a plan to change your mind.

Clearly, you're in a minefield right now, and all I can do is wish you luck.
And don't be tempted to lift her up by giving her false hope, just so you can drop her back down, no matter how much she may deserve it.
It will royally backfire.

Good luck mate.

[escapingman]

Great reply as always Simon.

Regarding the food, it was just me not thinking but just routinely said "there is some food left if you want it" as I normally would do. I didn't prepare for that reaction from here, I will be more careful in the future.

I was just in a meeting, she came in and put a cup of coffee next to me. For me that is just another of those non emotional bribes of not asked for favours. I considered if I should drink it or not, but decided to put no emotions on to the cup of coffee and drank it (I hate to see things being thrown away). I am however keeping MC and GR and have not given her any reason to believe anything has changed, the only thing that has changed is in her head.

[SonofThunder]

Hello escapingman,

Imo, due to your decisions thus far regarding initiating a divorce and making certain declarations, i agree with Simon that responding positively to lovebombing at this particular step will really handicap you and in an opposite manner, and energize your PDspouse to heighten the manipulation and devaluation afterwards. 

In addition, imo your kids need some stability; not a chaotic limbo. They need the coming resolution you already started.  In addition, your kids are watching you stand up for yourself (and hopefully them where needed/where legally able) and so you are a model for them as well.  I suggest you be the calm, smart, planning model they need. 

Therefore, if i was in your shoes, i would maximize MC and move calmly forward on your already initiated separation to divorce without any response to lovebombing.  I want to also suggest you take a (quickly) deep educational dive into the hallmark PD trait of Fear of Abandonment.  FoA is that very deep chasm inside the mind of a PD that is the ultimate driver of PD behaviors.  FoA rears its head in many different ways, but one of which, you are experiencing at the moment; lovebombing. 

I fully tested this FoA theory of my PDw in a 'healing separation' in 2018 after educating myself deeply and my testing results fully supported the FoA education, therefore helped solidify my beliefs regarding my wife and my future necessary actions/plans in dealing with a PD.  If you respond positively to the lovebombing (even if your response is done to simply try and keep some sort of peace while moving forward on divorce), it will backfire on you in a huge way (what Simon is suggesting).  I suggest you do not engage in the attempts of your wife and yes, its going to be tough; shes going to play hard on your temptation and shes going to do it in front of your kids (invitations and shows of affection) and also in private (potential seduction and emotional pleading).  Imo its all a trap to reengage you in the IDD cycle and believe me, the next time around the IDD cycle will put the last cycle to total shame. 

I wish you the best on your journey out and wishes for strength and focus on MC and a plan, as directed by counselors, attorneys combined with PD self-education.   

SoT

[escapingman]

Hi SoT, thanks for your reply.

No I am not planning to respond to the love bombing, I am just keeping to myself and respond with MC and GR. But as she normally projects on me to be the bad one, she now projects on to me I am the good one. Normally she gets annoyed with me if I say take the bins in as she think I am taking them in just to show her she didn't take them in. Now she thinks me taking the bins in is me showing her love. You really can't win, all you can do is to try to keep yourself sane and use the toolbox.

[SonofThunder]

Hi SoT, thanks for your reply.

No I am not planning to respond to the love bombing, I am just keeping to myself and respond with MC and GR. But as she normally projects on me to be the bad one, she now projects on to me I am the good one. Normally she gets annoyed with me if I say take the bins in as she think I am taking them in just to show her she didn't take them in. Now she thinks me taking the bins in is me showing her love. You really can't win, all you can do is to try to keep yourself sane and use the toolbox.

" You really can't win, all you can do is to try to keep yourself sane and use the toolbox."

[SonofThunder]

Hi SoT, thanks for your reply.

No I am not planning to respond to the love bombing, I am just keeping to myself and respond with MC and GR. But as she normally projects on me to be the bad one, she now projects on to me I am the good one. Normally she gets annoyed with me if I say take the bins in as she think I am taking them in just to show her she didn't take them in. Now she thinks me taking the bins in is me showing her love. You really can't win, all you can do is to try to keep yourself sane and use the toolbox.

Also, just to potentially prep you:  FoA drives the PD lovebombing out of that deep need, deep chasm of emptiness inside of the PD mind.  Its a reset attempt to fill the void and then if you were to reset, the rest of the void gets filled with the adrenaline rush of amplified manipulation and devaluation, at a level much greater than before.

If the lovebombing fails though, and you proceed forward, ready yourself (stay laser focused and pre-educated) for a potentially total PD mental breakdown into a child-like victim mindset that will be 100% your fault.  Any confident-adult mindset that existed in your wife prior, may collapse into a heap of stinking manure.  You will also face the attempts at the smearing of your reputation as your PDw air's your dirty laundry to all who will lend a sympathetic ear to the victim. 

Your kids will witness this as well and so you need to have your steady, calm, available dad ready as well as all the other hats you are wearing.  Its simply the path we must travel if we choose to depart a marriage to a PD (50% rule + 51% rule to stay sane).

SoT

[escapingman]

SoT: I am very aware of this, and that is making me scared shitless. We don't have any real mutual friends so not afraid of that, she has her best friend aka the flying monkey, that she has smeared me to for years, but there isn't many she can smear me to that I care about. My real concern is the smear campaign she will do to the children, but to be honest she is already smearing me to them during her ordinary devalue/discard phase. She can of course smear me to my friends, but I can't really see how they would side with her as they never really spoken to her. She has already fallen out severely with her mum, yes she will smear me to her, and her sister, but I am not sure if they will really care as they all are Narcs and do whatever is best for themselves at any given point.

Was on my way out and she caught me trying to get me to smile and be nice, reiterated that nothing has changed and that we are splitting up. She still didn't get it and kept saying she is fighting for the marriage. Told her again it's to late and the hurt she caused me is not reversable, she start going on that she is hurt and that I have hurt her. FFS, I have hurt her? All I have done is keeping to myself, doing GR and MC during all her abusive cycles. Anyway, told her again nothing has changed and then went out. So just cam back home, she immediately wants to talk, she has been thinking and now know how to fix this. She knows what's needed to be done. Sure I say, but it will only be a monologue so no point I said. No no, she said, its a conversation we really need to talk about this as I now know..... Sure I said, but I am busy I told her. So now she is walking around on edge wanting to tell me how to solve the marriage problem. I already knows, no shit sherlock but there is only 2 things needed and neither will be done be her. 1) Start respecting me and 2) Stop abusing me.

[square]

Yeahh, the love bombing is just gross and must be hard to take.

It's just so.... cheap. Like a little hug and a kiss and pretend YAY! mood is going to make up for the abuse and craziness.

It's also really bad for the kids.

So cheap. If she wanted to stay married why not just drop the constant manipulation? She wouldn't even have to be wonderful, just stop making divorce easier and preferable to living another five minutes with her.

[SonofThunder]

I am of the opinion that all reputations are developed over time.  Unless others are shallow enough to allow smearing to replace time-earned reputations, most of the smearing will simply wash away over time, revealing the truth once again.  Imo, trying to correct a PD's smearing (with anyone, including children) is JADE and also allows the PD a victory of watching the non put forth effort to clean up behind the smear of the PD. 

I would advise you to simply remain focused on your self-protection, your short and long range goals and your calm, truthful ongoing relationship with the kids (PD cant touch the truth of 'father' and 'dad') as a stalwart dad who models balance and love (desiring what is 'best' for them).  They may be temporarily siding with their mother to avoid confrontation with her, and retain any embellishments she may be providing them, but they are not blind to the truth.  Imo, its the long-haul victory of relationship you are really after with your kids, and surely, your wife is very perceptive to your immediate concerns with them, therefore she plays in that arena. 

All the best on your decided journey out,

SoT

[escapingman]

She is just so predictable, and she just can't help herself. Came into me and SG tried to make conversation, I am still GR and MC. She tries to by asking me some questions, which I give one word answers to. When I give the fifth or so one word answer she gets annoyed and storms out closing the door behind her (the door wasn't closed before). Suppose at least she managed to not slam the door.... This love bombing she is trying right now isn't even any good, maybe it is just me being further Out of the FOG than I have been before? I don't even hate her, I just think she is pathetic.

[Justanotherlostgirl]

I feel for you escaping man, I'm in a similar situation at the moment. When we first got together, my husband love bombed me with gifts, trips, etc.

Now the love bombing is much more subtle, and if you were to tell anyone about it who didn't understand PD's it might even seem like they are the normal ones and you're being irrational.

Just as I was typing this to you, my uPDH called for the third time in an hour to make sure our son was driven to school, because it is raining. He then called me a further two times (in the span of an hour) to tell me to wear a raincoat on my motorcycle and drive carefully. To most people, that would seem very sweet! But the issue is, as you can see all over this forum from my comments about my husband, he hardly, if ever, calls me about anything. Certainly not out of concern. In fact two weeks ago, I took my son to do the laundry and there were heavy rains and winds, and driving back on motorcycle was very dangerous, but he was nowhere to be found. Now suddenly, he cares so so deeply.

This has happened sooo many times. He now uses love bombing and manipulation as this strange, twisted combination. It makes it look to others close to us that I am the problem. Who can complain about their husband checking on their safety? We all here know better. We know this is just what they do.

I'm so glad that you decided to take the step of getting a divorce. You're very deeply unhappy, and you don't deserve to live your whole life like that. Your PD will likely be angry either way, so it's just better to keep stating what you've stated. You want a divorce. I wouldn't accept anything from her, not even a coffee. 😅 She's going to continue this manipulation+love bombing combo, thinking she is working her magic. There will be a point when she will realize it's done and drop the act. If you haven't been recording her behaviors, start doing it now, especially if you're looking for custody of your kids. Get some hidden cameras if that is allowed where you are.

Wish you the best. Sending love to you, it's a difficult situation to be in, are you holding up ok mentally?

[Lauren17]

EM, my stbxh responded exactly the same way. I posted here about as I was furious. It showed me that he knew all along he was treating me badly. Complete control over his behaviors.
Originally, I tried to stay neutral about the gifts and the displays of affection. I figured I'd already hurt him with divorce, I didn't want to hurt him more by rejecting him further. Someone suggested to me that line of thinking might lead to false hopes. So I've tried to stay polite but firm in the face of love bombing.  I said something along the lines of, "I appreciate the thought behind abc, thank you. But II don't feel right accepting it. It won't change things."
It's hard!!
JALG, I could have written your "be careful in the rain" story. It sounds lovely to any outsider. But I know how that feels. And I know how crazy I sound when I say "I filed for divorce and I'm worried about stbxh's response. No, he's not violent, he's being too nice!"
I've tried to prep family and friends for the upcoming smear campaign. But no one seems to listen. They usually say something along the lines of "well if you're not fighting now, I'm sure everything will be fine."
So, I'm trying to focus on the end goal, be honest and stable for my kids, and be as calm and neutral  with stbxh as I can.

[escapingman]

I can so relate to your stories. Stbx did this again this morning, I am getting so tired. Stbx and GC sat in the kitchen habing their breakfast, SG still asleep and when I went down I did my routine I do every morning. I go into my office, turn on the laptop, logon and check my calendar to get an idea of my day. Then I go into the kitchen making myself a cup of coffee, going back to my office and start planning for the day, reading emails etc. This morning, no different, same routine, Stbx and GC leaves the kitchen whilst I am in the office, gets upstairs seeing my empty bedroom and stbx starts "panicking" wonder where I am running round the house searching for me. Then when she finds me getting annoyed that I am not appreciating her concern whilst GC starts moaning "look, this shows how much mum loves you". This exact sequence happens every day but today, today she decided to be concerned.

I am so tired.

[Justanotherlostgirl]

EM, my stbxh responded exactly the same way. I posted here about as I was furious. It showed me that he knew all along he was treating me badly. Complete control over his behaviors.
Originally, I tried to stay neutral about the gifts and the displays of affection. I figured I'd already hurt him with divorce, I didn't want to hurt him more by rejecting him further. Someone suggested to me that line of thinking might lead to false hopes. So I've tried to stay polite but firm in the face of love bombing.  I said something along the lines of, "I appreciate the thought behind abc, thank you. But II don't feel right accepting it. It won't change things."
It's hard!!
JALG, I could have written your "be careful in the rain" story. It sounds lovely to any outsider. But I know how that feels. And I know how crazy I sound when I say "I filed for divorce and I'm worried about stbxh's response. No, he's not violent, he's being too nice!"
I've tried to prep family and friends for the upcoming smear campaign. But no one seems to listen. They usually say something along the lines of "well if you're not fighting now, I'm sure everything will be fine."
So, I'm trying to focus on the end goal, be honest and stable for my kids, and be as calm and neutral  with stbxh as I can.

Lauren, yes! And we have to remember, like I said in my other post about PD's and their false self, that this "concern" is yet another way for them to confirm they are a good person, as their child self absolutely needs it. You/escaping man leaving is such a deep narcissistic injury, as SoT has said, their fear of abandonment is center stage and they are doing absolutely everything they can to stop that from happening whilst appearing like the good guy. Especially because the people around them will feel sorry for them and that victimhood feeds their false selves.

I know they don't actively sit down and think and scheme these things, but I can just predict when it is going to start up and exactly what he is going to do. This "concern"/love bombing is usually followed by a victimhood manipulation on their part when they don't get what they want. Watch out for it, because they will begin this new smear behind your back without you even knowing it. So typical and played out with PD's. It is especially common in divorce where they will first be really understanding, but once divorce court happens and they don't get what they want, they ramp up the behavior. I'm glad I will be a continent away when I initiate the proceedings 🤣

[escapingman]

Justanoterlostgirl: I know her cycles and her tricks.  She will be alternating between trying to be nice, play the victim and raging. She is keeping the rage reasonable under control at the moment, but it's only a matter of time. She had had glimpses of losing it but pulled it back quickly, funny she can do that when she wants to. Makes me feel even sicker about her.

[Justanotherlostgirl]

Justanoterlostgirl: I know her cycles and her tricks.  She will be alternating between trying to be nice, play the victim and raging. She is keeping the rage reasonable under control at the moment, but it's only a matter of time. She had had glimpses of losing it but pulled it back quickly, funny she can do that when she wants to. Makes me feel even sicker about her.

I could swear I'm married to your wife somehow! 🤣

It always frustrated me how they can control their anger around the people they want to present their good side to. You know they CAN, it's just they don't and that is a further manipulation even, that she can control it when she wants but didn't, and is only doing it now because it is serving a purpose for her.

Eventually she will see you are serious and then the rage will begin. Do you have any plans for actually leaving your residence at the moment before it gets to that point?

[escapingman]

I have done most of the initial hard work such as speak up about the abuse. Next week my solicitor is back from a week off and I will find out my options. My preferred is to book a looooong stay at a hotel and let the solicitor start the process when I am away. However, my worry doing this is how the kids will get treated. I have realised I don't have any material things in the house that I am to worried about if she break, so all I need is to get out alive. Obviously I am double her size so if it came down to a fight, I would take her easy, but then she would turn it round saying I attacked her so I would like to avoid her becoming physical (has happened in the past and after her standing and hitting me for a couple of minutes I had to grab her and pull her off me).

But, I do think I really just need to leave and hope for the best for the kids. My mental health are really going down the hill and I am not sure how much more of her sh*t I can actually take before I have a breakdown. This fast circling between her phases is making me nuts, she can go through the entire IDD cycle multiple times a day!

[escapingman]

I think the rage is coming..... She just told me that she is going to start a new project in the house. Told her she can do whatever she wants but we are still getting divorced. She got angry and told me I owe her for all the years married so I am not allowed to divorce her.......

[Boat Babe]

Have a calm exit plan escaping man. This is the very worse part. Write down your intentions. Record everything. Tell your children you love them. As they say in Recovery circles "Don't question the decision." I have seen a photo of someone's wrist with this as a tattoo, it was that important to them. Dig deep, avoid alcohol, keep talking to us.