Conflict Management with Co-Parent

[ForestDad]

I'm looking for ideas or resources on how to manage conflict with my ex. Frustratingly, I don't know her prognosis, some people I've talked to suspect there may be bipolar or schizoaffective disorder, or perhaps narcissistic pd. She had a psychotic break a few years ago, but as an ex-husband, I'm not on her HIPAA.

For the most part, she's high-functioning (despite not really managing her health), and we get along fine. But when conflicts arise, it's impossible to work through them. She talks over us, refuses to hear any differing opinions, and if we disagree on the problem (or even agree there is a problem, but feel it's not as serious as she feels), she accuses us of manipulating and gaslighting her. The only technique we have is to placate her, which is not ideal.

For my part, I'm not too worried, my life is now mostly separate from her. But I worry about my kids (my youngest is still a teenager and spends 50% of her time with her mom). I want them to have a relationship with their mother, but conflicts have been popping up frequently lately and they're taking a toll. I feel I'm sending my youngest into a very stressful and potentially damaging environment. (Note: I have no reason to believe they are unsafe... just very uncomfortable and frustrated.)

We've tried family counseling (my ex talked over the therapist and ended up walking out). I'd hoped that the counseling could provide my kids and their mom ways to work through these issues and manage their relationship, but no such luck.

Are there techniques and tools that can help my children navigate their relationship with their mother? Or is it time to look into limiting their time together?

I'm rather new here, so please forgive me if there's an obvious resource for this. I looked around, and tried some searches, but didn't find what I was looking for.

[Penny Lane]

Hi there and welcome!

Here are a few resources that worked for me:
The toolbox at the top of the page -- both for yourself, and to help your kids.

A couple books:
Coparenting with a Toxic Ex
Don't Alienate the Kids!

Bill Eddy (author of the latter) actually has several books about high conflict people.

Question: What do your kids want to do? Do they want to see her less?

[moglow]

ForestDad, My heart hurts for you, it has to be awful to watch it play out. I see my Daddy in your words, trying to protect us as best he could but knowing too that there were limits to what he could actually do.

My best suggestion is to encourage your kids first, last and always. Hear them out even when it's not what you want to hear, and let them know yours is a safe place. Build that trust with them and reinforce it every way you can. I've always given Daddy credit - even knowing what he had to have experienced with her, he never talked smack about mother. He listened to us and made it clear we were wanted and safe in his home. I'm sure he had to zip it far more than I can imagine, and it had to have destroyed him inside. We had some really tough years and the parental alienation [from her] was unending. Unfortunately I didn't see the real harm until he was gone and now can only appreciate him doing the best he could in a bad situation.

Why do you want them to have a relationship with her - better question: do THEY want that? IF [and it could be a possibility] she resents them because you're the father/her ex, it could be hard for them on multiple levels. The adult children may have had enough and need to limit their exposure to her, even if only for a while. They need to know that we all need boundaries and yours may just not be right for them - and that's okay! Encourage all of them to talk about it when it comes up, so they know you'll hear the bad and the good. Nobody needs to choose sides here, it'll be different for each person regardless.

[ForestDad]

Thank you for your replies! I've already started reading "Don't Alienate The Kids", and there are many parallels and it's given me some good advice already.

The kids love their mom, and do want to see her. They just wish they could do so without the looming threat of conflict. When she's not angry or anxious, their mother is a great mom. Caring, fun to be around, very adventurous, and would do anything to help them achieve their dreams and goals. But when she's upset she treats everyone terribly, says cutting and cruel things, and somehow manages to believe she's the victim of the situation.

My adult kids still see their mom, though much less frequently than mom would like. They seem to manage their relationship by withdrawing when things get bad. But my youngest is still at the mercy of our 50/50 custody agreement. A couple of times recently, she's (my daughter) mentioned that she might like to skip a weekend, or maybe see her mom less frequently. In actuality, she'll be 18 in less than a year, so she could choose to see mom less, without going through the court process. But she has another year of high school after this one, so will still need to live at home. Her mom is already planting the seeds of guilt and abandonment if she chooses to limit visitation after she turns 18.

I feel torn. On one hand, I want to be a good co-parent and ensure that I don't alienate the kids. On the other hand, I want to give them the resources they need to manage their relationship with their mother.  I worry by doing so, I'm immediately discrediting their mom, and alienating my kids. But if I don't then I'm just sending them into battle without any skills to manage the conflict, and preserve their sense of self.

[sevenyears]

Forest dad,

I hear your worries. I am in a similar situation, except my children are 11 and 7.5. Their father is high conflict and manipulative and actively undermines anything I try to do to support the children. I think he is uOCPD and uNPD. He is counter-parenting. Dr. Ramani described this as co-parenting with an elephant on your back. Whatever one calls it, it is hard! It sounds like you're not alienating the children from your ExW; rather, she is alienating them herself.

I see two questions in your posts: your daughter's relationship with her mother, and how to co-parent with a high conflict personality. Regarding your daughter, could you ask her how she feels about her relationship with her mother? And talk about the pros/cons of skipping a weekend or two? And, then, tell her you'll support her decision whatever she decides. 

And, how to co-parent with someone who is deadset on creating conflict? Whether it's intentional or unintentional, the stress and hurt to everyone else (ie you and the kids) is the same. Pick your battles, then respond rather than react. Make your boundaries clear, maintain them, stick to facts, and be a grey rock. And, a lot of grounding, plus yoga, kickboxing, running, meditation or whatever physical activity to relieve stress and take care of yourself. It's not easy, and certainly not fair, and will test your patience, but the model you set for your children will make it worth it in the long run. People recommended to me Non-Violent Communication by Marshall Rosenberg. I haven't read it yet, but have tried his techniques in an adapted manner. I don't state my feelings when communicating with my ExH, and only focus on the impact of his actions on the kids, but the technique MR proposes can be helpful if you adapt it to your situation.