Please don't leave me I hate you

[SonofThunder]

I am following you as well SoT and I hope we both can look back at this period from a calm place not to far in the future.

+1 EM. Amen to that my friend.

SoT

[escapingman]

I lost it, I really lost it. I have had enough.

GC has been riling me for days, telling me how much she hates me, telling me she suddenly doesn't enjoy any of her hobbies anymore. She told me she in introvert and only wants to be home (with her mum). GC is a child, she doesn't know the words, she is being heavily manipulated and brainwashed. I am so angry I don't even know what to do. uNPDstbxw just laughs at me pretending it is normal that a child spends all the time just with her mum. I can't take it anymore. I have never hated a person more in my life. Ever.

I tried to go through this divorce with minimising conflict, to spare the kids, to spare uNPDstbxw, but she has pushed it, sha has brainwashed my beautiful daughter, she has bullied my other daughter, not to even start talking about how she treated me.

This will be a truthwar as SoT would say, but I might lose it as I lost my temper. I get so angry when I see how she brainwash and abuse my children I can't control myself anymore.

[Poison Ivy]

escapingman, it's normal to feel angry. Can you try to save your expressions of anger for when you're not with your spouse and children? I know, this is easy in theory, not so easy in practice. But if you can keep your focus on the ultimate goal (e.g., finalization of the divorce, a fair and equitable property division, shared child custody and placement), you might be able to get through the divorce process without losing it in front of your spouse and children.

[escapingman]

escapingman, it's normal to feel angry. Can you try to save your expressions of anger for when you're not with your spouse and children? I know, this is easy in theory, not so easy in practice. But if you can keep your focus on the ultimate goal (e.g., finalization of the divorce, a fair and equitable property division, shared child custody and placement), you might be able to get through the divorce process without losing it in front of your spouse and children.

I am struggling, I am really struggling. I can see how she is brainwashing and trying to ruin my daughter(s) life(s). I just cant stand and watch letting it happen.

[Poison Ivy]

It is horrible that your wife is engaged in this behavior. If you are able to get some custody and placement of the children, you can work on "rehabbing" your reputation and the children's condition. If your wife gets sole custody and placement, it will be much more difficult for you to have a positive relationship with the children.

[square]

I wouldn't be able to take what you're enduring.

So that she doesn't get any recordings of you losing it, make a plan.

You need to physically remive yourself from the house if you are being pushed to the brink.

Plan:

1) Where you'll go. (Local hotel maybe, or just out for a few hours).

2) What words you'll calmly state when leaving - if any. If you are unlikely to be able to leave quickly (seconds) plan your response to her demanding to know what you're doing, where you're going. No answer is fine (a trigger for my H though so I could not do that) or repeat something over and over, perhaps. "Out. Later."

3) Have a go bag, possibly in your car, so you can just grab laptop and haul.

4) Plan how you'll respond if she tries to physically block you. Will she physically attack you if you start visibly recording her, or will she stand down? Memorize phrases to use: "I am trying to leave, you need to stop blocking my way."

[escapingman]

I can't take it, but I can't see the wood for the trees.

I have spent a lot of time with SG lately, she is suffering a lot. She told me that when I am away, STBX and GC are constantly at her telling her that I am useless and that she should stop spending time with me and that I don't care about her. This is clearly how STBX started it with GC and got her over on her side hating me. With these facts, how can I move out and leave SG behind? It will only be so long before she has also been turned against me. However, SG has told me she wants me to move out and for her to come with me and only for us to live together. As tempting as this is, I can't split the girls up, or can I? I just don't know what to do. I am going mad.

[SonofThunder]

I can't take it, but I can't see the wood for the trees.

I have spent a lot of time with SG lately, she is suffering a lot. She told me that when I am away, STBX and GC are constantly at her telling her that I am useless and that she should stop spending time with me and that I don't care about her. This is clearly how STBX started it with GC and got her over on her side hating me. With these facts, how can I move out and leave SG behind? It will only be so long before she has also been turned against me. However, SG has told me she wants me to move out and for her to come with me and only for us to live together. As tempting as this is, I can't split the girls up, or can I? I just don't know what to do. I am going mad.

Sorry EM, a few questions and you may have stated sometime in the past.

-age of SG? 
-age of GC
-when you have been at hotels, what is emotional temp like at in the home with stbx?  Does it cool down a bit?

My opinion is that teenage children are very resilient, but still pliable (a good thing).  I believe we all hope for a best scenario in divorcing a PD, but even covert, manipulative, adult-rights disordered individuals hold equal legal power until legal ties are cut, so best scenario will be manipulated purposefully.  In your case, the legal ties are A: marriage, B: minor children and C: asset ownership.  In mine, its A and C. 

A and C you can begin the process right away, following in my heels by moving out immediately.  C is the difficult emotional situation and stbx is going to be the 3rd child and you are fully aware of that, so we must accept imo, that it feels like were abandoning our own child. 

But, imo the longer we delay ripping the scab off this PD-infected marriage cancer, the longer the children (overall over time) remain in this toxic household.  Imo, the longer the minors remain in toxicity overall, the more affected they could become long-term.  Children are still sponges as teenagers and they are soaking up an education from both you and stbx.  I want mine to learn (even as adults) from my boldness, careful planning, and love for them. 

I did not come Out of the FOG until my kids were legal adults, but knowing what I know now, i would have ripped the scab off that cancer when they were teenagers, subjected their resilient yet pliable selves to the turmoil of the divorce process and if over 16, allowed those age children to decide for themselves with whom to remain until they fly the nest.  Keeping my kids in a toxic environment for longer, to avoid ripping off the scab, allows the infection to fester in their lives. 

Imo, these infections must be dealt with eventually and its going to take an open wound to start fresh with proper treatment.  I fully support you moving out immediately, allowing any 16 year old children to come with you if they desire.  Again, your bold move will feel like abandoning of 3 people, but 2 of them will learn through witnessed action that their father is willing to do what it takes right now to shorten the total toxic time span in their lives.

SoT

[escapingman]

SoT, thanks for you support.

Age of both my girls are between 11-13. SG tells me it is calmer when I am away but that she is under pressure to side with them and kind of is to get out of the firing line. But the hard reality is that she is still being abused when I am away, I am getting distressing messages that she then deletes out of fear that STBX will go through her phone and find them (this has happened in the past).

My plan is to get a suggestion of settlement agreement over to STBX solicitor and then push for either her to move out or me to move. How to frame it depends on how brave I am and what my solicitor suggests. Until one of us moves out I am intending to keep out of her way as much as possible, which means in my office day time, then go out for activities (with or without the children) after work and then either eat our or very late when she is out of sight. To get to the next step of the finance talk I need an appraisal of the house, I have booked this for tomorrow, I will let STBX know this by text when I am out tonight as that will trigger an explosion and her to have to clean the house from top to bottom (no one is allowed to visit unless she has done a complete clean up).  She might, or might not, try to sabotage the appraisal, but that would involve her showing her colours for someone that knows a lot of people in the neighbourhood so not likely.

Regarding the assets, I know that her biggest interest is to make sure I won't get what I want, so thinking about suggesting the complete opposite to what I want. The only thing I really want is peace and as much time with the girls as possible, wonder if she would cut them lose and leave them to me if she thinks I don't want them. But, will have to play this one a bit by ear.

As you had your moment with your STBX crossed your lines, so have I have with my STBX. For me is was when she started turning the kids (GC) against me, now when she is trying even harder I have no choice than ripping that wound completely open. I tried to work through something with it half healed but she shown that is not possible.

[hhaw]

I suggest you let your attorney ask for anything you want.  Perhaps stbx will transfer some of her hatred to your attorney IF she believes you're following orders and doing what that bad bad attorney makes you do.

I wouldn't speak to your stbx about the divorce settlement EVER ever ever ever ever and I'd be very sorry when my attorney asked for upsetting things..... I'd be puzzled and NOT appear to care for those things.... I'd say my attorney said a Court is likely to make that determination, wants to land on that settlement, usually divides assets that way and appear open to other things while blaming
My
Attorney.

I'd always be busy in the house.

I'd segue my way through the hours, active and going somewhere when the PD began pestering.

I'd record always and why hasn't your T contacted services yet?  She says there's abuse, but why hasn't she reached out to authorities? Yet.

[escapingman]

I am not talking about the divorce at all with STBX, everything is handled by my solicitor. When I say talking to STBX I mean my solicitor talking to hers, sorry for the confusion. STBX already hate, absolutely hate my solicitor so no worries there.

The reason my T hasn't reported anything so social YET is that I have told her I can manage and I think to involve social could make things worse RIGHT NOW. But, I am pretty sure she will involve them after our next session as I am not holding back any more. So far it has all been war preparations, next week the truth war will start for real. I have got to the point mentally and also got most ducks in the row. I am ready, or as ready as I can be, to take her on.