Am I not following the "clean-up" rule???

[Elsbeth]

medical insurance and such is under the ex-uNPD for the children.

the children are old enough (but not enough to be emancipated) to speak with the uNPD regarding insurance. in this particular case it was about the ordering (again) of more contact lenses. the ex-uNPD did the first 6 month order. now for the next 6 months.

well the order FINALLY was done and a box arrived ... with the wrong brand / type  of lenses ... this after the ex-uNPD delayed ordering saying they were trying a "new provider" of lenses.

and now the issue has been thrown to me to fix with the ex-uNPD telling the child that your (me) can call the doctor as the original order was canceled and I guess this one ordered???

I don't know the whole story. I can't seem to get a reply / response from the ex-uNPD and now on my to-do list for tomorrow is to call the eye doctor and see what happened, but more importantly, to return lenses that aren't the make the child wears.

I feel like I am cleaning up the mess but on the other hand, I know the ex-uNPD is just moving on to being difficult with each child in whatever way possible as there is no more communicating  with me so to speak ... orders issued by court and that's that between the ex and I.

And this isn't the first "being difficult" when it comes to children things. The ex-uNPD sent another child (and tangentally me as well, as I am copied on all higher education stuff and have monetary responsiblety for part of higher education) on a dozen email rabbit hole of word salad regarding summer classes ... again, clean up rule? the child and I both sent links to the defined answers to questions (i.e., links to the official web sites regarding the questions) and instead were replied with more emails of answer my questions, blah blah. From history, anything in an email becomes chisled in stone by the ex-uNPD if the ex thinks it works to their monetary advantage.

I'm exhausted with all of this but again ... am I enabling by not following the "clean-up" rule in these instances? I vacillate between am I fighting and making matters worse if I resist, and now I am questioning have i created the mess by "cleaning-up"

end of the day, child 1 need to take the summer classes to be employed upon graduation and child 2 needs contact lenses to freaking see (yes has a pair of glasses but predominately has worn contact lenses)

thoughts?

[Associate of Daniel]

I hear you on his refusal to read email links etc. Infuriating.

Is there a way you can live as though the ex doesn't exist on medical matters? That is, assume he won't attend/pay/organise appointments/order contact lenses etc.

Can you afford to do it all and pay for it all yourself?  If so, it might be worth doing so to ensure the children's needs are met and to minimise the drama.

How old are the children?  Can they organise/pay for such themselves?

At the end of the day, what is best for the kids? If the ex doesn't do what's right for them in these obvious situations it's pobably best you (or they) take over.

Clean up the messes that effect the children but not the ones that don't.

Easier said than done.

AOD

[Elsbeth]

I hear you on his refusal to read email links etc. Infuriating.

Is there a way you can live as though the ex doesn't exist on medical matters? That is, assume he won't attend/pay/organise appointments/order contact lenses etc.

Can you afford to do it all and pay for it all yourself?  If so, it might be worth doing so to ensure the children's needs are met and to minimise the drama.

How old are the children?  Can they organise/pay for such themselves?

At the end of the day, what is best for the kids? If the ex doesn't do what's right for them in these obvious situations it's pobably best you (or they) take over.

Clean up the messes that effect the children but not the ones that don't.

Easier said than done.

AOD

I highlighted the part I am replying to ... not sure your situation but um healthcare is expensive and it is why that is part of the ex-uNPD domain as it is a part of the ex-uNPD work coverage ... only deductibles  / copays for out of network and I've already jumped through hoops finding recommended in-network

pay out of pocket? when I win lotto

there has to be a better way  ...

[Poison Ivy]

I'm sorry you have to deal with stuff like this, Elsbeth. My children are young adults, and they were older than 18 when their dad and I got divorced, so our divorce judgment doesn't have any provisions for their support.  But I do help them financially on an as-needed basis, and for one of them, that includes helping with health care expenses, some of which go onto a shared (with the child) credit card.  My ex-husband agreed to pitch in for those expenses, but he has been paying his share from an account that isn't his. (He is his parents' caregiver and that includes banking for them.) I won't accept money that I don't know for sure is his, and he knows that.  So now I have to resign myself to the fact that I might be covering all those expenses again. It bugs me a lot that my ex is messing with me in this way.

[Associate of Daniel]

Ah.

In Australia the health care/insurance set up is very different.

Private health insurance is rediculously expensive to get worthwhile cover.  But our Medicare sytem and public hospital care is very good.

There's no way I can afford private health cover. My uNPD exH has (pretty much) top private health insurance for ds12 in a family policy with his uNPD wife.

He won't give me access to his insurance and refuses to help pay for any appointments that occur when ds is with me. So that's almost every appointment, as ds is with me during the week.

Do you have access to his insurance? Or could the children be given a card with the policy details so they can claim?

AOD

[Penny Lane]

Unfortunately the cleanup rule sometimes smacks right against your parental responsibility to make sure the kids' needs are getting met. To me, the cleanup rule is more about letting them fix problems they've created for themselves. If they're creating a problem for minor children, I do think you have some responsibility to step in.

So in this case, your ex is creating a problem for your kid by ordering the wrong contacts. Depending on how old the kid is, they maybe should take some responsibility for fixing it, and you should take the rest. Not because your ex didn't create the problem, but because he's not going to fix it.

In this scenario I do see one problem he created for himself, and that's that this is hurting his relationship with his kids. You don't have to dwell on that but I wouldn't try to smooth it over for them either by hiding the fact that he created this situation. That way when they're adults they can go into a relationship with him with their eyes open.

There are probably some areas where you can exercise the cleanup rule more successfully. For example, my DH's ex will sometimes lose the kids' birth certificates (!!! this has happened more than once) and ask DH to drop everything and rush his copies over to her so she can sign the kids up for something that she wants them to do. And his answer is, no, he'll make copies for her when it's convenient for him but he's not going to leave work for it or disrupt other commitments. Stuff like that.

Lately his strategy is to just take care of all the stuff the kids need - medical bills, the extracurriculars that we think are important, school paperwork. Because somehow there's always an issue when his ex is in charge. She takes care of some optional things (like, additional extracurriculars) where the stakes are lower and it's not as big of a deal if she drops the ball. Of course she always wants to turn it into somewhat of a power struggle over who signs the kids up for stuff. But once they're signed up (or the contacts are purchased, or whatever) the power struggle kind of becomes moot, you know?

The best thing to do, I think, is to set boundaries and try to set up a situation where you're spending as little energy as possible on him and his messes. At this point that's not none, unfortunately, but I don't think that's because you're doing anything wrong at all.

And as the kids become adults you probably will at some point be able to exercise the cleanup rule more successfully - like, if their dad creates a problem for them, they need to work with him on fixing it. That's not your job anymore. But like I said, my personal line for that is when they become adults, they can't be expected to fully do this when they're still kids/teens.

[Elsbeth]

thanks penny lane  :yeah that:

i did call the doctor office regarding the ordering (am waiting on call back - i don't quite understand the ordering of a different type of lens in the first place when the doctor does fittings to ensure the make and type is compatible before any money is spent on supplies - why would a doctor change that without the fitting????  it just sounds to me as if the ex ordered the "cheaper" and went, its the right strength, ignoring that different lenses feel and react differently and hence the fittings ... and of course the ordering is just done by an office mate not the doctor ) and i did email the ex-uNPD to reiterate that i can't clean up their mistake when it is their insurance, their credit card used to pay, their the ones with the bill / receipt for original order

of course, i've heard no response back from the ex ... but I will see what the doctor office can do  and then procede from there.

sometimes i forget how to just mindlessly do things in regard to the interconnects that remain with the uNPD-ex ...