I just had the best birthday and TG in recent memory!

[SaintBlackSheep]

I just wanted to drop by to share that, after uninviting my n/en parents for TG/my b-day celebration, and dealing with all the fallout that entails, my whole family just had the best holiday ever! We had a quiet birthday dinner and walk to look at holiday lights on my b-day. I picked the place I wanted to eat--sushi!! I did NOT have to consider anyone else's feelings, picky eating problems (dad eats like a toddler) or early bed time (nMom routinely lies about reservations only being available at 4 p.m. because thats when SHE prefers to eat!) After dinner, my kids, spouse, and I walked all over town looking at lights, at a reasonable pace and did not have to hear any complaining or worry about anyone having mobility, temperature, or bathroom issues. It was amazing!
We then went to a good friend's house for TG dinner the next day. We brought half the food, they cooked half the food. It was delightful to only have to do half the cooking, and to do so independently, without the constant useless nagging presence of my mother in the kitchen. Clean up with 4 normal adults took no time at all.

My husband and kids all wondered why I was so quiet. I guess I was just taking it all in, and RELAXING! I genuinely forgot what it feels like. My kids kept saying it was the best TG ever!!

For those of you who, like me, normally gaslight yourselves into thinking the usual expected holiday visit with PD parents "won't be that bad," I assure you that I had no idea just how BAD it really was until I didn't have to deal with it. My bull$hit barometer has been recalibrated!

[Call Me Cordelia]

That's fantastic. Many happy returns of the day, to be sure!

We had a similarly great Thanksgiving with splitting cooking. And yeah, cleanup with four *normal* adults is actually a pleasure too! I agree with you, when you have no baseline for "good" you don't know any better than to aim for "not that bad." You don't know the absence of the constant nagging until holy cow it's GONE and you can start thinking thoughts. Or just start to not be on hyper alert. Now THAT'S a head rush!

I'm keeping it. Glad you are too!

[Cat of the Canals]

I'm so glad to hear this.

For those of you who, like me, normally gaslight yourselves into thinking the usual expected holiday visit with PD parents "won't be that bad," I assure you that I had no idea just how BAD it really was until I didn't have to deal with it. My bull$hit barometer has been recalibrated!

For years, my husband insisted he hated the holidays. It was only once we put our FOO celebrations on the back burner and started making our own traditions (all very low-key) that he realized he didn't hate the holidays. He hated spending them with his PDmom. Now he's the one excitedly asking, "When are we going to put up the tree?"

[moglow]

That's great to see!! I know when I finally set aside the "you're supposed to" stuff and did what I wanted, I felt so much better. Mommie dearest actually invited me for tgiving but I'd already made plans, which I'd have probably said even if my plan was to sit at home with cranberry orange relish and a roast chicken!! She seems to think there are traditions and expectations and I'm not sure how she comes by that - we certainly have neither of those with her other than inevitable meltdown when someone fails to read her mind.

[SaintBlackSheep]

I'm glad to read some of you are basking in the freedom as well!! It's a wonderful feeling! Now that November is over, I am just starting to think about Christmas. It's 3 weeks away!! I had said back in October in the text to my mom that "Christmas is still a possibility." I've talked to them a couple of times and no mention of Christmas! Should I just ignore the elephant in the room and not bring it up? My kids are wondering if their grandparents are visiting or not, but I honestly hate to ask. Once I got a taste of the good life on TG, it's hard to go back to the way it was!

[Cat of the Canals]

I can't remember if they have a history of showing up unannounced/inviting themselves last minute or not. (My PDmil's M.O.) If so, I'd get out ahead of it and say something that makes it clear you will not be doing Christmas. Otherwise... what elephant?

[moglow]

There's no elephant, and no invitation to any imaginary or invisible elephants.   Feel free to get the kids to make a call to them Christmas morning, knowing it'll either be too early or too late or too short or something. Any way to gracefully overlook and/or talk around the subject should they bring it up?

[SaintBlackSheep]

Lort, I spoke too soon. I got a FaceTime call from them today. Dad surprised my mom with brand new carpet for Christmas???!!! (WTF Who does that but whatever.) They needed new carpet badly, but dad decided today was a great day for workers to arrive and turn their entire house upside down to remove old carpet and install new. It's freezing cold where they live and carpet has a strong odor at first. She ft'd me right in the middle of the install. It was so weird. The whole thing--every bit of it is a case study in PDs and cognitive decline!! They were both SHOCKED that their house got torn apart to have the carpet installed UNDER furniture--who would have guessed?! 

So she turned on the pathetic old grandma persona and asked about visiting at Christmas. I swear, she even batted her eyes at the camera and used her most contrite voice.    I said she and dad would have to agree to some boundaries first, and I named them. #1, stay our of our bedrooms unless invited (She thought it would be cute to hide easter candy in all of our underwear drawers last visit, then denied she did so, acted like we were crazy for not being able to find the candy she hid, then when we all finally found the candy in our underwear drawers, she yelled at my teen for not wanting her grandmother to go in her underwear drawer.) #2, not to badger anyone. (She badgered teen into a panic attack in the middle of the mall, and while I was tending to teen, she badgered then mocked my ADHD 9 year old for getting flustered about the badgering, and stuttering a response because she was so flustered. When I showed up and saw my normally very easy going 9 year old on the verge of tears right after wiping the tears of my teen, nMom tried to mock me for "investing so much money in music lessons for her when really what she needs is speech therapy for that stutter." 9 does not normally stutter, nMom was just being a jerk. She did both of these things to my kids when I wasn't there, which is classic behavior for her to isolate people then deny her abusive behavior. )

Of course, I got the whole "well I just never know what I CAN talk about with any of you because I never know what will set you off..." I shut that down right away and said "NOPE! I guess it's not a good time for a visit then! I have to go pick up the kids!" I felt myself starting to JADE but I think I stopped before it got too bad. I do anticipate some blowback, but after the peaceful TG, IDGAF!! 

[moglow]

GOOD ON YOU!! Shut it down and do what needs doing instead of continuing the insanity. I'm pretty sure you know danged well, *if* she were to agree once she's in your house all bets are off and she'd repeat ad nauseum "oh I'm not supposed to ..." the whole time she's committing said deed. 

I'd suggest your boundaries be actually enforceable - they cant get in your bedroom or anyone's underwear drawers to hide candy [who DOES that??!] if they aren't invited into your home. Plus once they're in, how the heck do you get them back out again without a scene? They go sideways and melt down over random foolishness and there's not one thing you can do. And the potshots at you and the kids? That'd be a big hell no for me and there'd be no invitations forthcoming.

I'd guess she's more apt to be on better behavior in public so consider neutral ground somewhere, maybe suggest they meet you for Christmas eve services or program, or lunch/dinner Christmas eve eve or day after Christmas.

[Call Me Cordelia]

  Well done, indeed!

Yes, if she's capable of badgering your kids to tears in the mall, no way to being behind closed doors in your home with her. Public place or her home only, where you can easily make good your escape and you are not responsible for her transportation. And she is not to be trusted around either child without you present to protect them. That's my take anyway. And it leaves her access mighty slim. That's a shame for her but your kids aren't missing much, to be sure. Her turning around and immediately trying the blame/shame game on your boundaries confirms 100% how much they are needed.

[Cat of the Canals]

Of course, I got the whole "well I just never know what I CAN talk about with any of you because I never know what will set you off..." I shut that down right away and said "NOPE! I guess it's not a good time for a visit then! I have to go pick up the kids!"

I'm also over here clapping. Bra-frickin-vo.

I'd add another ground rule to the list for any future visits: they have to stay at a hotel or airbnb/vbro/whatever. That way you can boot them from your house if they misbehave (and you know they will!). My guess is your mother is the type who "expects" to stay in your house and will throw a tantrum over this stipulation. Good! Another "Guess it's not a good time to visit then! Bye!"

[lkdrymom]

You are a true success story.  For all those who think "I couldn't possibly say NO to a parent"  watch and learn.