Super strange and rigid behavior

[Danie]

Since my UBPD mother is 80 I have been trying to let down my guard a little and see if there's any possibility of anything joyful in our relationship. She lives 12 miles away (important factor in my post) and has been widowed for 3 1/2 years. Going against the family tradition of avoiding each other and gossiping, I've tried to befriend her. I can't say it isn't working at all, but the dynamics are strange and confusing to me.

Right now she is fixated on a pink baby blanket that was a part of the haul from my grandma's house in 2007. She keeps wanting me to come and get it. She says it like it's an emergency. Or does she just hate anything associated with me and wants it out of her sight? When she calls, about this, it's business like--no warm greeting or social chit chat. She has done this with other items, like books. She'll call several times and practically order me to come and get stuff. She's so worried about mixing up possessions. In particular she's worried about giving away anything of hers.

She's so rigid about her time. She wanted me to come and get it today and orders me to call her back. I couldn't so she sets really tight restrictions on when I can get it------she has big plans to go to the senior center.

I guess I feel like I've offered my friendship and forgiveness and she doesn't want it, or I should say she'd rather control it and stay locked up in isolation controlling everything in her life. It's the first time in my life when my anxiety was down enough to be able to really consider any kind of social or friendly connection with her. I've always just been at the mercy of her Nazi-like mannerisms or just so fearful and anxious of her I couldn't do it. As a child we never ever did anything fun or joyful. I never considered her any kind of companion because she just can't do that.

This was a good step for me though: overcoming fears of her and realizing she won't change. Occasionally, like on holidays, she will try and manipulate me into creating some kind of holiday gathering and inviting her. It never works....she mucks it up so bad. We had a gathering last summer at a cousins and she rode with her sister and brother and law and when it came time to go she freaked out thinking my uncle was too drunk to drive. She made a huge pitiful scene. So trying to engage her in a get together isn't worth it.

It seems like major anxiety at the root of some of this behavior. I get headaches from just talking to her on the phone because its so darned rigid and controlling. I don't want to follow her strict orders on when I can come and go and what I can have.

Thanks for reading my post and please chime in if you'd like to.

[stasia]

This sounds really familiar to me.

The last conversation I had with M before giving up and going NC started with her absolutely freaking out about a suit that was my father's, that she wanted to donate. She was absolutely adamant that it be out of her house before Father's Day. Why? I've no idea. At that point, he'd been dead for 8 years. She wasn't moving or anything. There was absolutely no reason on earth that the damned thing had to be out of her house by that day, other than, she was totally fixated on it. And she wanted it out of the house on HER schedule, on HER terms (I had tried often in those 8 years to find a charity that she would find suitable, no pun intended, but there was always something wrong with the charity in M's mind. Usually, that "they don't REALLY want to help people." Um, OK?

That's just one example. She did this sort of thing pretty often.

I agree with you, it's about anxiety and control. Does your mom hoard? Mine does, and I think that has a lot to do with it.

[Danie]

My mom doesn't hoard, but she has strange attachments to things that cause her to get angry if you suggest it's junk. She is controlling over stuff and often uses stuff as weapons.
She gets food from the food shelf because she's poor. Not really, she has 5 bank accounts. She picks through the food and wants to give the rest back to me so I can put it BACK in my churches food shelf collection. That is the epitome of narcissism if you ask me.
When my grandma died in 2007 my mom took over. Nobody could go there. My mom took possession of everything. The stuff my grandma has promised to people, she kept. There was a cedar chest my grandpa made and she sold it to an antique shop. There was a few other things she got rid of that people were expecting. A picture from my grandma's was was promised to my sister and my mom took it and taunted my sister with it for years.
She told me to go over there and take a few things and that her husband would deliver them because he had a pickup. So my husband and I did. When it came time to have them delivered she changed her mind and charged me for them.
She took all the hoard (grandma was a hoarder) and put that in her basement. She's still trying to get rid of it, but nobody wants it now.

[WomanInterrupted]

Danie, I think your mom may be making her way over to "hoarder" territory, if she's got all your grandmother's stuff in her basement, and won't part with it - or makes excuses, changes her mind at the last minute, or wants others to pay more than an item is worth, just so she can keep it.

Here's the thing about the pink blanket - do YOU want it?

You've been told to come get it, but do you actually *want* it?

Remember, just because your mom wants to offload something, doesn't mean you're her personal Goodwill. 

What I'd do with the church donations is tell HER to donate them, herself and stop *covering* for her.   

UnBPD Didi was a hoarder, and after my grandmother died, Didi  found a crocheted crucifix necklace she'd made for my aunt, Didi's younger sister.  Didi just kept it in her dresser, complete with the note, "For J" - to her, I think it was a matter of "winning" in that her own sister didn't get something grandma had wanted her to have - and will never have, since Aunt J died about 6 months before Didi. 

That, along with everything else, went to one of several charities that came - repeatedly! -  for her massive amounts of stuff.

Didi would clean out her closets (what a joke...the woman had TEN closets stuffed full of clothes, plus my old bed was piled about 3 feet high with them!    ), and would insist I take bags of stuff home that I really didn't want.

Once I started putting up boundaries, instead of dropping stuff at the Goodwill, or heaven forbid, actually taking the stuff and wearing it (I'd NEVER hear the end of that!), I started saying, "No thank you."   

She'd act mortally offended and start ORDERING me to take the clothes - some of which were her used (but clean)  underwear    - and I'd just smile and say, "No thank you.  I'm good.  I have enough clothes.  I don't want more."

Again and again, she'd demand, try to reason me into it, or just shove bags at me that I'd always put down with, "Please stop.  I told you I don't want it."

She'd then roar or snot, "Well, what am I supposed to do with it!?" - like this was now *my* fault! 

I'd shrug and say, "You donate things to the church, all the time.  You can donate this, too."

For some reason, that would make her really angry, and she'd roll her eyes in disgust - but I never did take the clothes, or anything else I didn't want. 

All of this is about power and control, and I think when we say no to an item, they see it as us rejecting THEM - not the item.

And please remember, you don't HAVE to take items, just because she wants you to have them - but only if you come NOW, or at such-and-such date and time.

If you don't want something, you have the power to say, "No thank you" and let *her* figure out what do with it. 

[Danie]

Yes, now I see the *power* and *control* aspect of her behavior. Funny thing is, I'm not very materialistic and don't want any of her junk. I do want the baby blanket my grandma made for me.....how it got lost in the dysfunction is kind of a mystery (I'm 62 and never knew about it).

I tried to get her to talk about the baby-blanket, wondering why she had it, but now I decided I don't want to discuss it, it won't go well.

She gets very anxious about her free food-box items that she doesn't want, the ones she wants me to drive over to get. When I tell her I can't go today she will be whining and bartering. I don't mind taking the stuff when it's convenient for me because my church does a lot of food shelf collection. It is appalling to me that she accepts free food from the county because she doesn't need it and the fact that she can pick through it and expect someone else to take away what she doesn't want proves it.

I know she doesn't need financial help; last week she was complaining her "4 or 5" (she wasn't sure how many) bank statements were late.

Writing this makes me realize I've just become her sounding board for all *her* frustrations and issues, just like my childhood. And I thought maybe we could be friends and do something fun together   

I think it's time for me to re-establish what I am not willing to be or do for her. She still needs to get our of her home and I'm setting myself up to be her slave.

[Starboard Song]

Now I see the *power* and *control* aspect of her behavior.

I've just become her sounding board for all *her* frustrations and issues.

I think it's time for me to re-establish what I am not willing to be or do for her.

She still needs to get out of her home and I'm setting myself up to be her slave.

Congratulations. You are spot on.

[looloo]

One of the first things I really noticed as I started coming Out of the FOG was how "rigid" my Nmother was.  I think part of it was an early symptom of dementia, but it was also her being "her, only more so" as she got older.

Before I went NC, I'd visit pretty regularly, staying overnight often, and she'd drive me NUTS with her hovering over me all the time (not to be confused with hoovering)!  I'd try to hide out a bit in the guest room, and she'd call out for me a lot.  She even woke me up one morning, claiming to be "worried" about me  .  If I went directly to the cabinet in the kitchen where the coffee mugs were in order to get myself some coffee, she'd ask "What are you looking for?????"  I'd say very pointedly to her, "A COFFEE MUG."  She would do that with everything - "What are you LOOKING FOR???"  Even though I wasn't looking for anything - I was GETTING what I NEEDED  .  I was so uncomfortable being there, all the time...

The very few pictures I had (I've since gotten rid of them) of my parents were so awful.  My father would look like a hostage victim, he was so stiff and uncomfortable.  My mother would deliberately "perform" some action, usually acting like she was scolding the dog for something - the picture would be of my father looking like he was standing in front of a firing squad, and my mother almost out of the frame, shaking her finger at the dog...   

My mother would probably have become a full fledged hoarder if she hadn't eventually dropped her internet shopping.  Now, she doesn't use the computer all all (thank GOD!), doesn't drive anymore, and I monitor her finances.  She does grocery shop as much as she can, but her caregiver does what she can to rein her in.  I know emptying out her house and preparing it for sale will be a HUGE undertaking.  I've already downloaded a book that takes you through the process and I've even mentally plotted out how I'll tackle it (these are things I think about when I can't sleep  ).  First, the kitchen because of all the food, then a liquidator, then Habitat for Humanity...

Both my parents never could go with the flow in any situation.  I was always uncomfortable and anxious around them, and I knew they were different from pretty much everyone else I'd ever met in that way.  But I didn't say to myself "This isn't normal, this isn't ok" until my father died and my mother's behavior seemed to get worse.

[SerenityCat]

I do want the baby blanket my grandma made for me.....how it got lost in the dysfunction is kind of a mystery (I'm 62 and never knew about it).

This is just me speaking from my own experience: the blanket may not even be as described. The story of the blanket may have changed over the years.

I had to learn to make my own choices about "stuff".  Just because family makes claims about an item does not mean I have to automatically believe it or even care. I get to decide the importance or insignificance of an item to me.

Accepting an item, especially from a rigid family member, can lead to all sorts of drama. They may want to know what I did with it, where I put it, they may then insist that I have to act a certain way towards them because of this item.

[Danie]

Serenity cat, looloo, starboard song, stasia and woman interruted. Thanks for writing! I found it all so interesting.

[artfox]

I'm beginning to suspect that my FIL has some N/BP going on. He definitely has many of the attitudes mentioned above about his stuff. He and my MIL live in a four-bedroom house, and there are rooms that are so full you can barely get into them. They have his aunt's china because he doesn't want his cousin to have it. He was always trying to foist his old clothes on my DH, despite the fact that they're neither his style nor his size.

He's developed dementia, so he does less shopping than he used to, and luckily he's never been an online shopper. But he used to go to the store to pick up one thing (often a copy of the thing he couldn't find in the mess of their house) and would come home with three bags full of random stuff.

One thing that was kind of funny: they had some of DH's stuff in their house. Just kid stuff that ends up getting hauled around during moves and such. FIL kept insisting that we had to get it out of the way, that it was cluttering up the garage, etc. So we went and picked it up--about five boxes all told. After we loaded it into our car, the garage looked absolutely no different. Five boxes were barely a drop in the bucket.