Is it Acceptable Behaviour - Friendship

[BefuddledClarity]

To be honest, it's been blurred lines for me when it comes to friendship...
I don't know what's considered "bad" or "good" behaviour sometimes, or if I'm just being too...sensitive?

One of my good friends, whom I tell nearly EVERYTHING to... Sometimes he says things that irk me (mostly related to woman, but then he'll tell me I'm "cool" or "different" from those... experiences he's had with women). Idk, I feel slightly cautious. He'll say "most women (that he met, not all) don't own up to their mistakes, but you do!" Or he'll mention in "his experience" the girls he dealt with are too needy or the women he's been around have gone through multiple marriages, have many kids, smoke, drink, etc.

Then said he didn't want to date anyone that's a "project" or has too much "baggage" and...ended...the convo by saying something akin to (not exact) wanting a mellow girl he can [do sexual thing to] while watching anime...uhmm lol. Might've just been a cheeky answer but he is kinda obsessed with anime...and jokes about me being a "waifu"...

Yeah, I know this sounds really weird, and sometimes we make dark jokes, so idk if he's just being edgy sometimes or...whatever else.

I do call him out occasionally saying it's not JUST a woman/girl thing, and he'll go "oh I guess you're right" but go back to mentioning in his area/experience and didn't mean all. I get venting, because EVERYONE does. I might vent about men I've dated and even mentioned wanting to go back to dating women, but I don't believe all men are bad. I apologize usually for my crass language. I don't...want to be sexist against either sex, but I'm digressing a lot. I just..idk.. I. Probably reading into things a LOT more than I should and maybe I'm explaining this situation in an extremely biased way, as you're only seeing my point of view without viewing our messages.

It's just the language he uses makes me kinda err to the side.

I wanna get both men's and women's perspective on this...

I did talk to my uncle about something friend said to me before, and screenshot it to uncle.
So basically, I told friend I was in car accident(hit while walking), and have back pain. I self-educate with cannabis (friend is EXTREMELY against ANY kind of drug and alcohol). He said that it's my fault basically that I had back pain for years and can just exercise to get rid of pain. My friend is a bit of muscle head, he's very buff. He said that's what he did to prevent pain and explain some exercise and health related stuff to help.

All I could respond with was "thanks for your concern" (I honestly did not know what else to say)...and he ended up apologizing to me and felt bad after I gave a small response to that.

My uncle saw the screenshot I sent of the convo, and went something like "Oh yeah, as if you could magically fix your pain that you didn't cause", and was a it perturbed by friend's response.


So... I guess.. I mean, my friend usually apologizes if he offends in some way and tells me he doesn't mean to be harsh, so I don't know.

But this is only one side of him.
Usually he's silly, and very motivating type of individual. Always cheers me up when I'm down, always checks on me to make sure I'm OK.

Maybe it's just a matter of different opinions, and I shouldn't be so sensitive.

My sense of boundaries and what's considered "normal" have been destroyed by PDex, and also to an extent, my PDparents...
It keeps getting destroyed after I build it up by certain people.

In my head, I can't tell what's out right toxic, unless someone is physically hurting me or giving blunt insults, that's the only way I can tell. I don't know how to "read in-between the lines" or if I'm just seeing something that's not there...

Thoughts?

-BC

[DaisyGirl77]

To be honest, it's been blurred lines for me when it comes to friendship...
I don't know what's considered "bad" or "good" behaviour sometimes, or if I'm just being too...sensitive?

[...]

Then said he didn't want to date anyone that's a "project" or has too much "baggage" and...ended...the convo by saying something akin to (not exact) wanting a mellow girl he can [do sexual thing to] while watching anime...uhmm lol. Might've just been a cheeky answer but he is kinda obsessed with anime...and jokes about me being a "waifu"...

I had to look up what a waifu was after I finished reading your post, but it just cemented my impression.  He's been testing you to see if you'd be up for either a relationship or a FWB type situation.  In any case, everything he's talking to you about is very much him hinting he's interested in more.  But, honestly, after reading what a waifu is, this dude's got baggage, & I don't know if you'd be interested in it.  Having someone call me a waifu leaves a really bad taste in my mouth.  I don't want to be compared to some anime character someone's crushing on, like I'm a live action version of the cartoon.  Ew.  Ew, ew, ew.  All the "most women" talk "in his experience"...I get, uh, a very well seasoned hint that this dude's into incel type things.  I think he's got you set up as a kind of blow up doll in his mind.  All in all, this friend of yours gives me the icks.  Heavy icks.  That's my take.

But you're definitely not sensitive.  If anything, I think you're letting a lot more things slide because you're concerned about coming across that way.


Edit:  To answer your thread title's question:  No, I don't think it's appropriate behavior within a friendship.  It's up to you what kind of boundaries you need to draw in order to feel comfortable with this guy.  If you don't & you want to end it, that's okay, too.  If you do draw boundaries then be prepared for him to push back & suggest you're being paranoid or some such, & be prepared also to move him from "closest friend" to "acquaintance" if that happens.  Good luck.

[Catothecat]

 

While I think it's perfectly fine to attempt to map out the relationship in terms of plusses and minuses, sometimes just plain old "trust your gut" instincts can work better.  In my experience, the time worn "you're not like the others" is a huge red flag, an attempt to flatter you so the other person can manipulate you.  In truth, they most likely think you ARE "just like the others" but know the words that work to overcome your natural caution. 

I think when you trust your gut, you instinctively know when boundaries are being crossed, when words cross the line separating common bitching and venting into something more problematic.  Into something that says more about the person than their words.

[blunk]

Hello BC, I have to say that I got a heavy ick vibe from this, too. Especially...

Sometimes he says things that irk me (mostly related to woman, but then he'll tell me I'm "cool" or "different" from those... experiences he's had with women). Idk, I feel slightly cautious. He'll say "most women (that he met, not all) don't own up to their mistakes, but you do!" Or he'll mention in "his experience" the girls he dealt with are too needy or the women he's been around have gone through multiple marriages, have many kids, smoke, drink, etc.

It reminded me so much of things my bpdxh would say. All women do/say/think XYZ...and when I would call him on it and say something like I have never done/said/thought that he would reply...yeah, but you're not a woman you're my wife. I would always be left with that cringey WTF feeling. I got that same cringe reading the quoted portion of your post.

I am sorry that you're dealing with this. Generalizations like that from anyone are hurtful, but especially so when it someone we consider to be a close friend.

[BefuddledClarity]

To be honest, it's been blurred lines for me when it comes to friendship...
I don't know what's considered "bad" or "good" behaviour sometimes, or if I'm just being too...sensitive?

[...]

Then said he didn't want to date anyone that's a "project" or has too much "baggage" and...ended...the convo by saying something akin to (not exact) wanting a mellow girl he can [do sexual thing to] while watching anime...uhmm lol. Might've just been a cheeky answer but he is kinda obsessed with anime...and jokes about me being a "waifu"...

I had to look up what a waifu was after I finished reading your post, but it just cemented my impression.  He's been testing you to see if you'd be up for either a relationship or a FWB type situation.  In any case, everything he's talking to you about is very much him hinting he's interested in more.  But, honestly, after reading what a waifu is, this dude's got baggage, & I don't know if you'd be interested in it.  Having someone call me a waifu leaves a really bad taste in my mouth.  I don't want to be compared to some anime character someone's crushing on, like I'm a live action version of the cartoon.  Ew.  Ew, ew, ew.  All the "most women" talk "in his experience"...I get, uh, a very well seasoned hint that this dude's into incel type things.  I think he's got you set up as a kind of blow up doll in his mind.  All in all, this friend of yours gives me the icks.  Heavy icks.  That's my take.

But you're definitely not sensitive.  If anything, I think you're letting a lot more things slide because you're concerned about coming across that way.


Edit:  To answer your thread title's question:  No, I don't think it's appropriate behavior within a friendship.  It's up to you what kind of boundaries you need to draw in order to feel comfortable with this guy.  If you don't & you want to end it, that's okay, too.  If you do draw boundaries then be prepared for him to push back & suggest you're being paranoid or some such, & be prepared also to move him from "closest friend" to "acquaintance" if that happens.  Good luck.

To give a little more context, we did consider a relationship, but won't go for it because of the (extremely long) distance (as in, in a different country, though I tend to travel a lot, but I don't want to for him tbh) also... He's against FWB because he doesn't like high body counts (and now that I think about it, he's kinda judgemental on lifestyles different to his ...). I also told him I'm not looking to date or anything anymore because I'm not ready and need to focus on myself, I've given up on that prospect of dating...so maybe it's my fault for initially being OK with relationship then backing out, so now he thinks I still want to but not ready?...Despite making it clear it's a no.

---not that this excuses his other behaviour though, I just ... Have some fault too.

To be honest, his obsession with anime... I thought he was joking about "waifus" and liking "hentai"(which is anime p*rn), but he isn't joking. My younger brother told me I'm being too judgmental, and guys will be guys but idk ... My oldest brother thinks it's weird and unsettling, so two opposing opinions.

I like anime too, but I'm not...extreme like he is. I don't pretend to talk like one or act like one, and it feels like he thinks I act like one for being bubbly??? He said I should try and be a "V-vlogger/Virtual Vlogger" or whatever they're called. Basically, those people who use that 3D anime avatar for streaming gameplays or talking about whatever. I've ... tried it but it's too weird for me...and I'm a bit old for that (no offense to people who enjoy it, idk it feels awkward, and this is coming from an artist/animator).

I think I'll just follow your advice and slowly fall off this friendship-train.

While I think it's perfectly fine to attempt to map out the relationship in terms of plusses and minuses, sometimes just plain old "trust your gut" instincts can work better.  In my experience, the time worn "you're not like the others" is a huge red flag, an attempt to flatter you so the other person can manipulate you.  In truth, they most likely think you ARE "just like the others" but know the words that work to overcome your natural caution. 

I think when you trust your gut, you instinctively know when boundaries are being crossed, when words cross the line separating common bitching and venting into something more problematic.  Into something that says more about the person than their words.

I felt like I should've known better, because usually ANY guy who tells me something to the extent of "You're not like other girls" makes me cringe and I don't date them or talk to them after. This crept up later on, and I usually correct my friend and say they're other people like me, and he'll go "I guess you're right, it's just not like that in my area." He'll also be cynical about people in general, how there's no good people and being kind or nice is a rare mutation of genetics, and how I'm rare and nobody is like me etc etc. But ...idk... I did mention above he is from a different country than myself, so I get that certain countries may he a certain way, though I cannot say everyone from my mother's country nor the current country I reside in are all "terrible", that would be misrepresenting. I might not like some (outdated) culture aspects, but I know not everyone is like that.

So... Idk I guess ... In my head (and stupidly) I thought I could "fix" any misinformation/ignorance type stuff by telling him and him listening but idk ...He calls himself an awkward nerd and...

I noticed I tend to attract outcasts as friends/lovers for some reason but I kinda see why some were out-casted based on some of their perspectives.

Hello BC, I have to say that I got a heavy ick vibe from this, too. Especially...

Sometimes he says things that irk me (mostly related to woman, but then he'll tell me I'm "cool" or "different" from those... experiences he's had with women). Idk, I feel slightly cautious. He'll say "most women (that he met, not all) don't own up to their mistakes, but you do!" Or he'll mention in "his experience" the girls he dealt with are too needy or the women he's been around have gone through multiple marriages, have many kids, smoke, drink, etc.

It reminded me so much of things my bpdxh would say. All women do/say/think XYZ...and when I would call him on it and say something like I have never done/said/thought that he would reply...yeah, but you're not a woman you're my wife. I would always be left with that cringey WTF feeling. I got that same cringe reading the quoted portion of your post.

I am sorry that you're dealing with this. Generalizations like that from anyone are hurtful, but especially so when it someone we consider to be a close friend.

Ooof, so I'm not the only one that cringed about my friend's comment on "not like other women/girls". I'm starting to lose hope that I can make regular male friends that aren't trying to start a relationship of some sort ... I didn't mention this prior, but we're both artists and... I noticed the way he draws women...are always... Voluptuous and can look a bit vulgar? He also draws faces semi-realistic so... It was a bit odd one time because he drew me a picture. Now, in real life, I'm very skinny, tall, and "tomboy" kinda rough look or whatever you wanna call it. He drew me ... Rather curvaceous and extremely girly, and I didn't want to be rude so I said thank you but felt a bit odd. He was smart not to draw the top portion curvaceous and hid it through a hoodie, but the bottom portion lol. It was all Kim Kardashian levels of body(maybe bigger?...), even though he "hates" the Kardashians for their fake bodies...  So yeah, it looked like my face pasted on a Kim Kardashian body. 

I'm slightly sensitive about my body, since I went from a fitness-freak to being a depressed gal from life's events and losing too much weight/muscles that I'm trying to build back up. I'm underweight right now and it's depressing...

I had another male friend MANY years afo when I lived in another state, draw me before, but he did it in a normal/cute way. Nothing vulgar and I still have that picture till this day and snapped a photo of it in case it ever gets lost. It looks like a Studio Ghibli type of style, very cute.


Tbh, the only men in my life right now that take women's issues seriously is my oldest brother out of 3 brothers and my favourite uncle. They think it's gross when men talk like this and never comment on women's bodies. They also believe in women's rights and take women's issues seriously.

Every other guy has told me to "get over it" or "it's not a big deal" or "men will be men". Reminds me of that English or American (?) movie, how this woman talks about being forced into the "Cool Girl" role.


** Oh lol I write on mobile phone, it should say "self-medicate with cannabis" and no "self-educate". That sounds really funny though.

It looks like the conclusive answer is: Not Acceptable Behaviour .

I'm going to slowly stopped talking to him and go my own way... Not sure if an explanation is needed? Or if I should slowly just leave ... He knows I'm busy anyways in real life and honestly, I actually won't have readily accessible internet either anyways soon based on current circumstances.

[DaisyGirl77]

Okay...  Whew.  Lots to unpack here.  But firstly:  So much cringe.  I'm cringing so hard.  Full body shudders.  OMG.  I'm going to apologize ahead of time because of all the ewwwwwws I've got in here.  LOL.  The deeper I get into this reply of yours, the more grossed out I get.  I need several showers.

To give a little more context, we did consider a relationship, but won't go for it because of the (extremely long) distance (as in, in a different country, though I tend to travel a lot, but I don't want to for him tbh) also... He's against FWB because he doesn't like high body counts (and now that I think about it, he's kinda judgemental on lifestyles different to his ...). I also told him I'm not looking to date or anything anymore because I'm not ready and need to focus on myself, I've given up on that prospect of dating...so maybe it's my fault for initially being OK with relationship then backing out, so now he thinks I still want to but not ready?...Despite making it clear it's a no.

---not that this excuses his other behaviour though, I just ... Have some fault too.

To be honest, his obsession with anime... I thought he was joking about "waifus" and liking "hentai"(which is anime p*rn), but he isn't joking. My younger brother told me I'm being too judgmental, and guys will be guys but idk ... My oldest brother thinks it's weird and unsettling, so two opposing opinions.

I like anime too, but I'm not...extreme like he is. I don't pretend to talk like one or act like one, and it feels like he thinks I act like one for being bubbly??? He said I should try and be a "V-vlogger/Virtual Vlogger" or whatever they're called. Basically, those people who use that 3D anime avatar for streaming gameplays or talking about whatever. I've ... tried it but it's too weird for me...and I'm a bit old for that (no offense to people who enjoy it, idk it feels awkward, and this is coming from an artist/animator).

I think I'll just follow your advice and slowly fall off this friendship-train.

First off:  Relationship.  That's totally understandable for you not wanting to do a LDR.  But that aside, the fact that he's continuing to push the boundaries after you've already expressed your distaste for the things he spouts re: women, their body counts, etc., is a red flag.

Another red flag is that he had you try being a virtual vlogger in anime style even after all this.  He's literally objectifying women, & involving you in his kink/fantasy/fetish for whatever type of anime women he's into, & using YOU as his first "blueprint", all without your consent.  He's trying to see how far you'll go to change yourself to please him.

Your younger brother is being gross.  "Guys will be guys" is a cop-out.  He's excusing all this guy's boundary crossing behavior with you.  Honestly, this dude's behavior is really concerning to me.  Listen to your older brother.  He's got the way of it.

I felt like I should've known better, because usually ANY guy who tells me something to the extent of "You're not like other girls" makes me cringe and I don't date them or talk to them after. This crept up later on, and I usually correct my friend and say they're other people like me, and he'll go "I guess you're right, it's just not like that in my area." He'll also be cynical about people in general, how there's no good people and being kind or nice is a rare mutation of genetics, and how I'm rare and nobody is like me etc etc. But ...idk... I did mention above he is from a different country than myself, so I get that certain countries may he a certain way, though I cannot say everyone from my mother's country nor the current country I reside in are all "terrible", that would be misrepresenting. I might not like some (outdated) culture aspects, but I know not everyone is like that.

So... Idk I guess ... In my head (and stupidly) I thought I could "fix" any misinformation/ignorance type stuff by telling him and him listening but idk ...He calls himself an awkward nerd and...

I noticed I tend to attract outcasts as friends/lovers for some reason but I kinda see why some were out-casted based on some of their perspectives.

Okay, so he's from another country with different social mores than the country you're in.  However, this still doesn't excuse this guy's behavior.  He's being pretty slimily predatory with you here.  You're using a helluva lot of excuses to explain away his actions toward you, all of which are inappropriate & unacceptable.  I understand why, but there's a line between "Okay, so he didn't know that in My Country, we queue up to board buses." & "Okay, so he didn't know that in My Country he's saying incredibly inappropriate things & pushing boundaries & all this other behavior you wouldn't accept from, say, a coworker or a boss."  Make sense?  & the fact that he's excusing his disgusting behavior as being "awkwardly nerdy" is just...no.  All the nos.  There aren't enough nos in the world for this guy.  He knows EXACTLY what he's doing; he's just relying on your naivete & your background to get away with this shit.

You don't "attract outcasts".  You attract broken people who are trying to use you to fix them, or to use you in engaging in their--again--kink/fantasy/fetish without your consent.

Ooof, so I'm not the only one that cringed about my friend's comment on "not like other women/girls". I'm starting to lose hope that I can make regular male friends that aren't trying to start a relationship of some sort ... I didn't mention this prior, but we're both artists and... I noticed the way he draws women...are always... Voluptuous and can look a bit vulgar? He also draws faces semi-realistic so... It was a bit odd one time because he drew me a picture. Now, in real life, I'm very skinny, tall, and "tomboy" kinda rough look or whatever you wanna call it. He drew me ... Rather curvaceous and extremely girly, and I didn't want to be rude so I said thank you but felt a bit odd. He was smart not to draw the top portion curvaceous and hid it through a hoodie, but the bottom portion lol. It was all Kim Kardashian levels of body(maybe bigger?...), even though he "hates" the Kardashians for their fake bodies...  So yeah, it looked like my face pasted on a Kim Kardashian body. 

I'm slightly sensitive about my body, since I went from a fitness-freak to being a depressed gal from life's events and losing too much weight/muscles that I'm trying to build back up. I'm underweight right now and it's depressing...

I had another male friend MANY years afo when I lived in another state, draw me before, but he did it in a normal/cute way. Nothing vulgar and I still have that picture till this day and snapped a photo of it in case it ever gets lost. It looks like a Studio Ghibli type of style, very cute.

Tbh, the only men in my life right now that take women's issues seriously is my oldest brother out of 3 brothers and my favourite uncle. They think it's gross when men talk like this and never comment on women's bodies. They also believe in women's rights and take women's issues seriously.

Every other guy has told me to "get over it" or "it's not a big deal" or "men will be men". Reminds me of that English or American (?) movie, how this woman talks about being forced into the "Cool Girl" role.

Ewwwwwwwww.  He drew you like that?!  OMG.  This guy has so many issues.  OMG.  Okay, No.  Just NO.  There's nothing flattering about the way he drew you.  He sees you as a sex object, not as who you are.  He sees you as something he fantasizes about &, again, is drawing you into his world of kink/fetish without your consent.  After you've already made it clear you don't want a sexual/intimate relationship with him like that.  Notice your descriptions of the two drawings two separate friends gave you of you:  One is heavily sexualized you with barely anything on the bottom half.  You're very clearly uncomfortable in the way you describe this one.  The other is "cute" & "I still have that picture", & "cute" again.  There's a warmth here that's utterly lacking in the other description.

I love your oldest brother & your uncle.  They have the way of this.  Listen to them.  As for all the other guys you've spoken to:  Get rid of 'em.  You deserve better friends than these dudes.  You aren't a "cool girl".  You're not meant to be one.  You're meant to be YOU.  Unapologetically YOU.  So far you seem to be apologizing for the space you're taking up here.  DON'T.  You are WORTH every bit of space you occupy, & perhaps even more.  You sound like you're living your life as small as you can.  Start focusing on how to live "big".  Don't apologize for the space you take up.  Don't apologize because you find X subject distasteful.  Live LOUD.  Find yourself & be unequivocally clear about the boundaries you will have & the behaviors you will not accept from anyone.  Make 1-2 allowances if you must, but after that, mark them "unsafe" or "acquaintance only" or "medium safe" or whatever other label works for you & gauge your friends accordingly.

Repeating in all caps cuz I think you need to hear this again:  YOU HAVE VALUE.  AND WORTH.  IF SOMEONE DOESN'T RECOGNIZE THIS OR TRIES TO MAKE YOU LIVE "SMALL", DUMP THEM.

I'm going to slowly stopped talking to him and go my own way... Not sure if an explanation is needed? Or if I should slowly just leave ... He knows I'm busy anyways in real life and honestly, I actually won't have readily accessible internet either anyways soon based on current circumstances.

It's up to you how you want to handle it.  Either is appropriate in this case.  I won't presume to tell you that "You must do Option A!" or whatever cuz that's not what we're about here.  Whatever way you think is the right way is the one I want you to choose for you.

[BefuddledClarity]

Okay...  Whew.  Lots to unpack here.  But firstly:  So much cringe.  I'm cringing so hard.  Full body shudders.  OMG.  I'm going to apologize ahead of time because of all the ewwwwwws I've got in here.  LOL.  The deeper I get into this reply of yours, the more grossed out I get.  I need several showers.

To give a little more context, we did consider a relationship, but won't go for it because of the (extremely long) distance (as in, in a different country, though I tend to travel a lot, but I don't want to for him tbh) also... He's against FWB because he doesn't like high body counts (and now that I think about it, he's kinda judgemental on lifestyles different to his ...). I also told him I'm not looking to date or anything anymore because I'm not ready and need to focus on myself, I've given up on that prospect of dating...so maybe it's my fault for initially being OK with relationship then backing out, so now he thinks I still want to but not ready?...Despite making it clear it's a no.

---not that this excuses his other behaviour though, I just ... Have some fault too.

To be honest, his obsession with anime... I thought he was joking about "waifus" and liking "hentai"(which is anime p*rn), but he isn't joking. My younger brother told me I'm being too judgmental, and guys will be guys but idk ... My oldest brother thinks it's weird and unsettling, so two opposing opinions.

I like anime too, but I'm not...extreme like he is. I don't pretend to talk like one or act like one, and it feels like he thinks I act like one for being bubbly??? He said I should try and be a "V-vlogger/Virtual Vlogger" or whatever they're called. Basically, those people who use that 3D anime avatar for streaming gameplays or talking about whatever. I've ... tried it but it's too weird for me...and I'm a bit old for that (no offense to people who enjoy it, idk it feels awkward, and this is coming from an artist/animator).

I think I'll just follow your advice and slowly fall off this friendship-train.

First off:  Relationship.  That's totally understandable for you not wanting to do a LDR.  But that aside, the fact that he's continuing to push the boundaries after you've already expressed your distaste for the things he spouts re: women, their body counts, etc., is a red flag.

Another red flag is that he had you try being a virtual vlogger in anime style even after all this.  He's literally objectifying women, & involving you in his kink/fantasy/fetish for whatever type of anime women he's into, & using YOU as his first "blueprint", all without your consent.  He's trying to see how far you'll go to change yourself to please him.

Your younger brother is being gross.  "Guys will be guys" is a cop-out.  He's excusing all this guy's boundary crossing behavior with you.  Honestly, this dude's behavior is really concerning to me.  Listen to your older brother.  He's got the way of it.

I felt like I should've known better, because usually ANY guy who tells me something to the extent of "You're not like other girls" makes me cringe and I don't date them or talk to them after. This crept up later on, and I usually correct my friend and say they're other people like me, and he'll go "I guess you're right, it's just not like that in my area." He'll also be cynical about people in general, how there's no good people and being kind or nice is a rare mutation of genetics, and how I'm rare and nobody is like me etc etc. But ...idk... I did mention above he is from a different country than myself, so I get that certain countries may he a certain way, though I cannot say everyone from my mother's country nor the current country I reside in are all "terrible", that would be misrepresenting. I might not like some (outdated) culture aspects, but I know not everyone is like that.

So... Idk I guess ... In my head (and stupidly) I thought I could "fix" any misinformation/ignorance type stuff by telling him and him listening but idk ...He calls himself an awkward nerd and...

I noticed I tend to attract outcasts as friends/lovers for some reason but I kinda see why some were out-casted based on some of their perspectives.

Okay, so he's from another country with different social mores than the country you're in.  However, this still doesn't excuse this guy's behavior.  He's being pretty slimily predatory with you here.  You're using a helluva lot of excuses to explain away his actions toward you, all of which are inappropriate & unacceptable.  I understand why, but there's a line between "Okay, so he didn't know that in My Country, we queue up to board buses." & "Okay, so he didn't know that in My Country he's saying incredibly inappropriate things & pushing boundaries & all this other behavior you wouldn't accept from, say, a coworker or a boss."  Make sense?  & the fact that he's excusing his disgusting behavior as being "awkwardly nerdy" is just...no.  All the nos.  There aren't enough nos in the world for this guy.  He knows EXACTLY what he's doing; he's just relying on your naivete & your background to get away with this shit.

You don't "attract outcasts".  You attract broken people who are trying to use you to fix them, or to use you in engaging in their--again--kink/fantasy/fetish without your consent.

Ooof, so I'm not the only one that cringed about my friend's comment on "not like other women/girls". I'm starting to lose hope that I can make regular male friends that aren't trying to start a relationship of some sort ... I didn't mention this prior, but we're both artists and... I noticed the way he draws women...are always... Voluptuous and can look a bit vulgar? He also draws faces semi-realistic so... It was a bit odd one time because he drew me a picture. Now, in real life, I'm very skinny, tall, and "tomboy" kinda rough look or whatever you wanna call it. He drew me ... Rather curvaceous and extremely girly, and I didn't want to be rude so I said thank you but felt a bit odd. He was smart not to draw the top portion curvaceous and hid it through a hoodie, but the bottom portion lol. It was all Kim Kardashian levels of body(maybe bigger?...), even though he "hates" the Kardashians for their fake bodies...  So yeah, it looked like my face pasted on a Kim Kardashian body. 

I'm slightly sensitive about my body, since I went from a fitness-freak to being a depressed gal from life's events and losing too much weight/muscles that I'm trying to build back up. I'm underweight right now and it's depressing...

I had another male friend MANY years afo when I lived in another state, draw me before, but he did it in a normal/cute way. Nothing vulgar and I still have that picture till this day and snapped a photo of it in case it ever gets lost. It looks like a Studio Ghibli type of style, very cute.

Tbh, the only men in my life right now that take women's issues seriously is my oldest brother out of 3 brothers and my favourite uncle. They think it's gross when men talk like this and never comment on women's bodies. They also believe in women's rights and take women's issues seriously.

Every other guy has told me to "get over it" or "it's not a big deal" or "men will be men". Reminds me of that English or American (?) movie, how this woman talks about being forced into the "Cool Girl" role.

Ewwwwwwwww.  He drew you like that?!  OMG.  This guy has so many issues.  OMG.  Okay, No.  Just NO.  There's nothing flattering about the way he drew you.  He sees you as a sex object, not as who you are.  He sees you as something he fantasizes about &, again, is drawing you into his world of kink/fetish without your consent.  After you've already made it clear you don't want a sexual/intimate relationship with him like that.  Notice your descriptions of the two drawings two separate friends gave you of you:  One is heavily sexualized you with barely anything on the bottom half.  You're very clearly uncomfortable in the way you describe this one.  The other is "cute" & "I still have that picture", & "cute" again.  There's a warmth here that's utterly lacking in the other description.

I love your oldest brother & your uncle.  They have the way of this.  Listen to them.  As for all the other guys you've spoken to:  Get rid of 'em.  You deserve better friends than these dudes.  You aren't a "cool girl".  You're not meant to be one.  You're meant to be YOU.  Unapologetically YOU.  So far you seem to be apologizing for the space you're taking up here.  DON'T.  You are WORTH every bit of space you occupy, & perhaps even more.  You sound like you're living your life as small as you can.  Start focusing on how to live "big".  Don't apologize for the space you take up.  Don't apologize because you find X subject distasteful.  Live LOUD.  Find yourself & be unequivocally clear about the boundaries you will have & the behaviors you will not accept from anyone.  Make 1-2 allowances if you must, but after that, mark them "unsafe" or "acquaintance only" or "medium safe" or whatever other label works for you & gauge your friends accordingly.

Repeating in all caps cuz I think you need to hear this again:  YOU HAVE VALUE.  AND WORTH.  IF SOMEONE DOESN'T RECOGNIZE THIS OR TRIES TO MAKE YOU LIVE "SMALL", DUMP THEM.

I'm going to slowly stopped talking to him and go my own way... Not sure if an explanation is needed? Or if I should slowly just leave ... He knows I'm busy anyways in real life and honestly, I actually won't have readily accessible internet either anyways soon based on current circumstances.

It's up to you how you want to handle it.  Either is appropriate in this case.  I won't presume to tell you that "You must do Option A!" or whatever cuz that's not what we're about here.  Whatever way you think is the right way is the one I want you to choose for you.

No worries, you're good!
I appreciate the advice.

Maybe my English is not so good? 
I was not intending to excuse him from being from other country, I was saying the opposite. He complains about people in his country, and I understand doing that, because I've done the same to mother country and current country I reside in, but it doesn't make everyone in those countries terrible. He's saying everyone in his country is terrible... I don't get it. I mean... I know in his area there's much racial tension and politics, but that's the government and...I'm digressing. I think he is also obsessed with Japan without really...knowing Japan. My favourite uncle has been there many times, nice place. I like the idea of Japan, but I'm not going to fetishize it like that friend has been doing. Some people see it for the food, culture, people, and beautiful land others ... Only see anime and it makes me cringe..

Now I know why I get ominous feeling sometime when I talk to him...I had an inkling of something being... Off.

Yeah... Wow ew... I hadn't realized how much fetish he has. I agree with you, and I appreciate you pointing it out. I don't know what it was that was so...off. You put it easier for me to see what it is that gave me alarm go off. I kept wanting to think he didn't seriously think like this, no way! That would make him weaboo/creepy anime fan stereotype. I didn't take him seriously at all. I thought it was a joke and now I see it's not.

When he said he like anime p*rn, I LAUGHED. I thought was joke and was going to say some insulting jokes to follow-up, but no, he was serious and randomly brings it up ... I just... Left it alone and thought "maybe I'm being a prude, BefuddledClarity, maybe just leave it alone or you'll be a jerk".

Ja, I don't like weird caricatures of women being HUGE/THICK blow-up dolls, and when I saw his art style, it instantly made me uncomfortable/slightly irritated. It's not even anatomically correct from artist point of view lol.    He traces too so...(nothing against that but as artists, we see that as a no-no if all drawings are traced, only for practice is OK, but if all you do is trace the no, don't). He drew me with a HUGE butt... And covered the chest area with a hoodie(so can't see boob shape), because I'm sure he KNOWS I will say something if he even tried. I just... Why can't he just draw it like normal???

That's true... My college male artist friend never drew women like that ever. He makes them bad*ss fighters for his comics. He's a cool guy.

My younger brother doesn't watch the weird hentai p*rn, but he is a bit of a free hippy and thinks I'm too judgemental. And well, he's a lil s*x-addict and I hear about his conquests sometimes. I tell him to be safe and not be stupid... But he's ... A whole other story. 

Sometimes my "friend" will say little stuff like "Oh I see you messaged a lot, you must've been impatient waiting on me, huh?"... That's...just how I normally type is long paragraphs (we both do), but he always opens it up saying this and it confuses me??? Like, you DON'T want me to say much? Then he say "no, no I'm just kidding, type away!".


Usually men accuse me of being a "feminist" (I take no political stance in any direction, but I believe in human rights) because I open my mouth everytime I don't like something or whenever I disagree with them. They need to try harder to insult me. I don't see that as an insult lol.

When I mention Cool Girl, I don't mean me, just thought about the movie...it's supposed to elude to a woman tired of being the ideal girl for men.

My English is not good...  I'm sorry.

I only wonder out of courtesy I should tell him our friendship is not working out, or just ghost him with no explanation. We've known eachother since... November? So about...5 months of constant talking.

Just the more I talked to him, the more I feel a bit un-eased after awhile.

I agree with everything you say. It's true, it's no good to tolerate this. I was tolerating for too long. And he have bad fetish he lay onto me, it's not flattering, it's not normal. I don't want it. In my head, I keep thinking I'm being an *sshole, because every time I've stood up for myself (in general), people saying I'm a "prude" or "sensitive" or other words... So after awhile, I stop saying anything anymore, no more true opinion from me when I keep upsetting people...

But thank you Daisy, I think you are very kind and supportive. You're amazing!

[BefuddledClarity]

Slight update, my uncle liked the picture the friend drew?? Maybe since I've seen other drawings friend usually makes(ex. Huge breasts where women would cross their arms and it's bulging out, big butts, etc), I just...feel uncomfortable...this is probably his more toned down version of his usual drawings. I'm just so used to seeing the other stuff...

My uncle (for once) did not give good advice.
He told me to quit focus on dating and meditate...and I'm not even trying to date??? What??? So I don't...think he understands me.

At this point...

I kinda feel like I am too much, too annoying to people in real life. So, I will take break from uncle too. 

He didn't really seem to address any concerns I've had. Just gave generic answer of "don't worry about it".

So only my oldest brother has been helpful but...I'm just going to stick to support forums for advice and keep whatever's in head there and to no one else anymore(well, beside over here. You guys are great!).

I probably overworry too much.
I kind of feel slight annoyance now with myself and just don't want to talk much.

I've been planning on deleting some social/chat apps, so maybe it's time that I do that...

I'll just focus on myself for a while.

[DaisyGirl77]

I think your plan is a good one for now.  Focus on yourself, get your stuff straight, then tackle all the other stuff.

I'm sorry your uncle disappointed you.  Now you know that even though he's a feminist, he's still got this giant blind spot.  It really stinks when you have these realizations.

Whether you ghost this guy or tell him you're ending the friendship because he doesn't respect you as a person is up to you.  Take all the time you need.  If you can't come to a decision, place it on the back burner & let it simmer in the back of your mind until you feel at peace with the subject when you have the bandwidth to deal with it again.

Here's another squicky possibility:  You mentioned your uncle has taken multiple trips to Japan.  Are you of that race?  Or do you present as Asian?  You don't have to answer for anonymity's sake.  I mention it because that might be another reason why he continues to treat you as a sex object.  I know of people who get so obsessed over KPop or some such that they begin to fetishize Asian/Asian-presenting people & specifically seek them out to date them & live out their racist fantasies.  That's just a major concern that came up when you talked about your uncle's trips there.  Protect yourself if this is the case.

Good luck!  You've got this.

[BefuddledClarity]

I think your plan is a good one for now.  Focus on yourself, get your stuff straight, then tackle all the other stuff.

I'm sorry your uncle disappointed you.  Now you know that even though he's a feminist, he's still got this giant blind spot.  It really stinks when you have these realizations.

Whether you ghost this guy or tell him you're ending the friendship because he doesn't respect you as a person is up to you.  Take all the time you need.  If you can't come to a decision, place it on the back burner & let it simmer in the back of your mind until you feel at peace with the subject when you have the bandwidth to deal with it again.

Here's another squicky possibility:  You mentioned your uncle has taken multiple trips to Japan.  Are you of that race?  Or do you present as Asian?  You don't have to answer for anonymity's sake.  I mention it because that might be another reason why he continues to treat you as a sex object.  I know of people who get so obsessed over KPop or some such that they begin to fetishize Asian/Asian-presenting people & specifically seek them out to date them & live out their racist fantasies.  That's just a major concern that came up when you talked about your uncle's trips there.  Protect yourself if this is the case.

Good luck!  You've got this.

You've been really amazing and kind. The most I can say...is I am mixed with certain races and people only like me because it makes me appear "exotic".

That guy in general is a bit of "debbie-downer" as they say. Just always cynical and brag about being a "jerk" and how I somehow melted his heart. Like he view himself as "loveable a**hole" trope basically.

To be frank, I don't really want to be friends with people who are jerks to everyone else, even if nice to me. Not very good. I've already been there and done that, and had to cut those friends...so I guess he is no different.

Tbh, I forgot to respond to him in long time, he didn't really try contacting me much.