Why do they hate us so?

[JollyJazz]

Hi All,

I'm feeling a bit sad / reflective about my FOO today. I would have loved to have a close, warm relationship with my family members. I was the SG in the family, like so many here on these boards.

On the occasions that I see my siblings, they always get in some little dig or insult, often right away like they've been saving up and can't wait to get that hit of power/nastiness in. They also sometimes talk gleefully about how cruel they were to me when I was a small child.

It's really hard to understand why they want to be so cruel to me. I have given up now. I'm just MC/very LC, and grey rock. But it still makes me sad. I've seen other brothers talk about how much they love their sisters and would never want to hurt them.

It just makes me sad. In years past I tried kindness and things like that, but nothing really worked. In fact the only thing that has worked to a small degree is the VLC, and walking out the moment the first insult comes in.

Anyway, thanks for reading. Feel free to share your own experiences / insights.

I guess I understand a lot of this stuff intellectually, but it still hurts emotionally

[Summer Sun]

Jollyjazz, it is sad to not have loving relationships with siblings.  And IME it is a loss to be grieved until I reach acceptance.  Why they hate us may vary, but typically it is based in envy, jealousy, insecurity.  They put us down to elevate themselves.  Why?  If someone is stronger, more sensitive, caring, kind and they are not? They can feel superior and better about themselves to find some small splinter to fling.

Sure, intellectually we can understand it all, but the language of the heart, our emotions, are not always aligned because of our own needs, how we were created imho.  Maslow's hierarchy of human needs was helpful for me to understand.  We all need love and connection, it is not unrealistic to expect this of siblings, in fact society drills this into us, it is just unrealistic to expect this when we come to realize it is not achievable within one's FOO due to ZXY and beyond our control.

Hugs,

Summer Sun

[Hopelessly stuck]

I have been going through this. after a series of events, I went NC with My 1/2 Sister who was always blaming and making up lies about me to other siblings and to Our Mom. (nNPD) I have recently gone LC with My Mom because I have noticed a shift in her chats. I did discuss it with her and she went over My list of NON-achievements and what a failure I am. I said to her Yes I am a failure because I am sensitive to other peoples feelings? I didn't even know what a Narcissistic Parent was 5 years ago. It is exactly like YOU said... It is like she is saving up verbal abuse for me. (just like You say.)  My 1/2 brother who is the GC who has always been so coddled that We haven't talked about anything but the weather for decades.  Mom Has him in control. (Or at least she is afraid to pull her crap on him)


I have also been mentally going through My Whole life in My FOO and especially My relationship with her. I realize even now all the good times we had were because She needed something from Me. so, I am having flashbacks or a return of "bad Memories" especially concerning being molested by My step-dad and his family. As an Adult, I have come to realize that She probably knew it happened and allowed it to happen. I have NEVER confronted her with that fact. I have told her about two of the family members who molested me and She gets so defensive about it. So, I continue to work with My INNER CHILD trying to NOT ruminate and trying to move forward.


I am feeling lonely right now...I have sacrificed My whole life to help Sis and Mom out and Now I am just discarded. One reason is that I am Older than My Sis and can't help My Mom like I used to. So, being the N that she is She has replaced me so to speak. When she wouldn't talk to My Sis I became the peacemaker and got them back to having a relationship. My Sis is a very Jealous person. She said to me that I had had a relationship with Mom for 2 years so Now It was Her turn. I should have HEARD THIS AND RECOGNIZED IT as a warning and recognized it as a Smear campaign to come. I was trying to build a true relationship with My Sister and I had mentioned things I did not want MOM to hear. Of course, she used ALL that ammo against me exaggerating and adding other lies to the mix. 

I try and study every day the Sources and things on this site. It has been a blessing to Me. I am just at another LOW point as I get closer and closer to seeing things as they REALLY are and getting Out of the FOG. Hugs to You in Your quest!

[JollyJazz]

Hi SummerSun and Hopelessly Stuck,

Thanks for your responses!

SummerSun - thanks for that. Your point about grief is a good one. I think I need to work on this.
I now have a T again, so I will bring it up with her and try and work through it. I also need to remember and reach out to healthier friends and family members.

Hopelessly Stuck, thanks for your kind words. I'm sorry to hear about what you have had to go through as well. Best wishes to you, it sounds like you are doing a lot of good things to move forward with this.

[kiwi2]

I am sorry for what you going through Jollyjazz,i can totally relate to it. Why do they hate us ?Hmm, well hard to tell but yes that exactly how i feel myself,i almost feel like i have been given to carry a big bowl of hate from my sister now throughout the years that remains unresolved and that she seems unconcerned of. But like previous speakers have said its not about us its about them. And it may be hard to untangle since they are our siblings and the whole thing cuts to the very core of us and speaks to the child we once was. Like you i can see it intellectually but I am not there quite emotionally. In due time i think we can though and the key to it is acceptance perhaps and grieving the hell out of it. An internal funeral process that seems  limitless. Wishing you well on your journey.

[GentleSoul]

I was listening to a podcast recently that suggested the reason PD's and also addicts hate people is because they actually hate themselves so are hateful to others in an effort to feel better about themselves. 

Just something to think about.

[JollyJazz]

Hi Kiwi2 and GentleSoul,

Thanks for your replies.

Yes I agree, it does seem to be more about them than us!

I also think I have to remember all the good and kind people that also like me That's something!

[GentleSoul]

Hi Kiwi2 and GentleSoul,

Thanks for your replies.

Yes I agree, it does seem to be more about them than us!

I also think I have to remember all the good and kind people that also like me That's something!

Jolly Jazz, I am coming to see it is about them and the thoughts and outlook in their mind rather than us. 

Unfortunately as the people closest to them, we are in the firing line for the unpleasant behaviours.  I can see it really isnt personal, they would do it to whoever was there.  I used to think it was because of faults in me.

I can now see my best option is to simply move away when it starts. I used to try and "help" but I now know I cannot.  It is the thoughts or feelings my husband/my mum, dad & my sister are having that causes them to act out.

I now fully accept the Three C's. 

[treesgrowslowly]

Hi JollyJazz,

It is sad. It is heartbreaking when our FOO members are not able to show kindness and respect to people they are related to.

We deal with the heartbreak by talking about it as you have here. By being honest about how sad you feel about this, you are living more authentically.

When we ourselves are authentic about how we feel, we notice it more and more when people are covering up their pain with insults, and other forms of hurting others. I believe that when people confront themselves and consider their own pain as something they need to address, they stop hurting others. Unfortunately a lot of people believe that their defense mechanisms are who they are. In my FOO there is just denial.

If I engage with them, its never with authenticity. They are in denial about their emotional needs. I chose NC for my own sanity. Their entitlement towards me drove me away and I'll always wish I had different FOO. It is sad.

Being authentic about how we feel is necessary for us to recover. But in a family it seems that its the SG and Hero that finds themselves realizing as adults often, that there are some family members who cannot seem to be kind, and even some family members who are kind outside the family play the role of flying monkey for a PD parent. Leading a double life instead of integrating into one life not two. Usually because they do not want to deal with challenging themselves and the toxic people they are allied with in the family.

If it was not for this website I would never know how many of us there are. I would be pulled under by the sadness because our culture tries to make us believe that all other families are loving and ours is an isolated experience somehow.

We pull away from the dysfunctional family system and express ourselves authentically, and find ourselves without FOO relationships in adulthood because our relatives are commited to their denial. I wish I knew how to get FOO members to get Out of the FOG but I cannot say that I do. They are committed to their denial.

There is a lot of grieving along the way with this journey but we're not alone.

[LemonLime]

I've come to the conclusion that they "hate" us because they hate themselves.  We are a mirror to them.  When they see us, they see how ugly and hateful they're being.   So their inclination, instead of working to make themselves better, is to "break the mirror"  (ie destroy us).

It's a Catch-22, because no matter how patient and kind and compassionate we are, they can turn that around to us being "pious and patronizing and inauthentic".    OK.......so what are we supposed to do then?    I guess what they want is a fight, so that they can then play victim again.  What do they get out of playing victim?    A sense of purpose, a role to play, an excuse to be unproductive, a person to blame for their problems.....in short, a way to avoid being a responsible flawed adult who is vulnerable.    I think under it all is an unwillingness to be vulnerable.   And that is sad, because somewhere along the road they learned it was really unsafe to be vulnerable.

[guitarman]

Yes it does hurt. That is because you are a kind, caring person who feels. Abusers don't care and don't feel. If they did they wouldn't ever hurt you. That's what I've learnt. They only care about themselves.

Abusers know exactly how to push all your buttons. You are the target of their abuse. They take great delight in knowing you get upset and hurt. Ignoring them is what they hate and despise. Not reacting and staying calm doesn't fuel their narcissistic supply.

I try and calmly brush off all the mean and nasty things my uBPD/uNPD sister says to me. I don't show her how upset she can make me feel. She projects lots of her own fears onto me. What she says to me is what she is feeling about herself.

You have to look after yourself first. You are doing the right thing by going Grey Rock or calmly leaving. You do not have to be abused. I know it's not easy when it is a family gathering. Being more detached and not engaging helps when all your buttons are being pushed.

Learning not to take the bait and not participating in the absurd mind games helps me to stay sane. I'm only human. Sometimes I get angry but I forgive myself and say that I will try better the next time.

guitarman X

[newlife33]

I was listening to a podcast recently that suggested the reason PD's and also addicts hate people is because they actually hate themselves so are hateful to others in an effort to feel better about themselves. 

Just something to think about.

I can second this.  My grandmother, dad, brother, sister and aunts all really have miserable outlooks on the world and are almost always in a bad mood or judging or acting negativly.  When I was talking to them in my childhood they would always project their own bullshit and problems onto me.  I was more of a pincusion or venting board for them and less a human child. 

As I've gotten older I've developed more self confidence, boundaries and disipline and it doesn't have that much of an effect on me anymore.  It can get better with time away from PD's, therapy and support groups.  I wish you the best of luck.

[newlife33]

I've come to the conclusion that they "hate" us because they hate themselves.  We are a mirror to them.  When they see us, they see how ugly and hateful they're being.   So their inclination, instead of working to make themselves better, is to "break the mirror"  (ie destroy us).

It's a Catch-22, because no matter how patient and kind and compassionate we are, they can turn that around to us being "pious and patronizing and inauthentic".    OK.......so what are we supposed to do then?    I guess what they want is a fight, so that they can then play victim again.  What do they get out of playing victim?    A sense of purpose, a role to play, an excuse to be unproductive, a person to blame for their problems.....in short, a way to avoid being a responsible flawed adult who is vulnerable.    I think under it all is an unwillingness to be vulnerable.   And that is sad, because somewhere along the road they learned it was really unsafe to be vulnerable.

They love playing victim of getting someone to lose their cool.  It feeds their addiction of drama and chaos.  Instead of bettering themselves or doing good deeds or connecting with people, they simply bulldoze through life creating chaos, misery and drama because that at least distracts them from their horrible emotional coping mechanisms and the fact that they can't admit their faults and a host of other insecurites.

It's so unfair to us because the very people who should give us safety and the ability to be vulnearble are the ones who not only didn't do that, but they activliey tried to abuse and destoy my soul.  It's tragic.  But not a death sentence, we can all recover with time.

[FinallyPeace]

I was listening to a podcast recently that suggested the reason PD's and also addicts hate people is because they actually hate themselves so are hateful to others in an effort to feel better about themselves. 

Just something to think about.

Yes, I would agree with this.  It doesn't hurt any less, but it is true.

[sandpiper]

Siblings and Why do they hate us. Hmm.
I think it starts with the child-pitting that seems to happen in PD families. We are set up to be enemies, not allies, because if we are given a skill set to develop allegiance with our siblings and our peers, then that could lead to mutiny and that would depose the abusive PD parent.
We grow up in a dangerous and unpredictable environment where every step of the journey is one of dodging bullets and landmines, and if the artillery misses you, odds are it will hit your sibling. And the resentment over that just festers, over time.
It's just not conducive to developing a good relationship that's going to sustain you through later life.
Other than that, during the good times, you're competing with your siblings for love, affection, approval, resources - and it's never fair or predictable, who will get the rewards. It usually happens at someone else's expense.
Growing up in that kind of dysfunction  simply sets us up, later in life, to be at war with each other, or at very best you know that you can't trust each other.
Sometimes you see siblings overcome that, but it's hard work and I don't think anyone can get to that point of being friends or allies without doing a lot of internal work, probably with a therapist.