Parenting Plan

[WhiteWolf]

Moved onto a new forum after years of abuse. Yay!

Now trying to wrap my head around writing a parenting plan. I currently have an OP for myself and minor kids. No contact for all.

I'm going to have a long chat to the lawyer about specifics. But for those who have been there, what do I need to include on the plan, not forget or other details that were/are important to you? Kids safety around stbPDx are paramount.

[Penny Lane]

Hi WhiteWolf, and congratulations (I think?) on moving over here. I'm glad you were able to obtain an OP and I hope it is giving you some amount of peace.

I have some observations from living under my DH's parenting plan with his updxW, and also helping him navigate a modification several years in.

Basically, the pd is likely not going to follow the plan unless they absolutely have to, while at the same time harassing you about following it to the letter. And not just you following the plan but they will create insane interpretations of what the plan says, and somehow the interpretation always benefits them and hurts you.

So! You might not be surprised to hear that I don't think boilerplate language is very useful. I mean, sure, some of it can be the basis, but a lot of things that lawyers recommend assume that both coparents will be a certain degree of reasonable, and will eventually start putting the kids first.

My other observation is that DH's ex uses everything she can do within the bounds of the parenting plan to harass DH and, now, me. So it's best to limit face to face interactions.

What that might look like for you:
-- Supervised visitation at a center! If that's on the table, really really try to get it.
-- If you can get decision making power (whether it's officially called custody or whether it says "in cases of disputes mom decides") that is also ideal because it means you can cut off "discussions" that aren't going anywhere.
-- Extremely clear schedule, with minimal drop offs and pick ups. Leave nothing to interpretation. Don't build any flexibility into the plan.
-- Consider holiday time, vacations etc. Try to make the process as simple and clear as possible. For example, don't split Christmas at 2 p.m. or whatever. One parent has the kids for Christmas, the other for Thanksgiving - or something like that - is a much better arrangement.
-- Vacation time has been a huge headache, this is a YMMV situation but DH's ex hates hates hates that he goes on vacation and tries to do everything in her power to disrupt it, so anything you can do to spell out vacation time is a plus.

Things to avoid:
-- Right of first refusal - in our experience it led to her pretty much stalking DH while at the same time leaving the kids with a variety of random people
-- Shared birthday parties, Halloweens, parent teacher conferences - try to get in the habit of, your time is your time and his time is his time (even if it's supervised) and there's as little overlap as possible.
-- Unenforceable statements - I mean, it's fine to say "parents will share documents with each other," but just know that he will not in fact share documents with you. Better is a statement "parents agree that they shall have access to all medical educational etc documents" because you can show that to a doctors office or teacher and they will provide you with the document your ex is withholding.

Good luck! This is a very important step, and getting it right will make your life a lot easier. But also - your ex is going to mess with you no matter what, so there is a limit to how helpful a parenting plan will be. So don't put total pressure on yourself, get the best deal you can and take care of yourself in this process and hopefully enjoy your time with your kids!

[vanillasea]

Wow @PennyLane thank you for all of that!

I fled and not even involved with lawyers yet but I know it's coming. He is already using the kids to get to me and threatening me so all of this will be helpful for that day when it comes.

Can't expect them to act like adults but thanks to the system have to pretend they will do their share and parallel parenting only.

I'm starting to think you have to let them have their narrative and then ignore when not around...

[WhiteWolf]

What a wealth of valuable info there Penny Lane! I really appreciate your time and advice. Thank you.

[hhaw]

WW:

If you have an OP for the minor children.....
does the Court have reason to believe the children won't be safe when with the stbx?

If the Court already believes the PD isn't safe to be alone with your shared children..... ask for supervised vistiation.  The very best, iME, is through a visitation facility with many levels of supervision.  Some record everything and send reports to you and the Courts after each visit.  Some will drive the children to a visitation site and BE THERE, with the kids, the entire time to ensure safety.

What are you worried about regarding safe visitation?

What can you prove?

What does your attorney say about visitation and protecting your children?

Do your children feel safe with their father?  Ae they asking to see him?  Do they mind seeing him on their own?

DOn't give an inch of what you've gained with your PO. 

If those children need supervised visitation.... ask for it and stick to your guns.

Having a trusted friend or family member supervise is drudgery and most people are worn down by the committment and dealing with the PD, IME.  It's difficult to stand up to a PD and say no when they're constantly changing things and pushing boundaries by inches and feet ALL THE TIME.  Without fail.  Just.... bc it's what PDs do. 

To put supervised visitation in place, it's likely you'll need to put some kind of limit on it CONTINGENT on the PD behaving appropriately for a certain amount of time.  IME, the PD won't want to accept ANY superised visitation and will refuse anything offered IF it includes supervision by anyone other than someone he knows he can manipulate or scare into compliance.  That's another good reason to ask for a supervision facility up front.  People who will hold the PD's feet to the fire and not let him get away with ANYTHING for a minute.  No whispering to the kids or saying things like he wanted to be a good daddy and have a family BUT YOU ruined the family and won't let him be a good daddy, etc.  He won't get away with anything.

Whatever he did...... don't let him get away with failure to comply with that PO.... not for a second.  The proper way to report is to call the police and file reports, btw.  Continue documenting and be ready for a long drawn out divorce and visitation schedule fight. 

Don't let the PD get your hopes up about settling,bc PDs often SAY they'll settle, then change  their minds after Court dates have been cancelled and the attonreys wasted thousands of dollars "crafting" an Order the PD never planned to sign, so don't cancel ANYTHING until you have a signed, filed and stamped COPY in your hand.

In fact, don't agree to any settlement discussions without first having an understanding any Agreement will be hand wirtten at that meeting, signed and filed that day, by your attorney.  ONLY cancel trial dates adn hearings and depositions when you have that filed SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT in your hand, enforcable through the Courts..... is my suggestion.

Most attorneys don't operate that way, don't want to do things out of the box, but soon enough everyone will understand why you're asking.  Just stay polite and patient and don't tell people what to do.... rather... tell them what you need and what your CHILDREN need.  It's more difficult for people to talk you out of things your children need.... stick to what's best for the kids... the kids...the kids.

Be wary of everyone eventually pressuring you to give in on settlement items, bc everyone eventually sees you're the ONLY sane litigant in the room.  Sometims our own attonreys will lean on us just to get OUT of the case, IME.

Stick to your guns on those things you HAVE TO HAVE.  Make a list of things you can't give up and things you can..... tell your attorney what you need and make sure they appear very reasonable. 

good luck