Yes as per other thread. All because brother has said he can't visit as much, he says I need to step up, and I've said I do what I can already....
Apparently, "he'll have to go into a home".
I was thinking though about what criteria someone would need to have to take this step. With Dad:-
1. He has "meals on wheels" 5 times a week, he could have then 7.
2. He is able to cook for himself.
3. He is continent and able to use the bathroom and also wash himself.
4. Hes got someone in to clean once a week.
5. He can get around his apartment.
6. I do his shopping (and brother does) and theres always the home delivery option.
Yes his knees are shot and he walk probably 500 yards. And hes got pain I get that.
Apart from that I can see no reason why he should say "I can't manage without help so I'll have to go into a home".
Looks like a bit of waifing to me and what he really can't manage without is the amount of narc supply he currently gets.
To be honest though he'd love living in home. All those care assistants at least getting paid for pandering to him.
Never going to happen because there is no medical need for it at the moment. Anyone else here from the UK?
I understand he'd have to fund it himself if hes got savings over a certain limit (he has!). He'll expect it to be £200 a month or something - hes in for a shock.
When he says it, I would put on my best perky happy voice and say "that's a fantastic idea dad! Why didn't I think of that!" :evil2:
I have to agree. He is a perfect candidate for assisted living. Next time he says that tell him that is a wonderful idea. Point out that he would never have to worry about either of you making time for taking him grocery shopping ever again....Win-Win.
Quote from: Andeza on November 03, 2019, 10:02:04 AM
When he says it, I would put on my best perky happy voice and say "that's a fantastic idea dad! Why didn't I think of that!" :evil2:
Yes that would shock him. He'd never do it though because it costs money!
This is his "woe is me, no-one will look after me, I'll have to go away to die" speech.
Quote from: lkdrymom on November 03, 2019, 12:58:59 PM
I have to agree. He is a perfect candidate for assisted living. Next time he says that tell him that is a wonderful idea. Point out that he would never have to worry about either of you making time for taking him grocery shopping ever again....Win-Win.
He is. They'd throw him out after a month though because hes such a PITA!
Quote from: p123 on November 03, 2019, 02:05:34 PM
Quote from: lkdrymom on November 03, 2019, 12:58:59 PM
I have to agree. He is a perfect candidate for assisted living. Next time he says that tell him that is a wonderful idea. Point out that he would never have to worry about either of you making time for taking him grocery shopping ever again....Win-Win.
He is. They'd throw him out after a month though because hes such a PITA!
Trust me, they have seen much worse. My father likes to visit the nurse's station around 3am with a belly ache. They are paid to handle people like him....that is what makes the difference.
When my grandmother didn't get her way she would threaten suicide and my response would just be a simple "OK". Everything is to get attention. My father would go to the ER for routine things because he would wait to deal with it until after regular dr hours. He could walk to his doctor but needed a ride to the ER, therefore involving me. One time I told him I could drive him to the ER but I could not stay. Well he managed to con me into waiting with him. After two hours of waiting I told him I had to leave and he snapped that I should just take him home so he could die. Seriously...we were there because his catheter bag had a leak.....why he couldn't slap a piece of duct tape on it and wait until the doctor's office was open was beyond me (and fyi No I was not touching that thing so it wasn't going to be me to do that). He got told off right then and there. I stayed until the nurse took him back and she looked at me like I was the most terrible person in the world when I told him I had to leave. I was at the point that I no longer care what others think of me. I was at my limit of dealing with this. I just walked out. That nurse probably thinks I am the world's worst daughter. She doesn't know the HUNDREDS of hours I spent in the ER with my father over NOTHING. I did not have another 6 hours to waste on a Saturday afternoon.
Quote from: lkdrymom on November 04, 2019, 06:55:58 AM
Quote from: p123 on November 03, 2019, 02:05:34 PM
Quote from: lkdrymom on November 03, 2019, 12:58:59 PM
I have to agree. He is a perfect candidate for assisted living. Next time he says that tell him that is a wonderful idea. Point out that he would never have to worry about either of you making time for taking him grocery shopping ever again....Win-Win.
He is. They'd throw him out after a month though because hes such a PITA!
Trust me, they have seen much worse. My father likes to visit the nurse's station around 3am with a belly ache. They are paid to handle people like him....that is what makes the difference.
When my grandmother didn't get her way she would threaten suicide and my response would just be a simple "OK". Everything is to get attention. My father would go to the ER for routine things because he would wait to deal with it until after regular dr hours. He could walk to his doctor but needed a ride to the ER, therefore involving me. One time I told him I could drive him to the ER but I could not stay. Well he managed to con me into waiting with him. After two hours of waiting I told him I had to leave and he snapped that I should just take him home so he could die. Seriously...we were there because his catheter bag had a leak.....why he couldn't slap a piece of duct tape on it and wait until the doctor's office was open was beyond me (and fyi No I was not touching that thing so it wasn't going to be me to do that). He got told off right then and there. I stayed until the nurse took him back and she looked at me like I was the most terrible person in the world when I told him I had to leave. I was at the point that I no longer care what others think of me. I was at my limit of dealing with this. I just walked out. That nurse probably thinks I am the world's worst daughter. She doesn't know the HUNDREDS of hours I spent in the ER with my father over NOTHING. I did not have another 6 hours to waste on a Saturday afternoon.
lkdrymom - sounds similar to my Dad. The number of "fake" illnesses must run into the 100s by now.
Trouble is I'm in the UK at the mercy of the NHS and nothing appears "joined up". The GP refuses to visit now, ambulance too but no-one has done anything about it.
Oh and I've had MANY "looks" and "comments" from nurses who look at me "abandoning" such a sweet old man. He turns it on like a charm.
Of course, at this point they dont know there is sod all wrong with him and hes just playing up because he can.
Well bit of an update. Apparently brother thinks its "not fair" that his wife does things for Dad and my wife does nothing. Dad says he is right and he can't understand why she can't help out.
Honestly, it defies belief. I think Dad will try roping my kids into his "help me" posse when they're old enough. That Dad thinks that my wife "should" help him on her days off - I'm honestly flabbergasted. I think he needs reminding that my wife is ill, struggles to work part-time as it is, looks after the kids - yet Dad thinks the odd days off she gets to rest she should drive 25 miles to do menial tasks for him. And does he really not realise that, after all hes done, she doesn't want anything to do with him? And doesn't he think my wife might have things with her parents? (Can imagine his face - can't visit today Dad I'm doing shopping for my MIL)
Dad is not even ill or need "help" as it is. Honestly, it is like he thinks that everyone has a duty to run around after him.
Its always something new with a narc. It NEVER ceases to amaze me. You couldn't make some of these things up.
I'm trying not to get myself wound up about it. Trying to chill and let them get on with it. Its working. Some of his FM (cousin who in the past has said "you need to look after Dad") is beginning to realise as Dad asks him for lifts here there and everywhere. And lets him push him around in a wheelchair. (hes 3 years younger and Dad is not light).
Quote from: p123 on November 04, 2019, 10:51:20 AM
Honestly, it is like he thinks that everyone has a duty to run around after him.
That's exactly what he thinks. PwPDs believe that we all exist to cater to their every need and whim. We don't have lives of our own. And yes, he's going to rope your kids in as early as he can. Has to ensure the next generation is doomed as well.
So, as we say here in the states, do you have a game plan to stop it from happening?
Quote from: Andeza on November 04, 2019, 10:58:32 AM
Quote from: p123 on November 04, 2019, 10:51:20 AM
Honestly, it is like he thinks that everyone has a duty to run around after him.
That's exactly what he thinks. PwPDs believe that we all exist to cater to their every need and whim. We don't have lives of our own. And yes, he's going to rope your kids in as early as he can. Has to ensure the next generation is doomed as well.
So, as we say here in the states, do you have a game plan to stop it from happening?
Ha ha mainly "ignore them both!"
Yes, he does think everybody has a duty to run around after him, and you have NO lives other than to serve! :aaauuugh:
It's almost like he thinks you all sit on shelves, in suspended animation, waiting for him to snap his fingers or bellow for groceries or a ride to the hospital before you hop off your shelf and just FETCH! DO! BRING! CARRY! DRIVE! :sad2:
And when you're done, you just jump up and sit on that shelf again, waiting for your orders. :snort:
That's all he sees you and everybody else as: a means to an end. OBJECTS to use and discard when they don't work - or keep kicking until they do work again.
Right now, you and your wife are a malfunctioning washer and dryer, so he's going to keep kicking you until you work. When your kids are older, he'll treat them like a blender and a microwave, and start (proverbially) slapping and hitting them, because they SHOULD be taking care of him. >:(
Should: NO. :hulk:
That's what he thinks. What *he* SHOULD have done is hire a housekeeper, have his groceries delivered, and hire an aide to check on him, several times a week. :yes:
None of his care falls on you - and yes, the next time he bleats about having to go off to a home, I'd tell him it's a FANTASTIC idea, and he'll have all the care he needs, right at his fingertips! :yes: 8-) :thumbup:
I'm not sure how your laws work, but over here, anybody can go into Assisted Living if they feel they need or want to be there. You don't have to be in X or Y poor physical condition. You can just say you're old, tired, having a hard time getting around, and are tired of being so isolated. You'd rather live in a facility where there are other people, and there's a medical staff available.
Basically, once you disclose your full financial details, nobody cares if there's anything wrong with you, as long as you can afford to be there - or are having a lawyer shelter assets so Medicaid kicks in.
I don't know if you have anything like Medicaid (government insurance for those with very little to no income), in addition to Medicare for those 65+ and older.
Without going down the rabbit hole of trying to explain a system that doesn't apply to you, does your dad have any kind of supplemental insurance, in addition to his NHS policy? Are there services or supplemental policies he can apply for? :Idunno:
Your wife might be the one to ask, since she's our version of a Visiting Nurse - or she'll know the right people to ask. Or the people she knows might know the right people to ask. :yes:
Oddly enough, the Social Worker from Ray's supplemental insurance company was the one who told me to call an eldercare attorney, STAT. (She used to work for a nursing home and knew the system.) So you just never know who will turn out to be your ace-in-a-hole. 8-)
Let your dad waif about going into a home - agree with him. Encourage him. Tell him it's the next best thing to sliced bread and watch him try to throw out something about going there to DIE. :dramaqueen: :violin:
We have a LOT of seniors in this area, which means there are loads of commercials for Adult Independent Living, Adult Day Care, Assisted Living, Rehab, home health care, having your FOO or FOC certified to be paid to be your caregivers - you name it, it's being advertised and played up as being so wonderful on TV - and I'm sure a lot of it is, as long as there's no PDs in the mix. :spooked:
One place has the slogan, "People don't go to a nursing home to die. They come here to LIVE." :yes: 8-) :)
I suggest you borrow that and say it to your dad if he suggests he's going to creak and shamble off on his bad knees to go die in a forgotten corner of a nursing home, alone, with no groceries, and unable to play the ponies. :violin: :violin: :bawl: :dramaqueen:
He's going to keep upping the ante and pushing his agenda - but he can't do a damned thing except smear you and spout SHOULDS to your brother, who spouts them back to you, while your brother does pretty much NOTHING for your dad, who expects you and yours to drive 50 miles, so your brother doesn't have to go ONE MILE because it interferes with his drinking. :stars:
That's crap and you know it. :blowup:
That's why I say to *never* tell him anything other than you are BUSY and if pushed (or you feel guilty about not JADEing), state only that you're getting swamped at work, and your wife is also getting slammed - you both have too much to do and not enough hours, so your dad will have to figure out something else and take care of his own problems. :ninja:
You work on computers (IT) and your wife is a nurse - around here, you really can't work enough hours at those jobs. :yes:
He'll probably gripe to your brother or the other relative, and if they call you, I'd say, "I told him we can't do it, and if you're that damned concerned, YOU take care of it and leave me out of it." - then hang up. :ninja: :evil2:
And oh yes, those looks - at least until people got to know unBPD Didi and unNPD Ray. Then those looks stopped. 8-)
But when I'd get them from strangers who wouldn't have a chance to get to know them, I just didn't care. I pretended I was wearing Teflon armor, because those people didn't live my life or know the dynamics - they had no idea WTF I was up against. :ninja:
I haven't heard this mentioned, but it popped into my head, and if it pops into my head, I always say something, just to be on the safe side: Do NOT have your dad over to your house, for any reason. :no:
You said he played at being so sick and near death's door, not able to move last Christmas - he'll probably not only do the same thing, but manage to have some kind of "accident" where he *can't go home again and HAS to stay with you, indefinitely*, while refusing to go to the hospital, and making you feel guilty as hell for *allowing him to get hurt by not being careful enough with him.* :aaauuugh: :aaauuugh:
Yes - he'll make it *all your fault* and guilt you into letting him stay for a visit he's got NO intention of ending, while paying for NONE of the food or supplies for his upkeep - and he'll complain to your brother that you and yours *still don't do enough for him* - that's why he's selling the house and giving your brother all the money. Because He Who Holds Up The Bar deserves it, and you who bust your ass off, trying to please that which can't be pleased gets *nothing but the shaft.* :phoot:
If I just scared the hell out of you, GOOD. You should be scared, because there's nothing they won't stoop to, to get their way! :sharkbait:
He's probably going to up his efforts to come to your house - don't. You don't even have to see him, if you don't want - you ARE busy with work, after all! Those computers just won't fix themselves, and Boxing Day does sound like one of those high-volume days. :bigwink: (I don't care if you sit in your jammies with the kids and eat Christmas cookies until you all puke - that's being BUSY and your dad doesn't have to know that! ;D ;D :ninja:)
I keep bringing what you do down to a base level, intentionally - I think your dad might understand it a bit better, or as much as he *wants* to understand anything. :roll:
And don't even mention being self-employed. Mention the boss won't give you time off. You don't have the time accrued - and it's all hands on deck, 'cuz you're so busy. The boss is strict but fair and you like your job. :)
You *can* do this - don't worry about World War III, which will be nothing but words and FOG - worry instead about self-preservation, and the quality of life of you and your FOC. :yes:
Start putting them *first* - that includes you, too - and everything will start falling into place. 8-)
:hug:
I did explain to my brother the issues I have because I know that 6 months down the line it'll come out and he'll say "well if you'd told me that I didn't know". So he knows. And I've said no.
It amazes me that his attitude is "dad needs this so sort it out" and "I've decided what we're going to do and YOU ARE taking your turn".
Thing is my brother is the most selfish individual you could ever meet. Hes got three kids from two previous relationships he just does not bother with. Moved on to new partner. And hes having a go at me for responsibilities?
Yes over here you can choose to go into a home IF YOU PAY. As you may know, healthcare is free (albeit crap) here in the UK.
If you're ill and can't look after yourself the good ole NHS will pay for you're care home. Not without a fight though and only as a last resort. To be fair they have no money. And, as you can imagine, it aint going to be a 5 STAR home. It will provide basic care.
Since there is pretty much NOTHING WRONG WITH DAD hes got no chance at all.
There is private health insurance in the UK but its not THAT common. Basically pays for things quicker than the nhs. Most of the consultants work NHS in the day and do private work on top.
But bottom line, if you want to go into a home you are paying if you have got more than £23K of assets including your house. They will freeze this and take it off you when you die as well. And they know every trick in the book trying to hide the money. i.e. you cant just transfer £50K to your sons bank account -they get to see all of this.
Over the last 20 years I've tried to tell Dad - dont save all your money it may get taken off you. Give it away. I always remember brother needing a car and he had no money - I talked Dad into giving him some money. I was thinking £5K Dad thought £300. Great eh? That was years ago - that £5K now sitting in his account would have been gone and forgotten about by now by the authorities. (There is a time limit and you can reasonably give some away). Dad never listened, too obsessed with how much money he had in the bank. In the end, I gave up. It will end up VERY badly when he realises, if it ever comes to it that its all taken off him. Care homes are not cheap - certainly not the £50 a week Dad is thinking. Sometimes it amazes me how thick he is sometimes.
Work. Yes my wife works part-time as a Visiting Nurse (I like that!). Shes MEGA busy. She has fibromyalgia and REALLY struggles. I often have to tell her to tell work NO to extra shifts because she needs the rest at home when kids are in school. You can see why driving to Dads just to put his bets on is a no go here!
Me. Yes IT has its moments. 24/7 on call is one of them. I do have just one client I go to (been here nearly 3 years - previous one was two years). I dont think its big in the US but basically you work like an employee but you're not. No sick pay, pension, holiday pay etc etc. The idea is generally you're quite a high skill level and they can give you the boot without any hassle AT ALL. It costs them more but its the no hassle option for them.
Most people are good and treat you well but its bad form to cause any drama. Whereas an employee might be able to speak to their employer and get some slack due to ill parent etc. its not so much since you're basically a paid resource. Employees you have to look after, contractors you do not is the bottom line. Not saying it doesnt happen - most people are reasonable but, at the end of the day, they are paying for no dramas. Moaning and trying to get out of on call or letting people down at short notice is a sure fire way to not get a contract renewal at the end of every 3 months.
Xmas thing. Hmmm. Scary...... Dont think he'd do that. He never stays the night as it is.
Although saying that, he discussed an op with his consultant recently. Told the consuiltant "oh its ok my son can move in for a few weeks to look after me". Seriously when did I offer that? And no I won't because I'll still have to go to work in the day anyway so its pointless.
I'm going to address something from the last paragraph, first: talk to his consultant and tell the person you are NOT going to be able to care for your dad, in *any* capacity. If he needs help, the consultant will have to arrange it, but you will NOT be involved. :yes:
Sometimes talking to the outside party is better than trying to get it through your father's thick head - he'll *never* accept it, because *it's not what he wants.* :roll:
If the consultant tells him, "I talked to your son and he can't do it. You need to hire aides." - your father will either put off the surgery (and blame you :doh:), or have the surgery, fire the aides after a few days, and expect you to come running to his rescue. :aaauuugh:
Don't do it. Call the consultant and let THEM sort it. :yes: :ninja:
And about having an "accident" in your home, so he has to stay: I put nothing past people like your dad, unBPD Didi or unNPD Ray. They are as conniving and sneaky as they are manipulative, and to them the end always justifies the means. >:(
But...okay...back to the money. Why DOES he have all this money he refuses to spend? :???:
Ray was the same way, although he did make some modest investments in extra hand-grips for doorways, extra railings, and a shower chair, but like your dad, he sat on a substantial chunk of change (about $60K, in checking and savings, from bonds he'd cashed in), plus the house was worth about $68K, and he had about $35K in life insurance. He also had private pension of $2500 a month, in lieu of Social Security. (It's something to do with the industry he was in.)
Ray could have easily gone into Independent Living and transitioned to AL, but REFUSED. It was his house, his money, nobody was taking it from him, and this is America! He's got rights! :pissed:
Translation: YOU will come over and be my slave, and I will dangle the money above your head like a shiny carrot you're never going to receive. :roll: :no:
THAT is why he's got all that money stockpiled. It's a hoover you're never going to receive. Either your dad will wind up in a home and the assets will be gone, or he'll give it all to your brother, who will wind up in a lot of hot water, once your dad goes into a home. :yes:
If that happens, be GLAD you stuck to your guns and do *not* help your brother or your dad. It's their mess - let them sort it with the NHS. :ninja: :evil2:
Or your dad will just pass on and give it all to your layabout, irresponsible brother, while you've done all the work. I've seen that one FAR too many times, and it's right out of the PD Playbook. >:(
It'll be up to you whether to contest it - and you'll just about hear your dad cackle from the Great Beyond, happy he's stirred up more unrest between brothers. :roll:
That copious amount of money (and the assets) are nothing more than a LURE, because your dad thinks you *must* think like he thinks, and his thinking is, "Money is the most important thing on earth. You must always have a lot of money. All people want a lot of money, and my sons will want mine, but they will have to EARN it, and will get it when I'm dead."
Ray once promised to give me $1,000 a month - that was the money in his accounts. He'd cashed in his bonds, with the intention of giving me $1,000 a month, until I decided to go back under my VVVVLC rock instead, because I knew it was a gift with *strings.* :sharkbait:
I'd be expected to be his on-call, live-in slave, doing all the cooking, cleaning, laundry, driving, nursing procedures :barfy: - you name it, I'd be doing it, and I'd never get a moment's peace from his incessant YELLtalking at me, with topics increasingly incendiary or vile, hoping to provoke me into an argument, or at least anything that wasn't Medium Chill. :blink:
Ray wanted me as a verbal sparring partner, more than anything else. His died, and I HAD to be her replacement. :no:
NOPE! And I didn't have to do any other damned thing for him, either! :ninja:
Your dad thinks you think that money is REALLY important and you want it, but you are as lazy as he is and don't want to work for it, so he's going to FORCE you to work, but the problem is he's going to make you earn every single penny, ten times over in your blood, sweat, tears, hours spent traveling and listening to his whining, and the toll it will take on your mental health, children and marriage may be irreversible. :aaauuugh: :'(
You don't have to do a thing. You can walk away. You can stay out of it. You can practice saying, "Dad, that's not possible. I'm slammed at work, so you'll have to figure out something else" until it rolls naturally off your lips, along with, "No, my wife is very busy, too - I won't even consider asking her. You're going to have to figure out it without us." :ninja:
I stayed away from Ray. I rarely took his calls. Any time he needed anything I was busy, and couldn't do it. :ninja:
People at his doctor's office started asking if he had anybody to help him, and he'd go on a tirade about having all this money (complete with amounts!), and ending in a screamed, "But she don't want none of it!" :pissed: :mad:
I know because they called and told me about it, hoping to "motivate" me. I told them I was not involved, nor would I be getting involved, because I had no interest in caring for the man who abused me as a child and showed signs of being ready to resort to it again. I would not be SAFE and I wasn't putting myself in that position. If he was too stubborn to go into a nursing home, that really wasn't my problem. :ninja:
They seemed *relieved* that I wanted him in a safe place, and we all realized we'd just have to wait it out, until the day he was declared incompetent. There was really nothing anybody could do - and I wasn't getting involved, in any way, shape or form. :ninja: 8-) :no:
People like your dad - and Ray, and even Didi - think we owe them some kind of DUTY in keeping them out of nursing homes. We don't. We weren't born for that purpose, even though they think we are.
The best thing you can do is start ignoring your dad's calls or block him, especially if he and your brother have gotten together to decide that you and your wife HAVE to take up the slack.
Always remember: they can't catch you if they can't get hold of you on the phone. :bigwink:
I know you didn't want to play hardball or cause WWIII - but they seem determined to force the issue. If you don't want to hear it, blocking and going NC may be your best - and only option, because it only keeps getting worse, from this point on.
:hug:
My father is the same way about money. Has plenty but acts like he's destitute. He has done nothing to protect the money. If he goes into nursing home it's all gone with his house too. I told him recently I don't care about his money and I don't. He was shocked! I guess thought he'd use the inheritance thing as a way to control me. No thanks. No money is worth my self esteem and freedom. It would be nice if he would pass some of it to my son, his only grandchild, but not holding onto any hopes of that either. Would be nice though, and it's what most people would want to do, so no one can understand why my father doesn't get his affairs in order but sadly it's because he just doesn't care.
WI -Fortunately, hes dropped the operation idea now. It was stupid anyway. Hes 85. Last time he had an op on his knee he could not be bothered to do any of the physio or exercises afterwards and it didnt work. Thats Dad to a T "its your job to fix it so get on with it".
To be honest, he sees this consultant every 6 months. The guy must dread it. Dad goes in and moans about his knee. Pretty sure the guy has said "have the Op or put up with it" sort of thing.
He moans and moans about his pain. YET, Im sure I've said before - his doctor gave him co-codamol (not sure if you guys get this in the US - think its banned!). Yes its strong but hey ho. So his stupid friends told him he'd get addicted (OK you can if you're really stupid about it - its basically codeine). He got an idea that he wasnt going to take it.
So he takes HALF the dose. And then paracetamol (acetaminphen) - like thats realy strong NOT! FFS listen to your doctor.
I've knacked my back. Old age, big belly - spinal stenosis. Not great recently. Struggling in work and driving. I take FULL DOSE of co-dyramol (which is 50% stronger than cocodamol) plus Naproxen plus neurontin. Yet he expects me to drive over to visit him!!!!! Jeez - you ain;t that bad if half dose of co-codamol is all you take!!
Anyway, Money. Its crazy. His excuse is that when he was younger they were poor so he doesn't want to waste his money now. Yes he was poor - Welsh valley mining town. Outside toilet, no electric upstairs but that was 75 years ago!
Also, he has NO IDEA of how much things cost. I remember him refusing to pay a pound ($1.25) for a cup of tea once when we were out. Daylight robbery he said. Jeez. And I remember him saying my brother had a new job. £100 ($125) a week good money that. What? Thats like £2.50 an hours. Minimum wage in the UK is something like £9. No idea where he got this idea from.
He asks me how much I earn. Dunno why he wants to know. I avoid that one!
He won;'t spend money. I've given up. His place is a mess. Needs new stuff. No chance. I've had the "they will take it all off you" talk about 20 times. Nope. I'd get more response from my cat.
Quote from: Adrianna on November 06, 2019, 06:08:29 AM
My father is the same way about money. Has plenty but acts like he's destitute. He has done nothing to protect the money. If he goes into nursing home it's all gone with his house too. I told him recently I don't care about his money and I don't. He was shocked! I guess thought he'd use the inheritance thing as a way to control me. No thanks. No money is worth my self esteem and freedom. It would be nice if he would pass some of it to my son, his only grandchild, but not holding onto any hopes of that either. Would be nice though, and it's what most people would want to do, so no one can understand why my father doesn't get his affairs in order but sadly it's because he just doesn't care.
Yep same here. Are you in the UK?
Im same I dont want the money. It'll be probably about 20K if that. He seems to think hes going to be leaving me a million.
Same I've told him and told him about the money being taken away. Not sure if he just doesn't believe me or thinks it'll never happen. I can see it happening. Then see how upset he'll be when his beloved money pot is gone.
I'm in the US. I think my father too thinks he's going to magically get free care and we will get his money after he dies. Which I don't understand because he's not stupid. That's why I think he just doesn't care enough or at all to make the effort to help out his family. It's his money. It's his legacy. Sad.
Quote from: Adrianna on November 06, 2019, 07:37:16 AM
I'm in the US. I think my father too thinks he's going to magically get free care and we will get his money after he dies. Which I don't understand because he's not stupid. That's why I think he just doesn't care enough or at all to make the effort to help out his family. It's his money. It's his legacy. Sad.
Yeh I understand its sort of the same in the US i.e. if you've got money you pay yourself.
I do think my Dad is actually very stupid. Or at least VERY VERY stubborn and small minded. No matter how many times you present the facts - IT WILL GET TAKEN OFF YOU he seems to refuse to realise it might happen. Why on earth be so obsessed with the money you've got saved? Its like monopoly money for him - no need for it to be there at all. Hes pretty much got so much he'd never spent it all.
I honestly think if it ever happened, he had to go into a home and this happened, it would finish him off.
Yup my father will be in for a rude awakening when he has to spend all his money on his care to qualify for government insurance. He hates spending money already as it is. It's not like he hasn't been warned.
He doesn't care about me getting any since I'm getting his mothers house (which he wanted for himself and us bitter about), but it would be nice if he would consider my son and leave him some money. Then again it's his cash to do with what he wants. He doesn't owe us anything. He has a very me me me attitude when it comes to his money. Always has. In fact I'd say he's always been borderline obsessed with money.
Quote from: Adrianna on November 06, 2019, 11:49:28 AM
Yup my father will be in for a rude awakening when he has to spend all his money on his care to qualify for government insurance. He hates spending money already as it is. It's not like he hasn't been warned.
He doesn't care about me getting any since I'm getting his mothers house (which he wanted for himself and us bitter about), but it would be nice if he would consider my son and leave him some money. Then again it's his cash to do with what he wants. He doesn't owe us anything. He has a very me me me attitude when it comes to his money. Always has. In fact I'd say he's always been borderline obsessed with money.
Yeh Dad is OBSESSED. Got to have money in savings. Why?
I guess like your Dad, hes been told, and it WILL all end badly...
Quote from: p123 on November 07, 2019, 03:52:45 AM
Quote from: Adrianna on November 06, 2019, 11:49:28 AM
Yup my father will be in for a rude awakening when he has to spend all his money on his care to qualify for government insurance. He hates spending money already as it is. It's not like he hasn't been warned.
He doesn't care about me getting any since I'm getting his mothers house (which he wanted for himself and us bitter about), but it would be nice if he would consider my son and leave him some money. Then again it's his cash to do with what he wants. He doesn't owe us anything. He has a very me me me attitude when it comes to his money. Always has. In fact I'd say he's always been borderline obsessed with money.
Yeh Dad is OBSESSED. Got to have money in savings. Why?
I guess like your Dad, hes been told, and it WILL all end badly...
He needs to have money because it is control...control of you and your brother because he knows you don't come around for his sparkling personality. If he didn't have that money you wouldn't want anything to do with him (in his mind). He cannot comprehend that if you don't want to be around him it is because of the way he acts, not because he has no money. My father liked to hold
my inheritance' over my head too. He had 400K in the bank when he went into assisted living. Kept reminding me that I was an only child so it was all mine. I responded that once he went into AL any hopes of an inheritance was out the window because it would all go to that. His bills average around $7K a month and he has been there for 3 years. You can do the math. I am worried he will run out of money.
Quote from: lkdrymom on November 07, 2019, 06:51:31 AM
Quote from: p123 on November 07, 2019, 03:52:45 AM
Quote from: Adrianna on November 06, 2019, 11:49:28 AM
Yup my father will be in for a rude awakening when he has to spend all his money on his care to qualify for government insurance. He hates spending money already as it is. It's not like he hasn't been warned.
He doesn't care about me getting any since I'm getting his mothers house (which he wanted for himself and us bitter about), but it would be nice if he would consider my son and leave him some money. Then again it's his cash to do with what he wants. He doesn't owe us anything. He has a very me me me attitude when it comes to his money. Always has. In fact I'd say he's always been borderline obsessed with money.
Yeh Dad is OBSESSED. Got to have money in savings. Why?
I guess like your Dad, hes been told, and it WILL all end badly...
He needs to have money because it is control...control of you and your brother because he knows you don't come around for his sparkling personality. If he didn't have that money you wouldn't want anything to do with him (in his mind). He cannot comprehend that if you don't want to be around him it is because of the way he acts, not because he has no money. My father liked to hold
my inheritance' over my head too. He had 400K in the bank when he went into assisted living. Kept reminding me that I was an only child so it was all mine. I responded that once he went into AL any hopes of an inheritance was out the window because it would all go to that. His bills average around $7K a month and he has been there for 3 years. You can do the math. I am worried he will run out of money.
Wow. $7K a month! Not sure how much it is in the uk but I know it aint cheap. I guess a lot has gone then.
What happens in the US when the money runs out? Here in the uk, once you get below a certain figure they don't expect you to pay any more. Not sure if they might move you out into a cheaper facility though.
The pile of money definitely seems like a massive hoover... If you want it, you have to let them move in! Or a big FU.
My uNgrandmother had no intention of moving in with my Nmother (only child) who begged her to. She told me (a child) that she would never tolerate living with my uNF and she'd rather let the money run out and she'd simply die when it did rather than step down to a less posh "independent living". She got darn close to using up every penny, and then she went into hospital and died, right on schedule. The ICU bill sucked up the last of it. My uNF was so angry at her funeral... Which he played off as concern on my mother's behalf. :sadno:
I admire you all for not giving a fat rat's you-know-what about getting any of their money. I'm seeing care for the older folks' actual well-being despite all they put you through. It's so heartening. On both sides of my Nfamily there have been shenanigans from at least three generations about getting or not getting money and stuff from the older generation. I knew from childhood I would never be in the running for any serious "cash and prizes" so it was easy to see what was going on and not get involved.
In conclusion, the Bible is onto something when it says the love of money is the root of all evil. Peace to all of you.
My dad is exactly the same about money and savings. He has plenty in the bank, but he's a penny pincher.
It's for control.
He brings it up and dangles it.
Often.
A few previously absent family members have fallen for it, and suddenly in the last few years, they've become very obsequious and attentive to him. :angel: :roll:
They point the finger are those who are not.
I don't care. :cool2:
We are actually having him in Christmas day this year, but he doesn't know yet that it's going to be a flying visit!
He's not staying his usual 8 hours plus.
He literally never stops talking. It's really tiring. It's all about him, never about anybody else.
We are in charge of the transport, so we will whisk him home when it's time.
He's been waiting about his upcoming hospital appointment and procedure. He's already had this procedure three times in the last six months. I'm not sure how he's wangled another go at it. I'm thinking he may have exaggerated some symptoms. He's cagey when I ask him. Last time he went my sister said the nurse was rolling her eyes. Think sis was surprised. The other three siblings all tend to humour his health complaints and numerous, often sudden requests to be examined by GP, A&E or consultant.
I read in here a post that said their relative in AL goes to the nurse's station at 2am with a sore tummy. But that it's great because the staff in AL are trained to deal with that and can manage this behaviour.
I do wish dad would move into a home. This would solve a lot of problems both for dad and for us.
I'm sort of dreading the next few months. The crazy A&E visits are likely to start soon. I'm not dreading them as much as I was before I came Out of the FOG!
My sibs are dumbfounded as to why I don't respond like I used to!
They are missing my guilty servitude! And every time, they forget I'm different now, and we have to go through it all again! . Every time dad flips and a FOG opportunity arises, they try the same old same old, trying to push those dysfunctional buttons.
Those buttons have been disconnected. :bigwink:
This thing he's having which he doesn't need, is a procedure that the NHS provides transport for. He still wants us to take him. He's fine to go on transport but he refuses. He cannot be one of many in an NHS ambulance.
We are not taking him. He will have to pay for taxis. Sorry dad.
He's 87. This test is to get the all clear on the all clear. ( they removed a polyp that had cells that were not even pre cancerous. This is just to double check there are no more of these COMPLETELY BENIGN cells.
They are not even pre cancerous and even if they were somehow, they could take years to become pre cancerous, then years again to become cancerous.
I'm wondering, how much time my dad thinks he has? why all that at 87? Why is he spending his last years worrying about dying? When he could be enjoying living?
Maybe just leave your throat alone dad as all this jarring and pulling and scraping with a camera may not be helpful and could cause more issues than it solves?
The Doctor has already SAID that to him once, and he agreed. He told me he wasn't having any more.
Two days later he had totally changed his mind and then went back to wanting repeated checks!
When I queried this with him ( what the doc had said) he proceeded to gaslight me - he said the doctor never said that - it never happened!
OMG guess what, that was an amazing moment just now!
I've only just realised I've been gaslighted -as I've been typing! Clearly for a while then, it had worked!
As I type I've remembered distinctly now,that the doctor told him that it was probably doing more harm than good to his throat to keep doing the procedure!
He later convinced me that I'd imagined that conversation! I believed him, because of the brainwashing since birth.
OMG just shows you how valuable this forum is!
Talking clarifies and distills the truth.
Average cost for care home in Wales £650 a week apparently. Aint cheap is it?
Dad pays about £200 a month rent at the moment (he part-owns his home its complicated). He gets a decent pension etc and tax credits etc so hes got money left over at the end of the month (that he plows back into his saving for some stupid reason).
Either he learns to change and accept whats on offer in terms of help, his savings are going to be chewed into a rate of well over £2000 a month it seems. That'll shock him to say the least.
OMG apologies for the massive post previously! I must start my own thread if I'm going to go on like that!
Right yes, it's a lot of money that, isn't it? Gone are the days of free care. Have you mentioned the amount to your dad?
My dad is independent right now, so we will take it day by day I think.
I'm not going to stress about it too much.
The house is meant to be in trust, and when it is I think it's harder to for it to be used for care? But I can't really say for definite as my brother has all the details, not me.
I think my mum's half has to come to us but really do not know. Brother is a flipping solicitor so he will naturally know more.
We are in for some fun and games! 😊
Quote from: p123 on November 08, 2019, 11:08:07 AM
Average cost for care home in Wales £650 a week apparently. Aint cheap is it?
Dad pays about £200 a month rent at the moment (he part-owns his home its complicated). He gets a decent pension etc and tax credits etc so hes got money left over at the end of the month (that he plows back into his saving for some stupid reason).
Either he learns to change and accept whats on offer in terms of help, his savings are going to be chewed into a rate of well over £2000 a month it seems. That'll shock him to say the least.
Highly unlikely he will change. It has been my experience that Ns don't compromise. The thing is, you want to tell them that when you become dependent on someone else-- like your dad is dependent on you-- the rules change. One no longer gets to call the shots if they are depending on others for help. But they won't ever get this idea. It's their way or the highway. In my case, I chose the highway. :yes:
P123,
just want to echo the sentiments about being careful about having him in your home and not underestimating what he might get up to to get you more involved in his care.
The last time I had Christmas with my family, everything went pretty well until it became apparent that my father had not gotten my mother a gift. Major meltdown on my unBPDm's part while my unOCPD Father feigned (?) ignorance and said he'd just 'forgotten' to get her a gift. My mother proceeds to tell my brother and I how terrible he is to live with (could be some truth there, but she is 1000x worse), but that she didn't feel like she could leave and didn't want to live with her children. I got an uncomfortable feeling in my gut, like, I realized later, that is exactly what she DOES want. Mind you, it was all about what SHE wanted. Never a mention about what our wants/needs are.
So, a month or two later, my mother calls my brother and demands he come get her (she's in another city, 250 miles away), and bring her back to his place, because she just HAS to get away from my father. Thankfully, my brother said hell no. Cue another meltdown and rage attack from my mother onto both of us for failing her when she would do ANYTHING for us. Please note, I try to avoid my mother doing ANYTHING for me. Strings galore. No thank you. Oh, and the reason she didn't specifically ask to come to my place is it's too small. Nevertheless, we were lumped together in her rage, as we often are. We are a matched set, "HER CHILDREN." I don't believe she really sees us as independent entities. From each other or her.
All this to say, I wouldn't have put her up as the type who would act out in this way (that may be my fog tho). But desperate times (or what they deem desperate anyway) call for desperate measures. And my mother is getting desperate because she and her husband are old and starting to get frail.
Oh, and I am just starting to put this together, one of her colleagues at her job is around my brother's age, lives with his mom, and does everything for her. She wants the same thing. So sick.
I am learning a lot from your posts, P123, and everyone's responses, so thank you.
DoQ
Doq you are correct that your mother does not see you and your brother as separate people. That's part of the disorder. We are only here to serve and they have no concept of us as actual people, with lives and needs of our own. We are an extension of them in their minds. Nothing else.
And yes, a live in servant would be the ultimate dream for them. Someone willing, able and ready to be abused. Someone codependent with no sense of self. A life of servitude. A life of misery. All to attempt to please someone who can't be pleased. I knew of a woman who I believe lived this scenario with her elderly mother and she committed suicide.
There is no peace with them. They have no peace within themselves. They truly are tortured in their own minds and although I have compassion for that, it's not our job to fix them. They would gladly bring us down with them. We can't allow that.
Quote from: p123 on November 07, 2019, 07:00:13 AM
Quote from: lkdrymom on November 07, 2019, 06:51:31 AM
Quote from: p123 on November 07, 2019, 03:52:45 AM
Quote from: Adrianna on November 06, 2019, 11:49:28 AM
Yup my father will be in for a rude awakening when he has to spend all his money on his care to qualify for government insurance. He hates spending money already as it is. It's not like he hasn't been warned.
He doesn't care about me getting any since I'm getting his mothers house (which he wanted for himself and us bitter about), but it would be nice if he would consider my son and leave him some money. Then again it's his cash to do with what he wants. He doesn't owe us anything. He has a very me me me attitude when it comes to his money. Always has. In fact I'd say he's always been borderline obsessed with money.
Yeh Dad is OBSESSED. Got to have money in savings. Why?
I guess like your Dad, hes been told, and it WILL all end badly...
He needs to have money because it is control...control of you and your brother because he knows you don't come around for his sparkling personality. If he didn't have that money you wouldn't want anything to do with him (in his mind). He cannot comprehend that if you don't want to be around him it is because of the way he acts, not because he has no money. My father liked to hold
my inheritance' over my head too. He had 400K in the bank when he went into assisted living. Kept reminding me that I was an only child so it was all mine. I responded that once he went into AL any hopes of an inheritance was out the window because it would all go to that. His bills average around $7K a month and he has been there for 3 years. You can do the math. I am worried he will run out of money.
Wow. $7K a month! Not sure how much it is in the uk but I know it aint cheap. I guess a lot has gone then.
What happens in the US when the money runs out? Here in the uk, once you get below a certain figure they don't expect you to pay any more. Not sure if they might move you out into a cheaper facility though.
p123 - I'm sorry you are going through this with your father. We have my grandfather in assisted living here in the states. Over 5k a month. Nice facility. Once he gets below a certain point we can fill out papers to have military benefits. Also, on the advice of WI, and reading all of her posts (she is a godsend btw), I let my parents know they need to hire an elder law attorney because we live in a state that can sue the children for nonpayment. Wanted to make sure they were protected. All of this didn't happen overnight.
My thoughts would be to start calling some places and see how much it costs per month. In the states we go by level of care, independent, assisted and nursing. At least if he starts with the "put me in a home" you can let him know you scoped out some places and this is the cost. Depending again on level of care.
You may end up squashing that topic all together if he knows true cost. You also may not. In which case let him know if he decides to move forward he will have to think about packing up all of his belongings, getting rid of a lot of stuff, and hiring movers. (Which aren't cheap either.)
His fantasy is not based in reality until he knows all the facts and what is really involved.
Other than that, you have been doing quite a bit for him, long term. I'm sorry your efforts aren't realized and I would say, at this point, after providing him with concrete facts, take a long time out and just take care of your wife and family. The type of drama your father brings can split families. Take a time out and just focus on yours. Let him be uncomfortable with his thoughts sometimes, that's not a bad thing. He has to learn to do for himself or he will really be paying for it with his wallet. Good luck.
Quote from: p123 on November 07, 2019, 03:52:45 AM
Quote from: Adrianna on November 06, 2019, 11:49:28 AM
Yup my father will be in for a rude awakening when he has to spend all his money on his care to qualify for government insurance. He hates spending money already as it is. It's not like he hasn't been warned.
He doesn't care about me getting any since I'm getting his mothers house (which he wanted for himself and us bitter about), but it would be nice if he would consider my son and leave him some money. Then again it's his cash to do with what he wants. He doesn't owe us anything. He has a very me me me attitude when it comes to his money. Always has. In fact I'd say he's always been borderline obsessed with money.
Yeh Dad is OBSESSED. Got to have money in savings. Why?
I guess like your Dad, hes been told, and it WILL all end badly...
Hi p123,
You need to view this in a different way.
Every time he doesn't take a taxi, and you end up driving him he is punting the costs to you, rather than himself. That is just an obvious example, but from what you have described (like deliveries of food), these expenses tend to add up over the years (not just in money but also time).
So in essence, he is building up his bank account on your shoulders (via your time and money).
Now, this would be different if he were generous with your kids (and others). But he is not. He is a miser that will not change his habits. He is extracting both time and money from your own family while offering very little in return.
So instead of seeing this from an emotional standpoint, see this from a financial one.
M makes some VERY good points - and yes, Ray tried that stuff on me, too. He'd ask me to get chicken breasts at the butcher (huge honkin' things, more the size of turkey breasts :)) and "forget" to pay me back. :roll:
I recognized this from unBPD Didi's narrative of, "There's nothing my daughter wouldn't do for me or buy for me!" - while "forgetting" to pay me back, so I adopted the same tactic: NO more. :ninja: You can't even pay me back and have to be reminded repeatedly, only to "forget" in some kind of half-baked move to get me over there so I can chase down my money, and you can call it a visit?
Forget about it. I don't need the money that badly - and you forfeit a right to any stuff, or my getting it for you. The ride is closed. :ninja: :yes:
When we spend our time and money, it only feeds the delusion of, "I am such a wonderful parent that my child would do anything for me! " - and it feeds the other delusion of, "My child will make everything appear as though its normal, so others don't see how much help I need."
Both of those are VERY slippery slopes and you want to be nowhere near them. :no:
Ray and those chicken breasts? I chased him down for well over 2 months to get the return of $14 - at which time he said he was out of breasts and needed more. Was I going to the butcher soon, because he *really* wants them. :dramaqueen:
I'd already decided this wasn't going to happen, told him I was going to the butcher in a week - and told him the butcher discontinued what looked like Dino breasts. Sorry. :ninja:
Ray screamed that they were "bastards" who were trying to make his life miserable, then demanded I find them elsewhere. I told him I'd see what I could do - and did nothing, because THAT'S what I could do! 8-)
Ray also had a waterbed he hated, but unBPD Didi had loved. Now that she was dead, he was getting a mattress delivered in a few days. He called to ask me if I wanted the waterbed and I *clearly* and *repeatedly* told him NO.
We don't need it, don't have room for it, don't want it, and thanks, but no thanks - have the mattress dudes take it away when they deliver the new one - a free service provided ONLY when they were there to deliver the new product.
Several days later, he's on the blower, asking when I'm going to come and pick up the waterbed. :roll: :blink: :stars:
I told him that wasn't happening, as I'd told him we didn't want it or have room for it. :ninja:
Ray started screaming at me, trying to make it MY problem, while trying to talk me into this perfectly good waterbed that he didn't want, but we should feel LUCKY to have - it was only a few years old, had no holes, had a new heater... :pissed: :blahblahblah:
I cut him off and said, "I told you we don't want it. If you didn't have them take it away, that's not my problem." :ninja:
Ray started screaming it would cost him $75, like that was MY fault and I should pay it FOR him (aaaaah - and there you have it! He can't AFFORD such frivolities, but apparently, I can! :jawdrop:) - I reminded him I'd told him before he had the new bed delivered that we didn't want it. He started screaming I HAD to take it home, even if it was to put it out in my trash. I told him that wasn't happening - if he wanted it in the trash, he'd have to do it himself, or hire the guys to come back and haul it away. :ninja:
He wouldn't let it go, so I hung up on him, mid-rant, and screened my calls for the next week. 8-)
Okay - why was it so important to get me over there for that waterbed?
"My daughter will do it for me."
Even when you specifically say no, they still think it WILL happen, because that's what fits their version of how old age is going to go - even if it's not only unreasonable for other people, but possibly *unsafe* for them (fall hazards, medical procedures we have no business attempting, or putting ourselves in the line of fire of physical abuse) - and not only infringes on our time but our money, too.
They seem to work out that they earned it, so they're going to keep it, and we'll somehow get it back after they die - but we never or rarely do. Somehow, they make sure of THAT. :roll: :wacko:
The best thing I've found is to be brave enough to remove yourself from the equation. No, you will NOT step up and do a thing when they freak out that nothing costs what it did in 1959, will not help them at home, will NOT be beholden to them, or make things appear that all is well in their little world, when it's anything but.
It takes a certain amount of bravery -but a certain amount of knowing who REALLY calls all the shots - and that person is YOU. :)
UnBPD Didi tried to reign WWIII down on me by insisting she was in charge of my life and I OWED her my submission and subservience. :thumbdown:
She was wrong. And after the first salvo of WWIII, you get a taste of what they're really capable of - in my case, I just laughed with disgust and rolled my eyes. There wasn't a damned thing Didi could do or say to get her way. :roll:
By the time Ray popped up, I didn't *care.* I was fresh out of F's. Nothing terrible happened. WWIII? It was mostly between the social workers and me until I told them we're on the same side and I WANT him in a home, where he's SAFE. :yes:
Your dad can do and say whatever he wants - nobody can control that.
The ONLY person you can control is YOURSELF - and that includes your reactions to your dad's black hole of endless need.
Say no. Don't do. Malfunction! Let your brother take up the slack, and the next time you get one of those calls insisting THEY decided you and your wife have to do more - I'd just block them both and get on with it. :ninja:
They aren't going to change - but you can - and they can go through their "P123 and his wife SHOULD be doing more!" dance without your involvement - or your time and cash!
:hug:
Quote from: nanotech on November 08, 2019, 12:45:34 PM
OMG apologies for the massive post previously! I must start my own thread if I'm going to go on like that!
Right yes, it's a lot of money that, isn't it? Gone are the days of free care. Have you mentioned the amount to your dad?
My dad is independent right now, so we will take it day by day I think.
I'm not going to stress about it too much.
The house is meant to be in trust, and when it is I think it's harder to for it to be used for care? But I can't really say for definite as my brother has all the details, not me.
I think my mum's half has to come to us but really do not know. Brother is a flipping solicitor so he will naturally know more.
We are in for some fun and games! 😊
No is fine. Interesting to hear from others with the same thing...
Quote from: WomanInterrupted on November 11, 2019, 12:22:09 AM
Ray screamed that they were "bastards" who were trying to make his life miserable, then demanded I find them elsewhere. I told him I'd see what I could do - and did nothing, because THAT'S what I could do! 8-)
This is a great way to reply! I'll see what I can do - sounds professional and like you mean business but you don't. You've determined you can do nothing but you don't need to tell them that. :yes:
QuoteHe started screaming I HAD to take it home, even if it was to put it out in my trash. I told him that wasn't happening - if he wanted it in the trash, he'd have to do it himself, or hire the guys to come back and haul it away. :ninja:
Luckily my uNPDmom hasn't screamed in this situation but got all huffy and silent treatment-y. Same as Ray, I believe my mom offers me her unwanted items because it's just easy for me to pick up and remove. It's not that she wants me to benefit from the item but I'm convenient and cheap to take them away. I stopped taking everything. I don't need anything and if I do, I can buy things myself and not have strings to my mom.
QuoteThey aren't going to change - but you can - and they can go through their "P123 and his wife SHOULD be doing more!" dance without your involvement - or your time and cash!
So true and don't feel bad about it either. They are grown ups and can find solutions that don't involve you and your wife.
WI - Yes Dad certainly has an idea of how it should go. This includes who and what other do for him.
As I've often said, 95% of the time theres an easier way, and probably 75% of the time he doesnt "need" this thing anyway. He just EXPECTS things work like this.
Like I said, he'd cover over xmas day. You could tell he hated it. (not as much as me). Even when I offered to take him home early he'd refuse because "he didn't want to upset my wife by going too soon". (Of course, wife is in the other room clenching her teeth!). So he'd stay ALL DAY. Then he'd say "Oh I'll go now so you can take me home and come back and have a drink". (it'd be like 8pm). All because is his head the way it worked was that your son or daugher had to look after you on xmas day and he was obliged to go. Crazy.
Same with his birthday. EVERYONE had to phone him and wish him happy birthday. Thus when my wife didn;t that was it.
Did well this week - let him get on with it.
He pays for his gas and electricity by Direct Debit per month - as a lot of people do in the UK. Its basically just a pay of paying monthly for what you use. Sometimes they adjust it up sometimes down depending on usage. And they're not very good at doing it.
So Dads has gone up by £10 a month. Hes not happy. (Bearing in mind hes probably got £100 a week "spare" EVERY WEEK).
Wanted me to ring the utility company to check - NO ITS RIGHT.
Wanted me to ring them and ask for a discount - NO!!!!
So his latest idea - he wants to disconnect the gas so he doesnt have to pay for it. So no heating, no hot water, no cooker. Honestly. Plan being cook with microwave, boil kettle to wash, put a jumper on it the house. (Bear in mind it regulary gets below freezing in the winter in the uk)
Whether he will follow through - probably not. But I told him to do what he wants....
This is a new level of penny pinching even for him...
I'm thinking that he won't do that. I think he wants to just make you fearful, obligated and guilty. FOG.
I could kind of get his thinking, if he were struggling financially.
But it could just put his electricity costs way up in any case.
No one does this!
Maybe he wants you to pay the extra ten pounds?
Or the whole bill!
Sounds like it could be some cognitive impairment showing itself. That's crazy talk and he could be putting himself at risk if he follows through. A home might be a good idea, dad. I'll talk to your doctor about that.
It could be a cognitive thing, but I think he's just testing to see what he can get away with before you jump in and save him from himself (moving in with him and/or paying all his bills). :roll:
I think you handled it the right way - telling him NO about doing things for him, and telling him to do what he wants regarding his gas. 8-)
Expect to have to push back like that more and more, as he keeps testing his boundaries. If he makes any other ridiculous suggestions (right up there with turning off the gas and wearing an extra sweater), I'd say something like, "I think it's time I talk to your doctor about you going into a home, since you can't seem to make rational decisions for yourself." :ninja:
Ray was like your dad - he had a great pension, extra money every week, a sizeable chunk 'o change in the bank, BUT he was looking for ways to make extra income - and save money, like denting cans of peaches at the store in the hope he could get them cheaper and screaming at the poor, hapless cashier until he or she called the manager - who'd cave - just to get that awful old man out of the store.
See: why they keep doing what they do. Because it WORKS. :aaauuugh:
So...Ray's great idea to make money and piss the neighbors off was to rent out his back yard to a wind turbine company. :upsidedown:
We have wind turbines a few miles south, along the Great Lake we live near, and they're MASSIVE. Ray had a sizeable back yard, but I don't think the foot of a turbine would have fit in his yard - and I don't think his town would have allowed it.
I shrugged and said he should look into it, so he told me to look up all the information on the internet and get it for him. I told him I'd see what I could do - and did nothing, because I knew he'd forget, and if he didn't, I wasn't going to take his calls. And didn't. :ninja:
Ray expected me to give him enemas - I stuck my fingers in my ears and started singing, "LALALALALALAAAA I can't HEAAAAAR YOUUUUU!" when that gem came up and he laughed, but said I HAD to do it because *he wouldn't know where to put it.* :blink:
Um - yeah. :phoot: :rofl: :barfy:
UnBPD Didi had been giving him enemas, so he damned well knew where they go - and it's not Baskin-Robbins Ice Cream, where you've got something like 102 choices! :stars:
I told him he'd have to see his doctor about that, and they'd either do it for him or instruct him. :ninja:
All of these incidents - and many more - put me on notice of just how sneaky, cagey, manipulative, deceptive, conniving and WAIFY Ray had become - but also confirmed what I'd been telling his doctors for YEARS - there is something seriously WRONG with him!
The first chance I got, I had Ray's competency tested. Within 6 months, the man who thought he was the smartest man in the room got himself declared incompetent by overplaying his hand.
Your dad might be headed down the same road - by thinking himself so clever, he might get a label slapped on him that he never anticipated.
My best suggestion: be wary. Stay out of it, let him make all the foolish decisions he wants, but if he's actually going to do something harmful or you find out he has done it, call the authorities - or his doctor - and ask for a competency test.
:hug:
Quote from: nanotech on November 20, 2019, 05:51:45 PM
I'm thinking that he won't do that. I think he wants to just make you fearful, obligated and guilty. FOG.
I could kind of get his thinking, if he were struggling financially.
But it could just put his electricity costs way up in any case.
No one does this!
Maybe he wants you to pay the extra ten pounds?
Or the whole bill!
No its his legendary "tightness". Hes loaded so I aint paying it!
Quote from: Call Me Cordelia on November 20, 2019, 06:53:30 PM
Sounds like it could be some cognitive impairment showing itself. That's crazy talk and he could be putting himself at risk if he follows through. A home might be a good idea, dad. I'll talk to your doctor about that.
Been through this over the years with his GP. They say NO WAY is he showing any signs at all. The GP put it kindly - "some older people have certain ways that are hard to explain".
Dad would do ANYTHING to save money. Once sat in hospital waiting room for 4-5 hours to wait for the free patient transport rather than pay £10 for a taxi. The blamed me for making him ill because I refused to drive the 60 odd miles to collect him.
Quote from: WomanInterrupted on November 21, 2019, 12:36:41 AM
It could be a cognitive thing, but I think he's just testing to see what he can get away with before you jump in and save him from himself (moving in with him and/or paying all his bills). :roll:
I think you handled it the right way - telling him NO about doing things for him, and telling him to do what he wants regarding his gas. 8-)
Expect to have to push back like that more and more, as he keeps testing his boundaries. If he makes any other ridiculous suggestions (right up there with turning off the gas and wearing an extra sweater), I'd say something like, "I think it's time I talk to your doctor about you going into a home, since you can't seem to make rational decisions for yourself." :ninja:
Ray was like your dad - he had a great pension, extra money every week, a sizeable chunk 'o change in the bank, BUT he was looking for ways to make extra income - and save money, like denting cans of peaches at the store in the hope he could get them cheaper and screaming at the poor, hapless cashier until he or she called the manager - who'd cave - just to get that awful old man out of the store.
See: why they keep doing what they do. Because it WORKS. :aaauuugh:
So...Ray's great idea to make money and piss the neighbors off was to rent out his back yard to a wind turbine company. :upsidedown:
We have wind turbines a few miles south, along the Great Lake we live near, and they're MASSIVE. Ray had a sizeable back yard, but I don't think the foot of a turbine would have fit in his yard - and I don't think his town would have allowed it.
I shrugged and said he should look into it, so he told me to look up all the information on the internet and get it for him. I told him I'd see what I could do - and did nothing, because I knew he'd forget, and if he didn't, I wasn't going to take his calls. And didn't. :ninja:
Ray expected me to give him enemas - I stuck my fingers in my ears and started singing, "LALALALALALAAAA I can't HEAAAAAR YOUUUUU!" when that gem came up and he laughed, but said I HAD to do it because *he wouldn't know where to put it.* :blink:
Um - yeah. :phoot: :rofl: :barfy:
UnBPD Didi had been giving him enemas, so he damned well knew where they go - and it's not Baskin-Robbins Ice Cream, where you've got something like 102 choices! :stars:
I told him he'd have to see his doctor about that, and they'd either do it for him or instruct him. :ninja:
All of these incidents - and many more - put me on notice of just how sneaky, cagey, manipulative, deceptive, conniving and WAIFY Ray had become - but also confirmed what I'd been telling his doctors for YEARS - there is something seriously WRONG with him!
The first chance I got, I had Ray's competency tested. Within 6 months, the man who thought he was the smartest man in the room got himself declared incompetent by overplaying his hand.
Your dad might be headed down the same road - by thinking himself so clever, he might get a label slapped on him that he never anticipated.
My best suggestion: be wary. Stay out of it, let him make all the foolish decisions he wants, but if he's actually going to do something harmful or you find out he has done it, call the authorities - or his doctor - and ask for a competency test.
:hug:
thanks WI. Yeh I've left him to it now..... He wont actually do it because it would mean getting off his backside and phoning them which he'll never do. Pretty sure hes not allowed to do either (after all the pipes would freeze in the winter - this is the uk!) since he part owns his home but the housing assocation own the rest.
OMG the enema story. Made me gag lol. Thats nuts. He expects his own daughter to shove something up the wrong 'un. No way no way no way.
I remember last time I took Dad away (remember pee-gate) and he had a shower in his hotel room and he wanted me to towel him dry. NO NO NO. He manages on his own at home so no chance am I going anywhere near my naked father. Ewwwww.
As I've said before, my wifes a District Nurse (Visiting nurse in the US?). She works in a different area to where he lives. Fortunately, in the UK, the health system is split in trusts (or areas). We live 25 miles away but the Trust boundary is about 5 miles from him - stroke of luck that.
Dad often says,"pity mrs p doesnt work in this area she could come and see me". Yeh she'd love that - NOT. He still tries to get me to get to get him things (like incontinence pads) NO DAD - she cant steal supplies and give to you.
If it ever happened and she worked in the same area she would have to declare that she can't visit him because of the hassle he causes being family.
The obsession with enemas. Once my father sent me to the store to buy 2 four packs of fleet enemas, two bottles of prune juice and a container of prunes. Imagine walking up tot he counter with all that. I told the big burly guy checking me out "Now I know how you guys feel when your girlfriend asks you to buy tampons". The guy replied " At least everyone knows the tampons aren't for us".
Then there is the cheap aspect. My father has a lot more in the bank than P123's dad but he would be so proud of telling me how long he could make the leftovers I brought him last. Thanksgiving leftovers would make it to Christmas. And you know he wasn't freezing any of them. Ew.
QuoteRay expected me to give him enemas - I stuck my fingers in
:aaauuugh:
Quotemy ears
:doh:
Quote from: NumbLotus on November 21, 2019, 09:17:58 AM
QuoteRay expected me to give him enemas - I stuck my fingers in
:aaauuugh:
Quotemy ears
:doh:
this was the first post I saw when I clicked into this page :aaauuugh: and I was thinking ..... wait, WI??? Say it ain't so :aaauuugh:
Good one NumbLotus! :bigwink:
Quote from: lkdrymom on November 21, 2019, 08:47:11 AM
The obsession with enemas. Once my father sent me to the store to buy 2 four packs of fleet enemas, two bottles of prune juice and a container of prunes. Imagine walking up tot he counter with all that. I told the big burly guy checking me out "Now I know how you guys feel when your girlfriend asks you to buy tampons". The guy replied " At least everyone knows the tampons aren't for us".
Then there is the cheap aspect. My father has a lot more in the bank than P123's dad but he would be so proud of telling me how long he could make the leftovers I brought him last. Thanksgiving leftovers would make it to Christmas. And you know he wasn't freezing any of them. Ew.
Like the story ha ha. Good one that.
Haha I had to google it but thanksgiving is the end of November? Wow how'd he not die of food poisoning?
Dad is the same. We went away (weekend of pee gate). We had half eaten pasty (meat and potato sort of pastry wrap for the usa people here!) left over that had not been in the fridge (we were staying in a hotel). It was a VERY hot day (for the uk - 90F). Dad wanted to eat it two days later. He was disgusted when I binned it - what a waste he said! After he'd peed in my car twice there was no way I was risking a 350 degree "brown out" as well.
Talking about things like that. GP gave dad Cocodamol (not sure if its available in the usa - its a codeine based painkiller). Known side effect it bungs you up. So Dad wouldnt take. Made him go back to GP. Gave him stool softeners - wouldnt take these because he "didn't want to be caught and not make it to the bathroom". You can't win.....
Yet he still moans hes in pain with his knees..... Jeez
Quote from: SunnyMeadow on November 21, 2019, 09:28:02 AM
Quote from: NumbLotus on November 21, 2019, 09:17:58 AM
QuoteRay expected me to give him enemas - I stuck my fingers in
:aaauuugh:
Quotemy ears
:doh:
this was the first post I saw when I clicked into this page :aaauuugh: and I was thinking ..... wait, WI??? Say it ain't so :aaauuugh:
Good one NumbLotus! :bigwink:
I remember WIs story about Didi and the train in the station lol.