We had a party at our house. Updh's aunts and cousins etc were there. One aunt and her husband stayed a bit later. A conversation started which brought up lots of issues re other family members. In the course of this an issue came up about husbands controlling money/spending in the marriage. Updh very clearly expressed this was fine, sometimes necessary, etc etc. Aunt and uncle clearly disagreed. Uncle looked at me like he was waiting for me to say something... I think they realized that this is the reality in my marriage and were surprised/shocked.
This aunt is quite outspoken and I'm almost expecting a phone call from her...
It's just a weird feeling when he shows this behavior to outsiders as most people don't seem to really know what he's like...
It's strangely validating to finally have someone else see some of the PD behaviors. I experienced this with bpdxh when he brought a friend with him to move out the last of his belongings. When he arrived I offered to help, he refused. So I sat in the living room reading, he came in and started yelling that, what you're just going to sit there and not help.
Then our neighbor pulled into our driveway (I gave permission so that he could have guests park on the grass between our houses for a party). He started screaming that I had some nerve having my F@#$ing boyfriend show up while he was there. He was so angry that he threw a hand-truck down the basement stairs, nearly wiping out my furnace. Then he realized who was in the driveway, but still refused to apologize. His friend mouthed, I'm sorry.
That was the only time that anyone else ever saw it, usually in public he would just shoot me "the look" and I knew that I was gonna hear it later.
Blunk I'm sorry you experienced that.
It was validating but also a bit embarrassing for me as well
Quote from: 11JB68 on August 18, 2021, 09:16:02 PM
Blunk I'm sorry you experienced that.
It was validating but also a bit embarrassing for me as well
11JB68,
I also experience the validation as my uPDw will show herself to relationship circle's 3-5 on rare occasions. In the past I also felt a twinge of embarrassment, but am steadily learning to separate myself from my uPDw in that area.
Just because she is my wife, doesn't mean I am connected to, or able to control her own adult behaviors. In fact, this is an area that in the past, my uPDw would use to purposefully put me in an uncomfortable place, expecting me to come to her defense, when she was clearly in the wrong. It's a PD control move imo; a lose-lose for the non.
The 50% rule not only applies to me, but to my spouse as well. I will fully own my 50% and my 51% rule as well. In addition the 3 C's rule applies as well. So now, I am getting much better at disconnecting myself from my spouses behaviors toward all relationship circles and letting her be her own full adult. If she tries to attach me in order to rescue her, or put me in an uncomfortable position choosing sides (lose/lose) I use the MC, noJADE and boundaries and simply become an detached onlooker in a group of adults in a weird situation. Lol, all I need at that point is instant popcorn to watch the drama unfold. The detachment + validation can be energizing imo.
SoT
SOT - I'm much better at detaching/MC/no JADE than previously.
This particular incident he was revealing his controlling ways with money which unfortunately puts me in a bad light (in my mind) as my 50% or 51% or whatever is that I've allowed it to happen / allowed him to do this to me....so I feel like I look 'stupid' (?) or 'pathetic' somehow in others' eyes
Quote from: 11JB68 on August 19, 2021, 03:11:57 PM
SOT - I'm much better at detaching/MC/no JADE than previously.
This particular incident he was revealing his controlling ways with money which unfortunately puts me in a bad light (in my mind) as my 50% or 51% or whatever is that I've allowed it to happen / allowed him to do this to me....so I feel like I look 'stupid' (?) or 'pathetic' somehow in others' eyes
11JB68,
I'm sorry the financial controlling puts you in a bad light to others, and unfortunately he probably knows that as well. As you know well any rebuttal to him or the others regarding is a JADE and let's him know he has successfully irritated you in that way, as you well know, so therefore your strength is in your silence.
I have the opposite story in my home, as my PDw lavishly spends money to project a wealthy and stylish image for herself and I am the one who must balance the spending with savings. My wife projects me (hypocritically) to others as the money controller, but it's quite easy for all to see she spends on anything she desires. Lol not sure what her acquaintances think about her comments in that manner, as they hear her complain about my control, while she stands there next to her expensive car, clothes, handbags, jewelry, house and so on....nor do I care.
I tell myself; if I ever divorced her, in the area in which I live, I will be required to give her 50% of our money, and so I mentally brush off her lavishness to spending her current 50%, pre-divorce. So my goals are always to make and save enough money, that I am satisfied in my current living, and will be satisfied with 50% upon divorce, even if it never occurs. I use that motivation to work/save harder and smarter.
Now that she has realized she is not mentally affecting me any longer by her lavish spending, the manipulative thrill of her spending had died quite a bit, and the hypocrisy of her comments regarding me, is in a greater light. My job is to create and protect as much of my 50% as possible, always planning for a future divorce.
Again, I'm sorry he makes you feel this way but I do enjoy also, when my uPDw reveals her real self to others in the outer relationship circles.
SoT
It is a long road. While my own situation has improved and become a little more stable, it still just feel miserable most of the time.
I have occasions where I am flat out embarrassed of his totally embarrassing need for attention from people. Many years ago I would have never noticed by now I begin to wonder if the other people notice. Some do, and most don't.
A few weeks ago we ate lunch with his parents and he talked and has to be the center of attention the whole time. This past week his mother commented to me that he speaks for everyone. Ugh. Seriously, he learned to be this way from you! Whatever the hell she did caused so much of this.
This week we had dinner with another couple and I felt like I was this 'extra' there. They hook, line and sinker just love him and I pretty much get ignored. The wife literally made no eye contact with me during several parts of the conversation, her eyes were only on him. Pretty sure he ate that up. I am so over it.
I think about my future a lot. I am glad to hear in this thread I am not the only one who thinks divorce could be in the distant future. I am trying to stay for the kids and need to plan my financial future. I do control the budget thankfully. Otherwise we would not have much saved for retirement, emergency funds etc.
Oh my ex always shows her behaviors around her family, and unfortunately they always validate them.
She has attempted to show her behaviors around my family with not quite the same response although some do still validate just to appease her and calm her down.
My uNPDw and her highly narc mother have both said at different occasions that you can afford to be nasty to close family and that they are there to be punch bags when needed :stars: I was recently told off for not accepting being her punchbag when she needed to let off steam.... Needless to say, I am not allowed to use her as a punchbag for the same reasons....
I have had many people blame me for my exes financial disasters because I am "the man of the house" and should have stopped her or demanded bills be paid.
Quote from: Gettintired76 on September 29, 2021, 02:38:07 AM
I have had many people blame me for my exes financial disasters because I am "the man of the house" and should have stopped her or demanded bills be paid.
Imo, the boundary mindset reality of "we can only control ourselves", allows a healthy mental separation from the PD, even if we do experience financial disasters or other things linked to us because of a marriage. But, where we can have boundary-protective control over ourselves and finances in a proper manner, we should, although we will surely need the toolbox to protect ourselves from the PD drama of backlash and backhanded comments of others.
Also, as bad as love-bombing is (in hindsight), it can mentally assure us we were duped from the start. Thats love-bombing's purpose and unless a person has experienced it enough in the IDD cycle or been counseled in advance to understand it, its not going to get recognized before tying the knot.
Therefore the PD's behaviors to others (in a marriage to us), imo should be looked at by us, as something new that has arisen since marriage, and we can mentally detach ourselves from it, regarding choice in partners and others opinions.
Like Blunk stated already, there is a part of me, in full boundary protection and mental detachment from the behaviors, that enjoys witnessing my uPDw and uPDfather, show their PD side to others and then watch the drama unfold from the sidelines. Yes, i could think of a thousand things i would rather be doing then spectating a shat-show, but there is something validating about it 😂.
SoT
Agreed
I was aware of some of my ex's problems before we got married and I pushed ahead to marriage anyway. What I tell myself now is that I was young and dumb then.
Quote from: Poison Ivy on September 29, 2021, 02:23:17 PM
I was aware of some of my ex's problems before we got married and I pushed ahead to marriage anyway. What I tell myself now is that I was young and dumb then.
Im certain in my case, that they were probably visible as well, but as you stated, young and naive played a part. Love bombing was a huge factor for me, and I now can see its facade in my uPDw's dating history in high school and freshman college year. In addition, i modeled my caretaker mother, and so it was a perfect storm. But i now know that PD's are very high-radar to fulfilling their needs and very clever anglers.
My PD knew exactly where to put the lure for this waiting caretaking-catch and presented love bombing from both a sensual and kind-mannered approach. A couple years into marriage and a new child, and the devaluation began in a big way. What also began at that time is the topic of this thread. My uNPDfather (I was naive to that also) took off his gloves and started to spar with my new wife, in public settings, over control issues regarding our choices as a married couple and parenting. He was clearly out of line, but my uPDw also eagerly jumped in the fight and cleverly positioned me in the middle, and I became the target of both, as they verbally fought each other through me whenever possible and my caretaker self tried to sooth both. Total mental mayhem.
Two PD's trying to interact is like a volatile territory domination fight, and although i was in the FOG about PD's i knew things were changing and that masks were coming off. My boundary now is that i prevent myself from being around them both at the same time and if circumstances arise (weddings/funerals) that require both be present, i proactively mingle with others the whole time and keep myself occupied and MC.
As you said, wish i was PD educated as a young man and could have avoided so much drama over the decades, and been a physically (autoimmune issues) and mentally healthier adult at this time. Luckily now, with the toolbox in full protection, i am able to detach myself from the PD behaviors when they present themselves to others (in surprise) in the outer relationship circles.
SoT
SOT one of the big game changers for me was when updm and Updh started getting into it. It's what drove me into therapy the first time. I felt I was in an impossible spot!
Quote from: 11JB68 on September 30, 2021, 02:57:40 PM
SOT one of the big game changers for me was when updm and Updh started getting into it. It's what drove me into therapy the first time. I felt I was in an impossible spot!
Yes, its very difficult. Even apart after the first confrontation, each side began manipulating to be hurtful to the other, through me, my situations, my time. Very aggravating and exhausting. So glad i'm out of that mess using the toolbox.
SoT