To cut a long story short, my kids are 18 and 9 now. Dad hasn't seen either of them since before Covid.
Even when son was young Dad was pretty disinterested. Son would sit there in the corner and be ignored. When I told Dad we were pregnant with daughter Dad was actually quite nasty about it. I never understood why at the time.
I used to take daughter to see Dad at weekends but he'd ignore her pretty much. In an hour visit, he'd probably talk to her for30 seconds. She was bored. Thing is Dad is so focused on himself (how ill he is, how he needs help) that he just doesn't seem to have time for grandchildren. Thats him all over - he wants uninterruped access to me only. Hes always seen them as MY kids and not his grandchildren. I honestly believe he sees them as competitors for my time to be honest. Sad but true.
Even now Dad has a "list". I've seen it. One of the item is "ask about family". Reminding himself that he really should ask.
Anyway, as COVID came along, afterwards I decided not to go weekends but to pop up in the week nights. Dad lives 30 mins away and it was taking ALL my family time to visit at the weekend. And as daughter got older why should I make her sit there bored when the person she was seeing wasnt bothered if she was there or not?
Of course, Dad wasn't happy about this. I still get grief now "Oh its a long day on a sunday with no visitors". No mention of the kids at all. It was all about me not visiting every weekend.
So this has been going on for years. The kids get a mention because they're on the "list". Hes NEVER asked to see them pretty much - hes happy hes got me I think to run around.
I still get the comment about "can't you come at the weekend". Kids get £20 for birthdays - he doesn't even get them a card he tells me to buy a card, put £20 in and then he'll pay me. Great eh?
COMPLETE opposite to my kids gran (wifes mum). She dotes on them. They love her to bits. She buys them things etc. I always found it really sad but I guess if thats how dad wants to behave.
Oh one more thing. In the meantime, separate story, I don't speak to brother any more and my wife doesn't speak to either of them. ALL Dads doing again! To be honest, Dad was awful to my wife and I support her totally in that one.
Anyway, to get the point. Dad tonight said "I've not seen x for years, I'd like to see her, perhaps you could visit one weekend".
First feeling was one of massive guilt - I can't keep an old man from his grandchildren.
I've thought about it since. Why'd he mention "weekend"? Is he using this a scam to get an extra weekend visit out of me?
Also, he never mentioned my son? Hes 18 got his own car? Why didn't he ask me to ask him to pop in on his own one day?
And why after 2-3 years is seeing his granddaughter an issue? Shes damn well 9 years old now, doesn't really know who you are because of the way you were with her. What do you expect? I can imagine telling my mother-in-law (her gran) that we're not visiting - she'd be causing a riot with days!!! Yet Dad has been more than happy to just go with the flow.
Thing as well, my wife is dead against me taking her to visit. Her rationale is that Dad was never interested and didn't want her there, so why should we force our 9 year old to go see him now - he had his chance and decided he wasn't interested. I can see her point if I'm honest. If I pushed it, it'd cause an argument for sure- not sure if I should be letting Dad get between us like this - hes done that plenty in the past!
Still doesn't stop me feeling guilty.
p123:
You say you feel guilt over not taking your dd to see your father, but.......
it seems to me that's easier than feeling what's likely UNDER the guilt....
sadness your father didn't want anything to do with his grandchildren and so now he doesn't know his grands and doensn't have a relationship with them.
It seems like your wife has accepted the facts and made peace with them....... and you haven't, hence the guilt instead of feeling what's under it and just putting it down without feeling you HAVE to DO something about your father's request.
You don't have to do anything.
You can meet your father where he is, desiring your undivided attention, and give him only what you can spare, IMO.
Your wife seems OK with your seeing your father.... and that's amazing, considerin you said it takes almost all your family time on the weekends......maybe that's leading up to problems with your wife, OR maybe she's OK with you not being at the house?
What would you gain by taking your 9yodd to see your father?
Would it be worth the discord it would create with your wife and likely with your dd?
The discomfort you feel, when you consider saying NO to your father, is a very old reaction your father counts on to get his way with you. It might work this time, hard to say.
Just know, you don't have to love your father the way he says he NEEDS you to love him.
You have the freedom to put yourself and your children/wife first and love your father the way you NEED to.....and that's OK too. Even if your father behaves badly or pouts or rages.... whatever he does to keep you in the FOG.... know you can put it down, turn away from it and build a tolerance to that discomfort...... just sit with it without doing ANYTHING when it comes on hard. Pay attention to it. There;s a message behind it..... something you need to know about it and just sitting and tending to it often leads to insights AND a mental and physical relief you deserve and will benefit from.
Good luck to you, p123
QuoteI've thought about it since. Why'd he mention "weekend"? Is he using this a scam to get an extra weekend visit out of me?
Also, he never mentioned my son? Hes 18 got his own car? Why didn't he ask me to ask him to pop in on his own one day?
Yeah I think you've got it. It's unacceptable to divide your family members into loved and unloved groups. And his invitation hardly qualifies as loving toward your daughter, yikes. I see zero evidence, per usual, that he has any awareness he needs to actually care about his grandchildren, or that he's the reason he hasn't seen her in years. If nothing changes, nothing changes.
Quote from: Call Me Cordelia on August 09, 2022, 07:46:35 PM
QuoteI've thought about it since. Why'd he mention "weekend"? Is he using this a scam to get an extra weekend visit out of me?
Also, he never mentioned my son? Hes 18 got his own car? Why didn't he ask me to ask him to pop in on his own one day?
Yeah I think you've got it. It's unacceptable to divide your family members into loved and unloved groups. And his invitation hardly qualifies as loving toward your daughter, yikes. I see zero evidence, per usual, that he has any awareness he needs to actually care about his grandchildren, or that he's the reason he hasn't seen her in years. If nothing changes, nothing changes.
No I've no doubt she hasn't suddenly jumped up his priority list. Hes just though about it and realised he hasnt seen her for years.
I find with Dad a lot of the time its a tick box exercise. Sons phone at least twice a week - tick, visit once a week - tick, see grandchildren once in a while - tick. Half the time he seems to do stuff just to tick the box.
Quote from: hhaw on August 09, 2022, 07:16:42 PM
p123:
You say you feel guilt over not taking your dd to see your father, but.......
it seems to me that's easier than feeling what's likely UNDER the guilt....
sadness your father didn't want anything to do with his grandchildren and so now he doesn't know his grands and doensn't have a relationship with them.
It seems like your wife has accepted the facts and made peace with them....... and you haven't, hence the guilt instead of feeling what's under it and just putting it down without feeling you HAVE to DO something about your father's request.
You don't have to do anything.
You can meet your father where he is, desiring your undivided attention, and give him only what you can spare, IMO.
Your wife seems OK with your seeing your father.... and that's amazing, considerin you said it takes almost all your family time on the weekends......maybe that's leading up to problems with your wife, OR maybe she's OK with you not being at the house?
What would you gain by taking your 9yodd to see your father?
Would it be worth the discord it would create with your wife and likely with your dd?
The discomfort you feel, when you consider saying NO to your father, is a very old reaction your father counts on to get his way with you. It might work this time, hard to say.
Just know, you don't have to love your father the way he says he NEEDS you to love him.
You have the freedom to put yourself and your children/wife first and love your father the way you NEED to.....and that's OK too. Even if your father behaves badly or pouts or rages.... whatever he does to keep you in the FOG.... know you can put it down, turn away from it and build a tolerance to that discomfort...... just sit with it without doing ANYTHING when it comes on hard. Pay attention to it. There;s a message behind it..... something you need to know about it and just sitting and tending to it often leads to insights AND a mental and physical relief you deserve and will benefit from.
Good luck to you, p123
thanks hhaw...
No I dont visit at weekends any more. I stopped that a few years ago and Dad hated it. He lives 30 mins away so that was like a sunday afternoon gone. Now I visit say a Tuesday evening on my own. Like I said, part of the decision was because it was obvious Dad wasnt interested in his granddaughter just me, and as she got older, I thought why force her to go?
But you're right my kids hardly know who he is to be honest. and thats ALL down to him to be honest.
My wife literally can't stand him. Yes hes my Dad but the things hes done in the past he can't complain that she wants nothing to do with him. I support her totally in that - I'd be the same - probably worse - if her mother did half what hes done. So yes she tolerates me bailing out on a weeknight because its no big deal but its unfair to take up weekend family time. She works shifts so sometimes its rare.
And yes she has a strong opinion that hes never wanted to bother with the kids, so its unfair to make them visit him now when in the past they've pretty much not been welcome. (In the past, a few times I've turned up and hes said "oh you've brought her with you". Nice eh?) If I forced the issue, her attitude is yes you go visit him but I don't want our kids going there when its like it is. It would be a big argument if I pushed this.
Which Im not inclined to do. Dad has already caused SO much trouble in my life. I don't speak to my brother (Dads fault mostly here), Im not going to risk my marriage because of him.
Also, my daughter is 9 - shes at that age. She doesn't want to sit in the corner while Dad spends an hour asking me go through his post (yeh he does this - "Ive had a letter changes to terms and conditions of bank account - what is it?" "The terms and conditions of your bank account are changing" "Oh do I need to read it?" "up to you!!!!!").
I still feel guilt though. Ignoring how he is I cant help thinking of a lonely old man sitting there, having not seen his grandkids. I know I know I know....
Not the first time but when he pulls stunts like this I always feel guilty because I think "Jeez you're causing more trouble again, how much longer are going to be around for?"
I sometimes think it'd be better if he went sooner rather than later. All he does is moan, whinge, cause problems. I sometimes think "please go before you cause more massive problems with my wife and I end up divorced because of you".
Quote from: p123 on August 10, 2022, 04:53:58 AM
I still feel guilt though. Ignoring how he is I cant help thinking of a lonely old man sitting there, having not seen his grandkids. I know I know I know....
Which is exactly why he brought it up. You've quit going on the weekends, so he's cooked up a situation he knows will make you feel guilty: The Lonely Old Man Who Doesn't Even See His Grandkids.
Well, whose fault is that? He's made no effort to foster any sort of relationship with his grandkids, and yet he expects to just demand, out of the blue, a visit from his granddaughter?
I think your wife his right to say no to this. I suspect this is primarily just another way to try to get you to serve him, but there might be an additional motive here, which is to start grooming your daughter to feel sorry for Poor Old Grandpa.
Has your daughter ever asked after him? She last saw him when she was, what? 6 or 7? So she's more than old enough to remember what the visits were like and what he was like. If she hasn't shown the slightest interest since the last visit then I can't see any point in imposing one on her now just because he suddenly wants one.
As for the weekend suggestion, well that does rather seem to tip his hand, doesn't it? An easy excuse is "weekends are no good, the kids have planned activities/clubs etc".
Quote from: Cat of the Canals on August 10, 2022, 11:10:56 AM
Quote from: p123 on August 10, 2022, 04:53:58 AM
I still feel guilt though. Ignoring how he is I cant help thinking of a lonely old man sitting there, having not seen his grandkids. I know I know I know....
Which is exactly why he brought it up. You've quit going on the weekends, so he's cooked up a situation he knows will make you feel guilty: The Lonely Old Man Who Doesn't Even See His Grandkids.
Well, whose fault is that? He's made no effort to foster any sort of relationship with his grandkids, and yet he expects to just demand, out of the blue, a visit from his granddaughter?
I think your wife his right to say no to this. I suspect this is primarily just another way to try to get you to serve him, but there might be an additional motive here, which is to start grooming your daughter to feel sorry for Poor Old Grandpa.
I did think that. And like I said my son is 18 and drives his own car - he's not even mentioned him. There's no reason why he can't ask me to ask him to visit - but of course he could drive there on his own without me so Dad doesnt see any gain in that.
Yeh wife has a good point. Daughter never mentions him. She would not be happy if I told her she had to go visit. Thats my wife point - he made his bed, he ignored the kids, its all his fault they don't want to know him so its not fair to force a 9year old. (so yeh she was 6 probably last time)
p123:
You've suffered with this obligation and guild your parents installed into your brain and body during your formative years and it's not something you can think your way out of, IME.
It's clear yuo understand what's happening, but the pattern will persist as long as your brain continues to react and go down the familiar pathways of feeling guilt and obligation.... it's your default setting. It's an unconscious belief you CAN become aware of, tend to and STOP by replacing it with better things, IME.
Wouldn't that be amazing? Wouldn't that be relief and freedom and the ability to turn completely to the present with your wife and children?
It's possible and I hope you find a way to do that. Nowadays, trauma informed Ts don't drag you through your trauma over an over for years, like they used to and I think most T's still do. Dreadful stuff. Seen many of them, made many cry which made ME feel wore, not better, so.......the new breed of T's...... the trauma INFORMED T's......
They help you calm your brain down in order to process ALL THAT TRAUMA bouncing around in your limbic system, which is a process your brain was built to do every second of every day, BUT FOR the trauma shutting down your frontal cortex, bc survival/fight or flight brain actuall shuts down in order to KEEP YOU ALIVE. Your surival brain thinks FOO trauma is exactly the same as being chased by a tiger...... it releases the same chemicals and FEEEELS your life is threatened, which isn't helpful to deal with trauma, IME. It's impossible to process trauma without engaging your frontal lobe, which reqjuires learning to calm down your brain and body to integrate your WHOLE brain and EASILY PROCESS TRAUMA, which happens in a split second IF WE GIVE OUR BRAINS THE CHANCE.
Psst..... finding a good trauma informed therapist with ex[erience in AIT and EMDR, while also working on their own stuff with a T so they keep their EGO out of the therapeautic relationship, can be transformative, IME. It has been for me. Maybe consider spending 5 Tueday afternoons in therapy sessions with a good AIT therapist...... instead of spending that time with your father and see if there's a life changing shift?
Everyone finds their own path, so not saying my way would be your way, but you might look up AIT and practitioners near you, just to see what's available, as a place to begin, if it feels right to you.
AIT is ADVANCED INTEGRATIVE THERAPY which is a more comprehensive and helpful form of TAPPING, which is a proven therapy used by traditional and alternative therapists alike.
EMDR is EYE MOVEMENT DESENSITIZATION REPROCESSING. It's established and a very useful tool, all working to engage your entire brain..... to get your frontal cortex online WITH your survival/reptilian brain so the traumatic stuff can be processed and refiled into historic files.
I repeat some things, likely, bc knowing a bit about what the brain does really helped me understand and break down the parts of healing trauma into bite size pieces I needed.
You likely feel IN YOUR OWN WAY, bc that's how it felt for me to feel trapped in old patterns and habits I understood weren't healthy, but...... I didn't know how to get past it.
You deserve to get past it, p123.
Another really great things about doing the work is that you're modeling it for your children and teaching it as you learn and grow.
HUGE self compassion
dropping judgement
releasing exectations
learning to calm your brain down......
these are coping strategies and life skills you and I weren't taught, but the brain is capable of learning and changing our entire lives..... which is HUGE and good great news: )
Good luck, p123: )
I wonder if in addition to it being leverage for weekend visits, if he is also trying to figure out hiw to get you back under his thumb in general again.
I wonder if he thought, "what isgoing on with p, maybe he's angry I haven't asked to see granddaughter in a while, maybe that'll soften him up again."
Quote from: square on August 10, 2022, 04:50:23 PM
I wonder if in addition to it being leverage for weekend visits, if he is also trying to figure out hiw to get you back under his thumb in general again.
I wonder if he thought, "what isgoing on with p, maybe he's angry I haven't asked to see granddaughter in a while, maybe that'll soften him up again."
Yeh hes figured out somethings up for sure.....
He keeps grabbing me to give me a hug and tell me how wonderful I am - makes me feel ill because I know all hes interested in is getting me onside.
Yes he'd LOVE for me to start weekend visits again!
About wishing he were dead. Wouldn't it be nice to just have him magically disappear and you didn't have to keep doing the hard work of maintaining your boundaries. Yeah, I get it. But the health of your marriage is in your power much much more than your dad's... unless you give it to him. You know this. He would be pleased as punch if you sacrificed your family to his whims. A decent father would have enough love to go around for everyone, but your dad has made it into a perpetual competition. Foolish, because naturally wife and children ought to win that contest. So fight the good fight and keep the enemy out.
Quote from: Call Me Cordelia on August 11, 2022, 12:50:25 PM
About wishing he were dead. Wouldn't it be nice to just have him magically disappear and you didn't have to keep doing the hard work of maintaining your boundaries. Yeah, I get it. But the health of your marriage is in your power much much more than your dad's... unless you give it to him. You know this. He would be pleased as punch if you sacrificed your family to his whims. A decent father would have enough love to go around for everyone, but your dad has made it into a perpetual competition. Foolish, because naturally wife and children ought to win that contest. So fight the good fight and keep the enemy out.
Yeh hes persistent I'll give him that - he does not give up EVER. Hes like a terminator. Its constant trying it on.....
Of course, I dont wish him dead but I do wonder when the next major drama is coming that causes hassle with my marriage.
here's another thought-
i have a lot of conflicting feelings about both my biological parents- and even though i am NC with my mother and very LC with my father it's up to me to resolve those feelings- they didn't go away automatically just because i limited my contact. in the same manner, our unresolved feelings and the learned behaviors we adapted as children don't simply go away when a uPD/ PD parent passes- we still have to do that work to retrain our brain and response patterns to not operating on the FOG alone.
did you ask your DD if she wanted to visit? what kinds of activities would your father be able to participate with her? our best visits with niece/nephew are the ones where we either go someplace and DO a thing or play a fun family type game together. kids these days don't want to just sit there and be interrogated by their elders and it's perfectly ok to not subject your daughter to that. your DS is old enough to have a relationship with your father on his own- and his decision not to speaks volumes.
Quote from: xredshoesx on August 12, 2022, 05:10:19 AM
here's another thought-
i have a lot of conflicting feelings about both my biological parents- and even though i am NC with my mother and very LC with my father it's up to me to resolve those feelings- they didn't go away automatically just because i limited my contact. in the same manner, our unresolved feelings and the learned behaviors we adapted as children don't simply go away when a uPD/ PD parent passes- we still have to do that work to retrain our brain and response patterns to not operating on the FOG alone.
did you ask your DD if she wanted to visit? what kinds of activities would your father be able to participate with her? our best visits with niece/nephew are the ones where we either go someplace and DO a thing or play a fun family type game together. kids these days don't want to just sit there and be interrogated by their elders and it's perfectly ok to not subject your daughter to that. your DS is old enough to have a relationship with your father on his own- and his decision not to speaks volumes.
Ive no doubt what would happen if I turned up this weekend with my daughter. He'd do as he always did. He'd make a half hearted attempt to say hello, then expect her to sit in the corner and be quiet while he got on with the business of asking me what he needs to ask me (e.g. going through his post for the week, telling me how ill hes been, asking for my medical opinion).
I always remember when I did visit. Sometimes we'd go for a drive. There was this park with a lovely play area, it was in the mountains so Dad liked it too. So we'd drive there, go for a cup of tea, then I'd let daughter in the park bit. Dad would just moan and moan and even say "Come on I want to go home now". This would be literally after daughter being in the park 5 minutes. The one time I thought sod it and let him sit in the car for 10-15 mins did he moan afterwards that "he wanted to go home".
His excuse "well I want to go home now, there'll be other times for you to take her to park". So my 6 year old would sit in the car driving over there for 30 mins, then 45 mins driving to the park, sit at a table while he had his cup of tea, then was only allowed 5 minutes in the park according to him. Repeat journey home.
It always was HIS time and no-one elses. Hes never changed.
Last time I took him out to the cricket we got back to car, got him in, then I text my wife to give her an ETA. He rudely piped up "Hurry up I want to go home now, you don't need to be messing with your phone". This was after I'd driven 30 mins to pick him up, 30 mins to the game, I'd arranged a disabled parking space, and disabled tickets with great seats, pushed him in his wheelchair to the seats, now I had a 30 min drive to take him home, then 30 mins more for me to get home. And he hasn't the patience to wait literally 2 mins... Its not great is it?
You know your dad best so take from this what you will, but the first thing that occurred to me was your daughter's age now.
9 year olds know how to sit quietly for longer, and are not as demanding as 6 7 8 year olds. If you go for a bathroom break whilst there then 9 year olds are old enough to inform on what goes on( your house) , yet young enough maybe not to know that your dad is being intrusive?
Often, PDs feel that they can pick up a relationship whenever it suits them. It doesn't matter if they haven't shown an interest before. It's their entitlement!!
He might feel that he could even influence her? And if it means. return to weekend visits then so much the better for your dad.
Am I being too cynical?
Quote from: nanotech on August 13, 2022, 10:41:58 AM
You know your dad best so take from this what you will, but the first thing that occurred to me was your daughter's age now.
9 year olds know how to sit quietly for longer, and are not as demanding as 6 7 8 year olds. If you go for a bathroom break whilst there then 9 year olds are old enough to inform on what goes on( your house) , yet young enough maybe not to know that your dad is being intrusive?
Often, PDs feel that they can pick up a relationship whenever it suits them. It doesn't matter if they haven't shown an interest before. It's their entitlement!!
He might feel that he could even influence her? And if it means. return to weekend visits then so much the better for your dad.
Am I being too cynical?
Nano - do you what Im thinking the same thing?
Like you said hes made zero effort in the past so why does he think its ok now. As I said, its a tick box exercise, "Entitled to see grandaughter, turned up - tick". To be honest, I'm not sure hes really that bothered but thinks maybe he should see her.
And of course nice chance to get a few weekend visits out of me.
I had a right go at him last night on the phone...... Im away on holidays in 10 days time and yes hes not happy (what about me???)
So he tried to tell me I HAVE to visit next week because he won't have any food otherwise. I mean I intended to visit I am very busy this week so it does annoy me when he demands. I told him I'd try to work something out but he could get food delivered so he won;t starve. So then he wants to know WHY?
When he then said, well you're family will have to cancel things or your wife will have to tell her employer she can't work that day. Told him his food was not an emergency, I would help him when I could as I always do, but hes does not get priority over things my family do.
Then he pipes up "oh bring x (my daughter) with you if wife is working then?" (umm so you want me to bring my 9 year old out at 8pm at night to sit in the corner while you talk crap to me for an hour and totally ignore here then?)
How manipulative is that?
"I can't keep an old man from his grandchildren."
First of all, you totally can. And it's really not your problem. Grandparents can make an effort and meet us halfway, but we shouldn't have to move mountains so they can maintain a relationship with grandkids. That's them screwing up their relationship and making no effort to repair it themselves, instead he outsources the problem to you. It's not your job.
Why does he care now? In my experience, we never know what happened to suddenly make our PD parents reach out, but you can often assume there's a third party that said something to them that made them feel ashamed at their abysmal parenting/grandparenting and then they reach out.
Quote from: donutmoonpanda on August 15, 2022, 10:50:48 AM
"I can't keep an old man from his grandchildren."
First of all, you totally can. And it's really not your problem. Grandparents can make an effort and meet us halfway, but we shouldn't have to move mountains so they can maintain a relationship with grandkids. That's them screwing up their relationship and making no effort to repair it themselves, instead he outsources the problem to you. It's not your job.
Why does he care now? In my experience, we never know what happened to suddenly make our PD parents reach out, but you can often assume there's a third party that said something to them that made them feel ashamed at their abysmal parenting/grandparenting and then they reach out.
Wouldnt be surprised if something has twigged in his head...... Or someone has said something....
As I've always said hes so self absorbed hes got zero space for anything else in his head. So its possible someone has said something and hes thought "oh yeh I haven't see my grandchildren for years"
I think your Dad just wants groceries delivered by you and a long chat with you, p.
I also think your DD would be left sitting in the corner, as history would predict and your father would behave just as he's always behaved if you take DD to visit on a weekend.
You can't change, fix or otherwise make your dad more appropriate or grateful.
You can give your dad what you want to give without meeting feeling obligated to meet his irrational expectations and demands, ime.
Your dad will never be happy, no matter what you do.
You might as well make yourself happy and take care of what's yours to care for....yourself, your marriage and your children.
Your father is responsible for himself and the consequences of his life choices.
You couldn't save him from that if you tried and I think you did try.
Release the guilt and embrace your joy, for all its worth, p.
Guilt sucks.
Acceptance is a balm.
Quote from: hhaw on August 15, 2022, 07:05:09 PM
I think your Dad just wants groceries delivered by you and a long chat with you, p.
I also think your DD would be left sitting in the corner, as history would predict and your father would behave just as he's always behaved if you take DD to visit on a weekend.
You can't change, fix or otherwise make your dad more appropriate or grateful.
You can give your dad what you want to give without meeting feeling obligated to meet his irrational expectations and demands, ime.
Your dad will never be happy, no matter what you do.
You might as well make yourself happy and take care of what's yours to care for....yourself, your marriage and your children.
Your father is responsible for himself and the consequences of his life choices.
You couldn't save him from that if you tried and I think you did try.
Release the guilt and embrace your joy, for all its worth, p.
Guilt sucks.
Acceptance is a balm.
Well groceries is an excuse to make me go to be honest. He doesn't need groceries this is just his excuse.
What he wants is for me to visit regularly, go through all his post etc, get a medical opinion off me etc etc.
100% she'd sit there in the corner. Dads attitude to kids is weird. He seems to think they just need to be quiet and not be heard.
Well just got back from 3 weeks away in Florida.
He REALLY milked that one. I know all the tricks now though so ignored him. It follows a pattern.
He starts off telling me how selfish I am going away when I don't get paid (none of your business!) then it moves to how is he going to cope, then hes SO worried about me with all those FOREIGNERS.
Then a few days before hes SO ILL but he'll managed. Then I;ve GOT TO phone him EVERY day.
Ignore it all of course, I phoned him once in two weeks when I was away.
Back now, and its the "I was so worried".....
As expected the visit with daughter thing is forgotten about., Hes now on full tilt to tell me how ill hes been to try and make sure next years holiday doesnt happen.
I love it...a list telling him to ask how the family is. My father would ask how my kids were but 10 seconds into my reply his eyes would glaze over and he wasn't listening anymore. He just knew he was supposed to ask about them.
I'm a bit spiteful so this is what I would have done with the granddaughter's visit. I'd bring her out. But as soon as he got tired of talking to her (2, 3 minutes tops?) the visit would be over and I'd leave. How can he argue with that? He wanted to see her and you brought her...that was the entire purpose of the trip.
That stuff about your "boss" not liking you taking time off or you being selfish (to your wife and kids I guess?) for going without pay and all of that, he doesn't even really believe it.
They are just ways to badger you about how your FATHER doesn't like it, your FATHER thinks it's selfish (to him) and so on.
When you hear those stupid reasons, don't twist your mind to figure out how he doesn't understand you are self-employed, doesn't understand how saving up holiday time and funds is a joy to your family not a burden, doesn't understand how any of it works. Don't look for the logic there because all he's doing is throwing spaghetti at the wall and seeing if any of it moves you to doing what he wants.
Great job managing that, one phone call? Wow.
Quote from: square on September 12, 2022, 08:33:35 AM
When you hear those stupid reasons, don't twist your mind to figure out how he doesn't understand you are self-employed, doesn't understand how saving up holiday time and funds is a joy to your family not a burden, doesn't understand how any of it works. Don't look for the logic there because all he's doing is throwing spaghetti at the wall and seeing if any of it moves you to doing what he wants.
square nailed it. They will say pretty much ANYTHING if they think it might get them what they want. Whether or not their words are true/reasonable/rational/etc. is sort of beside the point. They don't care. Everything is secondary to getting their Want.
Quote from: square on September 12, 2022, 08:33:35 AM
That stuff about your "boss" not liking you taking time off or you being selfish (to your wife and kids I guess?) for going without pay and all of that, he doesn't even really believe it.
They are just ways to badger you about how your FATHER doesn't like it, your FATHER thinks it's selfish (to him) and so on.
When you hear those stupid reasons, don't twist your mind to figure out how he doesn't understand you are self-employed, doesn't understand how saving up holiday time and funds is a joy to your family not a burden, doesn't understand how any of it works. Don't look for the logic there because all he's doing is throwing spaghetti at the wall and seeing if any of it moves you to doing what he wants.
Great job managing that, one phone call? Wow.
When my grandmother didn't like something and wanted to prove she had 'backup' she would proclaim .."well THEY said..." and I would ask her who They were? She would just repeat THEY louder and louder. I would ask "who are 'they'? I want names and addresses" and she would get so frustrated that I would question her. I assume THEY are related to P123's 'boss'.
Quote from: lkdrymom on September 12, 2022, 08:04:47 AM
I love it...a list telling him to ask how the family is. My father would ask how my kids were but 10 seconds into my reply his eyes would glaze over and he wasn't listening anymore. He just knew he was supposed to ask about them.
I'm a bit spiteful so this is what I would have done with the granddaughter's visit. I'd bring her out. But as soon as he got tired of talking to her (2, 3 minutes tops?) the visit would be over and I'd leave. How can he argue with that? He wanted to see her and you brought her...that was the entire purpose of the trip.
Yeh I've seen the list "Ask about family" is there......
I know hes not really interested. I tested him once and said "oh son has been really ill". Didn't even register or listen. Nope onto next agenda item.....
Oh yes 100% she'd have literally 30 seconds and he'd be on to the "list"
Quote from: square on September 12, 2022, 08:33:35 AM
That stuff about your "boss" not liking you taking time off or you being selfish (to your wife and kids I guess?) for going without pay and all of that, he doesn't even really believe it.
They are just ways to badger you about how your FATHER doesn't like it, your FATHER thinks it's selfish (to him) and so on.
When you hear those stupid reasons, don't twist your mind to figure out how he doesn't understand you are self-employed, doesn't understand how saving up holiday time and funds is a joy to your family not a burden, doesn't understand how any of it works. Don't look for the logic there because all he's doing is throwing spaghetti at the wall and seeing if any of it moves you to doing what he wants.
Great job managing that, one phone call? Wow.
Yeh see what you mean.....
Dad is also the worlds biggest grey man though. Hes stuck in the 1950s. This is how the world works and I know is his attitude.......
But yeh of course it helps him too.