Am I too senstive?

[sevenyears]

Am I being too sensitive? On Saturday, I dropped DS4 and DD7 off at uocpd Xh for their week with him. This was an exception to our usual transfers. The children invited me inside, and xh and I had something to speak about regarding the health of DS4 since I think he is coming down with the chicken pox. He said he would take him to our GP on Monday. I told him that I had emailed the pediatrician already on Friday to get an appointment for the weekend, but hadn't heard back from them yet (while DS was with me). A couple hours later, I heard back from the clinic that they could see DS on Sunday, PD's day. I let PD know about that, and he complained that he should be able to make his own appointments. I pointed out that this was the earliest they could see him. Well, this morning PD cancelled the pediatrician appointment and gave several excuses. I countered his excuses with facts, but didn't push again for him to take DS to the doctor. He said he would keep DS home on Monday so that he could observe him.

I feel like uocpd XH tries constantly to negate me. In this case, my observations about our son's health count for nothing. I also told XH about progress DS was making with a new skill and how proud I am of him. XH response - he already does that when he's with me. It's not about DS doing something better with one parent than when he's with the other. It's about developing a new skill! But, of course, PD wants credit for it. He also tries to get the children to form negative associations with me. DD7 has a small blanket that she carries everywhere that gets filthy. He told her he would wash it this week, and she protested. She never likes having it washed, not at my place, nor at his. His response: I know you don't like it when your mother washes it.

How do I deal with this? I didn't respond when I was there except to say again how proud I am of both children. They sound like small things. But, it was constant before we divorced. It continues when we see each other. And, it happens when I'm not there. I'm aware of a few big criticisms, which i've posted about here. How can I deal with the regular degradation of me he tells the children?  Am I too sensitive about this? 

[anxiousmom]

I wish I had advice for how to handle this -as I completely understand and am going through it myself right now. I just wanted to let you know that NO, you are not being too sensitive. That's part of what a PD does to us: makes us feel as if we are the crazy ones, or we are the ones overreacting. I suppose after dealing with a PD, we shouldn't *expect* normalcy, but we still deserve it and deserve to have our feelings when the PDs break these very simple co-parenting rules. You are not alone. I am sure someone much wiser than me will have some good advice for how to handle.

[sevenyears]

Thanks Anxiousmom. I know from your other posts that you're going through some rough waters right now. My PD's comments feel so dismissive and negative. They are small, but constant. And, if they bother me, I can only imagine what impact they are having on DD7 and DS4. Are they like drops in a bucket that eventually fill up? Or, is it nothing really to worry about? I guess having good responses will help worry about them less.


I also realized that something in my original post might not have been clear, so here it is again, cleared up. "me" referred to PD, not to yours truly.

I also told XH about progress DS was making with a new skill and how proud I am of him. XH response - "he already does that when he's with me" (PD). It's not about DS doing something better with one parent than when he's with the other. It's about developing a new skill! But, of course, PD wants credit for it. 

[notrightinthehead]

You might consider beginning to document all these events. Especially the cancellation of a doctor's appointment when the child might be  ill  and any such incidents  - especially those that you can prove. Parental alienation is a thing and if you can prove it - it might  help you later on. I would medium chill and grey rock all these provocations and quietly document like hell!

[sevenyears]

Notright - good idea. I will document it better. Parental alienation isn't recognized here. Criticizing one parent in front of the child is considered emotional child abuse. Proving it is nigh impossible as I have found. Recording him is illegal without his consent. He denied criticizing me during our divorce proceedings. He yelled about me and angrily criticized me to the children right before our custody evaluation. I reported what the children said to me to the evaluators. They did not talk to the children individually. In their final report, they said it is questionable whether he really criticized me in front of the children. For example, DS4 does not have a pacifier any more at my place, he still does with his father. When DS4 threw temper tantrums (as 4 year olds do) at uocpd xh, xh would rip it from him and angrily yell that he is throwing it away since he doesn't have one at my place. Clearly he wants to create a negative association with me. When I told the custody evaluators what DS4 and DD7 told me on several occasions, she responded that maybe he was trying to help me wean DS from the pacifier! They were protecting him!

So, realizing that proving anything is unlikely, and wouldn't change anything, how can I build up my resistance of his crap, as well as that of the children's?

[Penny Lane]

I don't think you're being too sensitive. I think PDs are very good at finding the worst way to get under our skins. That's like their superpower.

However I do think you'll feel better if you can find strategies for dealing with it and trying to not let it upset you. Whenever DH shows that he's not reacting to some kind of attack like this from BM, she stops doing it.

Some ideas I have:
Stop telling him stuff. Coparents should be able to share the joys and pride of their kids doing good stuff. But your ex will use literally anything you tell him as a means to attack you. If you have to pretend like you're sharing stuff while the court case goes on, fine, but after that he should not even know whether DS uses a pacifier at your house or not. I know that in an ideal world you would coordinate stuff like this. But you can't coordinate, he won't work with you, and he'll just use the information against you. (If he asks, I'm not advocating that you lie - just, don't volunteer anything that isn't something he specifically needs to know in order to make decisions).

I don't think you should go into his house or let him into yours. In fact I think you shouldn't really talk face to face at all and minimally over the phone. The reason is that it's harder for you to hide that he's succeeded in upsetting you. And so he's getting the feedback he wants when he treats you badly to your face.

The health stuff is very scary! I would definitely document it. It might not help you now, but you never know.

This is all very hard to deal with and it's OK to be having a tough time. One light at the end of the tunnel, for you, is that I think after court ends you will be able to relax and do some healing. You are in triage mode all the time right now and that doesn't leave a lot of room for working on yourself. I hope that end comes as quickly as possible for you!

[athene1399]

BM would argue with anything SO said to her, even if he's repeating what the doctor said. It is so frustrating. The whole situation is just so frustrating, heartbreaking, angering...

I will second what Penny says about trying to not talk to xh face to face. Try to get all communications in text or email. That way you can print up whatever you need (or may need) for court. It's also less of a "he said/she said" if you can show the text message/email from him. I would also cut back communications where you can and keep only what is necessary, like when are the doctors appointments, if someone got hurt, or suspended from school (stuff like that). It sucks, but you can't tell xh "I am so proud that DS is doing x" becasue he will just throw it in your face somehow. You can share stuff like this with your friends and family however. unfortunately, you really can't trust xh.

I agree with the others to document whenever he cancels appointments and log what happens. Like if it ends up that DS4 does have chicken pox, note that you thought he did, made an apt, the earliest available was on xh's day, he refused to take SD, so SD had to wait x number of days to be seen by a doctor.

The degradation is difficult to deal with as you shouldn't outright dispute what he says. i've read that if you come right out and tell the kids "xh is lying when he says x about me." or "that isn't true about me" they get confused and don't know who to believe. What you can do is prove you aren't what he says through your actions. If xh tells the kids you are a liar, then make sure that you follow through with everything you promise them/tell them and don't make promises you aren't sure you can keep. And remember that you aren't the one ripping the pacifier out of their mouths; he is. And if the kids say "XH ripped a pacifier out of my mouth becasue of you", ask "have I ever done this to you?" and empathize: "I am sorry XH is doing this. I cannot control what he does. We can only control our own actions." I would also document that if you hear it happening again even if no one else appears to care right now. You never know when/if it will hold weigh in court.

The hardest thing is to be patient with the kids when they parrot back stuff xh says. Try not to loose your cool. This can be very hard when you feel that you are being scrutinized and lied about. It is our natural instinct to defend ourselves, but this usually just confuses the kids. just stay patient and try not to show them you are frustrated with them. "I'm sorry xh says this. how do you feel when he says this? It's okay to feel however you do. I would probably feel sad if I heard my parent say this". DS4 might be too young for some of this. I honestly only had experience with a teen going through this.  But lead by example, model good and mature behavior. Kids learn best through modeled behavior. Be the opposite of what xh says about you. They will start connecting the dots and notice that what he says is just not true.

And self-care. Take care of yourself. It is so easy to burn out with this going on. Allot time in the day to do something for yourself where you don't think about the situation. it will help keep your mind fresh and it will help to recharge you.

[sevenyears]

Penny, Athene, thanks for your advice.

This time was a bit of an exception. According to our new arrangement for transfers, if there is no school/kindergarten on Friday, then the parent with whom the children have been should take them to the next parent. Since DS was developing spots, and it was too cold to show them outside, we went into the house. Since the children were excited, they began telling him about our vacation and I told him how proud I was of their developmental milestones and new skills. UOCPD XH took credit for the new skills. I wanted to ask him why he was taking credit from DS, but refrained and stayed medium chill. I try to be MC when we're face to face, as much as possible. I don't always succeed, but I do pretty well all things considered.

I also stay calm when the kids parrot stuff back that he has said. For better or worse, I'm good at not expressing my views. I do though want to build their resilience to his crap. Athene, you gave some good concrete suggestions.

I have documented everything about the medical appointment. In the end, DS went back to kindergarten yesterday. He wasn't sent home, so that's a good sign that he's on the mend and it wasn't too serious. Good news.

[athene1399]

I think you did great with the medium chill. Sometimes we are so thrown off by what the PD parent says, we don't' realize how we are engaging with them in the moment.

And I was speaking from experience on the "be patient" part. SO would get very frustrated with SD when we didn't know what parental alienation was. He and SD would argue becasue she was saying the most ridiculous things. Once the Law Guardian explained what was going on, we had to work very hard on not getting frustrated in the moment. It sounds like you do not have this problem and are already calm with them. That is good!

The reason why I went into the "not making promises you can't keep" was also based off of what we specifically went through with the alienation.  Until BM ranted one day about SO's lies and gave an example, we had no idea why she called him a liar. SO has a tendency to blurt out whatever he is thinking. BM called him a liar because he never followed through. And it was stuff like "One day I want to buy a boat" and since he never did, BM tells SD he is a liar. But it's stuff that most people wouldn't consider a lie. So I suggested to him to be careful on what he says around SD in case she's hearing these things  he's blurting out and considering them promises. Like don't say "I want to go on vacation this summer" if you can't guarantee we'll have the money too. So SO being mindful of what he was saying around SD helped him to prove he was honest and not a liar (even though technically it wasn't anything I would consider a lie).

I hope things get better. I know we always felt like we weren't doing enough. I think it's because the alienation can really only be combated gently. Like the alienating parent employs all these nasty tactics in turning the kids against you and all you can do is smile and be nice. Sometimes it feels like nothing you do matters. but it does make a difference. It makes a huge difference. All those little nice things and words you say and do add up and the kids notice subconsciously.