Struggling to Figure Things Out

[makingachange]

Hi, thank you for reading this.  I guess this is more me trying to sort through things and looking for insight from those who have gone No Contact with FOO.

I have been no contact with mostly my extended family for years...because of situations/comments/and them turning me into their scapegoat.

My Mother and I only talk through text messages at this point in our relationship.  However, after months and months of her only talking about herself and not really having any care for my newborn or anything going on in my life, I made the decision to start gray rocking.  I started to gray rock because I felt irritated that nothing in my life seemed to matter, and all she was ever looking for was validation from me and praise towards her.  My father has never called me or even texts....it is as if he doesn't even bother with me...but says he loves me. 

After gray rocking my Mother for a bit, she started to notice and started giving me guilt trips a couple times a week.  It felt like she amped up her games and also started to ask me unusual questions.  So, out of the blue during the gray rocking, she asks me to call her.  I tell her yes, maybe sometime...she blows up big time with messages that are rude, threatening, and over the top.

I took this as a threat really, and honestly didn't think I should respond, so I didn't.  She is used to texting me multiple times a day every day...and so, when I didn't respond for days...she ends up sending me another message 4 days later saying....I know something is wrong but you just aren't telling me...are you ok...and says that mothers know when something isn't right.  She then starts acting and saying things that makes it seems like I am the one with the problem.

Basically what ends up happening is she continues to send mean and threatening messages...telling me she is going to do a wellness check on me or send someone who will...etc. Even though I told her I am completely fine. 

I was astonished that she could be so rude and over the top and then not take one ounce of responsibility or see that her actions with those first messages was why I did not respond.  Then to make it out as though it was me with the problem was ridiculous.

So, I basically just stopped answering her messages...she started to try to love bomb me...and I just didn't respond.

Now, she isn't sending any messages at all, and hasn't said one word.

I guess there is a part of me that still wonders, was her actions over the top...or am I just "too sensitive"? 

Right now, we are no contact...and there is a part of me that feels like there is no way I could go back to this, but then I also hate not having a relationship with them.  The relationship has not been good for years...but I guess it is just the thought that this is your Mother and Father...and you are done.  I guess it is also the pain and the hurt that they cannot see their own actions or simply just don't care.   I did end up sharing a couple things with them that they had done that hurt me in these messages, and all I get is..."I cant fix the past. Sorry."  and ..."That is a poor excuse" - in regards to the thing that they did to me.

I think my intuition keeps saying to stay away and move on, but there is still a part of me that wishes that things could have been different.


Thank you so much for reading this.  I would love to hear any thoughts or insights you have on this.  I am beyond thankful for this forum, it has been a lifesaver!   

[Boat Babe]

Hi makingachange. I think it's our inner child who is the last to let go of the hope that our parents will love them as they should. When we have done all the work and have clarity, as you do, then we need to hold and cherish that part of ourselves with unconditional love. Then that need/hope dissolves.

Giving up the hope that my mother will be any different was actually very freeing. There's a lightness to it which makes LC more doable for me. And it's very emotionally healing.

[buffy]

Hi, I haven't gone no contact but am planning to this year.

I wonder if it's a universally used manipulation tactic by every abuser to say ''you're just too sensitive.'' By gray rocking you set a boundary, in a way. Something in you had enough and decided you deserved more. I think a parent can feel that, and if they're not emotionally mature, it freaks them out. My mother has always done a similar thing to her victims – asking: are *you* okay? To the point of actually making people question their own reality and sanity. I think all of it is also just a desperate attempt to provoke you, in the hopes that you'll respond to something. But it seems like you're already pretty immune to it.

It's so hard to walk away when you have a million different conflicting feelings. Something I try to do is just let myself feel it all, while knowing I'll still put myself first in the end. There can be doubt, guilt, sadness, but that doesn't mean you have to act on it. It's perfectly normal to wish things were different. And that is a painful feeling to have when you're trying to let go and make a decision. Doesn't mean your gut is wrong, though(is it ever?)

Maybe some people get lucky and don't doubt themselves as much, but I get the feeling that for a lot of us it's reeeally hard to give up hope and walk away.

[Hilltop]

makingachange I spent all of last year doing gray rock with my parents.  I noticed that each visit their behaviour became more and more overt.  They were quite rude.  I didn't say a thing as in the past it had never helped and thinking about it I think they expected a reaction from me.  By the end of the year I was exhausted and went NC.  I couldn't see a way out, I had also started putting more distance in between visits and they got worse and worse.  At no point did they ever say what was wrong or if they were upset, they just got ruder and ruder.  I finally gave up.

DH said to just give them more space, more distance and eventually when I see them they will be pleasant enough however to me that's exhausting.  I would go not knowing if they would be normal or rude and really I was already spacing out my visits by a few months and they were getting worse not better. I am now NC.

I did unblock on email and got an email from my mother earlier in the year, nothing about not seeing each other.  It was a funny video with a simple message of hope you find this funny.  My mother has a habit of any time I am upset by her behaviour, she sometimes tells me I have depression.  To her I am not upset by her behaviour, no I am depressed and she sends me funny videos to cheer me up.  Not asking if I am ok, just sending something to say have a laugh at this.  I don't think I have depression, I get down about our relationship and I would get upset over things that have happened but this is normal, well I think so anyway.  In fact I would go so far as to say my mother doesn't think there is anything wrong with her behaviour and it really is all me, just 6 months ago, she told me I was difficult once again.  Its really hard with these types because they simply don't get it.  There is no self awareness.  They do something hurtful and all they can say is "you're too sensitive".  Yep I have heard that one before too.  I didn't respond to my mother and blocked the email again.  She is continuing to play the same game she always has and I am no longer interested.

The thing is, we aren't too sensitive.  I have spent a lot of time thinking of my behaviour, how would it come across to them, what could I have done differently, I have then done things differently, responded differently and yet it hasn't made a difference.  When I think back to some of the things they have done, it is really hurtful, its bad.  That's the thing though, you get programmed to be use to being treated poorly that in the end they can do really hurtful things and you will question if you are too sensitive like they say.

"I can't fix the past, sorry".  That's dismissive.  You aren't asking her to fix the past, you are asking for her to apologise for hurting you, to actually recognise the hurt, to show some empathy. 

"That is a poor excuse".  Dismissive again.  She doesn't get to judge if your feelings are valid.  Your emotions are valid. Again there is no empathy, she just wants to rug sweep everything away and keep on doing the same old dance.

NC may just give you the chance to start healing.  Its not easy, I am going through the same stuff. Gray rock works for some people.  I just found it escalated their poor behaviour so it didn't work for me.  I am NC because I am exhausted by it all.  I don't have the ability to simply ignore hurtful behaviour, I do get upset, I can't shut that off, so for me NC is the answer.

Its not easy but hopefully you'll find what is right for you.

[DistanceNotDefense]

Gray rock works for some people.  I just found it escalated their poor behaviour so it didn't work for me.  I am NC because I am exhausted by it all.  I don't have the ability to simply ignore hurtful behaviour, I do get upset, I can't shut that off, so for me NC is the answer.

I had the same experience as Hilltop here. Grey rocking/medium chill and LC work in some situations with some tweaking of distance, space between messages, visits, etc. to keep some "thread" going, but I think if your gut is telling you that even this isn't making you feel respected and safe, that's something to listen to.

My FOO also ramped up in response to innocuous/delayed responses. They sensed it was a boundary and resented it to the extreme. I was no longer caretaking, and no longer allowing scapegoating, and my usefulness had thus been worn out. I went NC. The "thread" was petering out to be nothing but pain for me, and pain was all I was holding on to.

"Too sensitive" - I think that's definitely a common tactic in the dysfunctional family/scapegoating playbook. This was drilled into me as a kid. It's thrown out at the family members who can actually self-reflect, wonder if it is true, and thus sow doubt so that those who say it don't need to ever be accountable for their actions. You're probably not sensitive, you're just self-aware.

You're perfectly reasonable not always responding or giving an overflow of information with every message. You have a right to mental space. You wouldn't deal with your boss doing this to you on the weekends.
Family is no different! Your M's response to that was, in my opinion, very disrespectful of your god given right to just breathe and take care of yourself. You aren't committing murder. You're just being less accessible. A healthy person would be able to deal with that.

I hate not having a relationship with my FOO either. But the relationship I hate not having is one that doesn't exist: one where I actually get something out of it. I miss them but more and more I realize I'm missing the idea of them and what they couldn't be for me.

It gets easier and clearer with time. And it gets ESPECIALLY clear the more and more time you spend away from their influence and communication and you get a chance to see and feel what life without them (and without their guilt hanging over your head) is really like.

If going NC feels scary because it feels like "THE END" then don't call it that. Don't label it. That really helps me. You're taking "A Break." It's not permanent. You can always go back to LC. It's just what you need to do to feel OK right now, get clear on things, and to heal. As long as your FOO responds to what you need right now with nothing but resentment and rudeness (if you still have a way of seeing what they're up to/reading messages etc., though I'd recommend blocking everything) then that just means you can continue to let "The Break" ride if that's what you need.

And remember you're not doing it because you want to! You're doing it in response to choices your family members made. It's the defense mechanism of a healthy person. They're the cause, you're the effect. Stay strong 

[makingachange]

Hi makingachange. I think it's our inner child who is the last to let go of the hope that our parents will love them as they should. When we have done all the work and have clarity, as you do, then we need to hold and cherish that part of ourselves with unconditional love. Then that need/hope dissolves.

Giving up the hope that my mother will be any different was actually very freeing. There's a lightness to it which makes LC more doable for me. And it's very emotionally healing.

Hi Boat Babe!

Thank you so much for your input and advice!  I agree with you about the inner child.  It wasn't until I felt pushed to start healing and focusing on my inner child that all of this started to be pushed up for me with my FOO.  When I started to actually focus on the inner child things started to make more sense and the more I was able to see clearly.

I am starting to notice a difference in myself in the last couple of days, and especially this morning.  I feel like I am starting to see more clearly and realize that I can't expect anything more of them...and I feel like I have been able to let that go more.  I agree with you, this is beginning to feel more freeing and empowering as the days go by and I continue working on the inner child.  =)

I thank you again! 

[makingachange]

Hi, I haven't gone no contact but am planning to this year.

I wonder if it's a universally used manipulation tactic by every abuser to say ''you're just too sensitive.'' By gray rocking you set a boundary, in a way. Something in you had enough and decided you deserved more. I think a parent can feel that, and if they're not emotionally mature, it freaks them out. My mother has always done a similar thing to her victims – asking: are *you* okay? To the point of actually making people question their own reality and sanity. I think all of it is also just a desperate attempt to provoke you, in the hopes that you'll respond to something. But it seems like you're already pretty immune to it.

It's so hard to walk away when you have a million different conflicting feelings. Something I try to do is just let myself feel it all, while knowing I'll still put myself first in the end. There can be doubt, guilt, sadness, but that doesn't mean you have to act on it. It's perfectly normal to wish things were different. And that is a painful feeling to have when you're trying to let go and make a decision. Doesn't mean your gut is wrong, though(is it ever?)

Maybe some people get lucky and don't doubt themselves as much, but I get the feeling that for a lot of us it's reeeally hard to give up hope and walk away.

Hi Buffy!

Thank you for writing me!  Yes, I am starting to wonder that myself about the "you're just too sensitive" comment...I am starting to see that lots and lot of people are hearing that same line.  I know personally I've heard that since I was a small child.

Oh my goodness!  YES!  I had been hearing literally for months the same question every single day...Are you ok?  No matter how much I said I was great and I honestly was, it was never believed.  Back in the day I would probably have reacted poorly, but thanks to this forum and other resources I kept my cool.

I am starting to feel a difference in myself in the last day or so.  I am starting to realize the reality of my life with them growing up until now.  I truly feel like I was in complete denial about all of it.  I made excuses for them, and I feel like I did this just to numb the pain and not have to fully look at it. 

My intuition had been leading me to work on healing my inner child, and ever since I started that process, things have been unraveling and their mask has slipped.  I feel like I see things more clearly than I ever have...I know that I still have more work to do, but I am hopeful that I am on the right track.

I want to thank you for your response, it has helped so much!  I hope you're having a good day! 

[makingachange]

makingachange I spent all of last year doing gray rock with my parents.  I noticed that each visit their behaviour became more and more overt.  They were quite rude.  I didn't say a thing as in the past it had never helped and thinking about it I think they expected a reaction from me.  By the end of the year I was exhausted and went NC.  I couldn't see a way out, I had also started putting more distance in between visits and they got worse and worse.  At no point did they ever say what was wrong or if they were upset, they just got ruder and ruder.  I finally gave up.

DH said to just give them more space, more distance and eventually when I see them they will be pleasant enough however to me that's exhausting.  I would go not knowing if they would be normal or rude and really I was already spacing out my visits by a few months and they were getting worse not better. I am now NC.

I did unblock on email and got an email from my mother earlier in the year, nothing about not seeing each other.  It was a funny video with a simple message of hope you find this funny.  My mother has a habit of any time I am upset by her behaviour, she sometimes tells me I have depression.  To her I am not upset by her behaviour, no I am depressed and she sends me funny videos to cheer me up.  Not asking if I am ok, just sending something to say have a laugh at this.  I don't think I have depression, I get down about our relationship and I would get upset over things that have happened but this is normal, well I think so anyway.  In fact I would go so far as to say my mother doesn't think there is anything wrong with her behaviour and it really is all me, just 6 months ago, she told me I was difficult once again.  Its really hard with these types because they simply don't get it.  There is no self awareness.  They do something hurtful and all they can say is "you're too sensitive".  Yep I have heard that one before too.  I didn't respond to my mother and blocked the email again.  She is continuing to play the same game she always has and I am no longer interested.

The thing is, we aren't too sensitive.  I have spent a lot of time thinking of my behaviour, how would it come across to them, what could I have done differently, I have then done things differently, responded differently and yet it hasn't made a difference.  When I think back to some of the things they have done, it is really hurtful, its bad.  That's the thing though, you get programmed to be use to being treated poorly that in the end they can do really hurtful things and you will question if you are too sensitive like they say.

"I can't fix the past, sorry".  That's dismissive.  You aren't asking her to fix the past, you are asking for her to apologise for hurting you, to actually recognise the hurt, to show some empathy. 

"That is a poor excuse".  Dismissive again.  She doesn't get to judge if your feelings are valid.  Your emotions are valid. Again there is no empathy, she just wants to rug sweep everything away and keep on doing the same old dance.

NC may just give you the chance to start healing.  Its not easy, I am going through the same stuff. Gray rock works for some people.  I just found it escalated their poor behaviour so it didn't work for me.  I am NC because I am exhausted by it all.  I don't have the ability to simply ignore hurtful behaviour, I do get upset, I can't shut that off, so for me NC is the answer.

Its not easy but hopefully you'll find what is right for you.

Hi Hilltop!

Thank you so much for responding to my post.  I appreciate your insight and advice!

I completely agree with you about going gray rock.  It was as though they just knew something was up immediately, and it felt like it did provoke them much more than the usual.  It was so obvious and over the top.  However, it allowed me to see that they truly have never changed nor want to.

Yes, I ended up having so much anxiety not knowing when I saw them previously how they were going to be in person in the middle of last year.  I felt horrible about having to see them, the anxiety was so high...When they look at me it feels like they are judging everything I do, say, etc.  I also got to the point through text that it became an everyday battle to know which game we were playing that day.  I got so incredibly tired of having to play the game plus my other daily responsibilities.  It just got to be too much, and then the outbursts, guilt trips, it all just piled up so much.  I ended up losing 3.5lbs in a week and was getting zero sleep.  I just knew something had to change with this.

I too have thought about my behavior towards them...being my communication is through text, I would look them over and over thinking...hmm what could I have done?  Was I rude or sensitive?  But, looking at them and what has been said plus the months prior, I realized I truly did nothing wrong.  My responses were mature and really neutral.

Yes, it has always been sweep it under the rug and forget it.  I've done that too long...something in me changed...and I saw that this can't keep going on.  I won't continue to make excuses for their actions any longer.  I have chosen to focus on myself and my own family.  I can't keep caving into the pity party and the aggression and then pretend nothing happened.

I feel like I am starting to feel better about my choice on this...I know that there will be ups and downs right now...but I also know that I need to focus on my own well being and my DH/LOs.

I just want to say thank you from the bottom of my heart for sharing this with me.  I don't know what I would honestly do without this forum...It does help to know that there are other people in the same boat as myself...

I hope you are having a beautiful day!

[makingachange]

Gray rock works for some people.  I just found it escalated their poor behaviour so it didn't work for me.  I am NC because I am exhausted by it all.  I don't have the ability to simply ignore hurtful behaviour, I do get upset, I can't shut that off, so for me NC is the answer.

I had the same experience as Hilltop here. Grey rocking/medium chill and LC work in some situations with some tweaking of distance, space between messages, visits, etc. to keep some "thread" going, but I think if your gut is telling you that even this isn't making you feel respected and safe, that's something to listen to.

My FOO also ramped up in response to innocuous/delayed responses. They sensed it was a boundary and resented it to the extreme. I was no longer caretaking, and no longer allowing scapegoating, and my usefulness had thus been worn out. I went NC. The "thread" was petering out to be nothing but pain for me, and pain was all I was holding on to.

"Too sensitive" - I think that's definitely a common tactic in the dysfunctional family/scapegoating playbook. This was drilled into me as a kid. It's thrown out at the family members who can actually self-reflect, wonder if it is true, and thus sow doubt so that those who say it don't need to ever be accountable for their actions. You're probably not sensitive, you're just self-aware.

You're perfectly reasonable not always responding or giving an overflow of information with every message. You have a right to mental space. You wouldn't deal with your boss doing this to you on the weekends.
Family is no different! Your M's response to that was, in my opinion, very disrespectful of your god given right to just breathe and take care of yourself. You aren't committing murder. You're just being less accessible. A healthy person would be able to deal with that.

I hate not having a relationship with my FOO either. But the relationship I hate not having is one that doesn't exist: one where I actually get something out of it. I miss them but more and more I realize I'm missing the idea of them and what they couldn't be for me.

It gets easier and clearer with time. And it gets ESPECIALLY clear the more and more time you spend away from their influence and communication and you get a chance to see and feel what life without them (and without their guilt hanging over your head) is really like.

If going NC feels scary because it feels like "THE END" then don't call it that. Don't label it. That really helps me. You're taking "A Break." It's not permanent. You can always go back to LC. It's just what you need to do to feel OK right now, get clear on things, and to heal. As long as your FOO responds to what you need right now with nothing but resentment and rudeness (if you still have a way of seeing what they're up to/reading messages etc., though I'd recommend blocking everything) then that just means you can continue to let "The Break" ride if that's what you need.

And remember you're not doing it because you want to! You're doing it in response to choices your family members made. It's the defense mechanism of a healthy person. They're the cause, you're the effect. Stay strong 

Hi Distance!

Thank you so much for responding to me.  I really appreciate your advice and insight on this!

Yes, I have been trying to trust and rely on my intuition, and I guess this whole thing with my FOO has been going on for so long and draining me so much, I just knew I had to make a change.  The stress of their actions/words/etc. have been too hard on me.  My intuition says to keep moving forward and to leave this in my past.

Exactly!  I was talking to my DH about this and I said, you know, if this was the kind of situation or treatment that I got from a friend, I would completely walk away in a heartbeat.  I feel like realizing the reality of this situation with them has really helped me to see that this isn't normal and it isn't a true/real relationship.  It has been nothing more than a game really. 

I feel that it has been difficult, but every day I am now starting to see a shift and a change within myself.  I feel like I am starting to see more clearly who they are and what had been happening, the parts that I purposely shielded myself from out of protection from the pain.

Seeing more clearly is now allowing me to start to focus on the people and the things in my life that really truly matter...the people who do care about me and love me.

Yes, I completely agree with you about this...I am not doing this because I wanted this...but more to protect myself and help me to find more peace in my life.

How long have you been No Contact?  Do you feel like it has gotten better with time?


Hope you're having a beautiful day!

[DistanceNotDefense]

How long have you been No Contact?  Do you feel like it has gotten better with time?

I've been NC 7 months.

It's been an emotional rollercoaster! I'm relatively new and can relate to where you are at.

I felt something really shift in me around the 6 month mark, and others I've talked to seem to say there is something about that mark too.

If at the very least you want to take a complete break from FOO for at least 6 months, and not consider full NC, I highly recommend it. And then you can see where you feel after that mark. HUGE learning experience. I've experienced growth I never thought was possible.

[Hilltop]

I agree with Distance I don't think of this as complete NC just yet, I think of it as I'm taking a break and I know I want to do that for at least 1-2 years.  I am about 3-4 months in so far and already feel better although I have moments.

I like that you have those text messages, keep them and refer back to them.  The thing is your family probably tells you how sensitive you are and other things and its hard sometimes to see yourself through that, beyond that if you know what I mean.  I believed what my FOO told me about myself for years and even now its hard to break from that.  Having those messages is so important so that when you doubt yourself, you can read them back and reinforce in yourself that yes you were neutral and mature.  You can then reinforce in your mind that your FOO opinion and thoughts about you are not what you think, you don't agree with them.

I have a photo that my mother took of me when I was getting ready for my wedding.  My mother had done something awful and I was angry.  She looked at my face and said I'll take a photo.  My face in that photo clearly shows my emotions of anger, annoyance.  My mother saw that face, was looking at it and was smiling happy as ever.  Directly after that photo she asked me to tell her how she looked and didn't once tell me I looked beautiful in my dress, she withheld that the whole day.  The thing is that a while back I came by that photo by accident and as I looked at it I clearly saw my emotions all over my face.  I kept the photo.  The photo reminds me of the truth of that day with how my mother acted.  The photo let me see that when I am in my parents presence and I don't say anything to them that the emotions are all over my face and that my parents still get a reaction and a kick from it so that's another reason gray rock didn't work for me.  In some ways I think my face showed my emotion but I wasn't saying anything and the more I took it without speaking up the worse they got, I think they liked pushing those buttons.  To tell you the truth me now taking a break has probably made them happy, its a reaction, its something, I could tell from my mothers email that she finds the whole thing a joke. The thing is I could have continued gray rock and it obviously got under their skin but I also had to put up with the consequences of that and it was unpleasant for me so for me it was a stalemate.

I think it is easy to forget or doubt yourself in time, especially if others are telling you a different story or version.  Those text messages are something solid to show yourself when doubt creeps in.

I kept text messages as well and to be fair you would think I had a great relationship with my mother by reading them.  It is in person that my mother does and says things.  Of course its easier to deny that way.  I eventually found it useful to go home and write things down she had done or said straight away, my own version so that if I needed to I could refer back to it later.  The thing is with a little distance I have come to see this dance we play where my mother is one way in writing and another in person where she can deny and lie about it.  I find it hard to believe this is coincidental.

Focus on your DH/LO's.  Give yourself a break to sort out how you really feel and what you want.

[FindingHappinessAgain]

Hi makingachange -

I have been NC with my FOO for the better part of 8-10 years (at least the extended family), NC with my BM for about a month, and NC with my bio-Dad for 5 years.

Your story resonated with me as we almost have the same relationship with our mothers (and fathers as well)...started with the grey rocking about 5 years about with BM (after being far too close for my entire life) and she thinks I'm depressed or there is something wrong with my life/me since I don't give her any details anymore. It always seems like my life doesn't matter or isn't important and I would get the constant text messages all day everyday as well. My DH actually told me years down the line that it kind of scared him early on in our relationship with how much my BM and I texted each other; it makes me laugh nowadays but I completely agree looking back on it. If I went 3-4 days without texting her, I would get near-frantic texts asking if I am okay and hope everything is okay because she hasn't heard from me in awhile....I would always respond with, "I just spoke with you 2-3-4 days ago, of course I'm okay, why wouldn't I be"? She is almost always very negative, manipulative, showed little interest as I got older, hurtful, mean, and just outright not a nice person. The 'I love yous' felt fake and forced in the end. I still struggle with going NC with her because I want to have that normal mother-daughter relationship, but I know it will never happen and that I am just romanticizing something that isn't in the books for me. I know NC is obviously the best choice for me when it comes to my talking to my FOO and BM, and I could never go back to full contact because it destroys my mental health and well-being. Although I ache for a healthy relationship with my FOO, I know that staying NC with them is what is going to keep me mentally level and happy. Believe me, going NC is more than worth it.

Hang in there and I hope that it all works out for you! It takes strength, fortitude, and courage to go NC. We've got your back here!

[BettyGray]

Hi makingachange-

My heart goes out to you. Reading your post was like reading my own story. I went NC with my FOO (every blood relative, extended family included) a little over 5 years ago.

After way too many obligatory Sunday morning phone calls ( I always called her, of course) that were almost all exactly alike  - she talked about herself, her physical ailments, updates on all siblings, people I had never met who were sick, distant relatives who had died, etc. - I was just done. Of course it was a million other little things (in the end, a lot of it was how poorly she treated my spouse), but I surmised years ago she had no interest in me or my life.

At the end of the calls (which lasted at least 30 minutes, even though we ran out of things to talk about after 5) she would throw in a question or two about what I had been up to, how was DH, etc. , but I could tell she never listened. Lots of “uh huhs.”

I moved away 25 years ago. Our relationship was veering toward chilly then, but I was still mostly in FOG. Over time the relationship turned downright freezer-burned. I emailed her, she never emailed back. I tried to win her affection in many ways. I had always thought we were close and when I was younger, she was my hero. Fast forward to me becoming an independent adult - she turned on me.

I was still telling her too many personal details for years. I didn’t realize these things would be used against me. I didn’t realize she was prying, rooting for my failure, rooting for my marriage to fall apart, or that she would twist what I said and gossip about me to my sister. Even after I went gray rock, keeping conversations very superficial, deep down I still wanted her to love me....if only I tried harder, I thought.

Everything you mentioned I have heard from my own mother.

“Too sensitive!”
“Are you ok? A mother knows!”
“I can’t fix the past.”
“you’re so melodramatic!”

While my mother never went full on with mean texts (she was waaaay too passive aggressive for that), she had my mean sister do her bidding. That way she could look like a saint to everyone else.

One day she just pushed me over the edge. I was in a fragile place already. Everything in my being was saying “ENOUGH!” All staying in touch did was make me feel terrible. My self-esteem was low, I doubted myself, was critical of myself, I was depressed and anxious (diagnosed with both disorders at 19), and most of all, so empty and craving a real, caring mother and family. I could continue with things the way they were (because a confrontation or an earnest conversation would do nothing to change the situation) and feel awful, or I could save myself and make the gut wrenching choice to cut them all off. It might be painful at first, but I had nothing to lose relationship-wise by going NC, so I listened to my intuition and removed the leash. She had tightened it long enough. I was through being the nice one, the good daughter, the one who tried to do the “right thing.”

My father NEVER called me (not that I wanted him to,  he pretty much disgusts me and is too self-absorbed to waste any of my energy on). My 2 brothers NEVER called me. No birthday cards, no correspondence whatsoever. Of course, I bent over backwards to get them lovely birthday gifts and cards.

Lots of “I love yous” tossed around. It was reflexive. My sister pretty much NEVER said those words to me. Very little loving behavior - the whole lot of them.

I immediately blocked all of them. Eventually I had to change my phone number.

All I can say is you’ll know when you’re ready. The doubts will vaporize. When I was ready I had never been more sure of anything in my life (except the decision to move away from the toxicity in the first place - and also marrying my husband). The moment took me by surprise, but in the moment I was 100%
sure. My body had been trying to warn me - I finally listened. They had forced me to choose- I chose me.

I am not going to sugarcoat it. Even though it was the right decision and nothing would make me go back, it was excruciating. For about a year I was a useless puddle of absolute despair.  There was a lot to reckon with. It was horrible. I didn’t have guilt - still don’t - but it was a dark time. It all just seemed so unfair to end up in this position. But this was my path and I had to walk it. Each year has gotten easier.

Today I no longer hear the critical voices in my head. I am so much kinder to myself. I am more confident and self-possessed than I ever thought I would be. Once I cut the “chaos cancer” out of my life, I could breathe.

And my Sundays are no longer filled with dread, disappointment, depression, and doubt.

[makingachange]

I agree with Distance I don't think of this as complete NC just yet, I think of it as I'm taking a break and I know I want to do that for at least 1-2 years.  I am about 3-4 months in so far and already feel better although I have moments.

I like that you have those text messages, keep them and refer back to them.  The thing is your family probably tells you how sensitive you are and other things and its hard sometimes to see yourself through that, beyond that if you know what I mean.  I believed what my FOO told me about myself for years and even now its hard to break from that.  Having those messages is so important so that when you doubt yourself, you can read them back and reinforce in yourself that yes you were neutral and mature.  You can then reinforce in your mind that your FOO opinion and thoughts about you are not what you think, you don't agree with them.

I have a photo that my mother took of me when I was getting ready for my wedding.  My mother had done something awful and I was angry.  She looked at my face and said I'll take a photo.  My face in that photo clearly shows my emotions of anger, annoyance.  My mother saw that face, was looking at it and was smiling happy as ever.  Directly after that photo she asked me to tell her how she looked and didn't once tell me I looked beautiful in my dress, she withheld that the whole day.  The thing is that a while back I came by that photo by accident and as I looked at it I clearly saw my emotions all over my face.  I kept the photo.  The photo reminds me of the truth of that day with how my mother acted.  The photo let me see that when I am in my parents presence and I don't say anything to them that the emotions are all over my face and that my parents still get a reaction and a kick from it so that's another reason gray rock didn't work for me.  In some ways I think my face showed my emotion but I wasn't saying anything and the more I took it without speaking up the worse they got, I think they liked pushing those buttons.  To tell you the truth me now taking a break has probably made them happy, its a reaction, its something, I could tell from my mothers email that she finds the whole thing a joke. The thing is I could have continued gray rock and it obviously got under their skin but I also had to put up with the consequences of that and it was unpleasant for me so for me it was a stalemate.

I think it is easy to forget or doubt yourself in time, especially if others are telling you a different story or version.  Those text messages are something solid to show yourself when doubt creeps in.

I kept text messages as well and to be fair you would think I had a great relationship with my mother by reading them.  It is in person that my mother does and says things.  Of course its easier to deny that way.  I eventually found it useful to go home and write things down she had done or said straight away, my own version so that if I needed to I could refer back to it later.  The thing is with a little distance I have come to see this dance we play where my mother is one way in writing and another in person where she can deny and lie about it.  I find it hard to believe this is coincidental.

Focus on your DH/LO's.  Give yourself a break to sort out how you really feel and what you want.

Hi!   

Yes, I am so happy to have these text messages, just so I can look at them and know that I am not insane!  When things happen in the past, it is sometimes hard to remember exactly what was said and happened, but having these texts really shines light on the situation.  I have also started journaling everything!  It has been so helpful and has helped me to get a lot out.

Wow, the wedding picture situation!!!   At least you do have that picture to help remind yourself of what happened and took place!

I also completely understand about having the text messages and if someone else would have read them they would think there was a great relationship there!  I've looked back at many of mine and it looks like ...wow, what a great bond...but, if you know her, and you dig a bit deeper, I feel they always have a hidden meaning to everything they say and do.

For me, my gut just knows that if I went back  it would be the same song and dance, and I am at the point in my life where I just don't know if I can keep doing the same thing.  I feel like I have given so many chances, opportunities, and even in this big ordeal a couple weeks ago, my DH even told her bits and pieces of what had hurt me...but she still never really took any responsibility for that.

It's like you either say, okay, I'll just let you be the way you are and continue to act like this when you don't get your way...or really just cut it off.  I personally couldn't imagine going back even after a break...but, I know that everyone has their own unique situations.   It's a hard situation.

Anyways...YES!  I am focusing more on myself and my DH/LO's.  I do feel a lot less stressed out, am actually able to eat and sleep now.  So that is a good thing!   

Thank you so much for sharing your experiences and story with me!  I do appreciate your insight and it is nice to see that I'm not the only one on this path...I hope you have a great weekend!

[makingachange]

Hi makingachange -

I have been NC with my FOO for the better part of 8-10 years (at least the extended family), NC with my BM for about a month, and NC with my bio-Dad for 5 years.

Your story resonated with me as we almost have the same relationship with our mothers (and fathers as well)...started with the grey rocking about 5 years about with BM (after being far too close for my entire life) and she thinks I'm depressed or there is something wrong with my life/me since I don't give her any details anymore. It always seems like my life doesn't matter or isn't important and I would get the constant text messages all day everyday as well. My DH actually told me years down the line that it kind of scared him early on in our relationship with how much my BM and I texted each other; it makes me laugh nowadays but I completely agree looking back on it. If I went 3-4 days without texting her, I would get near-frantic texts asking if I am okay and hope everything is okay because she hasn't heard from me in awhile....I would always respond with, "I just spoke with you 2-3-4 days ago, of course I'm okay, why wouldn't I be"? She is almost always very negative, manipulative, showed little interest as I got older, hurtful, mean, and just outright not a nice person. The 'I love yous' felt fake and forced in the end. I still struggle with going NC with her because I want to have that normal mother-daughter relationship, but I know it will never happen and that I am just romanticizing something that isn't in the books for me. I know NC is obviously the best choice for me when it comes to my talking to my FOO and BM, and I could never go back to full contact because it destroys my mental health and well-being. Although I ache for a healthy relationship with my FOO, I know that staying NC with them is what is going to keep me mentally level and happy. Believe me, going NC is more than worth it.

Hang in there and I hope that it all works out for you! It takes strength, fortitude, and courage to go NC. We've got your back here!

Hi Finding Happiness!

First off, I just want to thank you so much for writing me!  I do really appreciate it! 

I completely can understand what you mean when they think something is wrong with us...and yes, I feel you are right...that it is mostly because we no longer share our private life with them.

I don't know what it was, whether it was her lying that made me think a couple years ago...intuitively, I just felt like...Nope, I can't tell you anything anymore.  However, I did want that bond and relationship, so I did tell her some bits and pieces.

Haha, yes...my DH probably can relate with yours too on the texting too much early on in our relationship!  LOL!

Yes, it is absolutely amazing that it can be 3-4 days and they freak out.  It's like they just can't cope or deal with that...that isn't acceptable.  When I had this big situation a couple weeks ago, my Mother had sent me a question about calling her...well, I honestly felt like it was a game at that point because of all the messages she had been sending, and I felt uncomfortable being on the phone...I just said, yea maybe sometime.  Well, she went off on me...threatening me to a certain extent.  I decided I just don't have to deal with that and I honestly didn't have anything to say to her response because I was in the process of gray rocking.  So, I did not say anything...I thought maybe she'll apologize but no.  4 days later she texts me saying "Mothers know when something is wrong...what is going on?  I feel like there is something you aren't telling me..."  I think she thinks something was wrong because I didn't respond to her for days...and she couldn't take responsibility for what she said to me that made me not want to talk to her.

I think in a weird way she thought I was seriously kidnapped, murdered, or something bad...and didn't want to take responsibility for the mean things she said....

I hadn't heard anything from her in about a week but the day before yesterday just sent a message saying "hope we are all doing good."  I didn't say anything.

I guess I just can't understand that my DH basically told her some things a couple weeks ago that she had done that hurt me...and still acts like I am the one with a problem or that something is secretly happening here....She told me a couple weeks ago that me feeling upset about what she had done was a poor excuse not to talk to her.  I don't understand why my feelings do not matter.   

I am actually able to eat and sleep a bit better ...I feel intuitively this is what I need to do, so I will continue to honor my inner knowing on this.     When did you start to feel better after going NC?  When was the shift where you thought...Yes, I feel much better...I feel at peace?

Thank you again so much for sharing your story with me!  I truly hope you have a great rest of your day, Love!

[makingachange]

Hi makingachange-

My heart goes out to you. Reading your post was like reading my own story. I went NC with my FOO (every blood relative, extended family included) a little over 5 years ago.

After way too many obligatory Sunday morning phone calls ( I always called her, of course) that were almost all exactly alike  - she talked about herself, her physical ailments, updates on all siblings, people I had never met who were sick, distant relatives who had died, etc. - I was just done. Of course it was a million other little things (in the end, a lot of it was how poorly she treated my spouse), but I surmised years ago she had no interest in me or my life.

At the end of the calls (which lasted at least 30 minutes, even though we ran out of things to talk about after 5) she would throw in a question or two about what I had been up to, how was DH, etc. , but I could tell she never listened. Lots of "uh huhs."

I moved away 25 years ago. Our relationship was veering toward chilly then, but I was still mostly in FOG. Over time the relationship turned downright freezer-burned. I emailed her, she never emailed back. I tried to win her affection in many ways. I had always thought we were close and when I was younger, she was my hero. Fast forward to me becoming an independent adult - she turned on me.

I was still telling her too many personal details for years. I didn't realize these things would be used against me. I didn't realize she was prying, rooting for my failure, rooting for my marriage to fall apart, or that she would twist what I said and gossip about me to my sister. Even after I went gray rock, keeping conversations very superficial, deep down I still wanted her to love me....if only I tried harder, I thought.

Everything you mentioned I have heard from my own mother.

"Too sensitive!"
"Are you ok? A mother knows!"
"I can't fix the past."
"you're so melodramatic!"

While my mother never went full on with mean texts (she was waaaay too passive aggressive for that), she had my mean sister do her bidding. That way she could look like a saint to everyone else.

One day she just pushed me over the edge. I was in a fragile place already. Everything in my being was saying "ENOUGH!" All staying in touch did was make me feel terrible. My self-esteem was low, I doubted myself, was critical of myself, I was depressed and anxious (diagnosed with both disorders at 19), and most of all, so empty and craving a real, caring mother and family. I could continue with things the way they were (because a confrontation or an earnest conversation would do nothing to change the situation) and feel awful, or I could save myself and make the gut wrenching choice to cut them all off. It might be painful at first, but I had nothing to lose relationship-wise by going NC, so I listened to my intuition and removed the leash. She had tightened it long enough. I was through being the nice one, the good daughter, the one who tried to do the "right thing."

My father NEVER called me (not that I wanted him to,  he pretty much disgusts me and is too self-absorbed to waste any of my energy on). My 2 brothers NEVER called me. No birthday cards, no correspondence whatsoever. Of course, I bent over backwards to get them lovely birthday gifts and cards.

Lots of "I love yous" tossed around. It was reflexive. My sister pretty much NEVER said those words to me. Very little loving behavior - the whole lot of them.

I immediately blocked all of them. Eventually I had to change my phone number.

All I can say is you'll know when you're ready. The doubts will vaporize. When I was ready I had never been more sure of anything in my life (except the decision to move away from the toxicity in the first place - and also marrying my husband). The moment took me by surprise, but in the moment I was 100%
sure. My body had been trying to warn me - I finally listened. They had forced me to choose- I chose me.

I am not going to sugarcoat it. Even though it was the right decision and nothing would make me go back, it was excruciating. For about a year I was a useless puddle of absolute despair.  There was a lot to reckon with. It was horrible. I didn't have guilt - still don't - but it was a dark time. It all just seemed so unfair to end up in this position. But this was my path and I had to walk it. Each year has gotten easier.

Today I no longer hear the critical voices in my head. I am so much kinder to myself. I am more confident and self-possessed than I ever thought I would be. Once I cut the "chaos cancer" out of my life, I could breathe.

And my Sundays are no longer filled with dread, disappointment, depression, and doubt.

Hi!   

Thank you so much for sharing your story with me!  I really appreciate that!  It does help to see that I am not the only one in this situation and helps me to see there is hope going forward.

I've been pretty much NC with my whole extended family for 5-6 years...but I have kept going with my parents.

I guess I saw the issues with my extended family but somehow never saw the issues with parents until the last couple years. 

There have been so many situations and small things along the way that I just overlooked and swept under the rug...but, after what happened a couple weeks ago, it really opened my eyes big time.  It was that moment that I knew something has to change here.  I lost around 3-4lbs in a week and got no sleep, the stress of the threats, gaslighting me, etc. had just taken a toll on me.

I feel this deep inner knowing that NC and keeping my distance is what I need to do.  I feel like there is something in me that says, you can't go back to this.  It feels so strong.  But, I have my whole life second guessed myself not really knowing if what I was doing was right...and I feel this has a lot to do with my childhood.  My intuition says don't go back...but my brain is saying..."what if" "are you sure you're making the right choice?"

I am tired of playing the games...doing the daily messages that are negative....or only focused on their day of activities.  I completely understand when you say you felt like you were not being listened to when you did talk...I have felt that way for years as well.  Before I knew anything about what this was...I thought...is there something wrong with her?  Because it felt so strange...to talk to her and have her immediately change the subject or to act like she didn't even hear a word I said.  Or for her to be on her phone playing around, and me talking to her and getting the "mmhmm".  I felt like...well, maybe something is just wrong with her...but, I didn't fully understand that it was something much deeper there.

I remember as a child pretty much making my Mother and Father say "I love you" to me...and now looking back on it all these years later...I see that I was trying to get them to "love" me...I felt very lonely as a child...and felt this sadness really.  They always made me out to be a burden it felt like...and I can't believe that I didn't see it sooner than now...I feel like it started to unravel when my Mother's sister had a rage against me through text.  I did not say anything to provoke her texts/threats/showing up on my doorstep.  I told my Mother about how her sister was acting, and she acted like she didn't even believe me.  She basically asked what did I say or do?  Completely ignored what was happening and said she wasn't getting into it.  Wanted to look through all my messages on my phone just to prove it to her...and still didn't believe me.  My Father said nothing and did nothing...  This same aunt rode in a car with me and my Mother and screamed at me that I should never have kids ...and my Mother said absolutely nothing...pretended she never heard a word.

It was these experiences that made me go....wow, they won't even take up for me...they don't believe me at all. 

I think I know deep down what I have to do...my intuition keeps saying don't go back.  I think I would feel like I was betraying myself if I did...because I know deep in my heart I can't keep going on this way with the stress.

She sent a text a day or so ago saying (Hope you all are doing good)....In a weird way I feel like that comment isn't out of sincerity...I did not respond.  I guess the biggest thing is that I am sad I never got what I wanted or needed in a family.  The saddest part is that they cannot even see why I have chosen this path...even after DH told them some things that they had done to hurt me...all she could say was "That's a poor excuse not to have anything to do with us".  Didn't seem to care that it had hurt me. 

Anyways!  I truly want to thank you for sharing your story with me...I know that I have a lot of inner child work to do and overcoming the anxiety.  But, I am hopeful and I know I will bounce up from this! 

I hope that you have a great rest of your day.  Seeing your story gives me hope, it truly does, and I thank you for that!