How long does the hangover last?

[5isRed]

2 weekends ago I decided to block NM from texting/phoning me. This was a few days after she showed up unannounced at my home, ambushing my daughter with 2 cards for my husband's bday and our anniversary. She was hostile and nasty to my daughter and followed up her visit with a hostile text and vm to me.  I ignored both and posted here for the first time about it. After reading many posts here and on the NC board, I decided to block her, with the hope that I'd feel like a weight would be lifted once I knew she could no longer disrupt my entire day/mood with a text or phone call or vm. Instead, I find myself irrationally checking my texts several times a day, expecting her to have found another way to contact me. I've not sent off a letter notifying her of my decision to go NC, and not even sure I will send one, so there is always the possibility that she will show up at my door again when she becomes pissed off enough that I'm not responding to her text/call attempts. I don't know what is holding me back from sending this letter, but I can't seem to do it...yet. Part of it is that my aunt lives with NM and sending that letter means I'll lose access to my aunt. She is mid 70s, mentally and now physically disabled, and fairly reliant on NM. Aunt cannot live alone, and I cannot take her in. I try to convince myself that I had my aunt's best years (30-50) and it would cause her more harm than good if I tried to have contact with her, given NM's need for total control. I need to find a way to forgive myself for the collateral damage of abandoning my aunt by going NC with NM.

I have a sibling who is about an hour away and is the GC. NM is the type that will feign ignorance to GC as to why I'm not responding to her and try to get him to intervene. He recently told me that he is fed up of listening to her rant to him about me and has told her off a few times when she's launched into a monologue about how horrible I am. He says he won't be put in a position of choosing between us and wants to maintain a relationship with me/my husband/kids, but the reality is that we have never had consistent interaction over the last 20 years, and she foots a lot of his bills, so I know where this will eventually go. It really doesn't bother me, so the threat of a lost relationship there is of less concern.

My children have all blocked NM as well, though my husband has not. We (perhaps mistakenly) left her unblocked on his phone, in case there is a true emergency. I type that out and roll my eyes, because she's been known to concoct situations (my daughter refers to those as "grandma's Christmas cancer schemes") just to hoover us in. The most recent was actually quite amusing- GC had told her to shut it after a particularly annoying phone call with her, where she was going on and on about how awful I am. She was so upset and offended by him telling her off, that she faked a stroke, and texted all of us about needing to go to the hospital, wanting to know who could drop everything and take her. None of us replied for over 3 hours (I was legitimately in work meetings and didn't see the text until hours later), so she drove herself to the local ED. Proceeds to send us blow by blow accounts of every test and interaction throughout the evening, only to declare herself "fit as a fiddle and passed every test with flying colors". Claimed the dr brushed her symptoms off as possible Bell's palsy and that she'd return to feeling normal in a few weeks. We saw her a week later for Mother's Day brunch and there was zero evidence of anything wrong. That was the last time I saw her and have only exchanged a few texts since then, so the next ailment will surely need to be amped up considerably to get the attention she seeks.

The reason for my post today is that I have been struggling with these overwhelming feelings of sadness and guilt since I blocked her. Not that I have any positive emotions towards her, or concern that she'll feel hurt, but just this feeling that I'm a bad person who didn't have it all THAT bad to warrant NC. I continue to gaslight myself, and don't have many people IRL that know the details of NM's history that can offer support or validation. My dad was a huge support to me, but he passed away nearly 2 yrs ago. Unfortunately, my husband comes from a very dysfunctional family and has his own share of serious emotional neglect, from very emotionally immature parents and sibling. He is a very kind and loving person, great father, and is actively working on himself but is definitely neuro-diverse and struggles with demonstrating authentic empathy for me. It's been the source of many years of marriage counseling, but it's not a deal breaker in my eyes. It does mean that I feel very emotionally lonely, like no one really has my back. I am looking into starting therapy again, but that takes time and work before feeling the benefits of it. I exercise daily, work full-time, am in a master's program, and very involved with my kids...so keeping busy/distracted doesn't help. I just feel like there is this vicious hangover that I cannot shake. Headaches, nausea, exhaustion, literally hangover symptoms! (took covid test, was negative. can't be pregnant either, and all other bloodwork is normal) Have others had similar experiences? I'm assuming these are all physical manifestations of a grieving process of sorts, but it's now really interfering with my ability to get thru all the day to day stuff.

Thanks for reading.

[traumakorma]

Hello 5isRed

you're in the eye of the storm right now.  Don't underestimate how powerful that trauma bond is and how you will feel every fibre as it loosens and snaps.  You'd think it would be simple wouldn't, someone is harmful to you so you stay away and job done.  But we forget we have had a lifetime of manipulation around this so that we don't think we even can or should get away.  It's why these hurtful relationships go on for decades.  It's the effect of the indoctrination we went through from the get go that they shouldn't be held accountable and that we should tolerate what ever behaviour they see fit to mete out. I can understand you checking your phone all the time, this is an exquisitely difficult experience, one that feels alien and unsettling in the extreme.  Now is the time to listen to your inner parent.  Your inner parent wants you to avoid people who harm you. This is what a good parent would want for you.  If your Mum had any of the normal motherly instincts and any level of self awareness she would want you to get away and stay away from her. It's because she lacks this that she will want you to feel guilty and twisted up. 

My parent was similar in that they would feign sweet confused innocence in the face of my no contact, what else could they do?  they can't look at the situation like an adult, they can't want to own their part, all they see is an object that ain't doing what it should do. I never sent a letter explaining my NC, I let it speak for itself.  I knew that if I had behaved how they did to someone I would have no grounds to be confused. And any confusion on my part would be an attempt to alter the narrative. My parent has since died and I am confident that any communication to even briefly explain my reasoning for NC would have been used against me, this was just how they were.  even at the beginning when I toyed with the idea of telling them why I wasn't returning calls or visiting it just felt futile.  It felt like shouting into a void, there would be nothing there to catch what I was saying, think about it and repair.  It would have been a waste of time.  They had never demonstrated an ability to let me have a different opinion on even minor things let alone serious issues. 

I also have a sibling who I have had to accept a change in relationship with.  It's rough and not fair but it's the hangover of me protecting myself and for that I am okay with it.  I would not expect someone to tolerate abuse in order to have access to me and I extend that right to other people.  if someone doesn't extend that right to me I know they are not going to be good for me, they will be unable to validate me when i need them to.

5isRed you are not a bad person because you want to protect yourself.  Could you imagine thinking that about someone who had been through the same as you.  Of course not.  Again, sit with your inner parent.  They want you to avoid harm, and work towards that peace with your decision. They know you deserve to feel safe from emotional harm.  It's a long journey, I'm 2.5 years in since I made that decision and while it kicked off a battle of carefully laid down traps I am still reaping the benefits and healing in real ways I couldn't have imagined.

Peace and love to you

[Cat of the Canals]

 

When I first came Out of the FOG, I was in a funk for several months. Which is probably not what you want to hear, I know. But I did find things that helped. Journaling was probably the biggest one, because it was a way to get all of the nasty, confusing, anxiety-inducing thoughts out of my head. The next was venting out loud: sometimes to my husband and sometimes here (because I know he can only take so much). I also read a lot of books (highly recommend Understanding the Borderline Mother and Complex PTSD: From Surviving to Thriving) and watched a LOT of videos (Les Carter, Kris Godinez, and Dr. Ramani are some evergreen favorites).

[moglow]

SisRed, it varies. I've been very very limited to no to somewhat contact with mommie dearest for the past several years, bounced back and forth between them depending on my mindset and how she treated me. I was all over the place for a long time then realized, I'm my best self without her. Sad, but true. While I'm not so much triggered by mother anymore whether we talk or not, I've come to understand how much she took away and how little she added to my life.

Worse - or more importantly - I've realized how little effort mother put into building or making anything better between us or with my brothers. Her demands of I *must* do this or that to "fix things" were just noise. Clearly she had no intention of any concerted efforts of her own. It was all on me, and looking back it seems it always was. She's there to take from whoever for as long as she needs, then she'd move on. Including with her own children. Her interests appeared to lay in tearing down and decimating everything around her. She's just that limited.

Sad as it all sounds on the surface, the realities are freeing me from so much. I don't feel like I have to empty myself to fill her, if that makes sense. The hangover headaches, stomach upsets, fatigue/exhaustion, sleepless nights, agitation - they're going away. Flashes here and there but they're brief and not debilitating as they were for so long. I'm learning to be there for and with myself, whatever shows up. It does vary, but for the most part having given myself no contact time without her noise may have saved my life in all the ways that matter. As of right now, I really don't care to see or talk to her. There may well be an encounter in the next few months [distant brother and family will be here for a visit] but other than that, No. I realize I'm honestly just not interested. I'm finding acceptance and I like the way it feels.

[5isRed]

Thank you all for your responses. I honestly felt so much better after reading them, that it felt like a bit of the dark cloud lifted yesterday. Today has felt even better. I parsed out a few things from traumakorma that were absolutely spot-on and such a great way to think about it.

you're in the eye of the storm right now.  Don't underestimate how powerful that trauma bond is and how you will feel every fibre as it loosens and snaps.  You'd think it would be simple wouldn't, someone is harmful to you so you stay away and job done.  But we forget we have had a lifetime of manipulation around this so that we don't think we even can or should get away.  It's why these hurtful relationships go on for decades.  It's the effect of the indoctrination we went through from the get go that they shouldn't be held accountable and that we should tolerate what ever behaviour they see fit to mete out. 

Now is the time to listen to your inner parent.  Your inner parent wants you to avoid people who harm you. This is what a good parent would want for you.  If your Mum had any of the normal motherly instincts and any level of self awareness she would want you to get away and stay away from her. It's because she lacks this that she will want you to feel guilty and twisted up. 

I never sent a letter explaining my NC, I let it speak for itself.  I knew that if I had behaved how they did to someone I would have no grounds to be confused. And any confusion on my part would be an attempt to alter the narrative. My parent has since died and I am confident that any communication to even briefly explain my reasoning for NC would have been used against me, this was just how they were.  even at the beginning when I toyed with the idea of telling them why I wasn't returning calls or visiting it just felt futile.  It felt like shouting into a void, there would be nothing there to catch what I was saying, think about it and repair.  It would have been a waste of time.  They had never demonstrated an ability to let me have a different opinion on even minor things let alone serious issues. 

5isRed you are not a bad person because you want to protect yourself.  Could you imagine thinking that about someone who had been through the same as you.  Of course not.  Again, sit with your inner parent.  They want you to avoid harm, and work towards that peace with your decision. They know you deserve to feel safe from emotional harm.  It's a long journey, I'm 2.5 years in since I made that decision and while it kicked off a battle of carefully laid down traps I am still reaping the benefits and healing in real ways I couldn't have imagined.
Peace and love to you

Thank you for all this above, it really helps to read the perspective of someone who opted not to send a letter. I've struggled with it and whether or not it would give me any closure...and I don't think it would. And I don't owe her closure either. It would definitely be like shouting into a void. I had drafted one, taking full ownership of my part in the breakdown of the relationship, apologizing for the pain it has caused her, stressing the wish for peace, and wishing her well. My husband read it and said "huh, so you're gonna give her the knife back to stab you with again, eh? This will just serve as her advertisement to anyone she can corner, to show as evidence of how bad she's always claimed you are. She'll wave it around as her get outta jail free card and feel fully vindicated." That is absolutely true, and while I say I don't care who she would tell or what they would say, it pains me to give her that satisfaction.

She's been loud and obnoxious for years now, complaining about how distant I've become, dating back to 2013. How much she doesn't like who I've become and how she has no idea why I've become this way. Uh huh, sure ya don't. I've only told her a dozen times to stop trashing my father to me or in front of my children. After he passed, the first Xmas (a mere 2 months later) she couldn't control herself from making nasty comments about him at Xmas Eve dinner...in front of my kids. His death was still so fresh and raw for me that I had to leave the room....but not before leaning across the table and growling "knock it off, NOT in front of the kids". That has never faded for me, and probably one of the things that pushed me to decide NC. It's never been worth bringing up with her, because she only lives in the moment when it comes to her own actions and does whatever she needs to in that moment to benefit or fuel herself. Anything from the past is only brought up to drag someone else down and will be embellished to suit her narrative.

CatoftheCanals- I agree, journaling has been helpful. I did that extensively 4 years ago when I first learned about narcissistic parents. It helped me immensely to write out the dozens and dozens of examples from my past, where she gaslit me, was manipulative, dishonest, abusive, etc. I would journal about the experience and write about how they aligned to the descriptions I read online about narcissistic traits. Because I tend to be so private, that was my form of validation- seeing it written out and mapped out to the traits. I am also checking out the books and videos you recommended, thank you!

Moglow- I'm glad to read that the physical symptoms have lessened with time. I'm hopeful that mine will subside soon.  I also hope that thoughts of her, or when she does show up again, start to not trigger me so badly. I don't know exactly what triggered me so much in the past month, since it's been mid-May since I've even seen her, but it's been intense. Maybe less important to identify what, and more important to understand how to deal with it. This forum is helpful, a couple of books I've read have been very eye opening, and opening up to a couple of people and talking it out has made me realize I don't need to hide this...I shouldn't carry shame about it, I didn't cause it. The empathy, validation, and stories of similar experiences from others is taking a lot of the power of it all away.

[easterncappy]

She was so upset and offended by him telling her off, that she faked a stroke, and texted all of us about needing to go to the hospital, wanting to know who could drop everything and take her. None of us replied for over 3 hours (I was legitimately in work meetings and didn't see the text until hours later), so she drove herself to the local ED. Proceeds to send us blow by blow accounts of every test and interaction throughout the evening, only to declare herself "fit as a fiddle and passed every test with flying colors". Claimed the dr brushed her symptoms off as possible Bell's palsy and that she'd return to feeling normal in a few weeks. We saw her a week later for Mother's Day brunch and there was zero evidence of anything wrong.

...

The reason for my post today is that I have been struggling with these overwhelming feelings of sadness and guilt since I blocked her. Not that I have any positive emotions towards her, or concern that she'll feel hurt, but just this feeling that I'm a bad person who didn't have it all THAT bad to warrant NC. I continue to gaslight myself, and don't have many people IRL that know the details of NM's history that can offer support or validation.

...

I just feel like there is this vicious hangover that I cannot shake. Headaches, nausea, exhaustion, literally hangover symptoms! (took covid test, was negative. can't be pregnant either, and all other bloodwork is normal) Have others had similar experiences? I'm assuming these are all physical manifestations of a grieving process of sorts, but it's now really interfering with my ability to get thru all the day to day stuff.

I love when PD relatives fake medical crises. They're so predictable and it's never as convincing as they think it is. I always wondered if my mom thought I was faking every illness and injury because, well, that's what she did. Once, she got caught lying about going on a trip somewhere to get out of work, so she doubled down by pretending that she actually ended up in the ER with "post-COVID syndrome"... she went as far as wanting to create false paperwork from the hospital and she wanted me to help. She told me all of this as if it was a normal thing that normal people do. When caught in another lie in this particular string of lies, "it's not fair - everyone lies, but when I do it, I get in trouble?". Sorry for interjecting my story, but it's such a perfect example of what these people do and how detached they are from reality.

You don't really have anything to feel guilty about, she's just good at making you feel guilt. I'm sure that this "stroke" incident wasn't the first time she tried to make everyone in her life feel like bad people for not giving her what she wanted. You're probably stuck in a mental loop of the guilt trips working on you even if you recognize them as such. Another part of it is probably grieving, like you said. I'm on the way towards NC myself after thinking for a long time that we can work our way around our issues, and all I think I've figured out that a lot what I'm feeling is mourning. I see the people around me and how their parents are a source of emotional support, practical advice, and a last resort if SHTF... and I don't just not have that, but I have someone who is actively dangerous to me and my chosen family. You could also be experiencing a form of panic attack, I don't know if you have an anxiety problem, but panic attacks don't always look the "stereotypical" way. I once had a series of panic attacks that I thought were food allergies (that coincidentally went away as soon as I moved out of their house). The physical symptoms that come from it can look like anything.

I'm of the opinion that people don't owe their parents a damn thing after they turn 18. At that point, the relationship should be held to the same standard as any other adult relationship. Do I like this person? Do they like me? Do we treat each other well? Are they pleasant to be around? Do they apologize if they hurt my feelings? Do they have my best interest at heart? Etc. And it sounds like none of this is really adding up in your mom's favor. You don't need to "warrant going NC". If you had a friend or partner who behaved this way, you wouldn't be questioning yourself like this. This behavior doesn't become okay or more tolerable because she's your mom. Being a parent is wonderful and fulfilling, but it doesn't give you special privileges that make abusive behavior non-abusive.

I don't know about sending letters. When you send a letter, you operate under the assumption that you're writing a letter to someone who perceives reality the same way you do. At best, you'll probably waste your time reliving every terrible thing that's happened to you, and she'll read it and go "I don't understand, these are made up stories, this isn't the real reason, why won't she tell me why she doesn't talk to me anymore?". At worst, she'll purposely misinterpret it, show it to relatives, make you out to be crazy, pretend it was "full of abuse and vitriol"... you know her better than any of us do, but these are just things I've seen happen in my almost 10 years of being on these kinds of forums. But I've never seen a parent decide to change their ways, go to therapy, truly apologize from their heart, and make up for the abuse. Ever. I'm sure it's theoretically possible, but it's best to keep these things in your journal or a document on your computer to reread when you're gaslighting yourself into thinking "it wasn't that bad" instead of setting yourself up for more abuse and disappointment by presenting her with them.

There's a blog series about estranged parents that I really like, and this is a good article from it about this exact issue: http://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html