Adult Daughter Again

[chowder]

Our 36-year-old DD again, more of the same.  When does it end...

She lives on her own, works full-time, has financial struggles, and is very impulsive.  She just returned from a trip to Rome and Munich for Oktoberfest, which she planned only 2 weeks in advance.  While she was gone, my husband told her we could take care of her needed water heater repair, so that it would be fixed upon her return. 

In order to reach the water heater, she had told us to go ahead and move her car out of the garage.  But the car would not start.  We called AAA, who came and said the battery was good, so we needed to bring it in for repair because it could be the starter, etc.  So we had it towed to the repair shop that she uses to see what the problem was.  Since she wanted updates about the water heater, I also included in texts the info about the car not starting.  She joked that there is a trick to turning the ignition, and she's the only one who knows the trick, and there's nothing wrong with the car.  I immediately thought, why didn't she share that with us, but I didn't say anything.  She laughed about it.  There was no recognition that Oops, I forgot to mention, I'm sorry you've now incurred a service charge for them to look at it. 

While in the shop, they discovered many things wrong with the car, not the least of which is that the brakes are shot.  They recommended at least getting that fixed, due to the safety issue.  I sent her the info, since their records are in her name, and it would be her call as to what repairs to do or not do.  She got upset that I was "disturbing" her on vacation, made it very dramatic that she was "literally on another continent," she wouldn't discuss it with the repair shop, and she wanted her car back home.  We said okay, no problem, and brought it back with no work done.

Upon returning from vacation, she called me this week to let me know how upset she still is that we "disturbed her on vacation while she was on another continent, she has no money for repairs," etc.  I listened and heard her out.  I told her I understood, and when she wanted the car brought back, we respected that, and the car was brought back with no work done.  I said we covered the cost of the service call, and she was none the worse for wear.

I remained calm and then tried to lightly say, Gee, I wish you would have told us about the trick ignition, that would have avoided the tow.  She absolutely exploded.  Went from zero to sixty, yelling that I was looking for an apology from her (which I wasn't) when I should have been the one apologizing to her for disturbing her.  She carried on about having no money for a repair, and just continued yelling over me.  I said I was sorry, but I didn't feel right handling things the way they turned out and not keeping her in the loop.  She was so condescending, yelling, Oh, now you apologize, because I had to drag it outta ya!  It sounded like a parent to a child - though thankfully I never heard this growing up.  I told her she didn't drag anything out of me, I say something because I want to say it.  She was over the top, continued to yell over me, until I finally said I was hanging up.

As an aside, DH brought up the subject of buying her a new car.  This has come up so many times before and the answer is always the same, especially from our financial advisor.  I told him it was not good for our marriage to constantly be disagreeing about this.  He always wants to give money away to the kids without regard to the position it would put us in.  We just had our estate planning updated, and we (rather I) go to great lengths to make sure things are in order.  I pointed out to him the irony of him talking about buying her a car because she has no money, while she's vacationing in Europe.

At one point he wanted to get the brake job done and not tell her, due to it being a safety issue.  I agree it's a safety issue, but she's an adult who knows about it and it's up to her to take care of it.  Every counselor we've ever gone to has said that the kids who have trouble and issues are the ones that are always getting rescued.  That's DH to a T.  He continued on about the safety, trying to guilt me, God forbid something happens, etc.  I kept repeating it's not up to us to solve her problems.  And yes, God forbid if something happens, it's not on me, but it's on her.  This is her issue.

She acts so entitled.  Whenever there is any pushback, she erupts and descends into such condescension and disrespect.  We have never spoken to her the way she speaks to us.

But she has hot water.

[1footouttadefog]

I would buy her a gift card at a place that can put brakes on the car. 

I would then cut her off. Her priorities are unbelievable.  Running to Europe when she had a bad water heater and a car with bad brakes.

Even if she did not know the brakes were bad her response to them being bad and you contacting her is unhinged.

Sounds like she needs some tough love and a chance to grow up a bit by handling her own problems. 

He brakes are no more or less dangerous than they were before you found out.  It's only bothering because you know.  Imagine all the things she does that you don't know about. 

I like you would. Dwell on it however and that is why I would help get them fixed this one time. Brakes and tires wear out on new cars also, so buying a new car would not solve the problem any better than buying brakes for the car she has.

[chowder]

Hi, 1foot - thank you so much for your wise words.  I feel like the Lone Ranger sometimes between DD and DH. 

At one point when DH was trying to guilt me into buying her a new car, I actually asked him if we had failed her somehow as parents - did we not teach her not to live beyond your means?  At least his pushing for a new car stopped at that moment.  Until next time.

It's very troubling to see her sense of entitlement and, dare I say, irrational overreactions in the big picture.  If it's not the car, someday it'll be something else.  What's missing is the "Okay, I'll have to take care of that when I get home."  The personal responsibility is simply not there, but making me the scapegoat sure is.

[1footouttadefog]

At 36 it's long past time for her to find her way to loving within her means.  For you to participate in helping her to do otherwise is to do harm to her.

Enabling bad habits is harmful whether over spending or substance abuse etc.

It might hurt to see her struggle at first but in reality she is bright and able and will work with in the boundaries live gives her.  At this time they include your time and checking account.  When they don't she will find another option.  Whether that is dialing her spending down or finding a new source to mooch off of , it matters not.  What matters is that you will no longer be captive to her irresponsibility.

My guess is that some time will pass and she will realign her relationship with you based on something other than being a money and resource supply.  If not then you know where you stand with her and no amount money can change that or make it feel better. 

Respecting her as an adult means IMO not allowing her to be a child with regard to your resources and time.

[chowder]

Totally agree, 1foot.

I just discovered, in re-reading the texts from that date, I did indeed say "sorry to bother you on vacation" while it was going on.  So she had her apology from day 1.   

Thanks again, 1foot.

[bloomie]

chowder - I am imagining the frustration and how demeaning it might be to be spoken to by your adult child you are helping in this way.

I am very sorry and I am sorry the way it sounds like your DH prioritizes your DD and adult children's needs above the future financial stability for the both of you.

I once heard what stepping in a rescuing someone from their own carelessness can do explained like this:

If a child/person sits at a table with a full glass of water and is careless to the point of knocking it off the table time and time again and we catch it before it hits the floor time and time again, they never have to experience the consequences of cleaning up their own mess.

Is it uncomfortable to bear witness to the consequences of their careless ways? Yes. Rescuing anyone over and over again cripples them and creates a sense of entitlement that you are now seeing. Ask me how I know... #livedit

Good luck and stay the course. What you are showing, in your resolve, is what love looks like!!!

[Rebel13]

bloomie, you are so right! chowder, I think you get to transition your relationship with your daughter from parent to child, to adult to adult, at this point. I know your husband has his own struggles and you feel caught in the middle. However, this whole situation could have been avoided if your husband had not agreed to handling the water heater repair in the first place.

Again, adults, friends, often help each other out. We just got back from feeding a friend's cat while she is on vacation. But it is reciprocal. Our friend has taken care of our pets and home when we were away, many times. I don't see that kind of reciprocity in what you have written here about your daughter.

Your daughter is an adult. She's almost 40! That's middle aged. There's no reason to allow someone middle aged to scream verbal abuse at you over the phone. You also don't have to take the heat for your husband's decisions. If he wanted to get the water heater fixed, he could have dealt with all of the fallout of that decision, including your daughter's overreactions. Since you can't control him or her, you could tell them both, "That's between the two of you," and gotten off the phone immediately if your daughter didn't respect your boundary of not discussing the issue.

You also might want to look at the article on JADE in the Toolbox WRT your husband's desire to continue rescuing the children. The thing I learned from that article was that continuing to argue about things only grooves the other person's position deeper. The article recommends saying "No" or stating an opinion one time and then refusing to continue to argue about something. Again, your husband is going to do what he wants, but you can set boundaries about what you will do to protect yourself if he does those things.

Wishing you the best!

[chowder]

Bloomie and Rebel,

What valuable input you both have - yes, in hindsight, the water heater repair should have been left for her to handle.  Never again will I put myself out like that, whether it's helping directly or indirectly - which is difficult with DH, because he runs to the rescue and sucks you in, expecting you to help, when it's really not our issue.  Then he gets combative, Oh, you don't wanna help me, your daughter, etc., and tries to isolate my position and sow discord where there was none to begin with. 

The JADE link in the toolbox is quite helpful.  I hadn't thought of it in terms of grooving the other person's position deeper, but I now see where he just digs in his heels repeating the same mantra, and there is no desire to hear any other side.  Needless to say, these things just chip, chip, chip away at the marriage, but that's for another thread.

Thank you both for your kind words and wisdom. 

[hhaw]

Oh, Chowder.... you're up against your DD and dh's distress/ demands/entitlement.

I wonder what it would look like/feel like if ....
you began asking your DD what she was going to do about any problems she brings to your attention. Then be very quiet.

The same with your dh.....steer him towards helping DD resolve her issues, rather than enabling her to repeat mistakes (he won't always be able to rescue her from.)

Withdrawing your energy, from the situation, with love.....how does it feel to consider that?

If you're only expressing care, for DD's ability to function as a proper adult (for when you and your dh are gone) maybe your dh won't feel defensive and pull the bully card in you?