A whole family of personality disordered people?

[SpottyDotty]

Thanks for reading.
I have been left for the third time by my PD husband.
I obsess daily about what has happened over the years between myself, my kids, husband and inlaws.

I initially got on very well with inlaws. Looking back it was somewhat of a one sided relationship but I really enjoyed family get togethers etc. I felt that my sil was like a sister I never had. She is older than me by 8 years. I loved being an auntie to her sons, and had them for sleepovers, days out etc. Sil was not one to do this with my children but seemed to enjoy being their aunt to an extent.

I would visit my inlaws often when my kids were small. My mil doted over them when they were tiny. Seemed to enjoy being their grandma.

My fil was never a hands on grandad and seemed to enjoy annoying the grandkids and anyone around him. Always done in a teasing way, but could also be hurtful at times.

Things took a turn for the worse after my 13year old nephew, sexually assaulted my 2 year old daughter. My nephew took my daughter into his room, and at the very least, removed her nappy to look at her genitals. My daughter was so young, it was difficult to ask her what had happened. When I took her home that night, I had found her with her nappy on backwards and her genitals were also covered in my sil 's dog hair. My sons were able to tell me that their older cousin told them to stay out of his room, that he was going to change her nappy, so we knew it had been him.

I went over to speak with sil. She started to cry and said she knew he had done it, but also said he would never admit to it. (both myself and sil were pregnant at the time too).
I felt upset for her, but also enraged and devastated for my daughter. Sil said it was her fault.
She did not ask her son to talk about it, or ask him to apologise. I left and went home.
I reported incident to social services as I had my daughter checked over by our doctor.
I believe the police spoke to my nephew and he has some kind of mark on his record.

Mil and fil instantly sided with sil and said they felt for her. I was beyond angry, what about my daughter, she was the victim. Husband never said a word to them about their views. He was however supportive with me regarding nephew and how kids would have to be supervised around him.

Mil, fil, sil & bil, all brushed incident under the carpet. They wanted the family to remain as it had been. Every time we visited most of what they would talk about was how great our nephew was doing etc. I found this quite triggering.
I had my baby 6 weeks after the incident and there was a noticeable difference in how my mil and sil treated me. Both had an aloofness about them. Sil never bought baby a gift, mil expected to be able to call with baby and have me make her tea while visiting. Their behaviours were very passive aggressive and difficult to talk about as it also sounded petty complaining.

Mil tried to invite all family to my house (we did this once per month before incident). No one stood up to her outrightly. Husband and sil did try to laugh it off but it seemed as though they couldn't directly speak with her.

It went on like this for quite some time, always felt like there was an elephant in the room. Nephew was usually a big topic of conversation and about how great he was doing. It felt like they were trying to change our opinion of him.

We were tricked into family dinner at mils a couple of times, when nephew was present too. A very hard situation to be in.
I expected the kids to be supervised, doors left open etc. But I was the ONLY adult checking on them. No one else was interested in safe guarding issues.

(years before, Nephew had also exposed my eldest son to porn when he was 4, nephew was 8 at the time. This was at my mils. It was me that put parental controls on her computer afterwards.)

I continued to meet with sil and mil etc but that aloofness was always there. The relationships had changed completely and I felt increasingly uncomfortable around them both. It felt strained and I felt like their actions were not matching their words.

I decided to try and chat with sil and address the awkwardness. She appeared to take it well and said she didn't realise how I felt. I understood it was difficult for her too as its her son. I said I found it very difficult to be around him etc. It felt like we cleared the air.

But nothing changed and the aloofness was still there any time we met. I started to feel like I was the problem, or like I had done something.

Little things would happen, like being left out of a trip, left out of family photos, being triangulated with other sil (who was hated by my inlaws for years, they actually called her princess dung beetle).

I gradually spent less and less time with them.
I tried to remain polite and cordial.

I started to read about narcissism and it really fitted their behaviours and reactions. I believe I became the scapegoat because I dare challenge inappropriate behaviour instead of brushing incident under carpet and acting like nothing happened.

I went to counselling for grief and chatted alot about my inlaws and what had happened between my nephew and daughter too.

I realised I was a people pleaser and that if I wanted things to change in my life I needed to set boundaries and try to become assertive.

Thanks to counselling I then realised it was ok to feel angry and upset about things.

I felt that sil may never see me the same again because I'm a reminder of what her son did, or that she was upset that I reported him or tried to challenge it.

I had made a new friend and was trying to make my life enjoyable with the ongoing strain.
I noticed my husband started to make upsetting jokes like 'oh mummy only cares about her new friend more than her family'.
I thought to myself, it's ok, I'll chat to him in a nice way and he will understand and stop it.

I said "i feel hurt when you make fun of my new friendship" i didn't get a chance to finish. My husband screamed in my face "don't you dare tell me how to feel" and then ignored me for 2 weeks (during which time i was very ill and he didn't help out).

I was shocked. I knew this wasn't a normal reaction. I knew he could be like this with other people but felt like we were good and had a close connection.

I couldn't stop reading about narcissism and everything made sense. I felt out of my depth and worried. There had been red flags from the start but I had ignored them
. Husband has substantial criminal history which he often brags about
. Serious assaults on other men, was on bail for a year for one attack
. Told me he fought with someone years before and found out the next day they'd died
. Told me he used to push one gf
. Found out he was still with that gf when we met, didn't know at the time
.he scalded a waitress when we were out for a meal, then pretended to care for her

Too many more things to mention.

Fast forward to 2018,my husband assaulted me infront of our kids. Tried to drag me out of bathroom while I was being sick. Told me I wasn't being sick, asked me why I wasn't looking after the kids, told me I was having a mental break down, told me I was a social services problem, threw water over me.

My heart had palpitations the next morning. He didn't care and was still angry with me. I called my own ambulance and went to hospital.

We separated for a while. Lots of mind games. Even more aloofness from his family.

We got back together, he convinced me to remortgage house to invest in new property for retirement.
Husband kept money. Left a 2nd time (right before family holiday), blamed in on our son. He committed credit card fraud with money. Frittered it away and got caught frauding so had to pay back money apparently.

He went to an abusers programme but didn't last and completed denied any abuse afterwards. Saying he did not domestically abuse me or kids etc.


We got back together but it felt wrong and cold, very degrading. 2020 covid made it difficult too at times.
We muddled along. He would often target one of our children and I would challenge him on his attitude, respectfully.

He insisted we get a holiday home. Really insisted. So we did.
Things really didn't feel right, despite the grand gestures.
Mil and sil really upping the ante with their covert mistreatment.
Sil completely ignored me for most of year, no communication. Drive past without waving. Sent my son a horrible birthday card meant to poke fun at him.
Mil picking on one of my sons, saying mean underhanded comments such as "you were really beautiful as a baby, but I'm not saying you are now". Kept asking me infront of other family members why I was so quiet. Made up a lie about my daughter not believing in santa, fil backed her up.
Guilt trips about not visiting. Nephew moved in with them for months too.
She gave me a poinsettia plant as a gift. I had to rehome it as it was toxic to my cat. I rehomed plant on a facebook freebie site. My husband told me his sister saw ad and let him know. Told me it was heartless of me to do this, that I really hurt his mums feelings and did I not think to ask her permission before giving it away.

Tension built coming up to Christmas 2020.husband was barely speaking to me. Had mil and fil for xmas dinner.
Mil spilt her drink over my daughter, her bracelet I got her miraculously had a knot in it.

Anyway.
I confronted husband about his treatment towards me.
I thought he was in the huff because of plant incident.
Turns out it was another discard.
Apparently he's not happy and wanted to run back to mummy and daddy. I don't keep a clean enough house
. The kids aren't being raised right
. He wasn't more enthusiastic about my new job because he thought how the hell would i keep up with housework
. The bloody poinsettia incident came up again. I was reminded of how cruel i was
. Told me he doesn't know me anymore
. Told me I was driving a wedge between him and his family.


Off he went the next morning. Packed his bags infront of the kids. Told them he needed space.

My head is spinning still.
Can there be a whole family of pd people?
Is this normal?

Sometimes I still feel like it's all me.

[Poison Ivy]

"Can there be a whole family of PD people?" Yes.
"Is this normal?" I hesitate to use the words "normal" and "abnormal." I'm not sure what you mean by "normal" in this context.

I don't think it's all you.

[SpottyDotty]

Sorry, Poison Ivy.
I meant normal family behaviour?

I realise my post is a bit of a ramble. So much went on in the 12years I was with my husband and his family.

[Poison Ivy]

Personality disorders and sexual abuse are probably more common than many people think they are, but no, I wouldn't call this family's behavior "normal."

[Leonor]

Hello Dotty,

I am so heartbroken reading your post,and extend all my compassion to you and your dear children.

My foo was also sexually abusive and throughout my own healing journey I've been honored to meet and connect with other survivors as well. We have yet to know anyone whose sexually-abusive family has acknowledged the abuse. What you describe in your ILs is, sadly, usually the invalidating, damaging non-response we have experienced as well.

Dotty, what most worries me in your post is not your problematic in-laws (although "problematic" is way too casual a word for the monstrousness you and your children have suffered from them), but the violent and abusive treatment you and your children are receiving from your dh.

He's left? Good. Change the locks, call a safe women's or family crisis shelter and file a report with the police. Do it now, before you doubt your own reality and start to feel overwhelmed with panic or he returns in an attempt to hoover you with remorse. You know things aren't right, Dotty, bit you may not know that you're speaking the truth to your ILs is brave and courageous, and that bravery is what will bring you through to a safer and more living space.

[bloomie]

Hi Spotty Dotty. I want to welcome you to Out of the FOG. I realize we are just seeing tiny snap shot of what you and your dear children have experienced and the damage and wounds from it all that you must be carrying. I am just so sorry.

I do believe from personal experience that there can be toxic family systems where terrible abuse is covered up and anyone who dares to take right and appropriate action such as you have done by reporting the assault on your child and insisting on the protection of your children going forward, and refusing to rug sweep the behavior is punished and demonized. You have done a brave and courageous thing through incredible pressure to cave and you have paid a very high price for it.

As you process this latest leaving by your husband it may be awhile before you can begin to trust your instincts about his abusive behaviors. Living in an atmosphere of risk and waiting for the next bad thing to happen while trying to keep your kids and family together has to be exhausting and very confusing.

I am thankful you have some space from the abuse and false accusations and hope that you will be able to connect with local domestic violence counselors and get some help for yourself and your children in dealing with all of this. It is wise to talk with experts as this time of separation can be a time of high risk for you and your children.

I want to offer a few resources that we have handy in case any of them would be good support for you right now:

https://www.thehotline.org
you can chat live with a DV counselor, read articles, develop a plan for safety through this website

and more resources are found here:
https://outofthefog.website/emergency/

Sending you strength and wisdom as you take your next best steps to a healthy and safe environment for you and your kiddos. Keep coming back as you are able and let us support you and tell us how you all are doing.

[Breakthrough]

Yes there can be a whole family of PDs.  My husband's mother's family is mostly PDs.  He is sometimes a flying monkey and has some PD traits.  He has done some pretty bad things, enough to make me seriously contemplate divorce 2 years ago, but we worked through it.  I have extremely contact with my MIL.

Your husband's behaviours are abusive.  The inlaws are too.  I wonder if the other SIL you speak of actually cut off contact with them.  Might be worth reaching out to her to connect if that is the case.  You are in the right here, protecting your kids.  Frankly, if anything like that happened, I would cut off contact indefinitely myself.  You were being too kind to continue contact.  I would not risk my kids, I don't care if they are family.  My MIl did something that endangered my eldest daughter when she was 18 mo old.  I put up with a lot of her horrible behaviours over the years, and was a people pleaser too.  I put my foot down about this, we didn't see them again for 8 months.  She got the message sort of and also caused a lot of drama. Between me and my husband.  I put my foot down with him too, he chooses me over family or we're done.  Doesn't mean he we can't have contact with his family, but the well being of our kids is more important than not hurting his mom's feelings.  She was wrong, never apologized or acknowledged what happened.  My husband was trying to sweep under the rug and still does, but I won't be gaslit anymore.   

That feeling of them making you feel like it's you?  That's gaslighting.  It's not you, it's them.  Being a people pleaser means they will use that against you and gaslight you more.  My inlaws did this, it was not nearly as bad as your inlaws actions though. Read about gaslighting, it's an abusive tactic, and it really threw me off, now I realize the only way to deal with PDs is boundaries.  They don't like it, but it's necessary.  It sounds like you might need to divorce your husband.  He is not a safe sounding person and it sounds like he doesn't care about your kids the way he left.

Financially, it sounds like your husband is abusive too.  Lock down that situation right away.  Get the advice of a good accountant or lawyer.  Keep your money separate and if you can legally separate his debt from yours now, do so.  He may do things like take out a joint credit card and rack up debt which you will then both be responsible for.  Try to head this off now.  Document any abusive behaviours by calling the police when it happens.  You definitely want to get full custody of your kids, which can be difficult unless there is a well documented history of abuse, depending on where you are.

Please keep yourself and your kids safe.  Also, consider counselling so you have get support.  I am glad you have a new close friend.

[all4peace]

SpottyDotty, I want to check in with you and see how you're doing, if you are comfortable sharing. I hope you've had time to read and process what others have shared here. It is a lot to take in.

Yes, entire families can have neglectful to dangerous behavior.

I very much hope you have considered reaching out to the resources Bloomie mentions above. When I read your story, there is a lot of pain, but the thing that leaps out at me is your husband's behavior over time and the level of threat you describe. I would very much encourage you to find support outside of this family and begin building a support network for yourself. This forum could be one of the pieces of support for you right now, and you will also need to find support in your real life.

Please check in if it is safe and if you would find that helpful. My best to you.

[gettingstronger1]

SpottyDotty,
I am terribly sorry to hear about what happened to you and your children. That had to have been a nightmare for you. What happened to you and your kids is just plain wrong. You have every right to protect yourself and your kids from your husband and his family. You can't change them, but you can reach out to domestic violence shelters for help. It is incredibley painful being blamed for the family problems. Thats called scapegoating and its what toxic families do best. Please know that no matter what they say, it's not your fault and you are not bad for having boundaries. Actually you are increadibly strong.
Gettingstronger1