Full on flying monkey!

[moglow]

...and I saw it for what it was - progress!! I was contacted yesterday by a cousin I've not seen or heard from in years, probably not since her mother's funeral. She's well known within the family for stirring drama, much like her own mother and mine. Last I knew she was big buddies and in regular contact with mommie dearest so my radar went up anyway.

I actually engaged this cousin's conversation, curious what story was being told and how. I was surprised actually - far from hiding and playing victim as I suspected, mother was apparently bragging about what she's said to me and has been for quite some time.

There were a couple of times a while back that mother's comments to me were "off," and I realized she was sharing our texts with someone. I thought it was to make herself appear a victim. You know-  only sharing what I said, not what it was in response to. (I called her on it a few times, the defensive tone followed by her disappearing answered my questions pretty quick!) I just wasn't sure who it was then. But no. Mother hasn't been playing victim - she's apparently told this cousin about a number of her attacks, told her what she/mother has said to me. Very matter of fact and open about it, as if it's her privilege and she's using it.

Paraphrased from cousin: "She's just lonely and trying to get your attention" and then says she has this great idea. I should show up at mother's for a visit, just to laugh and talk, open that door with her. Laugh and talk, when we've not even had a civil phone conversation in how long? Uh huh, that'll happen.

But WHY all this? Cousin doesn't want *me* to have regrets, I should make this last ditch effort so I KNOW I've done everything I can. Like I haven't long since reached that point?! And seriously, mother's a grown woman - there's been NO indicator she wants to see me, in fact all the door slamming she's doing indicates quite the opposite and I'm good with that finally.

But buried in this great idea, she mentioned that mother wants her house cleaned and she's told mother that neither of us are going over there to do it. There are services for that! Oh. Now I get it -  Means to an end. More manipulation, as I suspected. I have no doubt that house needs cleaning and know mother's not getting around well, but really? Hint around that I should come over and do it? Nah. I'm sure there are local housekeeping services she can call. Google it.

So, confirmed: There truly is no remorse, no conscience, no recognition that apologies and acknowledgment are overdue and massive changes are needef. She still wants what she wants and will happily manipulate anyone to get it.

[Starboard Song]

People who don't get it always exhort us to "one more try," and even a "last attempt." They really aren't in our shoes and I don't think they can realize that if we heeded their advice, and it didn't work, they'd be right back calling for one more try again within a month. At some point, last is last, and has to last.

Good for you for recognizing what's happening here. I am sorry you had to experience this call at all, though.

[moglow]

Cousin it used her own mother and family as an example, not a great comparison to pull from. She cut her siblings out of her mother's estate and they subsequently cut her off years ago, with good reason from what I saw. She wishes she had [fill in the blank] - noted. YOU have regrets. Been there, done that. I understand regrets. This? No. I've exhausted my inner resources and have to look to myself.

Many years ago this very cousin admitted to me that "they" knew of the abuse and it had been discussed in their home when they were growing up. They didn't know how to help us so they didn't. This cousin is well aware that didn't change, mother never changed, has heard (according to her) many times how we don't call or visit.

As I pointed out to her last night, the only difference between the childhood abuse and now is, now mother can't hit me. She's still the same bully she was, she's just upped her game. Cousin continued with how angry mother always seems. Really? I hadn't noticed. And yet you think I should visit her ...

[Penny Lane]

People who don't get it always exhort us to "one more try," and even a "last attempt." They really aren't in our shoes and I don't think they can realize that if we heeded their advice, and it didn't work, they'd be right back calling for one more try again within a month. At some point, last is last, and has to last.

This is so true! Like, how could they possibly know that we haven’t already tried that? Why does your next attempt need to be your last attempt, when your previous one could be? Nothing has changed on moglow’s end — the only difference is that the cousin has decided to be involved. Which doesn’t change anything in terms of how many attempts to make.

[wisingup]

I'm sorry Moglow.  It's hard to be so mis-understood.  When someone hasn't taken the time to fully understand an issue, it's more like bullying.  If they stopped to ASK about your experience...but they never seem to do that before launching into the advice.

I hear the voices of my relatives on mom's side in my head constantly.  Judging me for what I do or don't do.  Most of them think she's a sweet old lady.  Even her sister, who KNOWS most of what she's capable of, doesn't get it because she's the older sister.  She was never in a position of complete dependence on mom. 

So why do I care what they think?  I never see these people anyway.  I'll see them at funerals.  I'm already anticipating being very uncomfortable at my mom's funeral, with people thinking I was bad to her.  Ugh - how to get past this without JADE-ing, even to myself in my own head?

[moglow]

Actually, I'm okay, better than okay. Cousin was pleasant enough, shared some things that were verbatim from mothers texts a while back. So she knows, there's no doubt in her mind what's happened here or at whose instigation. I shared some information in kind, how it seems to have come down and how I feel about it. Nothing harsh, bitter, angry. Just matter of fact and several home truths so she knows my eyes are open.

I don't doubt cousin likely thought she was helping on some level. But tell me about mother's blistering anger and how she's backed off calling because it never lets up - but I should visit so I don't have regrets when she's gone? Are ya HIGH, cuz?

[Boat Babe]

You didn't need that Moglow. However, being Out of the FOG means you dealt with is really well and you will do the right thing for yourself. 

Sending hugs 

[Cat of the Canals]

Paraphrased from cousin: "She's just lonely and trying to get your attention" and then says she has this great idea. I should show up at mother's for a visit, just to laugh and talk, open that door with her. Laugh and talk, when we've not even had a civil phone conversation in how long? Uh huh, that'll happen.

Good gravy. They only have themselves to blame for being "lonely." And "trying to get attention" is NOT a valid reason for abusive behavior. There are a thousand different ways one might get certain needs met. Being NICE is one of them. Somehow many PDs never seem to figure that out. My PDmil being one of them. She wants to bemoan that no one wants to spend time with her, and all I can think is, "Has it ever occurred to you to try to be a decent person?"

Screw the notion of regret, too. Regret what? Not signing up for more abuse and manipulation? Regret implies that there was something we COULD have done and didn't. I have regrets about PDmom, but they're about all the times I wish I would have defended my boundaries but didn't. I can't regret the connection we don't have because there's nothing I can do about it. No amount of effort on my end will fix her deficiencies.

[moglow]

Exactly! My regrets are that I kept mother-installed blinders in place all those years, ignored the very real and numerous physical and emotional signs of how bad it was affecting me. I regret the violence I allowed, rolled over for and did nothing about "because she's my mother."


It's really kinda laughable when you think about it - her taking a page from mother's playbook thinking she can guilt me into swallowing yet more bullshit. Really, they don't know me at all, do they?! Still not listening to a word I've said, but okay.     

[theonetoblame]

It's really kinda laughable when you think about it - her taking a page from mother's playbook thinking she can guilt me into swallowing yet more bullshit. Really, they don't know me at all, do they?! Still not listening to a word I've said, but okay. 

It's unfortunate you needed to go on yet another trip around the PD merry-go-round...! I like what you say here though, and how you say it.

It has always amazed me how often (not always, but often) when a PD person is cut off, and no longer has direct access to us which allows them to cause harm, their behavior becomes so predictable. Just basic, and immature... and omg, so repetitive - ad nauseam.... just the same stuff over and over. Sure, there are some very high functioning narcissists out there who may hatch a multi-year scheme of revenge that we would never see coming, but they seem to be the minority. Most seem to lack any sort of behavioral flexibility, which probably comes in lockstep with their limited insight -- sort of like part of their brain isn't working well.

I think it's good you can laugh about it, to perhaps throw up your arms and exclaim for the world how ridiculous their behavior is. I do this often. I also agree that there is nothing to regret about your decision and current situation other than the need to bat away the occasional unwanted messenger. And nope, mommy dearest isn't going to change (as you know).

[Hepatica]

Isn't that cousin a nosy nellie!! What gives her the right to tell you want to do? I've been on the receiving end of that kind of thing, where someone in the family is on their high horse about thinking they're going to step in and give someone some lame advice and solve all the issues. It's just another way of them thinking they know better than us, that they are smarter and have all the answers. It's infuriating.

Bottom line is they did not live in the house we grew up in. They do not get the same treatment we do by the PD parent or sibling. They have no idea what they are talking about, and yet they think they know it all. I am, I think, a pretty tolerant person, but I've become really impatient with behaviour like this. I have a few cousins (and my sister who are like this) and I realize they have been raised in a toxic aquarium like me, but I've climbed out and they remain swimming around in denial. 

[moglow]

I know! The whole "I have a great idea for you ..." as IF! We've not been in contact for several years but she feels she's a voice of reason, someone I should trust? She forgets I have eyes ears and a mind of my own. She's talked to mommie dearest all this time and knows exactly why I'm not camped out on her doorstep. Told me herself that she contacts mother less because of all the anger and spite. But *I* should go. Ha!! Riiiiiight.

[p123]

When people find out I won't bend over backwards for Dad any more the phrases where I want to kill people:

"But hes old and lonely" (Help yourself a bit then and stop moaning)
"He looked after you when you were a kid so he needs you now" (I particularly hate this one! - yeh remember my kids too?)
"Hes you're Dad" (So I have to put up with his crap?)
"Hes a lovely old man" (yeh hes good at that)
"You'll be sorry when hes gone" (Umm will I?)

Dad has a cousin. He was a nightmare. I had these phrases all the time from him - it got crazy. Of course, as I withdrew, Dad had to get his hooks into someone - yep his cousin. Lets just say, he found out how the land lies.

[lightworld]

Oh yes this sort of person drives me crazy. They know how it is but somehow they think you should suck it up! It's outrageous that they think they have the right to do that. I have a cousin like this who has said she and her M knew about the abuse yet they still insist I should get over it in a 'he's old and he's your Dad' sort of way. B's way is to minimise F's behaviour making me feel paranoid for calling it abuse. 

It's deeply invalidating but I'm so glad you are able to see it for what it is Moglow.  When you are Out of the FOG you find clarity.

[Hazy111]

Funny how a lot of them are cousins. Ive got one acting as a flying monkey for both my sis and dad and her brother . But this cousin  is definitely PD too in my opinion. (well same family intergenerational trauma  why wouldnt she be)

She had nothing to do with my side of the family for about 30 years and now shes writing me letters now cruel i am to my Dad. She gets invited up for Xmas etc by my sis and is so grateful.

Strange how my sis couldnt stand her and never saw for about 40 years  since she was bridesmaid at her wedding. 

No thankyou

[Fortuna]

But buried in this great idea, she mentioned that mother wants her house cleaned and she's told mother that neither of us are going over there to do it.

Did you let the cousin knew she's glad she found a service for that? Proud of you for recognizing the flying monkey for what they were.

With my mom it felt really good when I started dropping the rope on the random stuff she wanted from me that she could do herself.