The intersection of aging and PD

Sneezy · December 05, 2021, 03:25:51 PM

This has been an interesting few days. I know we often talk about the interaction between aging and personality disorders, but this past weekend I had a front row seat to a good example of where things sit with my mom. Mom is always miserable, everyone is mean to her, her life sucks, the food in senior living is terrible, etc., etc., etc. You all know this refrain, right? But lately, she has come up with a bizarre story, full of odd details. The price of food is going up here, and stories about inflation have been all over the news. So Mom keeps insisting that her senior living facility can not afford food and thus they are sending the chef out hunting for deer to feed them. According to Mom, the chef shoots deer and drags them back to senior living to feed 150+ seniors. Mom is full of details of how the chef is paid for this service, and how the last deer he shot was too gamey for her taste, and how she just doesn't care for venison three or four times a week and all this venison is making her ill. It all sounds so believable, except for the fact that it is crazy as can be (not to mention, something like this would violate several food safety regulations for senior living). Somehow, her brain is taking stories about inflation, mixing them with deer meat (!), and turning all this into yet another example of how bad the food is and how terrible her living conditions supposedly are.

This place where PDs and aging meet up is absolutely fascinating.

square · December 05, 2021, 03:44:13 PM

Honestly, this sounds like dementia regardless of PD.

My non-PD dad had all sorts of weird ideas just like that in the last few years of his life.

The dementia also triggered paranoia, which has got to be extra special for PDs. But even my non PD dad (no prior hostory of paranoia either) had all sorts of ideas about how They were screwing him. The topics were based on areas of interest/concern he previously had, though.

Boat Babe · December 05, 2021, 03:45:30 PM

Ageing can be terribly cruel. We need to approach it with the best mental and emotional health we can achieve in order to deal with the challenges it brings. PDs don't have that insight, they've never had it. That's their pathology and their tragedy. It leaves them desperately unprepared for the losses we incur when ageing: looks, energy, mobility, health, status (in many wealthy countries) and much else beside. The only real compensation for this is greatly increased wisdom and a peaceful heart. That is forever out of their grasp.

Sneezy · December 05, 2021, 04:05:17 PM

Quote from: Boat Babe on December 05, 2021, 03:45:30 PM
Ageing can be terribly cruel. We need to approach it with the best mental and emotional health we can achieve in order to deal with the challenges it brings. PDs don't have that insight, they've never had it. That's their pathology and their tragedy. It leaves them desperately unprepared for the losses we incur when ageing: looks, energy, mobility, health, status (in many wealthy countries) and much else beside. The only real compensation for this is greatly increased wisdom and a peaceful heart. That is forever out of their grasp.

Unfortunately, this is true. My mom has never felt at peace. She is a bundle of anxieties. And as she gets older, this only gets worse for her. I really feel sorry for her, while at the same time feeling very frustrated and unsure of how to deal with it. So far, a combination of medium chill, boundaries, and simply ignoring the truly crazy talk tends to work best.

Quote from: square on December 05, 2021, 03:44:13 PM
Honestly, this sounds like dementia regardless of PD.

It could be just that. I took mom out for a nice brunch yesterday, and as I was driving her back to her apartment, she started complaining that I never take her out, and why won't I take her out, and my oh my, she just NEEDS to get out of her apartment. These are typical complaints from my mom, but I was a little surprised to hear them while I was taking her home from being out. There is definitely some confusion going on. And I don't think it's going to get better.

square · December 05, 2021, 04:28:25 PM

It's not, I'm sorry

My father complained to my mom a lot that she didn't visit. (She did).

He frequently called her to ask her for her phone number.

Dementia hurts. I'm still trying to integrate my memories (my father passed recently).

SunnyMeadow · December 05, 2021, 04:57:08 PM

Quote from: Sneezy on December 05, 2021, 04:05:17 PM
It could be just that. I took mom out for a nice brunch yesterday, and as I was driving her back to her apartment, she started complaining that I never take her out, and why won't I take her out, and my oh my, she just NEEDS to get out of her apartment. These are typical complaints from my mom, but I was a little surprised to hear them while I was taking her home from being out. There is definitely some confusion going on. And I don't think it's going to get better.

No I don't think it will get better. That's got to be a shock and hard to hear sneezy. But with her confusion at least you know you can't take it personally. I'm sorry.

Sneezy · December 06, 2021, 10:14:09 AM

I think it would be a good idea for mom to get a couple doctor appointments. One for a full physical checkup and one for a cognitive evaluation. There is so much that could be going on with her. I know from experience with my MIL and my stepmother that something as simple as a chronic UTI (which is common in older women) can cause cognitive issues. It could be that her medications are interfering with each other, or that her unresolved knee pain is messing with her thinking abilities. Or it could be dementia. In any case, it would be best to know and address the problem if we can.

The problem is that mom thinks she is absolutely fine. Better than fine. She still questions why she is living with "old people" and why I am mean and force her to use a walker. In her mind, she is still the sorority president and straight-A student. This is where I think the PD part comes in. People with PDs can't cede control. They don't trust that anyone else would look out for their best interests. And so they insist on calling the shots, even when the decisions they are making are not wise or safe. (Note - often mom will *pretend* to let others make decisions, so that if something goes wrong, she has someone else to blame. But in reality, this is a type of manipulation that is meant to keep her in total control).

Well, wish me luck - when the time is right I may try to gently suggest that I go to a checkup with mom and we try to get some answers.

square · December 06, 2021, 10:50:40 AM

Good lick. And yes, a good idea to rule out UTI or med issues. My dad did have dementia but one time he had an infection too and things got really bad until it was identified and resolved.

I agree also that the mental block on the situation is her particular personality, and thus PD. The effects on the brain do naturally make insight hard but my father and another late male relative with dementia had an overall awareness that they had it, in the early stages. (But when someone with dementia is in a highly confused/agitated state, they can't be convinced it's dementia, no matter how much insight they normally/naturally have).

Maybe you should call the doc's office prior to the visit to share your concerns. It's better for the doc to suggest the workup rather than you "betraying" her by suggesting it. At the visit, you can just take the attitude of "that sounds like a great idea, doc, I am concerned about mom and have noticed she doesn't seem to be feeling her best lately" which is different from "yeah my mom has been saying and doing some really concerning things."

daughter · December 06, 2021, 06:35:28 PM

Food pantry central collections here in our county takes frozen-meat venison donations from local hunters. Maybe chef hunts, and this was a one-off "treat". Maybe not.

Sneezy · December 11, 2021, 11:11:10 AM

Quote from: daughter on December 06, 2021, 06:35:28 PM
Food pantry central collections here in our county takes frozen-meat venison donations from local hunters. Maybe chef hunts, and this was a one-off "treat". Maybe not.

It could be something like this. Or maybe one of her neighbor's relatives brought venison in for them to try. But I finally asked mom if she might want the doctor to check all her meds and make sure nothing was interacting in a weird way. She kept pressing me and I finally told her I was concerned about the venison story. Now she flat out denies that she said any of it. I don't know if she made the whole thing up, if maybe there was some underlying truth to it, or am I losing my mind and completely imagining the whole thing. Ok, I'm 99.9% certain I didn't imagine it. It was such a lengthy and detailed story.

I can't tell when my mom is telling the truth or not. Yesterday, she told me that the van at senior living was in the repair shop and so all transportation was canceled. I couldn't tell if that was true or if it was manipulation to get me to drive her around. So I stopped at the front desk and asked, and sure enough, the van is in the shop. I hate not being able to trust what my mom says, and I feel guilty when I doubt her and she's telling the truth, and I feel angry when she isn't telling the truth. And then I feel guilty because she's an old lady and maybe she can't help it. All kinds of fun emotions today!

Cat of the Canals · December 15, 2021, 09:46:17 PM

That's half the point of gaslighting, Sneezy. They mix the truth with lies, and that way you're never quite sure.

For your own sake, maybe it would help to keep a journal, if only to stop yourself from doubting things like the venison story she now so vehemently denies.