Help with paraphrasing a comeback for put downs

[Hilltop]

So distance is my friend with my parents now that I have moved away.  I am  not ready for NC, I am working on VLC.  Now that I don't live near them I am not in a position for regular visits and this has reduced my stress a lot, so text will be the main communication and I am thinking eventually they may drop in for a quick visit when they drive to visit my sister.  I am not ready for that yet however they usually visit my sister late in the year so I figure there may be a visit late next year, if I agree.  The biggest problem I have with my parents is that they put me down, sometimes subtlety sometimes it's obvious. I understand I don't have to agree to any visit but I am hoping I can achieve 1-2 visits a year that go ok.  I would be happy with that. 

I got to the stage of not saying anything in reply to their insults because I didn't want to show any emotion or show any reaction but to be honest this ended up feeling horrible, like I just accepted the abuse.  Moving forward I want to stand up for myself, I want to be calm, without emotion but have some quick comeback to have ready to keep repeating to shut down any insults that come my way.  I am thinking if they kept up with any negativity I would leave, I am only going to meet them for coffee in a neutral place, so I have the ability to walk away.  I really want to have a plan now, so that I can practice it and by the time I see them I feel confident in what I am saying and doing. 

I am thinking of replies such as "I feel like it would be more productive if we didn't put each other down during this visit, lets focus on having a pleasant time".  Then changing the subject.  Obviously I need to work on wording but something like this.  If they refused to acknowledge or dismiss the insult then perhaps "It's ok that we disagree, have you seen xyz".  If they continue then saying "It doesn't seem like today was a good day to get together, how about we try another time". Then leave.  My father sometimes does a weird mocking laugh, I was thinking "Oh what's funny?".

Does anyone else have a paraphrase that worked for them?  What wording would you use?  What comeback would you use for "You are too sensitive".  I just want a phrase I can use, practice it over and over and then use it.  Any ideas would be really helpful. Has this worked or helped anyone here to lessen the negativity?

[moglow]

"You are too sensitive".

That's a favorite of my mother too. That and "aw you can't take a joke?" I have on a few occasions responded with a pointed look and, "if I thought it was funny I would have laughed." I've also reminded her that she raised us that if you can't say anything nice don't say anything at all. My personal favorite and it shut her right up, "I wonder how you'd feel if someone said that to you? I suspect you'd have a much stronger response than mine." No smile, deadpanned and looking her right in the eye. 

No, none of it went over well because one mustnt contradict mommie dearest, but with a little practice it comes out easier and I feel better for it. Gritting my teeth and crying later just doesn't work for me anymore.
Somewhere along the way subservience be damned. I'm not saying return insult with insult but do stand up and walk away for yourself.

[Cat of the Canals]

My father sometimes does a weird mocking laugh, I was thinking "Oh what's funny?".

Does anyone else have a paraphrase that worked for them?  What wording would you use?  What comeback would you use for "You are too sensitive".  I just want a phrase I can use, practice it over and over and then use it.  Any ideas would be really helpful. Has this worked or helped anyone here to lessen the negativity?

One I like that is similar to, "Oh, what's funny?" and works in a broad spectrum of situations is to blink innocently and say, "I don't know what you mean." It forces them to either explain the nasty remark they've just made in further detail or simply drop it. Most PDs I've encountered are cowards at heart and they don't actually have the guts to explain it further. It also puts the whole thing back on them in a completely non-confrontational way (which they aren't expecting), and gives at least the impression that their little emotional jab hasn't landed the way they thought it would. In short, they usually end up confused.

Another one I've heard but haven't had the chance to use yet is, "That's interesting. I wonder why you think that?" I got it from a video I'll link below, but the concept is similar to the above in that you are (as she says in the video), "returning the responsibility to it's rightful owner."

https://youtu.be/Dc_ZOjt0QFA

[Happypants]

I need to be careful not to trigger anger in my intolerant father as he has a serious heart issue so I've had to bite my tongue for years. Where he's concerned, I know that just not taking the bait and carrying on the conversation as if nothing was said, preferably with someone else, means he doesn't get that supply he's looking for.  Where my mother's concerned, she leaves the underhand comments for texts and one to one phone conversations so it's a little more difficult. But a resigned/exasperated  "oh right" (that sounds like I'm rolling my eyes  ) then a change of topic sometimes diffuses her effect on me and distracts us both. Hope that helps x

[Boat Babe]

If you can muster it, bursting out laughing is a great comeback and is also powerful.

Saying you don't understand and can they explain that further is the smart response imo. Watch them squirm as they have to explain their nasty covert digs. If they bite the bait and try to explain, act really dumb and ask for further explanation.  Look interested!  This also works for randoms spouting racist, sexist etc nonsense in public.

The sad thing is that we are all discussing how best to fend off abusive comments. We really shouldn't have to but we're related to these people. Gargh.

[GentleSoul]

Urgh, I recognise all this PD behaviour.   

What I started to do was treat the nasty comment as if it was real.   Treat it seriously. 

So I would response completely dead pan face and say something like "oh, do you think so?  I am not sure what you mean, perhaps you could explain".

Their passive aggressiveness only really works if it is kept in a sly and underhand place.    The criticism, the digs etc.

I found by putting it in the light, it took the power from it. 

I have found PDs in my life were huge cowards.  If called on their rubbish they shrink away.  They were all hot air and show.

They say they were only joking or I am too sensitive, again deadpan face, even tone voice "oh, not sure what you mean".   

Similar really to Med Chill, Grey Rock except that I was putting their sly comment in the spotlight which they can't bear.   Um, think vampires and daylight!! 

I think this only works with the cowardly, covert flavour of PDs.  Lee xx

[Hazy111]

The best comeback ive found is NC. 

Ive had and no doubt so have millions had the "Youre too sensitive?" "Cant you take a joke? " lines.  The bullys classic defensive "gaslighting" technique .

Funny that those that dished it out used to be super sensitive if they were on the receiving end. Their fragile narcissistic egos explode at the slightest criticism.

[Hilltop]

Moglow I am sorry you had to put up with so much from your MD.  She sounds really hurtful and I'm glad you are now protecting yourself. 

Cat of the Canals - I watched the video and found it really helpful, I liked some of the phrasing she used and wrote it down.

Happypants - my mother use to use the phone to make underhanded comments as well. I have found that my mother will behave with text and I think that's because she knows I can show people.  So although I keep it really mundane and limited it does work as she behaves. 

Boat Babe - I know there is part of me that can't be bothered but another part that thinks that perhaps 1-2 visits a year with so much distance in between may be doable.  I am not sure yet, I'm not overly invested in it being a solution or fix, I understand they aren't going to change, however I want to see if a detached response defuses things.

GentleSoul - I love these expressions and I think they will work well.  My parents are definitely the coward covert types.  I think the problem I have had in the past is that I got emotional, then I went silent.  I feel like I need to stand up for myself which this does in a non confrontational way.

Hazy - Yep I get it.  No one should have to go through this BS to simply have a relationship, it shouldn't be a game or feel like a game.  Really if next year I still feel like crap being around them or I find I can't do detached then I am starting to accept that NC will flow naturally from there.  I will let the relationship die a natural death. I have already implemented boundaries where I have limited phone calls and moving forward I am no longer going to visit them at their house, I will meet them for coffee somewhere neutral.  I use to be local to them so I would see them a lot more and now with distance I don't have to, I'm hoping this is going to help me with the detachment. Who knows they may refuse to drop in when they drive by to visit my sister and then NC starts earlier than I thought.  I'm not going to go out of my way to encourage any visits but I want to be prepared if something comes up. 

Thanks for all the suggestions, I just wanted to make sure I had a reply that was non emotional that is not unintentionally going to give any further supply to them.

[Hazy111]

Good luck but remember if you decide to go NC you have to put a lot of preparation into it. Changing numbers emails deleting social media etc Then the flying monkeys and extended friends and family come into play. Youll trigger a lot of resistance.

[MIB]

One thing that I have found helpful is basically no response. So when they say something stupid/rude/irritating I might simply say "hmm" or "mmm". Or give them a calm and blank look before calmly changing the subject or physically going to do something else.

I have found that PDs love the reaction. No reaction removes the fuel that fires them up.

Good luck 🤞🙏

[GentleSoul]

I thought of this thread a little earlier, I was in the supermarket at the checkout waiting to pay and a lady behind me made a passive aggressive remark to me.  A mean one criticising the supermarket staff.  Completely uncalled for. Nasty. 

I replied as we have been discussing in here.  I took the remark at face value.  Responded in dead pan way and said "oh, do you think so?  Why do you think that?"

Well you have never seen anyone retreat as quickly!!  It shut her right down. 

I think she was looking for someone to join in with a bitter moaning session about the staff.   These being the staff who have gone well above and beyond during the pandemic to help us. 

[Cat of the Canals]

One thing that I have found helpful is basically no response. So when they say something stupid/rude/irritating I might simply say "hmm" or "mmm". Or give them a calm and blank look before calmly changing the subject or physically going to do something else.

I have found that PDs love the reaction. No reaction removes the fuel that fires them up.

Good luck 🤞🙏

The last time I saw my PDmil, she got all worked up and started blaming us for something silly. At first my husband and I both tried responding to her, but that only seemed to add fuel to the fire. And then we both just went quiet. We both have a tendency to have "freeze" reactions, where we don't say anything because we're stunned like a deer in headlights, but this was different. It was a calm, assertive, intentional silence.

She ranted for a few more sentences and then she just seemed to run out of steam. Not only that, but she didn't bring it up again (not her usual style at all). So yes, sometimes silence is golden.

[Boat Babe]

I thought of this thread a little earlier, I was in the supermarket at the checkout waiting to pay and a lady behind me made a passive aggressive remark to me.  A mean one criticising the supermarket staff.  Completely uncalled for. Nasty. 

I replied as we have been discussing in here.  I took the remark at face value.  Responded in dead pan way and said "oh, do you think so?  Why do you think that?"

Well you have never seen anyone retreat as quickly!!  It shut her right down. 

I think she was looking for someone to join in with a bitter moaning session about the staff.   These being the staff who have gone well above and beyond during the pandemic to help us.

That made my day.

[Hilltop]

I replied as we have been discussing in here.  I took the remark at face value.  Responded in dead pan way and said "oh, do you think so?  Why do you think that?"

Brilliant, love it, I am definitely taking this one, thanks for the suggestion.  It's great that you stood up for the staff, they have been through so much the past couple of years.

Cats of the Canals - I agree that if you have a rager in the family that silence may work.  My parents don't rage, they are more passive aggressive with put downs etc.  I find that in the past when I have used silence I end up going home feeling bad, like I put up with the abuse.
I tend to freeze and I get really stiff and I know my face gives away everything and my parents then seem to laugh. I don't want to freeze anymore, I want to stand up for myself. 

Hazy I doubt there will be any response to me slowly quietly drifting into NC.  I am already NC with the rest of the family and I can block numbers.  I went NC for 2 years a while back after a really bad experience with them and didn't hear from anyone.  I have an ignoring family.  Sometimes I think I should have kept going but I wasn't ready, I'll see what next year brings.  I haven't seen them since their last weird episode which was mid 2020 and if I see them again and it's still weird there really won't be much left there to hang onto.  If it turns into a weird sort of thing where they don't mention visits and I don't mention visits then I can only imagine that's because no one wants to see each other and at that stage I plan to exit quietly.    In some ways I think this is what will happen. I mean I moved and my mother only wanted to know when I moved, there was nothing from her about our house or really anything, she just had this weird fixation on when I was gone.  I think I am still grappling with the idea that my parents actually don't like me and I think the coming year will be interesting.   I mean I haven't seen them for a  year and a half and there hasn't been anything from them about getting together. If they make no effort like they have been, I already know I won't live with that sort of pain in my life, I will withdraw.

[GentleSoul]

Great discussions in here, thank you everyone.

Picking up on the feeling of if we don't stand up for ourselves then we feel we are letting ourselves down.

Very valid.  I felt the same way originally with late PD husband but then I realised I was honouring and respecting myself more by choosing to not react.  That it is stronger and kinder to myself to choose to protect myself from his mentally ill outlook and his need for conflict all the time by me not engaging. 

That me "standing up" for myself was damaging to me when dealing with a PD person.

I think with people with PD issues in play, we have to do the opposite that we would do with healthy people.  Also the PD person doesn't actually care, they just want a vehicle to have a fight with to let out their inner issues.  Although it may be aimed at me, it is not personal.  They would use any means that came along to take out their inner angst on.

In my experience too, it is the same when dealing with alcoholics.  Late H was both PD & alcoholic.  Remarkable similar attitude and behaviour traits.  Both seem to be looking for a fight all the time either in a covert or overt way.

Grateful to say I have neither in my life now.  Lee xx

[bee well]

Hi Hilltop,

You don't deserve to be treated like that. I'm glad you are taking steps to take care of yourself.

Sorry you and all here are dealing and or have dealt with this. It's extremely tiring.

I find the responses on this thread to be useful validating as well. Thank you all.

Here's my take:

Not responding is usually best for me because I don't want to spend energy calling them out. (I have realized that "standing up for myself" (as GentleSoul writes) is futile if my goal is to be understood, or respected. That won't happen.

I choose carefully which boundaries I enforce, and when.

When I do take a stand, I do it for me, and do my best not to engage. I make sure I have the energy to be strong enough to say my piece and then hold my ground with comments like "well. it doesn't matter what you meant, what you said wasn't nice" or "we see it differently, I can see that won't change.." etc etc. Then I go on broken record mode.

Occasionally I will answer by asking a question about something so far out of the blue that it disarms them and then the conversation turns.

There is no respect for boundaries with the type of people we are describing, they constantly infringe,  and in my experience they will only back off if there is an element of surprise, or if they decide they are finished bullying/baiting for the time being.

Fortunately I don't have to deal with it as much as in years past as I am now in NC on one side of family (not recommending it as a solution, although I'm one of those who was able to start healing because of my decision)  and LC with the other. Inlaw family is still a challenge.

It never ceases to amaze me though, how I can go for a long time between episodes, thinking next time it will be different, and then--boom--they come out of the blue with some covert aggressive absurdity. Sometimes all it takes is a sugar coated snarky email to get me going.

It's good to see you are keeping your toolbox stocked. Deflecting the BS is so much less of a drain when we are mentally prepared. Obviously, that's not always possibile, as our brains are not always on alert because we are busy thinking about other things. (Which is a good thing, as many of us would agree, hypervigilance is exhausting). It would be great to get to a point where the response (or lack of) just came automatically, wouldn't it?

After years of minimizing I have realized there is toxicity everywhere (I shiver to think at what I accepted as normal for most of my years). While it's impossibile to avoid entirely we must reduce it in order to make space for the good in life. I look at it kind of like a diet, what we consume inevitably has an effect on us...To  borrow Feuchsel's tech analogy, "Garbage in, garbage out...."

I have spent much more time in life thinking about all of this than I would like ...One of my goals in '22 is to deal with this issue as efficiently as possible so I can free up more mental space and allow more of the good stuff to flow in.