Feeling like a therapist with a friend

[mary_poppins]

Hi. So I have a friend and we both have PD families. She is not in touch with her family while I am. Idk what to think of her, apart from the fact that she is a kind person but she can rely too much on me emotionally. (& i don't like it)

For example, after we talk online, she says, thanks for the talk it was so helpful.
She says this often as if I somehow provided her with some emotional support/therapy and she benefitted from it. I understand that having no relationship with your PD fam is tough but I struggle with worse things: being in touch with these PD people. I try not to burden her and tell her about my deepest problems with them because, in my opinion that is what therapists are for. She also talks to me about this subject only. PD families and that's it. It is depressing and although I understand that it's our reality, I wanna move on from it.

And btw, I don't look at friends as free therapists or people who just sit there and listen to you. Friends are people you have experiences with and share simple things with. Of course, you also need good friends who you can trust to tell them about your problems but treating them as emotional support systems? No, I don't think it's good.

Am I exaggerating? How are your relationships with friends? Do they rely on your emotionally or expect you to listen to their problems often?

[pianissimo]

This topic is discussed in this forum from time to time under different titles.

I'm in a similar dynamic with a cousin. She also thanks me after our talks, and that bothers me more than the talk itself. Overtime, she also started to rely on me for the kinds of things related to therapy, but I refused that role after I noticed the pattern. For example, when the occasion arose, I made vague general comments, or I said I didn't know what to say.

In our case, there are two potential reasons for her to feel too much for me:

1- I'm introverted, and by the sound of it, she's extroverted. Seems like she needs people, but I need alone time. It's possible this is affecting the pace of our conversations, because as they go on or if they become too frequent, I start to become tired. It's possible she has no idea there are introverted people in the world who start to suffer after spending too much time with people.

2- I think she has codependent tendencies. She likes being needed in her relationships. So, from her perspective, perhaps she thinks I like that she needs me this way, so perhaps she shows this by thanking me. But, this is not how I relate to people. I suppose not to that extent. One thing I noticed is that if I express a different opinion, she's inclined to perceive that as anger or refusal. There was this time, I communicated a boundary, and she became defensive, and JADEd. It felt like we were having a fight, and it felt like I was the aggressor, and, ironically, this kind of made me angry (because I was trying to get out of the conversation), and I became more aggressive, and my comments in relation to what she was talking about became more ruthless and sarcastic (or this is how it felt to me in that emotional context). The conversation became resolved but it was just weird to be in an argument while not really arguing. In general, if I react to her in a way different than what she expects, I think it triggers her (not in an explosive way, she just goes blank for a second, or becomes confused). I suppose this is something that makes me filter what I say and how I say it when I talk to her. So, this dynamic is another possible reason why it bothers me when she thanks me after "a good" conversation. Our conversations are not completely authentic. Because I feel like filtering myself all the time, her appreciation feels manipulative or pointless.

I want to add that, like your friend, my cousin also likes talking about certain topics. She calls me when she's feeling down, and she calls me so that I will lift her mood. But, I think the problem is not about what she does but how she does it. Because, I have friends who feel down, meet up with me, talk about the same problems, and I feel OK with talking to them. When they talk to me, they ask what I think about their problems, some actually force me to be honest with them.  I must say that they also check with me to see if I became overwhelmed. I guess, they also thank me for making time for them, but, their appreciation makes me happy. I guess, in these kinds of meet ups, there is something for both sides. We are either in a cafe, or we are taking a walk. With my cousin, it's a phone call. So, I think it's not the emotional support itself but the way it's done by my cousin that feels too much for me. In the end, I reduced contact with her. Sometimes, we still have conversations that feel fine though.

This is by no means about how a friendship should be. I usually seek reciprocity and consistency. It bothers me if a person who is distant with me expects a commitment from me, or if a friend who meets up for coffee or drinks only expects some kind of big favour. In the end, there is no logic though, I just do what I feel like in the moment. Sometimes it turns out good, sometimes it turns out bad. I like interacting with people in general, and I suppose I end up providing emotional support in a one-sided way, but I think this is because I have access to more resources. I suppose I like emotional support, and I like being able to give it. That is, when I can talk to the person comfortably. So, I think, the emotional support doesn't work well with cousin, because our communication is not so smooth.

[feralcat]

I have had this dynamic played out, but with a sister ... And 'friends', (past tense) as well.

I've come to realise that I have had a bad tendency to people please, in order to try to gain friendship. I was so isolated when young that I never learned how to make healthy relationships outside the Borg ( Or inside). This unfortunately can lead to very one sided relationships, as per support and attention. It made me feel wanted . Whilst in the middle of such interactions I don't think I even cottoned on.

Until I needed support myself, then it's all excuses as to why they can't. Too busy, bad timing, going through a rough patch themselves etc etc etc. And this from people I wouldn't categorise as 'users', tbh. Just unthinking. And I very rarely ask for help. So when I try to, it's a crisis. So a double whammy.

It's hard. Hard to stop yourself, hard to try to become not that person any more. I'm over wary , nowadays. But that's ok.
And hard for THEM to accept you've changed. That you won't fulfil that role any more.
What happened when I challenged the status quo, even in a minor way ( not even asking for reciprocity, but not being there for them on tap)? ......silence. After a bit of hoovering of course, and expressions of annoyance. The classic extinction burst. No attempt to discuss why, no self awareness.

That's when you realise that your only value was in how useful you were.
Their loss.
I'm sorry, it's a process. And as you can tell from Pianissimo's post, it's a journey many  of us have to travel. But I think it's worthwhile, if only because it highlights for us the part we ourselves play in all of this. That relationships are transactional, and we have to learn new steps if we want to get better in the dance.

[mary_poppins]

Pianissimo-I'm sorry about your cousin. It sounds like she is using your for emotional support. I find it so odd that she thanks you at the end of the conversation because my friend does it, too. She again told me how helpful I am to her. Ughh..sorry but I'm not a therapist, nor I intend to become one.
I guess limiting the contact is a good solution to this.

Feralcat-I know what you're saying, that we learned that relationships should be transactional. But this friend has the exact same childhood as mine, she was abused in almost similar ways. She understands how painful one-way relationships are yet, she's engaging in one herself.

I have good relationships, too but this is a new friend. I really wanted to grow more and make new friends but I seem to attract people who want me to be there for them emotionally and that's it. I guess I need to let this one go and seek new friends in other communities that are not related to abuse/healing and recovery (I met her in one of those communities).

[BefuddledClarity]

Am I exaggerating? How are your relationships with friends? Do they rely on your emotionally or expect you to listen to their problems often?

No, you're not exaggerating. It's not your job to fix someone's emotional problems. I say this as someone who had a [gay] friend in college that constantly told me he wanted to commit suicide and how his (immigrant) family doesn't accept him[his family is full of PDs] etc etc.

I understand where he's coming from based on my own background[I like both men and women...I thought I was gay for the longest time((my PDparents HATED that
I "look" gay and wanted to throw me out of the house)), until my late teens-early adult years, I guess I like men too lmao...and I have an immigrant parent((my PDmother))].  Anyways, former college friend would call and text me EVERYDAY about hanging out and venting, but also acted like a jerk to me if I don't react how he wants me to...

After awhile, I told him has he considered seeing a therapist? Because then he can get professional help and an unbiased answer[of course as a friend, I'll see things a different way than a therapist would]. His answer? "It's better to talk to friends, because they understand me better than a stranger could." [Even though therapists are certified to help, and regular Joe's like me aren't. ] I stopped talking to him when he got mad at me for not answering his text message right away and he went off on me...But that was years ago.

To be honest, this is why I have a hard time keeping friends...

I end up being everyone's "rock", the listening ear. I don't mind to be that occasionally, but if it's constant then...I slowly start to slip away.

When I had a car, a lot of my younger (former) coworker friends would want to "hangout", but really they need a ride...

I'm also the type to pay for my friends quite often, mostly because I'm the one inviting them out or just taking care of them[ex. They had a bad day, I take them out for a treat]...but sometimes I feel like it gets abused, and I don't want to hangout anymore.

The most recent (former coworker) friend I have is in a verbally abusive relationship with her boyfriend. I've been there, done that [I left my physically, financially, and verbally abusive PDex who's my son's dad]. So, I've given advice and such but...I feel like she only wants to hangout to get away from him OR to have a wall to cover her[aka, me ... He's only nice when I'm around].

Also, he lives at HER house, or rather, her mother's house...who friend mentioned her mother has been verbally abusive as well to friend...Her mother has offered already to kick the boyfriend out to help friend, but friend feels bad for boyfriend [even though he used to live with his mother too, it's not like he'd be on the streets]...

Anyways, I'm rambling haha.
I'll just say I feel you on this and can relate.

I'm not...SUPER close to said friend and no longer work the same job, so it's just easier for me to phase out. I lost contact with most work type friends, since I've been changing jobs like underwear lately. Trying to get away from toxic environments and find a job in my field[tech] or where there's little supervision.

If this was a friend I've known for years, I'd be blunt and tell them to cut the shit. This guy I'm currently seeing...I'm pretty blunt with him on anything that bothers me. I don't like to play mind games, and I like direct answers. I'm also from the country...so I'm unsure if that's part of it too, now I live in the city and it feels like a different world of trying to understand people...

Anywho...

TLDR;
I guess it just depends on what level of friendship/relationship you have with someone. I'd say either recommend that she see a professional, communicate that the topic of PDs is tiring for you, as you're currently living it and don't want to hear about it, or...slowly cut her off if she doesn't respect your boundaries.

My tolerance has gotten lower the older I've become...So, I'm more likely to cut people off easier [not saying it's necessarily a good thing, but it's not really a bad thing either...some people are just incompatible as friends, I'm not compatible with the people I cut off].

[1footouttadefog]

I think it's okay to have different friends who serve different purposes in your life. 

Some will be quazi therapists for each other's , others maybe hobby related only, others share religious interests, others work related chatter and others travel partners. 

[Mintstripes]

You're right, some people are just not compatible as friends. I'm trying to phase someone out because she deeply annoys me. Sometimes it's hard to even do a slow fade. I don't have the emotional wherewithal for a conflict/big friend breakup.

I'd communicate to her that while you understand the difficulty of having PD family, you don't want to discuss it all the time because it drains you. If she's using you as a sounding board/free therapy, she'll ditch you and find someone else to vent to. I've had these types of friendships play out in the past and no longer tolerate them.

[moglow]

She also talks to me about this subject only. PD families and that's it. It is depressing and although I understand that it's our reality, I wanna move on from it.

It may be that's your only common ground left and you're the only one she can talk to about it. But still, not your stuff to carry. Maybe start with gently changing the subject. Hear her out for a bit then refocus elsewhere.

Friendships absolutely change and we can outgrow them over time. Sometimes the very thing that brought us together is what ultimately drives a harder wedge between.

[DistanceNotDefense]

I'm late to this but related to it a lot.

I've been on both sides - thanking others for listening to me, and also receiving the thanks. Being thanked is not the most triggering aspect to me of how things feel imbalanced or "transactional" in a one-sided friendship, but I see what you mean.

Maybe she *is* aware of bending your ear by saying thank you, at the very least? I wonder if you brought it up to her honestly, that you were irritated this was how things were, what she would say.

I had a friend like this recently that I just had to do a friendship "breakup" with. It was the opposite: I'd just gone NC, she was still enmeshed. She wouldn't EVER say thank you for messaging/emailing me out of the blue, delivering all her problems and worries to me in a nearly wrapped package, and then going silent/unavailable for weeks/months if I contacted her. (Not that I expected thanks, but she seemed highly unaware this was all she was reaching out to me for).

She was dismissive of my grief at the very start of my NC but found the patterns she refused to break with her own dysfunctional family (she was being severely scapegoated and I could tell it was crippling her) far more important to talk about, and went out of her way to avoid talking about mine - then when I confronted her about it she said she had no problem with it.

That is so heavy that that is ALL your friend wants to talk about! I don't think you're exaggerating. It could also mean that you're naturally a very good listener.

I've experienced the same thing many a time in my relationships - it only dawned on me this year that I'm a better listener than most other people and this may be why I run into the same pattern. Not only because I'm quiet and private, and don't share details about myself right away. I also ask insightful questions, give validating and thoughtful feedback on what people say, etc. and I didn't even realize this was rare.

I also didn't realize that sometimes, when you meet people for the first time and they *seem* like really good listeners and eager to validate you, that that may actually be lovebombing or codependent people-pleasing...and then that trait goes away People who are naturally wanting to listen and keep it up? Few and far between.

If you think you might be a good listener, trying to put boundaries around that is something I'm trying to do and that's helping me.

[mary_poppins]

I told her about being drained by the discussions around our parents. She understood. So it was just me being weary of having made another toxic friend. 
Anyway, things are good and hopefully they stay good.

Thanks, guys.
Sorry if this thread is old. As you can imagine, it takes time to confront someone, especially if you have a history of abuse behind you.