Really rethinking past with MIL

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There have been some conflict events with MIL that I've never really digested, but I always knew what they were. But lately I've been thinking of things here and there that I never really paid attention to, that I instantly let go of and never held her accountable for.

These are not really big deals but they have been coming up in my mind in a new way.

For example, I was musing about the first time I met her. It was a chance meeting in a public place and she was with my future H. She was completely dismissive when H attempted to introduce me to her. It was like he was introducing her to the cashier or something.

I wrote it off as she was distracted, or maybe STBH had never mentioned me to her before, or whatever. So I just cheerfully told her it was lovely to meet her and let her get back on with whatever all important thing she was doing.

Does she feel embarrassed she treated her future DIL that way? HELL NO. In fact the expectation was that I would EARN her approval, and she continually made it clear that I was at best on very thin ice and at worst a total failure.

Why did she feel entitled to that and never consider whether SHE would be acceptable to ME?

I'm angry and I like it. She has been childish, selfish, demanding, unpleasant, and no prize for me to win.

Let HER worry about whether she offended ME. I DON'T CARE ANYMORE.

She keeps people in line by throwing huge tantrums and will never ever let you forget things. For 10 years she rehashed one event every year, and if she had wine it would get ugly. I'd hate to offend her and pay, year after year after year.

I'm done. I've offended her, big whoop. She's not worth me caring about.

[bloomie]

Why did she feel entitled to that and never consider whether SHE would be acceptable to ME?

I'm angry and I like it. She has been childish, selfish, demanding, unpleasant, and no prize for me to win.

this very well may be one of the best things I have read in a long time!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I unknowingly married into a family system dominated by haughty, rivalrous, manipulative, drama bound females. I can relate very closely with that moment when you realize

[hellslilangel]

Wow, I feel like I could have written this regarding my MIL. Mine always seemed superficially excited by me but now I realize as things have progressing gotten worse with her behavior towards me, she never believed I would stay around and didn't expected the engagement, marriage and now having children. I'm getting to the point now where I could care so little to her feelings or even being bothered by her outbursts. I'm not going anywhere. She can figuratively kick and scream all she wants I am happily married her to her and her son is in love with me and our family. She holds no weight in our marriage and that makes her melt in envy. It's her choice to act as she does and it's my choice to completely ignore her antics.

I'm proud of you! It's a hard finish like to make when dealing with people like the ones we have orbiting around us.

[square]

Bloomie, thanks for your feedback, and sorry you relate.

HLA, the part about MIL never believing there would be an engagement, marriage, children kind of reminds me of the phone call H madd to his mother when I went into labor. He started by asking rhetorically and excitedly "so are you ready to be a grandmother??" and her response was a flat, sour "no." That's another thing I shrugged off, I don't know why. The goal is to shrug it off but I did it in a bad way, excusing her rather than accepting she is a selfish person. My H has been super clear on her and while he didn't confront her on that one, he did not excuse her either.

I asked H recently about the icy introduction I described above. He didn't really remember it but said other girlfriends got similar treatment, and there was one, of a different culture than MIL, that got even more overtly rude treatment.

He believes his mother wanted him to stay single so she could keep his labor all to herself. She felt entitled to having him at her beck and call for projects around the house.

There were two major conflicts that happened soon after he met me. Both were about her entitlement to his labor, and one was quite explicit where she tied a certain financial contribution in exchange for his continued compliance. However, it wasn't even a choice in MIL's eyes, as when he declined the financial offer all hell broke loose.

H was way ahead of me on this, I barely even understood what was going on. He saw it all and was determined to break free. He still struggles with guilt and obligation but his anger overrides them both. Unfortunately he is still stuck in anger but he really did good, and no thanks to me either, as I was afraid to cross MIL.

[Cat of the Canals]

Wow, square. Our husbands and their relationship to their mothers really do sound similar. He's always kept her at arm's length and has never made excuses for her. If he'd had the language for it, he would have recognized and labelled her as "disordered" from early childhood.

And yet it still took me years to realize how "off" she really is, despite his history and the mountain of evidence I witnessed myself. Like you said, things would happen, I'd know they were wrong/abusive in the moment, but somehow I'd let them go. It was a long time before I started collecting them into a big enough pile to say, "Something is very wrong here." And when I finally did that, my husband was like, "Duh?"

One thing about my MIL is she's almost never been outright hostile to me. Lots of little passive aggressive things, but nothing I'd call cruel. But I've still seen what she's capable of firsthand. When I first met her, she had this habit of making these horrible comments to my BIL when we'd go to visit her. I remember wishing that he'd demand we leave, but he always just went silent and would avoid her the rest of the visit. Knowing what I know now, I'm guessing he was having a "freeze" response. I still regret not standing up and saying, "We're leaving."

It's definitely a freeing feeling when you get to a place of genuinely not caring what they think.

[hellslilangel]

Wow, square. Our husbands and their relationship to their mothers really do sound similar. He's always kept her at arm's length and has never made excuses for her. If he'd had the language for it, he would have recognized and labelled her as "disordered" from early childhood.

And yet it still took me years to realize how "off" she really is, despite his history and the mountain of evidence I witnessed myself. Like you said, things would happen, I'd know they were wrong/abusive in the moment, but somehow I'd let them go. It was a long time before I started collecting them into a big enough pile to say, "Something is very wrong here." And when I finally did that, my husband was like, "Duh?"

This made me feel more sane (recently I've been judging my own judgment of my MIL's character, but my husband was similar when I finally vented about his mom. He has never been "close" in terms of emotionally available for her and sadly it's because it's not reciprocate. He admitted to me he realized in his preteens/early teenage years his mom was different. He just started creating distance and my MIL just continues to force herself at him and he just doesn't care. My parents live in another state and he talks to them more and jokes around with my mom when I'm chatting her. My MIL envies it a lot because my husband has told her he prefers my family over her (his parents are divorced and we don't have issues with him or his wife they have always been kind to us and helpful without expecting anything in return).

[NarcKiddo]

Luckily for me my husband had long escaped his mother's clutches by the time we got married. She is a right piece of work but saves the worst of it for her daughters these days. My husband does what he sees as his duty by his mother but no more.

Also luckily for me I never fell into the trap of wanting MIL to be a mother substitute. I sorely need one, in some ways, but I married young and was still totally in the FOG as regards my own mother. So at least I was not opening myself to abuse from MIL as well as my mother.

An old friend of mine (well, he is not longer a friend of mine as my mother took him over long ago but she keeps me up to date on his situation) is the only son of a narc mother and she has systematically ruined every relationship he has ever had. It is terribly sad, and I feel sorry for the mother of his children who was very badly treated by his mother.

Square - I am really happy that your H recognises his mother for what she is and is strong for himself and you. These things are not easy. And I can see why you were afraid to cross MIL, because when it is not your parent you have your spouse to consider as well as yourself. My poor H has trodden a difficult path for years because he has always disliked my narc mother (and she him) but I was very volatile in my reactions when I was in the worst of the FOG. Sometimes he could point out a problem and I would accept it. Other times he could point out something and I would fly off the handle in her defence.

I sometimes think about the cultures where it is customary for the DIL to move in with her husband and his parents. Imagine how awful that could be if the parents are narcs!

[treesgrowslowly]

What I've learned...

When a healing DIL encounters a drama queen / traumatized MIL, the result is misery. The DIL who enters into her relationship full of hope for a good set of relations with her new relations, will be subject to whatever maturation stages that the MIL has (or has not gone through). MIL could be living on crumbs of attention in her own marriage. Enter the DIL who has no idea how unhappy her MIL truly is.

I am convinced, that when MIL is happy in her own marriage, she can be happy for her son, and his new life as a husband and father. If MIL is not happy in her own marriage / life, she cannot be happy for anyone - especially her DIL.

A wise DIL will learn to assess whether her MIL is capable of anything except the superficial, or anything except the damaging, drama-filled attention seeking behaviours of an immature child. And the wise DIL relates to her accordingly.

An unhappy MIL will consistency refuse to repair rifts and or to grow into more patience or understanding with anyone around her. And she tries to make everyone pay for it. It sucks!

Trees

[square]

Wow, square. Our husbands and their relationship to their mothers really do sound similar. He's always kept her at arm's length and has never made excuses for her. If he'd had the language for it, he would have recognized and labelled her as "disordered" from early childhood.

And yet it still took me years to realize how "off" she really is, despite his history and the mountain of evidence I witnessed myself. Like you said, things would happen, I'd know they were wrong/abusive in the moment, but somehow I'd let them go. It was a long time before I started collecting them into a big enough pile to say, "Something is very wrong here." And when I finally did that, my husband was like, "Duh?"

One thing about my MIL is she's almost never been outright hostile to me. Lots of little passive aggressive things, but nothing I'd call cruel. But I've still seen what she's capable of firsthand. When I first met her, she had this habit of making these horrible comments to my BIL when we'd go to visit her. I remember wishing that he'd demand we leave, but he always just went silent and would avoid her the rest of the visit. Knowing what I know now, I'm guessing he was having a "freeze" response. I still regret not standing up and saying, "We're leaving."

It's definitely a freeing feeling when you get to a place of genuinely not caring what they think.

Yes, our husbands seem similar in their insights to their mothers.

I thought MIL was never overtly hostile to me but I realize now I was wrong. I just excused a lot.

My husband clings to me when we visit her. He is not touchy feely, we don't hug or anything, but when we're there he suddenly has his arm around me a lot, like I'm a protective barrier.

[square]

Luckily for me my husband had long escaped his mother's clutches by the time we got married. She is a right piece of work but saves the worst of it for her daughters these days. My husband does what he sees as his duty by his mother but no more.

Also luckily for me I never fell into the trap of wanting MIL to be a mother substitute. I sorely need one, in some ways, but I married young and was still totally in the FOG as regards my own mother. So at least I was not opening myself to abuse from MIL as well as my mother.

An old friend of mine (well, he is not longer a friend of mine as my mother took him over long ago but she keeps me up to date on his situation) is the only son of a narc mother and she has systematically ruined every relationship he has ever had. It is terribly sad, and I feel sorry for the mother of his children who was very badly treated by his mother.

Square - I am really happy that your H recognises his mother for what she is and is strong for himself and you. These things are not easy. And I can see why you were afraid to cross MIL, because when it is not your parent you have your spouse to consider as well as yourself. My poor H has trodden a difficult path for years because he has always disliked my narc mother (and she him) but I was very volatile in my reactions when I was in the worst of the FOG. Sometimes he could point out a problem and I would accept it. Other times he could point out something and I would fly off the handle in her defence.

I sometimes think about the cultures where it is customary for the DIL to move in with her husband and his parents. Imagine how awful that could be if the parents are narcs!

Yeah, I think about those cultures too, and shudder. So much potential for abuse.

Yes, it is a blessing my husband recognizes the problems with his mother and did so very early on. I wish I could say the same for myself. We met in college so the crisis of him breaking free of her ownership of him and the labor she felt he owed her in exchange for doing her basic duties as a parent, happened at the same time as he met me. While I don't credit myself with being of the slightest help to him on that front, I think the simple fact of our relationship gave him a foundation to draw the line with her - he had someplace else to go, someone else to spend time with.

[Pepin]

Does she feel embarrassed she treated her future DIL that way? HELL NO. In fact the expectation was that I would EARN her approval, and she continually made it clear that I was at best on very thin ice and at worst a total failure.

Why did she feel entitled to that and never consider whether SHE would be acceptable to ME?

I'm angry and I like it. She has been childish, selfish, demanding, unpleasant, and no prize for me to win.

Can totally relate... and as you mentioned in a response,

He believes his mother wanted him to stay single so she could keep his labor all to herself. She felt entitled to having him at her beck and call for projects around the house.

Once she realized I was busy with our kids, she moved in on DH and reclaimed him.  He complied, particularly because she was becoming elderly and then eventually a widow. 

What I also find interesting is that she never really seemed content in her own marriage....it was out of convenience?  She turned to DH for things she should have been turning to FIL for -- and if she did and he said NO, she would bounce it back to DH and get her way.  DH was in essence her back up husband and I was clearly in her way.

Up until her death, she made zero attempts at any sort of reparation.  No accountability for her own personal behavior that DH sheepishly brushed under the rug for her out of obligation.  Since she's been gone, she rarely gets mentioned....

At first I thought she was acceptable.  Then she started to get icy when DH and I were serious.  After that, she would get icy again with jabs here and there to test me.  I feel as though our entire relationship was her trying to play games with me.  Childish.  Towards the end she was hardly acceptable to me.  I was disgusted to be in her presence and how she treated my husband, our children and extended family.  Sadly, she treated herself the worst and that's why she took it out on anyone that had what she didn't have.   

[xredshoesx]

my MIL told my DH at 5 that he was always  going to take care of her after she divorced his biological father.  multiple times, even after she remarried, he stepped in to 'help the family' as the oldest.  MIL doesn't seem to approve of any of her children's spouses and i'm sure i'm no exception. the one thing she doesn't do around me she does around the other ILs is verbally run the other inlaws down.....

she got really mad at me a few years back bc i said she couldn't live with us part of the year when her 2nd husband died.  i think she went 18 months without speaking or making eye contact with me.  it was bliss.