Therapy with PD Mom

[intothewest26]

So this morning I had family counseling with my PD M. I have heard that if people with narcissistic personality disorder go to therapy it's usually with a motive or to paint themselves in a certain light and that's what I think is going on here.

She twisted the truth and my words repeatedly, tried to make herself look good, tried to make herself look like a great, caring mother to the therapist, and denies my N grandmother being abusive. She said "I don't know my mom to be like that" in reference to her being verbally abusive when she has been present and standing right there to witness the verbal abuse many times. She also tried to say she had "invested money in different lands" about the fact that she spent over 100k which is just a straight up lie, she just spent it all.

I don't know if I'm going to get anywhere with her in therapy at all because she's so focused on changing the truth to fit her narrative to the point I think she manipulated the therapist a couple of times.

Anyone have experience with this?

[moglow]

I haven't even considered therapy with mommie dearest. It was hard enough for me to come to grips with the fact we have no relationship other than mother/daughter and she resents even that.
Were it me, I'd have to consider what *my* goals were for that therapy other than doing it to pander to mother. Am I wanting to build a relationship with her or understand why we are where we are [and thereby absolve her of all culpability for her own behavior]? My thought is, the idea of joint therapy implies that both people have a common goal and need a referee of sorts to help them find their way. Do you? Are you going because mom bullied you into it?  Just some things to consider!

[Leonor]

Yeah, I went to therapy with  my mom once.

As in, one time.

But I did what I went there to do, which is stand in my truth and not cave to her
nonsense or worry if I was right or kind or justified or fair, and say everything I wanted to say: the good, the bad, the ugly, the grief, the mad, and even the hope.

Did it "work"? That depends. My mother didn't change. She didn't show any willingness to consider or accept or, really, even listen to me. In fact, she got up and walked out and I haven't heard from her since.

But I heard me. I heard me say out loud every thing I wanted to say, to stand up for myself, to refuse to doubt or gaslight myself, or make excuses or twist myself in knots to try to understand someone else's point of view. I wasn't mad or sad. I felt real compassion for her, because I could see in her, and me, past generations all #€#& up and traumatized. I invited her into that space of insight and compassion, and she wasn't able to join me.

But that doesn't mean the therapy session failed, or that I failed or even she failed. Now I look back and see that actually, I did accomplish what I had set out to do. I stepped into my adult self, and my mother released me into my own life.

And no matter how excruciating and awful and confusing it was in the moment, and it was all of those things, it's kind of what parents and adult children are meant to do. I would rather it didn't come about through decades of abuse and trauma, but it did come about. In that way, yes, therapy with my mom did work.

[intothewest26]

Really the only reason I even considered group therapy was because I was hoping a third party would help her see her current boyfriend is dangerous. But I'm realizing maybe she's the only one who can realize, or not realize, that. Then she started saying she would only discuss my abuse memories in therapy which I'm now thinking is very underhanded.

That sounds really freeing to stand up for yourself in that way. That's a great take on it; I think. I did some of that today too, and most of it was well received by the therapist but she did make a couple comments I didn't like much. I guess she has to be neutral, but it came off like she couldn't really see what was going on.

She did ask my mom some good questions but I'm not sure at all my mom is able to hear it. I may not continue long term.

[TimetoHeal]

HI, into

I have never attempted therapy with my mother (it seems like it would torture), but I did with my ex-uNPD husband.  It was torture.  He got the therapist on his side after one session.  He did the same thing with our pastor after I met with the pastor first in desperation, and pastor seemed to understand and empathize with what I was going through.  Poof.  All gone in one session when my ex met with us.  So, I generally don't think it can ever work well in your favor.  I've read a LOT about narcissism, and everything I have read says that martial counseling with one is a bad idea.  I have not read that specific advice when it comes to a narcissistic parent, but I would imagine it would go about the same. 

Hugs to you and at least you tried.  You can always decide not to continue. 

[intothewest26]

Gosh. Sorry you went through that. Sounds kind of like what I'm going through.

I guess a therapist trained in NPD might me helpful but those seem to be few and far between and I'm not really sure it worth it at this point

[olivegirl]

I could not get through a single interaction with my uBpd mother or uNpd father without either of them lying and/or playing the victim.

So therapy obviously would be a no go.

I think therapy has a chance of working when there is a communication problem.

My parents know they are lying and gaslighting.  They do not want to communicate more effectively.

What we have is a respect problem.

My parents want to dominate and control and for me to understand that I am to be subservient to them bc that works for them.  They do not want harmony.  They want to win.

[JustKathy]

Hi intothewest,

The only time I ever went to a therapist with my Nmother was when I was a teenager, and it was set up. She played the victim .... sat there with tears in her eyes and painted this picture of a loving mother who was desperately trying her help her troubled daughter. At the time, I had no idea what NPD was. All I knew was that I was being abused and wanted it to end. I took a huge chance and spoke up. I told the psychiatrist what my mother was doing to me and begged for help. The psychiatrist thought I was being dramatic and sided with my mother. She looked me square in the eye and said, "I can't help you if you're just going to make up stories." My mother grabbed me by the arm and dragged me out of there. I left home not long after that.

As an adult, I never once thought about asking her to go to therapy because I knew what would happen, based on that past experience. Narcs are always the victim and you're the one who's mistreating them. They will never admit to being at fault. They can also be incredibly convincing so you're probably right in your suspicion that your Nmother has manipulated the therapist. To my experience, finding a therapist with expert knowledge of NPD is near impossible, so any attempt at getting help for a narc parent just isn't going to pan out, especially when the narc doesn't want help in the first place. In their mind, the only one with a problem is YOU.

[JustKathy]

Hi intothewest,

The only time I ever went to a therapist with my Nmother was when I was a teenager, and it was set up. She played the victim .... sat there with tears in her eyes and painted this picture of a loving mother who was desperately trying her help her troubled daughter. At the time, I had no idea what NPD was. All I knew was that I was being abused and wanted it to end. I took a huge chance and spoke up. I told the psychiatrist what my mother was doing to me and begged for help. The psychiatrist thought I was being dramatic and sided with my mother. She looked me square in the eye and said, "I can't help you if you're just going to make up stories." My mother grabbed me by the arm and dragged me out of there. I left home not long after that.

As an adult, I never once thought about asking her to go to therapy because I knew what would happen, based on that past experience. Narcs are always the victim and you're the one who's mistreating them. They will never admit to being at fault. They can also be incredibly convincing so you're probably right in your suspicion that your Nmother has manipulated the therapist. To my experience, finding a therapist with expert knowledge of NPD is near impossible, so any attempt at getting help for a narc parent just isn't going to pan out, especially when the narc doesn't want help in the first place. In their mind, the only one with a problem is YOU.