Abuse out of love?

[littlelimabean]

I had written a letter to my mother a few days ago, explaining to her how much I love her, how much I respect her, and that I think she might have a personality disorder. It was all from love I told her, and I didn't lie. I felt like she could get help.

She looked grave at first and then went away for a day or two to think. She came back and read me a letter.

I am trying not to think too much of my mother and what she has. Borderline, narcissistic, etc. I refuse to. It isn't my job to figure out what she has even though I love her.

In her letter, I recognize she generalized some things in the past and said things that made me question how bad things were. It confused me a bit, but I know even with my faulty foggy memory that I was abused definitely in the form of parentification, coercive-ness, and emmeshment. That much I know.

Anyway, she was telling me that she tried her best and she didn't have many examples in her life. She was controlling over me because she was scared of losing me. She saw all her friends' kids become far gone and she was afraid I would go just like them. She would freak out because that's the last thing she wanted for me.

She says she will try to become better. There was sincerity in her voice.

However, I am bit nervous because it is time for me to go shopping soon. My mother is extremely particular in how I dress. I want to wear non-baggy pants and a top. I want to have a bit of waist emphasis. Basically, I don't want to look like a trash bag. This is one the areas my mother is still controlling in. It is so bad that I have full on sobs and panic attacks in malls to wear the clothes I want (I never do get the clothes my mother doesn't like). My mother is conservative so I think she views is as a step away from safety...?

So, I will see. I was considering just wearing what she wants because I have a feeling she will flip out, but I think I will wear what I want. She says she is going to try so I will see.

Still, I feel so sad around my mother. She says every single thing she did to me was out of love. I believe it to be true nowadays, but I think this is just a general statement. I don't remember everything, but I remember my emotions. Not all of it was love, most of it was fear.

To continue, I want a skin deep relationship with my mother. I don't want anything beneath the throat. I want to love her still. I want to respect her still, but I don't want anything deep anymore. I am just sad when I am around her.

Thank you for listening. I appreciate it <3

[Cat of the Canals]

There's a quote by bell hooks that touches on this -- I think I originally saw it here but can't find who posted it. But here's the quote:

"When we understand love as the will to nurture our own and another's spiritual growth, it becomes clear that we cannot claim to love if we are hurtful and abusive. Love and abuse cannot coexist. Abuse and neglect are, by definition, the opposites of nurturance and care...."

I suppose it's somewhat of an academic argument when it comes to the actual conversation with your mother, but I think you nailed it when you said it was fear more than it was love. And was it truly fear of losing you or was it fear of losing control over you? There's a difference, and I'm not sure most PDs know what it is.

The clothing issue might serve as a litmus test, of sorts. Should she put up a fight over what clothes you want to wear, do you think she'd respond positively if you reminded her of your letter/discussion?

However things go from here, I think it was enormously brave of you to write that letter.

[littlelimabean]

There's a quote by bell hooks that touches on this -- I think I originally saw it here but can't find who posted it. But here's the quote:

"When we understand love as the will to nurture our own and another's spiritual growth, it becomes clear that we cannot claim to love if we are hurtful and abusive. Love and abuse cannot coexist. Abuse and neglect are, by definition, the opposites of nurturance and care...."

I suppose it's somewhat of an academic argument when it comes to the actual conversation with your mother, but I think you nailed it when you said it was fear more than it was love. And was it truly fear of losing you or was it fear of losing control over you? There's a difference, and I'm not sure most PDs know what it is.

The clothing issue might serve as a litmus test, of sorts. Should she put up a fight over what clothes you want to wear, do you think she'd respond positively if you reminded her of your letter/discussion?

However things go from here, I think it was enormously brave of you to write that letter.

Thank you for replying. I appreciate the support.

I think it is more fear and control. She says she scared and doesn't want me to be swallowed up by the world and its shadows.

About the letter, I made a mistake and said she might have narcissistic personality disorder when now it is becoming more and more clear that it is probably BPD.

I am struggling with figuring out whether or not I should bother. Telling her wouldn't be for me. It would be for her. You know the Maybe if she knew about BPD, she would change.

I think I will chill and process for me. Learn about it fr a daughter's perspective FOR MYSELF. It is so hard separating myself from my mom. I will continue to try.

[Granny May]

About the letter, I made a mistake and said she might have narcissistic personality disorder when now it is becoming more and more clear that it is probably BPD.

I don't think that really matters.  That's for a professional to decide.  You've stated your feelings in what sounds to have been a very loving way, and perhaps best to just leave it there?

I think I will chill and process for me. Learn about it fr a daughter's perspective FOR MYSELF. It is so hard separating myself from my mom. I will continue to try.

I feel for you as you try to figure out what's best for you, while you're trying not to hurt your mother.  But you are the important person here.  If you don't care for yourself it doesn't sound as if your mother is doing that.  That is your own job now.  And you're right about your clothing choices too, you should be able to make your own decisions without criticism.  Maybe you could wear what you choose, but take a baggy blouse to put over the top if *you* start to feel uncomfortable?

[littlelimabean]

About the letter, I made a mistake and said she might have narcissistic personality disorder when now it is becoming more and more clear that it is probably BPD.

I don't think that really matters.  That's for a professional to decide.  You've stated your feelings in what sounds to have been a very loving way, and perhaps best to just leave it there?

I think I will chill and process for me. Learn about it fr a daughter's perspective FOR MYSELF. It is so hard separating myself from my mom. I will continue to try.

I feel for you as you try to figure out what's best for you, while you're trying not to hurt your mother.  But you are the important person here.  If you don't care for yourself it doesn't sound as if your mother is doing that.  That is your own job now.  And you're right about your clothing choices too, you should be able to make your own decisions without criticism.  Maybe you could wear what you choose, but take a baggy blouse to put over the top if *you* start to feel uncomfortable?

Thank you for your input!! I will let that diagnosis thing go and wear what's comfy for me. I read your recent post and related to it so much. I was shaking so much as well when I spoke up. We will get through our paths! I believe in each of us

To be honest, I am still managing my facial expressions and speech to not upset my mom. She has been really nice lately, but I am seeing some teeny tiny cracks when I don't control myself.  I mean, it is amazing she is being so loving, but it's overpowering and sudden like someone walking past you with strong, stinging perfume.  I am not enforcing any boundaries. I just don't want to mess up this love I am getting I guess. It's messed up now that I am writing about it.

I am accepting her love, but I can't help to be cautious.

[Granny May]

Thank you for your input!! I will let that diagnosis thing go and wear what's comfy for me. I read your recent post and related to it so much. I was shaking so much as well when I spoke up. We will get through our paths! I believe in each of us

To be honest, I am still managing my facial expressions and speech to not upset my mom. She has been really nice lately, but I am seeing some teeny tiny cracks when I don't control myself.  I mean, it is amazing she is being so loving, but it's overpowering and sudden like someone walking past you with strong, stinging perfume.  I am not enforcing any boundaries. I just don't want to mess up this love I am getting I guess. It's messed up now that I am writing about it.

I am accepting her love, but I can't help to be cautious.

You're welcome and sorry to have been so long to reply.  Life gets in the way.  I'm really glad that you're working on what's best for you.  It's a long journey that we each travel at our own speed - and that's the best way.  Nobody can or should push you beyond your own comfort.  Nobody here is.  They all seem super supportive and compassionate and it's so helpful.

If you're having to 'manage your facial expressions' to keep your mother from misbehaving, she's still managing to control you.  You're right to say that it's messed up and I'm really happy that you can see what's going on once you write your feelings down.  I've done so much 'free writing' over the years.  Just get paper and pen, or computer, and let your words flow through your fingers without any analysis so that your true thoughts can come to the forefront.  Then you can read it back afterwards, add/delete/'polish up' what you've written and it will blow your mind to find out what you really think behind your own barrier of what you 'ought to' think.  It's a long journey, sadly, but it's wonderful that you've found this forum for support along the way