Just processing an unexpected conversation

[Associate of Daniel]

My ds is turning 18 in a week!  Therefore court orders will no longer be valid and there will be (as far as I can tell) even less reason for me to have any contact with his uNPD father and uNPD smother.

When ds finished primary school 5 years ago, the uNPD smother had a bit of a meltdown, lashing out at me about the fact that my family essentially had been ignoring her at school events. (She was right, they had, for good reason.)  I've had a trauma response to that incident ever since, especially when attending the place where it happened. 

I think she had unconsciously realised that the times when my family would be attending school events was now going to be greatly diminished since secondary school would not have as many occasions to attend.  She therefore was going to lose supply.

Then about 3 years later, ds stopped playing basketball.  So uNPD exH had a meltdown, demanding that we start to acknowledge each others' presence and talk to each other whenever we're with ds.  It was odd that he'd been accepting and participating in the non acknowledgment for years and now wanted to when we were no longer going to be seeing each other nearly every weekend.

Again, I think he unconsciously realised that there were not going to be as many occasions for us to be in each other's presence so he was going to be losing supply.

Well, I just received an unexpected knock on my door.  I should have known who it was by the style of the knock - loud, insistent and determined.

Who should it be but the uNPD smother.

She wanted to talk to me about Ds's birthday.  I thought for a minute she was going to "invite" (insist) that I attend the celebration they are having for him next week, but no. (thankfully)

She wanted to tell me of a pre inheritance ds will be receiving from her father (Ds's step grandfather) on his birthday and to tell me of the stipulations that would be coming with it.  I think she thought I should be grateful for her father giving the money to ds (I guess I am.) and that I should be impressed by the amounts involved. (I'm not particularly, since his other grandfather (my dad) has much the same amount to give away.). I think she also thought that I would demand ds handle the money "my way".

To my mind, it's none of my business.  And, whilst I will advise ds on how I think the money should be handled, if he wishes to discuss it with me, it's entirely up to him what he does with it. I will refer him back to her and her family each time.  It has nothing to do with me.

She drove for an hour or so to my house to tell me this.  I didn't see her car and I had only been home for about 5 minutes before she knocked on the door, so I'm guessing she was lying in wait.

Here are some points she made during the conversation.

She considers her telling me of the inheritance a courtesy that she expects will be returned if/when ds receives an inheritance from my family. (Ds will be 18 or more.  It will not be my place to tell anyone of an inheritance he receives from anyone.  That's entirely up to him.)

She said that the money he's receiving on his birthday will probably go towards a car and is a @#$% load more than I can put towards it. (Her words) (She's right, but... relevance?)

She decided to see me in person because she didn't want to put the news in an email because I don't answer emails. (She's right. I only answer the non abusive ones, of which there are few. And I limit the number of words I use.)

She said something about presents - I didn't understand it.  She said I'd written in an email years ago something about equal amounts being spent on presents.  I don't know.  I have no recollection of such a conversation. And relevance?  Just another dig I suppose.

Then the 2nd reason for her communicating today was that she thinks we should be communicating more about ds since he's turning 18 and will now be free to move around more.  I'm confused about this one as we haven't been communicating as much regarding his movements in the last 6 months or so, because ds is quite independent.  So I'm guessing this is another moment where she (and maybe uNPD exH) are unconsciously realising their supply (me) is going to be even more diminished.

I said that I didn't necessarily agree about the communication thing.  She started getting agitated so I said that I had work to do inside and that I needed to go.  Thanks for coming.  She stormed off, throwing her arms in the air and swearing at me.

Anyway, there are a few nuggets from an unexpected conversation.  I'm fairly sure she's left but I'm not feeling particularly safe in my home at the moment.  And I fully expect her to put everything in an email anyway.

Unfortunately I will probably have to see her again in a few weeks as ds has been awarded some award at school.  I must be a terrible mum as I was actually hoping that the email I received from the school was a mistake (and that he wasn't getting an award), so that I don't have to attend the awards ceremony.  Of course I'm proud of my boy but I so don't want to be in the presence of his uNPD smother.  His uNPD father I can cope with.)

I'll let you know if I remember any other zingers from the conversation (I think there were about 5 criticisms of me.) or if there are further developements.

Thanks for letting me process.

AOD

[firepoetry]

She sounds a lot like my dd Narc grandmother. Always giving with expectations. Always leaves me jittery. I hope that you are safe, and nothing happened. Right before you mentioned the lying in wait, that was my exact thought when you said you'd been home five minutes, that she had been waiting for you to arrive.

I think you responded appropriately, and every response was fine, and analysis correct. They are concerned about your supply. I can also understand your hesitancy about going to the school for the award. Do you have someone you can go with? A partner, a friend, someone or anyone that can help be a distraction if she tries to insert herself?

[moglow]

You're exactly right: All of her "concerns" could have gone in an email and you'd have no need to respond given they require no input from you whatsoever. It's information and not even yours. What they're doing [or not] isn't your stuff and nothing you need be concerned about. He's 18, an adult, and he can / will share what he's comfortable with when he's ready. If he asks for your input you'll provide. NONE of that has anything to do with her. I'm not even going into what I think about this ambush at your home. RUDE and completely unnecessary.

As for the awards, consider inviting a good friend to go with you or just make it a point to sit as far from them as possible, speak briefly if need be and carry on. She's married to your exhusband and that's the all of it. You weren't hired on as her bestie as part of that transaction. I wouldn't waste my good air trying to explain any of it to either of them again - as my grandfather would say, she can wish/expect in one hand and poop in the other, see which one fills up first. Not Your Circus!!

[firepoetry]

I just had another thought about the going to your home part. My Nex frequently shows up at my house unnanounced and uninvited. She may be trying to set a precedent for How she gets her supply from you. You may want to get a Ring doorbell or something so that when / if she arrives in the future, you simply turn the music on loud and pretend you don't hear her knocking; or if it gets frequent /  obnoxious, call the police. (But maybe pre-empt that at some point stating that since your son is 18 and a legal adult, you state you don't want her showing up at your door, and that you would consider it harassment if she does.)

[Call Me Cordelia]

  RUDE! 

It sounds as if you handled things beautifully, despite being caught off guard. I wonder if you fill some sort of scapegoat role for that woman. That's the only reason I can fathom her being upset about you not being around anymore and going to the effort of driving an hour to your house. Communicating more after you no longer really need to manage a child together makes no sense! Seeking out someone you don't like makes no sense! You are so right to opt out of that circus as far as possible. Only a few more weeks. I would not be surprised if there were some kind of extinction burst around the birthday and this is the beginning of it, but time will tell. You are more than equal to it. You are a sane and rational human being and well, she's all a dither because she didn't get the response she wanted. Poor thing.

[Lookin 2 B Free]

AOD, Well done!  Still, I'm sorry you had that awful encounter.  I know sometimes it takes a bit of time after to detox.  Hopefully sharing here with so many who understand can help with that. 

Congrats on raising DS and seeing him through his childhood.  That's another emotionally complicated time for many of us, watching our children enter legal adulthood.  Hugs!

[Associate of Daniel]

Thank-you for your replies, everyone.

I've often thought of taking someone with me to events but I never have.  I think that I think (and I mean the double statement ) that it makes me look the stronger one for attending on my own without "protection", although it would be nice to have someone to share the burden with.

Also, the uNPD smother would just barrel up to my companion and expect acknowledgment and information.  I know that my companion could distract and/or block her but it would all just be more fuel for her fire.

Moglow, I love your grandfather's comment!

Looking 2 B Free, I didn't sleep well on the night that she turned up, but that was also because there are several other things outside of the uNPD smother that are going on. You're correct though.  These interactions tend to upset the equilibrium!

FirePoetry, I don't actually have any "Smart" devices other than my phone.  I'm not keen on their general intrusion into people's privacy.  However,  if the uNPD smother does come again I'll consider something along the line of a ring doorbell after telling her not to come.  I don't think she will come again.  As Call Me Cordelia says, this may be the start of her extinction burst, or it may be the end of it.

Call Me Cordelia, I think the uNPD smother got exactly what she wanted from the interaction. Or at least most of what she wanted.  I didn't make a fuss over the generosity of her dad or over the amounts of money that she was quoting, but she did leave in a huff - and she needed to be able to do so, in order to have something to go back home and criticise me for.  She loves the whole throwing her arms up in the air, storming off and swearing at me under her breath thing.

I have spoken to a few people, including a counsellor today about the need/non need for parents to continue to communicate regarding arrangements for their newly adult child.  Everyone is saying the same thing:  There is no need, other than in an emergency.  So I guess I'm on the right track.  I just now have to find a way to convince ds, as I think he's either believing uNPD smother's stance on it or he's just trying to keep the peace, since he lives with them.

Anyway, I'll see how it all goes over the next few weeks.

A funny thing:  The award that the school says they are giving to ds is completely not relevant to him.  Lovely, but weird.  Ds doesn't want to attend the ceremony (and neither do I!).  But not only that, the school has not yet informed him of the award, despite telling me that the relevant students have been notified.  So I'm guessing (hoping) the school has made a mistake and sent a letter out to all students' parents and not just to those receiving awards.  Whoops!

Thanks again, everyone.

AOD

[Call Me Cordelia]

Call Me Cordelia, I think the uNPD smother got exactly what she wanted from the interaction. Or at least most of what she wanted.  I didn't make a fuss over the generosity of her dad or over the amounts of money that she was quoting, but she did leave in a huff - and she needed to be able to do so, in order to have something to go back home and criticise me for.  She loves the whole throwing her arms up in the air, storming off and swearing at me under her breath thing.

Oh, well if that's all it takes to make three hours-ish time investment worth it to her, she can surely come up with or invent something to criticize, no problem. She can find or invent something to justify leaving in a huff, even if it's, "I drove ALL THAT WAY and AOD said it wasn't a good time! Did you ever?!?" Given the circumstances, you remained civil and bland and refrained from socking her in the nose. What more do you expect from yourself?

[Associate of Daniel]

"Socking her on the nose"      That made me giggle.

And it's kind of nice to be relieved at being described as being "bland"!  I must be doing ok.

Thanks, Call Me Cordelia.

AOD

[verum71]

Associate of Daniel- It's such a struggle to identify the trauma sometimes.  I've ran that "I should just try to get along with my BPDx" record through my head many times over.  I try to stick to my Charlie Brown kicking the football analogy.  Lucy is going to let me kick it this time, and I should know that it will never happen.  Fell into this trap a couple of months ago with a hospital stay for my soon to be 18 year old daughter.  Thought maybe i could get some information from my Ex about her procedure and I got nothing.  I do think yoy have correctly identified the fact that it is the "fuel" that the PD"s are looking for - we don't have to give it to them. 
I woke up early this morning from a horrible dream.  My ex had sent people to my house to threaten me - in the dream some of the people in the group were people that I knew.  I was trying to explain to them that you know who i am - why are you doing this?  In the dream I had to call the cops - it happened again - I had to call the cops back a second time, and I remember subconsciously thinking i want to wake up because this dream sucks.  I have been divorced from my BPDx since 2009.  I can't even escape her in my sleep 

[Associate of Daniel]

verum71, I'm so sorry about your dream.  Sometimes the bad ones are difficult to shake.  And I imagine you're frustrated that even after so long you're still affected by memories/thoughts/dreams of your ex.  Do you think there is some trauma in your story that still needs to be worked through?

I've not seen or heard from the uNPD smother since the night of the ambush.  I'm guessing (hoping) that the confrontation was just the one off that she needed to process the ending of this era of Ds18's life, as seems to have been the case with the other 2 major incidents described in my 1st post of this thread.  I don't think I'll be hearing from her again for at least a while.  She told ds that she'd been to see me and he was a little disturbed by the news.

Anyway, onwards we go.

AOD

[verum71]

AOD - that has to be a little unsettling - and violating -  to have "smother" ( I haven't heard that one before  ) show up at your house.  In the last 15 years my BPDex has only done that once - I have done everything I can to keep that boundary in place after our divorce.  I've read those other posts about the "What's APP" and communicating more about your son's ongoings and whereabouts with the other PD's.  It just seems really odd that it would be necessary now that your son's moving into adulthood - most kids are looking for their independence when they become an adult.  I would think you could say to your son that i will leave it up to you to decide what communication will look like - I'm sure he didn't choose the WhatsAPP. 
At least a good 5 to 6 years invested in counseling sessions over the last 20 years - even before we got divorced.   I like to think that i've done most of the heavy lifting when it comes to the trauma.  However, it still reels it's ugly head from time to time.  I took a sort of personal inventory last October that I got from a friend in Alanon.  Once it was completed - about 20 to 30 pages of written notes, I sat down with a trusted friend to talk about it.  In the middle of it I was bawling and really had no idea how much of an impact that this situation with my ex still affects me to this day.  Always room to grow.

[Associate of Daniel]

Thanks, Verum71.

Yes, the trauma response (although I hesitate to use that word for my situation as my case is far less severe than so many others') does raise its head in unusual places and at unusual times.  It takes me by surprise since it's such a long time since much has happened and I thought I had processed it.  It's very frustrating.  But I think it stays with me simply because the uNPD behaviour is so out of the realm of normal, so when the memories come they stop me in my tracks.

Anyway, ds18 set up the WhatsApp thing this afternoon.  When it was just emails he only included me and his uNPD father (and his father only responded properly once out of 4 times). He's added his uNPD smother for the WhatsApp setup.  ugh.  She's already replied to the set up message - no sign of any response from his uNPD father.  I hate seeing her name come up.  I hope this doesn't last too long.

I can't wait for him to move out of their apartment...

AOD