Unable to see our grandchildren

[Pudding]

Hi, this is all very new to me as I had never come across this type of illness before. My wife and I are in the UK. We have two sons: the older one lives near us and has a baby girl and we have great relationships with him and his wife. The younger son lives abroad and has two children (3yo boy and a baby girl). We have a very difficult relationship with his wife. Whenever we have a big family event (like the other son's wedding) she has a meltdown. Last Christmas they had planned to stay with us for a week but on Christmas Day she had a major meltdown and we have not been allowed to visit for 9 months now. Now they have had their second child and our son wants us to visit, but has given us a list of demands before we can go. We had to send her money to pay for what she perceived as the inequality in presents compared to our other DIL (going back five years, but completely without any basis). We had to apologise for causing her to melt down at Christmas. We had to apologise for not showing enough interest in her family (they do have a history of extreme conflict/abuse and make our son feel very uncomfortable so it is true). She has accused us of being vanilla and bland, of having pathetic lives, being terrible parents. She also started to abuse my 93-year-old mother. The latest demand we have to agree to is that when we meet next week we must not be tense around her, or "walk on eggshells" as this upsets her. I am not sure if we can manage the last one. I have tried to reason with our son, but he seems to be controlled by her and is scared to rock the boat. If anyone has any advice on how we might deal with this situation, or at least try to get through to our son, we would be very grateful.

[notrightinthehead]

I would abandon all hope of getting through to your son for now. Having lived with a difficult person for decades myself, I only know too well how much one lies to oneself and closes ones eyes and doesn't want to know. But I urge you to study the Toolbox and apply the strategies described. And be prepared, you might not be able to prevent a melt down, if a difficult person wants to have drama, there will be drama. But you will use the strategies from the Toolbox and be able to keep situations somewhat calm. Maybe even role model some behaviour for your son. Good luck and let us know how it's going.

[square]

That sounds really hard.

Like NRITH said, getting through to your son isn't going to happen. He may come Out of the FOG himself, but only under his own volition.

The best strategy is to just be sympathetic to him but don't point out her flaws or push him to see them. You can say "that sounds stressful" or similar.

It's kind of like being in a cult. He and his wife have a shared reality that would be hard for him to break from. She has already told him a lot about how people betray and undermine her (such as you, her in laws), and he has been warned against doing the same. So when outsiders come and say "your wife is really toxic," he is primed to reject them amd close them out.

I'm not sure I'd be willing to plsy all those games with paying money and performing various apologies. It's up to you, of course, but it doesn't get better over time.

[zad7242]

Pudding,

I am so sorry you are going through this! Your situation sounds a lot like what my parents have gone through the last few years, with me being the son still unwilling to "rock the boat" just like your son. My parents have not seen my children (who aren't even the biological children of my wife) in about 6-8 months, and they have gone longer periods of not seeing them, even though they live only 40 minutes away from us. I only see my parents about once every 2-3 months myself. My wife has had meltdowns in front of my parents and of course my parents are always to blame. Like you, my wife has called my parents "boring, they have no friends, they don't really care about you" etc. Almost exactly like you, my wife has gotten angry at my parents and I for being tense or "awkward" around her. It likely causes your son much pain to know this situation is hurting you. I pray for the courage to do what is right and trust God even though standing up for my parents will likely create more chaos in my situation in the short term, and I pray your son too is able to get his ducks in a row so he can do what is right with a minimum of emotional damage to himself and most of all your grandchildren. I wish you the best!   


 

 

[NarcKiddo]

I agree with those who say you are unlikely to be able to "get through to" your son in terms of getting him to see and openly agree with your view of the situation. I think all you can do is set your own boundaries and do only what is acceptable to you, while remaining kind and supportive as best you can. There may come a time when your son has had enough. If he has seen in the meantime that you are good, dependable parents who hold their own boundaries and standards he will likely feel able to come to you for support. If you simply cave in to every unreasonable demand on the part of his wife he may not necessarily see you that way if he wants out. Or, indeed, he may come to the view that it is quite acceptable for people to go along with her to ridiculous degrees and therefore that there is no hope for him if he no longer wishes to play that game.

Best of luck.

[gcj07a]

Pudding, I am so sorry. I grew up with a Borderline mom who basically controlled my dad. When my wife and I had kids, we noticed her mistreating them. So we imposed some boundaries (very basic things) and communicated our expectations. This sent her into a meltdown of course. My dad called me begging me to fix it because his life was now a living nightmare. We catered at the time, but since then we've gone no contact and my dad divorced her. But it took a lot of behind the scenes chatting with my dad to get him to see the light. I finally persuaded him to read Walking on Eggshells, and that's what finally persuaded him that she wasn't just difficult. But they were married for 35 years. It's been six years since the divorce. I don't have any real advice except to maintain as much contact as possible with your son and, as much as possible, put info in his hands to read on his own. You likely can't badger or argue someone into seeing that their spouse is in need of serious help or is being unreasonable (that likely would just make him more defensive, especially since admitting there is a problem likely means he has to make very uncomfortable changes). But empathy, connection, and sharing what you can may eventually have a positive effect. So sorry y'all are dealing with this!