[Orangeblossom77]

Yes, enmesh, or separate I suppose. I found a good book i think it was called Thoughtful Daughters Guide to Separating from a Difficult Mother. That was really good.

[Sunshine days]

Looks good orange blossom
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Peaceful-Daughters-Separating-Difficult-Mother-ebook/dp/B014O8BDLS
I always wanted to read mothers who can't love but bought trapped in the mirror instead, I got fed up of reading about narcs in the end

[SeasonsChange]

Thank you Sunshine and Orangeblossom. I've just ordered that book, I've read another one but I know what you mean about getting fed up with it. I've been trying to read stuff that are helpful in other ways like about Mindfulness or eating well and self care things.

I know she is very angry with me now. I've had a text today which was very snotty. I did send a short, polite reply as it required information. Ok well looking back in all honesty it was her reaching out probably but I felt I had to reply. It's hard having this anger towards me. It feels physically uncomfortable. The pathetic part of me wants to rush to get her approval and make it 'right' the angry part of me wants to move and change our numbers and tell her to F off.

[ambrosina]

I don't have much in experience but I will just state what I noticed about your post. When you speak of yourself it's almost like it's just a passing thought about scenery or something moot but when you talk about her it's very articulate and thoroughly clear that her feelings matter most. Like she's the main character in your life. You are your main character in your life, everyone else is supposed to just be bonuses. (I'm obviously not very articulate in this response, sorry). I just mean to say that until you become a bigger role in your life and decisions it's probably safe to say you deserve this time to find yourself. Anyone who loves and respects you would see that you need this and support your decision to take this journey.

 SeasonsChange, Jennyslife said all on her reply.
It will get better , itīs not a easy path but everything slowly perhaps, will get better . donīt ever forget you are always first

[SeasonsChange]

SeasonsChange, Jennyslife said all on her reply.
It will get better , itīs not a easy path but everything slowly perhaps, will get better . donīt ever forget you are always first

Thank you, this is definitely the first time I've ever put myself first. I know it will be worth it in the long run its just getting through this drama first, one day at a time I guess.

[ambrosina]

Thank you, this is definitely the first time I've ever put myself first. I know it will be worth it in the long run its just getting through this drama first, one day at a time I guess.

yes it is like that
baby steps and one day at a time, and thinking long term .and thinking long term about you, allways, no matter what happens around you .

[Sunshine days]

It does get easier putting your self first you grow into who you should be. Don't fall in they don't stay nice for long and they cant reflect only deflect the blame. Don't fold over you are getting emotionally stronger and she's have a rage , no supply you see.

[SeasonsChange]

Thank you both, I really am trying to be strong it's so helpful having the support here because apart from my partner I don't have anyone who understands what it's like. Heck I don't even understand why this is so hard for me, sometimes I just want to tell myself to get over it and just get on with my life.

I guess we all want to do that but we have things to work through first.

[ambrosina]

Thank you both, I really am trying to be strong it's so helpful having the support here because apart from my partner I don't have anyone who understands what it's like. Heck I don't even understand why this is so hard for me, sometimes I just want to tell myself to get over it and just get on with my life.

I guess we all want to do that but we have things to work through first.

you are soooo right! I relate to you, her only my husband understands what i am going through. IT can be very sad and lonly most of the times but from a point it will be worth it.

[Sunshine days]

Looking back only I could of done it  , the emotional pain I went through to get to my freedom was intense torture, I have never had any emotional support my entire life so no wonder I was sat at the narcs feet (doormat feelings)  and I am like am I really that strong , courageous , forthright, honest , good faith and full of integrity , wow!!! I have a voice. God brought a person into my life who shared my journey and helped me through, I never thought anyone would of been there but I was given a friend and she got me and so my emerging from brokenness was never doubted she always reminded me how far I had come and like wise I helped her through a similar story. No one can understand this stuff it takes a loving trained eye to help us .

[Creativesoul]

Seasons Change, I could relate to your mother telling you that you are "just like her"...Mine would ask me, "Do you know why we don't get along?" I always fell for it since I was a kid and she would answer, "Because we are so alike." It still strikes fear in my heart, 30 years later!

I agree with Sunshine, there's no way you will ever be like her, because narcs don't worry about who they are hurting/how they are acting, and that's all you are doing right now.

The longer you are away from the abuse the stronger you will be. I never responded to her. Nothing.  I started to listen to my body; when it recoiled from the phone, I didn't answer! It is hard, but it gets easier. She sent me gifts for years, and I got to the point where I never responded. She sent them for about 2 years and then she stopped. (As I mentioned in the 'Gifts' thread, she then let everyone know that I wasn't responding and what a terrible person I was for not thanking her or sending gifts in kind.

A note about therapists: I have had some doozies who knew nothing. There were some that did more damage to me than good. Typically, the bad ones would say something like "If you don't heal this relationship with your mother, you will never be able to have a healthy relationship!" So then I would embark on trying to "help" my mom get better. Horrible. So, Sunshine, you could be much better off doing your own research! Sounds like its worked!

[SeasonsChange]

you are soooo right! I relate to you, her only my husband understands what i am going through. IT can be very sad and lonly most of the times but from a point it will be worth it.

That's it, it also feels a bit empty right now. Like something is missing. But it will be worth it I know. I definitely don't miss the drama and everything else!

Looking back only I could of done it  , the emotional pain I went through to get to my freedom was intense torture, I have never had any emotional support my entire life so no wonder I was sat at the narcs feet (doormat feelings)  and I am like am I really that strong , courageous , forthright, honest , good faith and full of integrity , wow!!! I have a voice. God brought a person into my life who shared my journey and helped me through, I never thought anyone would of been there but I was given a friend and she got me and so my emerging from brokenness was never doubted she always reminded me how far I had come and like wise I helped her through a similar story. No one can understand this stuff it takes a loving trained eye to help us .

Almost like a birth by fire. It makes sense, sometimes I feel quite child like in my actions I feel like I have a growing up to do and like you I didn't have emotional support or even safe space to express emotions. I am fortunate that my partner gives me that. His mum is very different though and there is a lot less drama so he doesn't 'get' it, but the fact that he tries and he is still here helps me try and figure this out myself. I'd like to find a way to trust my inner voice (the good one not the critical nasty constant one) and be ok with myself.

Right now, I am not happy with myself my self image is so low.

[SeasonsChange]

Seasons Change, I could relate to your mother telling you that you are "just like her"...Mine would ask me, "Do you know why we don't get along?" I always fell for it since I was a kid and she would answer, "Because we are so alike." It still strikes fear in my heart, 30 years later!

I agree with Sunshine, there's no way you will ever be like her, because narcs don't worry about who they are hurting/how they are acting, and that's all you are doing right now.

The longer you are away from the abuse the stronger you will be. I never responded to her. Nothing.  I started to listen to my body; when it recoiled from the phone, I didn't answer! It is hard, but it gets easier. She sent me gifts for years, and I got to the point where I never responded. She sent them for about 2 years and then she stopped. (As I mentioned in the 'Gifts' thread, she then let everyone know that I wasn't responding and what a terrible person I was for not thanking her or sending gifts in kind.

A note about therapists: I have had some doozies who knew nothing. There were some that did more damage to me than good. Typically, the bad ones would say something like "If you don't heal this relationship with your mother, you will never be able to have a healthy relationship!" So then I would embark on trying to "help" my mom get better. Horrible. So, Sunshine, you could be much better off doing your own research! Sounds like its worked!

That's what she says to me too!! That's why we don't get on because we are the same! And for years I avoided even expressing emotions because I thought that by doing so I was manipulating people. That's what I saw growing up.

I'm starting to think total NC might be a better idea for me. She still obsesses about my father who she divorced and changed her mind about 15+ years ago, I don't see her letting this go easily. I am worried about guilt with the gifts thing, which she relies on of course! That's why they do it.

It's funny you should say that about therapists. I had my first proper session yesterday and she said a couple of times that I probably see a 'glimmer of maternal love' and that's why I'm holding on and have been for so long. She asked me to give an example where she had been there for me....I really couldn't. I can't see this glimmer she speaks of but it might be because I'm so angry right now. I think she loves me, in her way but I don't think she knows how to care for anyone else. I don't think she has the capacity for empathy and I think all that is too damaging to keep in my life for a potential 'glimmer' every now and then.

Maybe the therapist will change her mind when she gets to hear more about how 'lovely' she can be.

[Sunshine days]

. So, Sunshine, you could be much better off doing your own research! Sounds like its worked!

Hi Creative soul,
                          Thank you, I did my own research because I didn't trust anyone and I knew I had to be my best friend and sit in the pain and grieve it. I couldn't afford a cruel unkind thoughtless word thrown in the wound it would of set me back and I heard some therapists are narcs so the thought of some one getting a kick out of me not growing really made me feel stuck so I decided I didn't want to be co dependant on anyone and I had to face it alone to get stronger and so I cried all by myself and with a kind friend sometimes  who crossed my path at that time for a reason and that was the making of me, there's no quick fix therapist . Also my narc use to tell me I was just like my dad who she hated , it took me years to work it out and she was like the gc and took pride in saying the gc is like her.

[Sunshine days]

!

Looking back only I could of done it  , the emotional pain I went through to get to my freedom was intense torture, I have never had any emotional support my entire life so no wonder I was sat at the narcs feet (doormat feelings)  and I am like am I really that strong , courageous , forthright, honest , good faith and full of integrity , wow!!! I have a voice. God brought a person into my life who shared my journey and helped me through, I never thought anyone would of been there but I was given a friend and she got me and so my emerging from brokenness was never doubted she always reminded me how far I had come and like wise I helped her through a similar story. No one can understand this stuff it takes a loving trained eye to help us .

Almost like a birth by fire. It makes sense, sometimes I feel quite child like in my actions I feel like I have a growing up to do and like you I didn't have emotional support or even safe space to express emotions. I am fortunate that my partner gives me that. His mum is very different though and there is a lot less drama so he doesn't 'get' it, but the fact that he tries and he is still here helps me try and figure this out myself. I'd like to find a way to trust my inner voice (the good one not the critical nasty constant one) and be ok with myself.

Right now, I am not happy with myself my self image is so low.
[/quote]
Its ok to admit you are not happy that's the gateway to healing , you have been pretending you are ok for so long , create that space you need, it's going to take time but you can do this . You have to pick up your inner child and let her have a voice , that should grow within you and silence the critical one. You got this.... You have support here.

[Sunshine days]

IS your therapist a Christian counselling ? I could only go to a Christian counsellor . Is she trained in narc abuse? It's obvious we want a motherly love and until we realise they can't love we won't let go. I hope she helps you to let go and grow into the person who should of been. Only you can love that part you missed out on. Wishing you all the best in your recovery. Hugs xx

[SeasonsChange]

IS your therapist a Christian counselling ? I could only go to a Christian counsellor . Is she trained in narc abuse? It's obvious we want a motherly love and until we realise they can't love we won't let go. I hope she helps you to let go and grow into the person who should of been. Only you can love that part you missed out on. Wishing you all the best in your recovery. Hugs xx

Thank you so much for your support. Today is a hard day. Anxiety wise it feels unmanageable, feeling a bit all over the place emotionally with random anger as got another text today. I think I may have to change the number. I don't think my therapist is Christian but as its government funded I can't change. We've only started recently so hopefully I can get to know her, I get good vibes from her. Going to focus on trying to relax today and get out of my head for a while.

Thank you for helping

[Sunshine days]

It's good you can feel your gut instinct , I could never block any of it until I had dealt with it , I had to keep talking about it and finding answers . I found my anxiety was because I wasn't breathing it out and trying to stuff it down but that place that was so stuffed had disappeared and I was dealing with it in all directions x 

[SeasonsChange]

It's so good to hear you managed to move past that, gives me hope too that I can. All feels a bit overwhelming right now, but I know that I need to deal it to move beyond it and feel better.

[Sunshine days]

It's so good to hear you managed to move past that, gives me hope too that I can. All feels a bit overwhelming right now, but I know that I need to deal it to move beyond it and feel better.

At the time I thought I was going to die of a broken heart and then I saw myself emerging from brokenness and I had to believe it was happening and that I was emotionally and mentally abused , trapped in the narcs mirror. It took strength and a belief within me , a belief I never had before . I struggle with my identity as it wasn't given to me as a child so believing in myself is really hard work but I ain't giving up just yet. So glad you are feeling much better, talk therapy is really good .