Do you know your role?

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delightedwhen

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #20 on: September 12, 2016, 01:13:05 PM »
Family of 5: Mom, dad, three sisters.

I'm The Lost Child, but I also tried to be everyone's emotional confidant/support system and the family's impartial, just conflict mediator. I haven't seen that role named anywhere yet.

Younger sister also The Lost Child.

Older sister Scapegoat/Identified Patient. Dx with BPD.

Mother something very disordered.

Dad his wife's enabler.

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Sunshine days

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2016, 05:06:28 AM »
Delight when, where is the golden child in your family, I thought there  had to be at least one golden child so the sg feels worthless. any ideas if this is true anyone .

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NewME2016

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #22 on: September 13, 2016, 06:48:55 AM »
I find this tread really interesting to read over. I still cant make any sense of my FOO dynamics - it still slips through my fingers whenever I feel like I get close.

There has been a lot of shifting roles in my FOO but triangulation is one of the big ones I can grasp.
Almost 10 years ago I started meditating & part of the style was to attempt to curb/stop any negative talk... It was at that time I became aware of the negative talk in my family. Now I have a term for it: triangulation. Its a start.

Congratulations to all of you for being able to identify the patterns in your lives. It impresses the hell out of me!



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Amelia3

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #23 on: September 13, 2016, 04:58:46 PM »
Always the Scapegoat for my family.  One day I realized I was not 'bad' having no substance abuse problems, never arrested, never did anything illegal, never even missed an appointment.  Then I realized the function of scapegoats, to absorb the family's 'elephant in the room.' To somehow provide focus on something else, so no-one would notice the true difficulties.

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Artsy

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #24 on: September 13, 2016, 08:48:18 PM »
One day I realized I was not 'bad' having no substance abuse problems, never arrested, never did anything illegal, never even missed an appointment. 

:yeahthat:

I had a similar experience. I really think I was my Mom's GC and my Dad's SG and I was my older sibs SG. I remember joining the Army (talk about Private Benjamin) to prove to my older sibs that I could be disciplined, successful, worthwhile. This distanced me from my mother and suddenly made me more golden to my father. When I returned my mother and my sibs were completely silent. That's how they treated any success that I had. As the years went by, I tallied the list: responsible parent, contributing member of work places and other  settings. My sibs particularly were just watching for me to screw up, and it just didn't happen. My graduating from Army schools with flying colors at 17 years old, just shut them up. My kids growing up to be decent members of society also shut them up. That didn't stop them from cutting lose once my parents were out of the picture and just making crap up to put me back in that role.

It was actually hard to realize that I never earned the SG role. There's a certain power in blaming yourself. 
"I used to think that the worst thing in life was to end up alone. It's not. The worst thing in life is to end up with people who make you feel alone." Robin Williams.

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Shockwave

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #25 on: September 13, 2016, 09:37:48 PM »
uBPD/uNPD mother = Perfect. :roll: (yes, she says this out loud). Knows everything and can't convince her otherwise.

uNPD/en father = Absentee Landlord. Physically, emotionally and mentally checked out. Has been for a LONG time. Can be a decent guy if you have no ties to him and don't depend on him for anything. Otherwise, look out. Has a mean temper, too.

Both of my parents = epitome of hard knock life and victimhood. Sure, they did have it hard, but they also took it out on everyone else in the process. Not fun, let me tell you. Avoided both of them like the plague growing up by holing up in the room with the video games, books and being a geek. One wanted to be a big-shot lawyer, the other, a doctor saving lives. Both fell short.

uBPD sister = Mom's Golden Child/Hero. She can do no wrong. Good grades, got her RN, became a nurse, just like uBPD/uNPD mother, but went beyond her level. She's her bestest friend in the whole wide world. Mom's face lights up when she's home and they're talking. Dad's scapegoat, though. Indifference is his MO because of all the attention she gets. Has never left home and has never lived on her own. Has been all over the world, but has the mental age of a perpetual teenager on her best days, and a 5 yo on her worst.

uPD older brother = Mom's scapegoat. She was vicious to him pretty bad growing up, and he returned the favor, rebelling in truly epic fashion. Punished the GC for being in her role, both had a bitter relationship. He was a true badass, criminal, drug dealer, been to jail multiple times, womanizer, alcoholic, etc. Managed to turn his life around after parents kicked him out of the house @ 23 yo. Became the best thing ever for him, wound up married to a pediatrician, 20+ years, 2 kids, but the FOO issues left unresolved came back to bite him in the @$$ and lost it all. Including his life. Her Majesty turned her back on him when he was on his literal last legs. Also found out that she also wanted my uNPD father to stay up there in Seattle with him, permanently, when he sent him up there with my brother before he died. Ironically, he treated me the best out of all of the dysfunctional family members. Especially when I snapped him out of one of his unguided Flying Monkey attacks and we started comparing notes on dear ol' Ma.

Me = Lost Child/Invisible Child. Got the worst of it after my brother got kicked out. Thought I would wind up like him, so Mom and Sis started the BPD brainwashing machine. Triangulated me against my father, and my brother. Became their slave seeking their approval until an incident with my GF which almost cost the relationship I cared about broke me free from their spell. Subjected to physical abuse, corporal punishment, and emotional/psychological/verbal abuse in my youth from ALL sides, and then the physical dropped when I became much more physically imposing and could not only defend myself, but crush anyone in the house with ease. Stripped me of my identity and sense of self very early, like 6-7 years old. Reprogrammed into being whoever they wanted me to be for a very long time. When I initially came OOTF, they were PISSED, and tried to have me go back, but it was a long journey out and I wasn't going back into that pit of Hell.
"Because he's the hero Gotham deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So we'll hunt him. Because he can take it. Because he's not a hero. He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector. A Dark Knight."
-- James Gordon, The Dark Knight

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Amelia3

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #26 on: September 13, 2016, 11:09:25 PM »

Artsy said:

"It was actually hard to realize that I never earned the SG role. There's a certain power in blaming yourself.  "


Understood when I took the role of SG at the age of eight or nine, to protect younger siblings, that I would be the one person they could count on in our family.  After awhile they simply took advantage of my loyalty and help. 

I chose the role to protect others. My EF used to indicate that I was the only one who was not afraid of him. Yet, I didn't see the consequences of being that selfless as it segued into the future (who could?).

Eventually everything was heaped on me, after I left home, it was still piled.  After NC it progressed to accusatory phone calls and emails. Eventually they chose someone else as scapegoat, someone much weaker.  And although its a relief not to be the SG, I understood that I never was what they said I was.

Still sometimes look at the world from the perspective of the scapegoat. That is, you are 'bad' and everything is your fault. Logically I know this is not true, yet it's as if I've been branded forever with scapegoat on my forehead. 

It's been a long road, and I need to rid myself completely of that brand.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2016, 12:10:24 AM by Amelia3 »

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Candywarhol

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #27 on: September 14, 2016, 11:45:06 AM »
 :aaauuugh:
mother and my sibs were completely silent. That's how they treated any success that I had
Thanks for that, Artsy! I just realised in reading this, that it was/is the same for me!
I'm the only one of my family who completed a university degree, I'm one of two out of four who has a good
marriage, I set up and run my own business, I've achieved one or two things of some small note in the arts,
yet two of my other siblings corporate jobs are talked about all the time and my other sibling has been critically ill
so she has the pity bonus. Me? nuthink!!! My parents don't even know what my business entails, I never got a wedding gift from them!

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Artsy

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #28 on: September 14, 2016, 02:10:28 PM »
Amelia3: "Yet, I didn't see the consequences of being that selfless as it segued into the future (who could?)."

The consequences of being that selfless - reminds me of the title of a book I dreamed of writing: Dangerous Compassion. It's our humanity that makes us easy prey. I acted out as a child, and still feel this rage rise up in me when my family is around that just makes me want to swing at them. I learned my success in life only happened when they weren't around to belittle or sabotage it. For some years, I see now that my childhood acting out was no different than belittling my accomplishments as an adult. I was trying to keep them all whole, give them the limelight, be the "problem" so others could feel good about themselves. Sounds weird, but it was coming from a place of wanting to protect them. Then when I needed protection, or compassion, or support, nothing. It's like they just consume you. I told my husband I feel like a blood sack, like something out of Mad Max.

Amelia3: "Still sometimes look at the world from the perspective of the scapegoat. That is, you are 'bad' and everything is your fault. Logically I know this is not true, yet it's as if I've been branded forever with scapegoat on my forehead."

This is why I've taken to journaling and writing down what happens to me and all the "evidence." It helps me "remember" what I really, REALLY, want to forget. With all the shame and self-hatred that comes from the SG role, it's so much harder to really face the truth - our families are *%$^&. I think there's some kind of primal need to be part of an in-tact tribe and it's traumatizing to see the cracks in what should be our support system.

Candywarhol: "I'm the only one of my family who completed a university degree, I'm one of two out of four who has a good marriage, I set up and run my own business, I've achieved one or two things of some small note in the arts."

Let me offer you my full, whole hearted congratulations on a life well lived DESPITE the lack of familial support and adoration! I think the very least a grown child can count on from FOO is recognition of success. When it's withheld, I find it shocking. Sometimes it's insensitivity, indifference, self centeredness, but sometimes it's out and out jealousy. I'm glad my comments resonated with you. It's always nice to realize your not alone, especially when your success is ignored or taken for granted. :bighug:
"I used to think that the worst thing in life was to end up alone. It's not. The worst thing in life is to end up with people who make you feel alone." Robin Williams.

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Amelia3

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #29 on: September 14, 2016, 03:22:59 PM »
Amelia3: "Yet, I didn't see the consequences of being that selfless as it segued into the future (who could?)."

The consequences of being that selfless - reminds me of the title of a book I dreamed of writing: Dangerous Compassion. It's our humanity that makes us easy prey. I acted out as a child, and still feel this rage rise up in me when my family is around that just makes me want to swing at them. I learned my success in life only happened when they weren't around to belittle or sabotage it. For some years, I see now that my childhood acting out was no different than belittling my accomplishments as an adult. I was trying to keep them all whole, give them the limelight, be the "problem" so others could feel good about themselves. Sounds weird, but it was coming from a place of wanting to protect them. Then when I needed protection, or compassion, or support, nothing. It's like they just consume you. I told my husband I feel like a blood sack, like something out of Mad Max.

Amelia3: "Still sometimes look at the world from the perspective of the scapegoat. That is, you are 'bad' and everything is your fault. Logically I know this is not true, yet it's as if I've been branded forever with scapegoat on my forehead."

This is why I've taken to journaling and writing down what happens to me and all the "evidence." It helps me "remember" what I really, REALLY, want to forget. With all the shame and self-hatred that comes from the SG role, it's so much harder to really face the truth - our families are *%$^&. I think there's some kind of primal need to be part of an in-tact tribe and it's traumatizing to see the cracks in what should be our support system.

Candywarhol: "I'm the only one of my family who completed a university degree, I'm one of two out of four who has a good marriage, I set up and run my own business, I've achieved one or two things of some small note in the arts."

Let me offer you my full, whole hearted congratulations on a life well lived DESPITE the lack of familial support and adoration! I think the very least a grown child can count on from FOO is recognition of success. When it's withheld, I find it shocking. Sometimes it's insensitivity, indifference, self centeredness, but sometimes it's out and out jealousy. I'm glad my comments resonated with you. It's always nice to realize your not alone, especially when your success is ignored or taken for granted. :bighug:

Big hug to you as well Artsy even though you're a stranger, we have a similar history and to you too CandyWarhol :yes: 

When I was first published in a city newspaper and magazine, my siblings read the articles and made no comment. At the same time as I made the dean's list.  Nothing, nada. Yet a close girlfriend said; "Were celebrating, I'm taking you out for dinner."  Which made me cry.  They never were anything those people, I put myself through university without any help. The elder siblings had financial help from my parents and they still flunked out.  I married, they divorced, some two to four times, I'm still married to the same person for thirty plus years.  It doesn't make me better, only more able to compromise and adapt.  Something they seem to have a great deal of difficulty with. 


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Artsy

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #30 on: September 15, 2016, 11:08:57 AM »
"When I was first published in a city newspaper and magazine, my siblings read the articles and made no comment. At the same time as I made the dean's list.  Nothing, nada."

See? Exactly. Getting published and being on the dean's list is a big deal! It's nothing short of outrageous for a family (even siblings) to ignore that. I'm glad you had a friend who celebrated you. Maybe we need a thread on here where we all report our accomplishments! I'm going to start one.

"I used to think that the worst thing in life was to end up alone. It's not. The worst thing in life is to end up with people who make you feel alone." Robin Williams.

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Candywarhol

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #31 on: September 15, 2016, 02:56:05 PM »
Let me offer you my full, whole hearted congratulations on a life well lived DESPITE the lack of familial support and adoration! I think the very least a grown child can count on from FOO is recognition of success. When it's withheld, I find it shocking. Sometimes it's insensitivity, indifference, self centeredness, but sometimes it's out and out jealousy. I'm glad my comments resonated with you. It's always nice to realize your not alone, especially when your success is ignored or taken for granted.

Thanks, Artsy!
I think in my case it may have been a combination of all of the above. Whatever the reason, it's pretty sh***y!
Not looking to others for recognition and validation is a very valid and tough lesson to learn and I get why it's important.
Surely, though, it's part of our make-up as humans to need to give and receive praise! Even my dog needs that!

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123banana

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #32 on: September 21, 2016, 08:54:31 AM »
My role is the Lost Child. I was the forgotten one, I spent most of my time away from my family, by choice. When I was home, I stayed in my room all of the time and only came down for meals. I did not want attention, even if I was ill, I just wanted to be left alone. I did not tell my family much about myself, did not show my emotions to them, and did not ask for anything. I was overlooked completely, my mother spent most of her time either talking with my sister, noticing my brother's bad behaviour (and sort of asking him to stop) and looking after the younger kids, who couldn't meet their own needs yet. My stepdad mostly ignored me too, he still didn't like me, and he still made creepy comments to me or tried to wind me up, but I escaped his abuse by not rising to the bait, being quiet, being unseen, compared to my louder siblings.

My sister was the Hero, the one who is successful, she was super close to our mother and they were the best of friends. She tormented me endlessly. She got away with the most out of all of us (although I think that is mostly because she knew how to get what she wanted-there was no actual discipline for any of us), but she was also PD Stepdad's scapegoat (same as me and my brother too, he didn't like us because we were not his, but he disliked my sister more). Despite her status as the GC to our mother, she did not do anything to stand up for her when our stepdad was a bully, but complained to her about their loveless relationship and how she only stays for the kids, when he wasn't around.

My oldest little brother was the rebel of the family. He was the outwardly "bad" child, the one who was aggressive, got into trouble at school, argued and answered back. My sister got on well with him, although for a period of time, he disliked her. They are both manipulative, but before he learned how to do it, she would set him on members of the family she had a problem with, to keep herself out of trouble. He was PD Stepdad's favourite, until he was forgotten after having a biological child.

Youngest little brother was the mascot-he is very immature for his age and also the youngest by a lot (he was born when I was a teenager), the hyperactive little one whose antics kept us all entertained. All of us love him, except for my other brother, who absolutely hates him and makes him miserable whenever possible and has since childhood. I think this is mostly due to the fact that he is my stepdad's GC, before he was born, PD Stepdad looked to my other brother as the son he could have as his little mini me, but then he had his own biological son and transferred his attention to him.

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Iivefree

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Re: Do you know your role?
« Reply #33 on: September 27, 2016, 05:46:51 PM »
I'm like 123banana I was the lost child for sure. Except I only had one half sibling who was 10 years older than me and she was the hero and at times mascot I think. I actually believed she was literally smarter/ better capable so why should I bother having an opinion about anything?
I do think at moments I was also scapegoated but all for made up reasons or being made to compare to my sister the hero. I was never as great as she was but I was also a decent kid because for the most part I stuck to my part of being quiet and not taking too much of anyone's time or resources.