$$$ issue and npd daughter

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$$$ issue and npd daughter
« on: August 22, 2016, 06:59:46 PM »
My first post: After a bit of research I believe our daughter of 30 years has npd. I'll be happy to go deeper in other subjects but at the moment I need to know how to stop her manipulation on my wife and her draining us of our money.  I know this is short and to the point and I'll be glad to add more detail later. My npd daughter knows how to push the parent buttons such as "guilt", "duty", that cause us to continue giving, giving, giving and all the while it appears that her attitude is just to constantly take, take, take.  We're only now realizing her possible npd issues.



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Re: $$$ issue and npd daughter
« Reply #1 on: August 22, 2016, 11:31:35 PM »
Hi and welcome to OOTF. If you are looking for strategies, tools, help we have that for you at the tabs filled with resources above. Equipping yourself and educating yourself as much as possible about the traits of NPD and what to do or not do when faced with them is a great way to take healthy steps forward and break patterns with your daughter that are hurting you.

You will find support and encouragement as you begin to share on the forum boards. There is a great community of people who are facing difficulties with adult children over on the Parents Discussion Board.

One of the most foundational things for many of us as we begin to come out of the fear, obligation, and guilt in our interactions with suspected PD family members, is to spend a significant amount of time working through identifying our core values and then setting and keeping healthy boundaries around our lives that are based on those core values.

A great resource for boundaries info is found here in this post:  http://www.outofthefog.net/forum/index.php?topic=24.0 along with the boundary info found in the glossary.

It is a painful realization, especially so with an adult child imho, when consistent behaviors over time do tend to add up to a potential PD.  I am so sorry. It helps to know you are not alone and there are other parents walking this steep path and the validation and understanding to be found here can be a great encouragement.

Take your time looking through the posts and resources and when you are ready join the conversations on the boards. We welcome you!
"You can understand and have compassion for someone and still not want a relationship with them."
Amanda E. White, LPC @therapyforwomen

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Re: $$$ issue and npd daughter
« Reply #2 on: August 22, 2016, 11:33:53 PM »
Welcome to OOTF!

I think what you refer to as your daughter pushing your buttons with "guilt" or "duty" is what we call here "Fear, Obligation, Guilt" or "FOG". You'll find more information on this in the Toolbox     along with lots of other information that might be helpful like Boundaries or JADE. I think the money issue is most likely just one part of her being unable to accept your boundaries or you setting any. Learning about boundaries has been key for me in getting my own life back and living it without constant FOG. A really helpful book for you might be this one: http://www.outofthefog.net/Books.htmlhttp://www.outofthefog.net/Books.html

Please check out the various tabs at the top of this page to learn more about personality disorders or to look at the book section.

We have a special forum for parents of children with diagnosed or suspected PD, the Parents' Discussion, and I hope you'll check it out and might share more of your story whenever you feel comfortable.
ďIf Iím not towards myself, who is towards myself? And when Iím only towards myself, what am I? And if not now, when?Ē (Rabbi Hillel)

"I can forgive, but I cannot afford to forget." (Moglow)



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Re: $$$ issue and npd daughter
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2016, 02:52:26 PM »
Welcome Mrak,
Whether or not your daughter has NPD it is always a good idea to learn to set boundaries with our kids. Kids, grown or not, can be manipulative and FOGging I think just because of the symbiotic relationship between parents and kids. You will also find that learning to set healthy boundaries, based on your core values, and tied to logical consequences when boundaries are violated, will be helpful in all aspects of our lives.
In most cases I don't think our society and socializing factions teach us how to set boundaries. Realize one important point. When beginning to set boundaries, especially if she is NPD, you will get a lot of resistance and testing the limits. It will be important to be consistent. Otherwise you provide what's called intermittent reinforcement and the cycle of FOG will be even harder to break.
Once again, I'm glad you found this site and wish you success.
How people treat you is their karma; how you react is yours.
 Wayne Dyer

The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Do you understand?
Capt. Jack Sparrow

Choose not to be harmed and you wonít feel harmed. Donít feel harmed and you havenít been. -Marcus Aurelius


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Re: $$$ issue and npd daughter
« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2016, 12:25:45 AM »
DH and I have wrestled with this issue with our adult children.  We would not turn on backs on our kids, if homeless, hungry, helpless.  We have done our fair share of rescuing and enabling.  Not as much as their Biological M, she is codependent over the top, kids are her life, she cannot say no, and bails, somewhat relentlessly.  She tries to be BFF rather than a parent.  I'm sorry to say our adult children can be very manipulative, and, feel entitled.  So very opposed to DH and my own values. 

While my own enF and UNm never ever lifted a financial finger from early teens on, I must say I am grateful that I learned I could not depend on them for a penny.  Forced independence high has become a source of success and adult pride. 

No is a small but powerful word. Allowing others to live with the consequences of their decisions and life choices allows them the opportunity and privelege of learning how to become capable adults.  Sometimes tools, advice and guidance help, if there is reception to listening.  Being prepared to be the "bad guy", temporarily, sometimes pays off.  I thanked my enF in the end for teaching me the value of hard work and discipline and am grateful for the independence I've enjoyed.

Hope this helps in some way.

"The opposite of Love is not Hate, it's Indifference" - Elie Wiesel



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Re: $$$ issue and npd daughter
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2016, 04:00:13 PM »

I hope you'll also post to the Parent's Board....there are a number of us dealing with adult children who want/need money at various times. 

While there is no right or wrong, I learned that I needed to develop boundaries or my PD adult child would be perfectly happy draining me dry and leaving me with no resources to raise the younger kids in the family.

There are books written about setting boundaries with adult children and several websites that have contracts for adult children.  I used these with both my PD adult children and nons. 

Hope to see you on the Parents Board!

"She made broken look beautiful and strong look invincible.  She walked with the universe on her shoulders and made it look like a pair of wings."



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Re: $$$ issue and npd daughter
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2016, 08:51:11 PM »
Hi Mrak
        Using Fear , Obligation and Guilt to manipulate parents , or any one else , into giving them money is a common ploy of PD people . My ex NPD / HPD / BPD , who describes herself as an ' Enlightened Artist ' and Healer  :roll: , is dead broke and dependent on others for housing , transportation , food and medical needs .  She sucks the money , transportation etc out of my adult children who  are constantly placed in that most awkward position of watching a parent go down the tubes and having to support her  :no: Pure financial manipulation . She makes no attempt to find work , after all , she is an enlightened artist and everyone knows how all great artists have patrons of some sort . She's an artist alright , a CON ARTIST .

Welcome to OOTF , there is a lot of valuable information here and the most amazingly supportive people you will ever encounter . Glad you found this place , I sure am  :) 
"I'm not confused at what I think because I'm coming from the place where I can't unsee what I have seen" . Gary



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Re: $$$ issue and npd daughter
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2016, 08:58:45 PM »
Hi Mrak,

The only way anyone learns how to become self-sufficient as an adult is to learn how to navigate and overcome trying times (money difficulties, etc) without relying on someone to bail them out.  Giving the money/housing/auto or whatever is being requested is not a kindness.  It doesn't allow the person to grow and learn to rely on herself.  Learning how to navigate one's way, and the feeling of accomplishment that accompanies it, is deprived when we keep bailing others out.  Do they throw tantrums and try to FOG us? Yes.  Our job, as I see it, is to keep boundaries, stay strong, and protect ourselves. 

Best of luck to you in your trying times.



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Re: $$$ issue and npd daughter
« Reply #8 on: August 31, 2016, 10:19:36 PM »
As a step I manage all the money loans with our 19 who is working on independence. We have a written contract and it includes thr clause for failure to repay. Ms 19 knows I will enact it too...