Desperately need NC advice re: HPD sister - she won't stop

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Jorge Rodriguez

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Desperately need NC advice re: HPD sister - she won't stop
« on: September 29, 2016, 12:22:03 AM »
Sorry for lack of introduction, and for any grammar/structure mistakes. Real stressful week.

I stopped talking to my HPD sister completely in June of 2015 after no longer being able to cope with her abuse and manipulation. I replied to her once in March 2016 (stupid) after she sent me a post card saying 'i'll be at ____ at 5:00 pm wednesday. please come'. I replied with a very short, concise letter saying "the last time you asked to meet I agreed to only if you would not talk about past contentious events. you said that was not acceptable to you. if that has changed please reply to this and I will gladly meet you". I did this only so I could possibly attend her child's graduation last spring and attend the family chirstmas.

Her response was an overnighted cardboard envelope with a 2 page, rambling, angry letter and a print outs of 'nice' texts she had been sending to me (have her number blocked). Insane lies and bullshit and it sucked me back in and sent me into a spiral of feeling crazy, not sleeping, drinking too much, etc.

At this point I decide to ignore her forever and completely. I tell my parents never to mention her. My dad defended me and faced her wrath, too. She barely speaks to him now. My mom is not willing/able to stand up to her because of fear of losing her grandchildren. She eventually gets sucked back in and starts bringing her up more and more. Tells my dad "i think she's changed".

Monday I get an anonymous text from what I believe to be a burner app. It is pretty vague, calling me selfish and immature and cruel and saying I need to apologize to my sister. I at first think it's her husband, but come to my senses and realize it's her trying to stir up drama as it's been too long since she's had any. I tell my dad, because I'm losing it again. He calls her out on it, denies sending it and refuses to say who did it. I  told him because I at first I was scared because I thought it was her husband (violent convicted felon).

I now realize I must go FULLY no-contact. I know what this means and am willing to take all the steps. Question: my mom won't make this easy. Dad will (sister barely speaks to him, told him to never text her again this week). My mom will undoubtedly be sucked back in and convinced she's 'normal now' (even though she has taken the brunt of sister's abuse for 20+years, and is fully aware of that. been there). I don't think my mom will ever get out. Mom supports me going no contact, don't get me wrong. Even encourages it. But I know she won't ever stop trying to (subconsciously?) humanize my abusive sister to me. I am not able to hear it without going off the rails emotionally.

Aside from this, I love my mom and get along with her great. Absolutely 0 issues that do not involve my sister. What do I do? How do I communicate this to my mom? Will she ever get it, still being in my sister's clutches? My mom is an emotional wreck BECAUSE of my sister's abuse. How do I handle this without making it worse? I just deactivated my facebook beacuse my mom mentions her too much. My girlfriend had to unfollow my mom. We LOVE my mom. We want need rid of my sister. Advice?

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Jorge Rodriguez

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Re: Desperately need NC advice re: HPD sister - she won't stop
« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2016, 12:28:38 AM »
also, do I need to send my sister a one-line letter/email/text like

'I ask once again that you please refrain from all attempts to contact me."

or do I just let it go? I never told her our relationship was over forever. I gave her the option to meet civilly and she did not accept it. That offer no longer stands and it will never exist again. There is nothing that could happen that would make me want ANY relationship with her again. I think that's obvious from my silence, but do I need to explicitly tell her that?

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goodgirl

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Re: Desperately need NC advice re: HPD sister - she won't stop
« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2016, 02:18:39 PM »
Hi, Jorge!  I'm so sorry for what you're going through.  Your situation is kind of familiar to me, as I ended up having a similar conversation with my mom last year.  The good thing is, you say Mom already totally understands and is even encouraging you in your decision to go NC.  So yay!   You're one step ahead of where I was when I approached my mom.

And what I said to my mom was that it was just too damaging to me to have contact with my uNBro anymore, it literally made me sick (and I have dangerous depressions that he triggers).  I made it clear that I didn't want to make her choose between us, that I understood that she loves uNBro and that he was a good son to her (he isn't but that's what she tells herself), but that he's literally dangerous to me, and so sadly I have keep my distance, and I need her to respect that and not try to change it.  She's mostly been good about it, too, although there have a been a few instances where she's mentioned his concern for me (which of course has never been directly expressed to me). 

If she ever does try again to reconcile us, I just plan to reiterate calmly to her:  "Mom, you remember what we talked about with this.  I know we feel differently about uNbro, and that's fine, but I need you to respect that I need to protect myself from him, sad as that is.  I'm sorry that hurts you, but I have to protect my own well-being."

As to  informing your sis?  If you've asked before, I don't think you need to.  Actually, I don't think you need to period unless you really want to.  For myself, I try to avoid any contact with my brother unless it's absolutely necessary (i.e., there is a crisis with one of our parents) because I don't see any good out of opening any conversation with him.

So sorry you're going through this.  It stinks.

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Muggins

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Re: Desperately need NC advice re: HPD sister - she won't stop
« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2016, 02:46:20 PM »
It sounds like you're afraid of her and or her husband so you don't want to provoke her. Silence without explanation might do that. You want to keep it simple so there's nothing to argue about. You could be passive and say you need a time out to study the situation for a few years.

I drifted into NC with my sister over a year ago. She contacted me in the spring to ask what's wrong and I still haven't come up with an answer so still NC. If I was afraid the silence would provoke her into action I suppose I would try harder to find a response.

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Jorge Rodriguez

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Re: Desperately need NC advice re: HPD sister - she won't stop
« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2016, 03:09:20 PM »
Thanks so much, goodgirl. It helps just knowing others have very similar dilemmas.

I want to convey to my mom I can't handle hearing how normal my abusive sister is, without my mom thinking I am mad at her or wanting her to choose sides. All I want is to not hear how someone who objectively hurts everyone she's in contact with (sister has driven ALL of her local friends away. only out of state friends still speak to her more or less) is normal, or a good mommy, etc.  especially "better". 

This latest anonymous text came after I a.) went on a weekend trip with dad and b.) went to a concert with mom. She punishes all 3 of us when she gets offended that we are spending time together. it makes me not want to spend time with them, which is her goal.

If spending time with my parents means a.) I have to hear about my sister and b.) I can expect a bombardment from sister the next week....why would I want that? I feel like I need some more support from my parents here to keep my relationship with my parents healthy. I don not deserve to  be punished by my sister for my parents loving me and spending time with me. I have asked, but mom is too afraid of her.

It sounds like you're afraid of her and or her husband so you don't want to provoke her. Silence without explanation might do that. You want to keep it simple so there's nothing to argue about. You could be passive and say you need a time out to study the situation for a few years.

I drifted into NC with my sister over a year ago. She contacted me in the spring to ask what's wrong and I still haven't come up with an answer so still NC. If I was afraid the silence would provoke her into action I suppose I would try harder to find a response.

I am afraid of her, and him when/if she ever manipulates him into action. And I don't know what will provoke her more, silence or a response. No responses have been well received (hate packets delivered to me overnight by FedEx,etc) so I lean towards silence. I expect if I told her I was done forever she would unleash an absolute torrent on me, my girlfriend, and my parents. I have never been scared of anyone but her and her husband in my life. It is a terrible feeling, and a lonely feeling as anyone that's never been victimized by this type of person doesn't understand how serious it is.

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goodgirl

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Re: Desperately need NC advice re: HPD sister - she won't stop
« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2016, 04:37:11 PM »
I'm sorry, I skirted right past the scary part!  I'm actually afraid of my brother showing up on my doorstep, as he's 2 hours away (for years he's been at least 12 hours away), and I don't even have any history to suggest I should be physically afraid of him (but I am). 

SO what to do?  When talking to Mom, I think all you can do is gently remind her that it's upsetting to hear about your sister when she brings her up and ask her to understand. If she says it's hurtful to her, you can understand, but your intent is not to hurt her but to protect yourself.  And if she can't stop, get off  the call.  I think you have to prepare to endure some hurt on Mom's part, but I think it's necessary.  Remember that she does already understand, and her hurt will still coexist with that understanding.

Regarding your sis:  Block those anonymous texts.  You've already told her you don't want any contact. I don't think there's anything to gain by any further messages; you'd just be continuing a conversation you want to end, and she'll be angry no matter what you do.  So I wouldn't respond to any attempted contact, and in that I would included any passing of messages through your parents (even if it's your parents telling her to knock it off).   In fact, I wouldn't tell your parents about any attempted contact by her, either; for sister, even the knowledge that you reported her contact could confirm to her that she got to you. 

Regarding her husband:  man, I dunno.  Has he ever threatened you or anyone in the family?  How close do they live to you?  i think the best thing is to plan ahead what you would do IF he (or your sister for that matter) showed up at your front door or confronted you publicly.  My husband has already declared that my brother never sets foot in our house (bless that man).


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Jorge Rodriguez

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Re: Desperately need NC advice re: HPD sister - she won't stop
« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2016, 05:07:55 PM »
I'm sorry, I skirted right past the scary part!  I'm actually afraid of my brother showing up on my doorstep, as he's 2 hours away (for years he's been at least 12 hours away), and I don't even have any history to suggest I should be physically afraid of him (but I am). 

SO what to do?  When talking to Mom, I think all you can do is gently remind her that it's upsetting to hear about your sister when she brings her up and ask her to understand. If she says it's hurtful to her, you can understand, but your intent is not to hurt her but to protect yourself.  And if she can't stop, get off  the call.  I think you have to prepare to endure some hurt on Mom's part, but I think it's necessary.  Remember that she does already understand, and her hurt will still coexist with that understanding.

Regarding your sis:  Block those anonymous texts.  You've already told her you don't want any contact. I don't think there's anything to gain by any further messages; you'd just be continuing a conversation you want to end, and she'll be angry no matter what you do.  So I wouldn't respond to any attempted contact, and in that I would included any passing of messages through your parents (even if it's your parents telling her to knock it off).   In fact, I wouldn't tell your parents about any attempted contact by her, either; for sister, even the knowledge that you reported her contact could confirm to her that she got to you. 

Regarding her husband:  man, I dunno.  Has he ever threatened you or anyone in the family?  How close do they live to you?  i think the best thing is to plan ahead what you would do IF he (or your sister for that matter) showed up at your front door or confronted you publicly.  My husband has already declared that my brother never sets foot in our house (bless that man).

I've had her number blocked, she's using some 'burner app' to get through to me with new numbers. I don't think it's worth changing my number as she has my work email and home address, etc. I have her filtered on email, so they go to trash. Guess i just need to prepare for when she figures that out and makes a new email account to get to me. I won't read them, and this feels weak to say, but the title will get to me. So will a letter I don't read.

I screwed up big time here by telling my parents I think, and having my dad contact her for me. She knows she got to me like you say, and that's what she wants. Me to be miserable. I freaked out so bad this time because the text was 'on her behalf' in tone and I thought it was her husband at first. That really took it to a new level and scared me. I was prepared for HER to contact me, not him. He never has before since this started. He's never threatened me, but he was arrested and convicted for domestic violence against her (she's the abuser, trust me....he just snapped after taking it too long I'm sure). I'm not condoning physical violence, but knowing her, I know exactly why he did that. She took him back after the arrest and was actually happy, because she could make more rules and control him more. She benefited from the assault. She treats him like her child and she just gained more control over him after that. She is the sole income of the house and she has the arrest and beating to hold over him and made him do her bidding. Would not be surprised if she planned it that way.  Not your typical 'man hits wife' story AT ALL.

If they show up at my front door the plan is to let the dog bark, call 911, and not answer. I live in constant fear they will do something terrible and underhanded, tho. Arson, throw poison over my fence for my dog, something. That household is held together by threads, financially and emotionally. Once one of them thinks they've nothing left to lose all bets are off. I've told my parents we will see them on the morning news before it's all over. She makes good money now, but it's a fluke job she got through connections and not a resume. If she loses it her extravagant lifestyle ends. He is unemployable (felon). My dad has actually helped them with rent before. He makes less than her and has never lived in as expensive a house. Insanity abounds, here. My parents tell me they are paycheck to paycheck. It's a house of cards over a pool of gasoline.

They are 5 minutes away. :(. Trying to pad my resume so I can get a similar-paying job on the other side of the country. It's hell. She sent me a letter (I burned) in January and I caught him driving by my house a couple days later. I want out so bad.

« Last Edit: September 29, 2016, 05:10:04 PM by Jorge Rodriguez »

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goodgirl

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Re: Desperately need NC advice re: HPD sister - she won't stop
« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2016, 05:59:42 PM »
"this feels weak to say, but the title will get to me. So will a letter I don't read."

On the rare occasion my brother's name shows up in my text app, I immediately flush, feel sick and angry and afraid, and sometimes shake.  I totally understand.

Oh my, their proximity to you must be so scary. So outside of the abuse between the two of them, does sister or her hubby either have a history of any of the scary-type behavior you fear?  Not telling you your fears are unfounded, but if they don't have a history, maybe be a little soothed by that fact?

When I found out my brother was moving so close to where we were, I was SO unnerved--and he's two hours away! 

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Jorge Rodriguez

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Re: Desperately need NC advice re: HPD sister - she won't stop
« Reply #8 on: September 29, 2016, 07:17:04 PM »
Not particularly, but my sister this year is not my sister the next. She changes personalities, jobs, religions, etc on a whim.

She became a fundamentalist suburban christian for a while. Shamed people for drinking, or being the wrong denomination of chrisitan, etc. Quoted the bible, sent religious cards for birthdays. Then became an atheist hipster partier, smoking pot, doing coke, binge drinking, hanging out in dive bars, working service industry jobs. Her latest and current phase is classy (in her mind) urban power yuppie, since she got her current job 2 or 3 years ago. Outspends her means trying to keep up this lifestyle.

Her current husband is unstable already, no telling what she'll do to him and what that will make him capable of. Her ex husband never went on a date after their divorce and now lives in his car. Wish I was kidding. It's only a matter of time before she drives someone to suicide. Probably him.

So I literally never know what to expect from her. She has no personality of note. Shallow is the only consistent trait of hers.

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NewFreedom

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Re: Desperately need NC advice re: HPD sister - she won't stop
« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2016, 12:30:54 PM »
Jorge, I am so sorry you're going through all of this. It is so hard, but you seem very strong and proactive.

My simple reply to your complex story- it might be okay to just have a straightforward conversation with your mom about what you want, and what you need. Just tell her that you love her and want a relationship with her, and that you are concerned for her about how your sister treats her. Explain that what you need is for her to not mention your sister around you. (That is your boundary that you are now setting with your mom).

As for your sister, I will echo some of the other responses and say that you don't need to contact her to say you don't want contact anymore. If you go NC and she won't leave you alone, then that's another story!

Wishing you the best!