A question for admin. or anyone who wishes to weigh in...

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solongStockholm

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A question for admin. or anyone who wishes to weigh in...
« on: February 21, 2017, 03:40:40 PM »
I'm new here. This site has been profoundly helpful for me to gain validation for my experience with the many likely PDs in my life. I wish to remain involved in this community to continue receiving support and also- as soon as I'm aware enough of the caustic dynamics at play with PDs - support others as they navigate their own situations. That being said, I have some concerns about some things on this board. I hope this is taken as constructive criticism, as it is intended.

I'm wondering to what extent individuals involved in this community welcome or do not welcome those of us  who have been issued a dx of PD or at least exhibit many PD traits. I've noticed many instances of someone sharing a dx of a PD or CPSTD and an almost immediate suggestion to explore OOTS with a clarification that "this board is for those of us who have PDs in our lives" and suggestions of finding the "right place".

Given that development of PD/PD traits and/or CPTSD stem from trauma, aren't we all sort of in the same boat? I would imagine this being especially true to those of us who came from dysfunctional FOOs. Trauma begets trauma in many of our cases and many of us likely have "fleas", so how can any of us suggest this board is not the "right place" for someone working through similar issues (while also managing their own recovery and learning new behaviors). I don't think anyone should feel ashamed to admit they've been issued a dx. To me, it could imply that the trauma was that much more severe. It comes across to me as that those individuals who many have been issued a dx of PD/PD trait (correctly or wrongfully, none of us including possible that indivudual will know) are viewed as "perpetrators" while those who don't have a dx are strictly "victims"/"survivors". Truthfully, this feels very unfair to me when we include a "Parent Board" for parents to discuss their children who exhibit traits of PD. In some cases, it's plausible to assume some of those parents involved here may have contributed to development of their children's traits/PD. So, in that case they are welcomed here although they too could be somebody's perpetrator.

I grew up with a depressed, addicted mother, enabling N trait father and have been emotionally neglected, ignored and scapegoated at least my entire adolescent years...likely much of my childhood but I am still working to remember those years. My mother modeled behavior that is unstable-unpredictably either under or over reactive. Within 20 seconds of her arriving home from a day of work, I knew by her tone of voice, pattern of foot steps and breathing what kind of person I should pretend to be. She had low self esteem and groomed me to have the same. I was ignored for most of my life. Of course, I have symptoms of PD.  I endured severe emotional neglect.

I feel like the quick response to this will be that the inquiry to find the "right place" is intended to be helpful. I'm sure it is. But please also consider another message that is being sent and potentially deterring individuals from receiving much needed support here.

My suggestion is to add a forum section for those individuals who struggle to balance the PDs in their life while they also contend with the harmful affects of sustained trauma, such as a PD or PD-like traits.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2017, 04:08:56 PM by solongStockholm »

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Spring Butterfly

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Re: A question for admin. or anyone who wishes to weigh in...
« Reply #1 on: February 21, 2017, 04:41:32 PM »
Thanks for posting the question. PD and CPTSD are quite different although there are sometimes overlap in behavior when a CPTSD person is triggered as I am all too aware from my own history.

We sometimes point people to OOTS for a place to focus on their healing journey since that site is dedicated for that purpose and has far more resources than we have here.

Since the focus of this forum is the toxic relationships specifically this is the best place to work through those issues.

We do have the Working on US board for those working through CPTSD and other similar issues for healing and growing.

The hypervigilence you mention in 'taking the temperature of the room' is oh so familiar. Its a topic discussed at length on OOTS and some here also but by far understanding that feeling wasost understood by those there. I frequent both sites personally but at this point in my journey I'm here mostly.

A related topic HSP and Empaths was an amazing leap in my healing
http://outofthefog.net/C-PTSD/forum/index.php?topic=1810.0

Hope that answers your questions bit. Maybe open a topic or two on Working on Us since that's the board for healing?
« Last Edit: February 21, 2017, 05:15:59 PM by Spring Butterfly »
∑ Every interaction w/ PD persons results in damage-plan accordingly, make time to heal
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solongStockholm

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Re: A question for admin. or anyone who wishes to weigh in...
« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2017, 05:15:57 PM »
Yes, PD and CPTSD are different. However, CPTSD as many here can attest is often misdiagnosed as a PD which brings me again to my main concern. Where do people who have been given a PD diagnosis or as having traits of PD go for support when they too have people with PDs affecting their relationships/life/healing journey. It's possible they were misdiagnosed and belong here. And even if they weren't, thy too are victims of trauma seeking support to navigate. I've observed numerous times, the first response to someone noting they have PD or traits being to seek help elsewhere. For example, I read today someone with a diagnosis defending them self that they "belong here" when it was suggested they may not and to look elsewhere. That doesn't feel right to me. All it does is lead to shame and likely people just leaving out that piece of information about themselves. We're all survivors.

I personally don't and never have received a PD dx but at some points in my life exhibited MANY frightening traits of BPD. After years of therapy, I was able to work though and identify the source of those behaviors as deeply rooted in the pain of chronic exposure to high levels of stress in my childhood home, poor modeling and repeated trauma. I wonder how I would have felt years ago if I too was urged to seek help elsewhere when I came here to seek a place of support for dealing with the PDs in my home.

Furthermore, I still don't see how it is allowed for there to be a parent board (for aforementioned reasons that make crystal clear sense to me but were left unaddressed in the initial response). 

I'm not trying to be a pain. I really respect this forum. I'm an advocate at heart and am simply trying to suggest we explore how this community may be more inclusive to those who have "fleas" or full blown PD as they are both symptoms of trauma. I'm also advocating that we either a) add a subsection for these individuals or b) at least be more aware that an initial response to seek help elsewhere may be inappropriate and/or of hinderance to someone getting the support they so need.

Thanks for posting the question. PD and CPTSD are quite different although there are sometimes overlap in behavior when a CPTSD person is triggered as I am all too aware from my own history.

We sometimes point people to OOTS for a place to focus on their healing journey since that site is dedicated for that purpose and has far more resources than we have here.

Since the focus of this forum is the toxic relationships specifically this is the best place to work through those issues.

Hope that answers your questions bit.

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coyote

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Re: A question for admin. or anyone who wishes to weigh in...
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2017, 06:22:56 PM »
solong,
The initial response to those diagnosed or identifying as PD or C-PTSD is not only trying to direct them to where they can get the most support but more importantly to warn them. The warning is something along the lines that there may be members here angry at the PDs in their lives and some of the posting may be triggering for other PDs. There is also the possibility of trying to speak from a PD viewpoint for all PDs.

In the example you mentioned where a person was directed to OOTS I was the one who did that. After the person said they were comfortable here I welcomed them again and said "I hope to see you on the boards."

I am new here as a moderator and don't claim to know as much as others who have been here longer. While I appreciate your effort to make the site as inclusive as possible, I can tell you the admin team here has seen and tried a lot and the format they have now is what they have gleaned as the best from a lot of tried and failed formulas.
How people treat you is their karma; how you react is yours.
 Wayne Dyer

The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Do you understand?
Capt. Jack Sparrow

Choose not to be harmed and you wonít feel harmed. Donít feel harmed and you havenít been. -Marcus Aurelius

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solongStockholm

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Re: A question for admin. or anyone who wishes to weigh in...
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2017, 06:38:02 PM »
Thanks Coyote. I appreciate both of your responses. I do feel heard and I do appreciate the moderators here. I can only imagine how much effort goes in to maintaining this site. I hope my comments were received in the intended light.

So, I know it's up to each person to decide whether or not they would like to share a dx with the group. And I do understand in a forum such as this there may be consequences of sharing certain pieces of information. Truly, some of this started with me viewing the parent board and feeling triggered in a way I didn't expect from a support forum. But I suppose many experience that all the time from unintended triggers. This is all new to me. Still figuring it out. Thanks for listening.

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xredshoesx

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Re: A question for admin. or anyone who wishes to weigh in...
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2017, 06:42:21 PM »
if someone shares a dx, we only ask that they post within the guidelines.

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Bloomie

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Re: A question for admin. or anyone who wishes to weigh in...
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2017, 06:45:19 PM »
solongStockholm - just wanted to add something that I hope will be helpful - when a new member arrives here we welcome them and if they mention their varying concerns we try to point them toward resources that will best support them in their healing and recovery, while also doing them the courtesy of letting them know what we do here and what the focus of the forum is. In doing this we hope to give a new member the opportunity to decide if the forum is the best place for them.

Those responses are truly designed as a kindness and include a welcome to continue posting here as long as the focus of the posts remains within the scope of the forum and is something we can offer support for. The heart of this forum is that people would find the help and support they are so earnestly seeking and being clear about what we offer and are not equipped to offer here,  is one way we attempt to show kindness and help to others.

One other aspect that has not been brought forward is that the leadership of this forum - from the highly technical aspects needed to keep a huge amount of data and processes fine tuned and smoothly functioning, to administrating and moderating a highly active and diverse community this size that crosses cultural and geographic lines - is 100% volunteer.

Those that spend hours a week behind the scenes in addition to having full time work and family responsibilities, challenges with healing and recovery from their own trauma, and continually seeking to support and encourage the community here, have to recognize our limits. Keeping the content of the forum, with the exception of The Cafe and Working On Us, focused on the part of the population that is seeking to be equipped to handle the PD relationships in their lives is the purpose of this community.

The leadership here does welcome anyone who has a relationship with a PD or suspected PD person, whose behaviors are hurting them to join us here for support. Having a PD, or fleas, or exhibiting some of the traits that may indicate a PD, does not exclude anyone from being part of this community. The message is only that this forum, with a narrow exception of the Working on Us board, is not for working through our own issues.

Your questions are valid and appreciated. Most of us here do find ourselves triggered from time to time and we learn to step away from those threads or parts of the forum that may set that off in us. Most importantly, you are welcome here and I personally have had the pleasure of responding in a really thought provoking and great thread that you started. We are glad you are here! See ya out there on the boards!


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Spring Butterfly

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Re: A question for admin. or anyone who wishes to weigh in...
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2017, 07:27:30 PM »
One other thought is the welcome we might do for a new member with CPTSD would be different if a member identifies as PD since the PD person is welcome to discuss other PD persons and challenges in those relationships but not their own recovery journey or challenges per guidelines. PD persons also cannot post from the perspective of a PD person as an advocate of sorts per guidelines. So we try to gently remind a new member of these guidelines for their protection and that of other members.

The difference between PD and CPTSD isn't the depth of trauma but how the trauma is processed. A CPTSD person is self aware, generally PD are not but there are exceptions and boards that exist to support their wellness journey.

Regarding children with PD there are other trauma sources besides the home where a child would develop PD as well as homes where one parent or ex spouse is PD and caused trauma. We do not recommend reading that board if you were raised by PD as it is triggering the same as those with PD children might want to steer clear of the Dealing with PD Parents board. We have had issue when folks from either visit the other as triggers result in issues that need intervention and moderating.

The misdiagnosis of CPTSD as BPD is a topic on OOTS as well.

If someone *self* diagnoses as PD I often point to Fleas or CPTSD in my welcome since the person is self aware if they are here looking for help. My personal unprofessional opinion is that would lean more toward Fleas or CPTSD. However we do get members professionaly diagnosed PD and need to gently remind of the guidelines.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2017, 07:49:16 PM by Spring Butterfly »
∑ Every interaction w/ PD persons results in damage-plan accordingly, make time to heal
∑ Individuation is one key to emotional freedom
∑ It's foolish to expect of others what they have no capacity to give
my Empowered Growth blog

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solongStockholm

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Re: A question for admin. or anyone who wishes to weigh in...
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2017, 08:24:18 AM »
Thank you all for your time and thoughtful responses. And thank you for clarifying some important points too.