Can anyone relate to any of this? BPD mother's effects on me as an adult

  • 48 Replies
  • 4640 Views
*

SunnyMeadow

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 955
I wouldn't give her the option of next time. "Mom , you said that you feel that I'm toxic and mentally il. For your mental health, I'm going to allow you to take some time off from me so I can work on myself. Once I'm able to handle things again I'll contact you."
Then stick to it and allow her accusations to blow up in her face.

This is good VI!

And when she continually texts, (and she will) let her know you're still working on yourself and aren't ready to subject her to your toxic ways.

*

jennsc85

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 404
I'm completely prepared (well as prepared as I can be) to tell her exactly what Vivid Imagination suggested, whenever this happens again because I know it will sooner or later.

So, is there any possible way that she could take that as an admission that I'm mentally unstable and possibly use it against me? I mean, I've got sufficient living space, running water and a child proofed home so I'm not really worried about CPS but I'm still afraid of that threat and what my mother could use against me. Any time that I've (sarcastically) said "Yes, I'm so mentally ill" she mentions that she should be putting in a call to children's services.

Once she grabbed my purse with my phone and keys and locked herself in her bedroom with it when I announced I wanted to leave after some crazy blow up at her house. When she came out, I attempted to grab my purse from her and in the process "bruised" her hand and she threatened to call the children's services on me. I was so distraught over this that I ended up profusely apologizing even though looking back I know it wasn't my fault, but ugh. I wonder if she could use something like that against me, if she's taken notes or pictures or who knows what.

*

Zebrastriped

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 479
jennsc85, wow, you can start a hot discussion.  I'd wondered why I respond better to a "crisis" than to everyday life and all the stuff you typed made sense to me.  Now that I have an explanation, maybe I can work on steady progress more productively.

That is some strange stuff your mother is doing and saying.  Not a judgement, uBPDmom responds to any future plans for her care that she doesn't like by threatening to stop taking her life saving medication.  I'm not sure how to best prepare for so many different scenarios that upset you or are meant to do so.  As a general defense, I would just recommend that you never let her see how much you are affected by what she does or says. 

If she is threatening to call agencies on you, why are you going back?  If you are comfortable answering or thinking about that question?

At one point, I was worried about uBPDmom making the outside world believe that dad mistreated her.  She bruises easy and went thru a phase where she acted afraid of him.  She still has the martyr thing going, not leaving her coat, purse and shoes on the main floor because (insert shifting reason I pay no attention to) and struggles up the stairs with COPD and bad balance every time before she goes out.  At any rate, suggestions were made from the group here that I keep a log of what I saw on my once a week visits to protect myself and dad if possible from accusations way drifted from reality.  It helped keep me calm and the need for it diminished after a month or so.

You are very brave to share all this.  I wish I had more pleasant 'answers' for all of us.

*

Spring Butterfly

  • Spring Butterfly
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • 17177
  • You can be free and heal ❤️‍🩹
    • One Key to Better Boundaries
It's a perfect response! Nice one Vivid!

"you said that you feel that..." I hear no admission of anything just an acknowledgement that she said she feels a certain way. If you're more comfortable leave out the part about working on yourself. You're just allowing her space when a break away from you since she feels you're toxic to her. 

If the wording feels to much an admission that will cause you concern she will use against you and your children shorten it to just "Mom since you said that you feel that I'm toxic for you then for your mental health I'm going to allow you to take some time off from me and let you make your own transportation arrangements"
« Last Edit: March 01, 2017, 11:12:52 PM by Spring Butterfly »
Every interaction w/ PD persons results in damage-plan accordingly, make time to heal
Individuation is one key to emotional freedom
It's foolish to expect of others what they have no capacity to give
my Empowered Growth blog

*

VividImagination

  • Fear is not real; it is a product of the thoughts you create. Danger is very real, but fear is a choice. - After Earth
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 7491
  • Vivid the Blunt
Any time that I've (sarcastically) said "Yes, I'm so mentally ill" she mentions that she should be putting in a call to children's services.

Call her bluff. "If you're so concerned, you certainly should do so. Just remember that malicious reporting is a misdemeanor."

I've worked very closely with CPS in my state for years, even provided training for investigators. Unless an investigator can PROVE (photos taken in the home, doctor's reports, lab results) that a child is in IMMINENT and IMMEDIATE danger (hazards in the home, no electricity or running water, extreme filth) a child cannot be removed from the home. It takes an act of God to even get an open case. I read a report that in my state 70% of the complaints called in were malicious and false, often by vengeful family members. SEVENTY PERCENT - that's huge! From what you've said, you have nothing to worry about. CPS is well aware of the crazy, angry old ladies whose daughters aren't toeing the line.

Once she grabbed my purse with my phone and keys and locked herself in her bedroom with it when I announced I wanted to leave after some crazy blow up at her house. When she came out, I attempted to grab my purse from her and in the process "bruised" her hand and she threatened to call the children's services on me. I was so distraught over this that I ended up profusely apologizing even though looking back I know it wasn't my fault, but ugh. I wonder if she could use something like that against me, if she's taken notes or pictures or who knows what.

This scenario is quite easy. For starters, never take your purse in her house again. Lock it in your trunk, and keep your phone and keys in your pocket at all times. If something like this ever did happen again, that's an instant 911 call that your mother has stolen your belongings and will not allow you to leave the house.

I wonder if she could use something like that against me, if she's taken notes or pictures or who knows what.

Have you ever heard of burden of proof? She has to prove that you did something. A picture of a bruise proves nothing. I actually have a picture on my phone right now of my son's bruised arm. In the eyes of a stranger, it is meaningless...a picture of a bruised arm. How does anyone know whose arm it is? How can anyone know WHO caused the bruise and how? Unless there was a witness or surveillance footage, a picture of a bruise is meaningless. Notes? I can write down anything I want. Here:

"Spring Butterfly came over to my house last night and beat the everloving crap out of me. I have a photo on my phone of a bruised arm. She is mentally unstable."

I even posted my "notes" on the Internet, so hey...it must be valid.

Jenn, I am in NO way trying to minimize your fears or make fun of them. I was in your shoes for 38 years, terrified of my insane mother and believing that the only reason the sun rose and set each day was because the AllPowerful NM deemed it so. What I'm trying to do is show you that your thought process needs an overhaul - you are operating from a place of fear instead of a place of logic.  When your mother makes these ridiculous threats you revert back into a helpless, terrified little girl who will do whatever it takes to appease Mommy - she knows that, which is exactly why she does it - to keep you compliant.

Change your thoughts and you change your world. You've made so many big strides in a very short amount of time. Your mother is bullying you severely, using terror tactics to keep you in the role she has created for you. The next time you feel yourself getting anxious, take a deep breath and think, "If this was a stranger who did this, what would I do? If this was a stranger, would I put up with this behavior?"
There are three solutions to every problem: accept it, change it, or leave it. If you cannot accept it, change it. I f you cannot change it, leave it.

Sometimes you're damned if you don't and damned if you do, so damn well do what's best for you.

*

jennsc85

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 404
Vivid Imagination- thank you for all of your logical words. I know my thought process is completely off kilter and needs a total overhaul. I'm trying, step by step. I guess by her controlling me as a child which she was able to do because I was a child, I've never been able to shake that as an adult. I feel like it's logical that the police would believe her over me, but I know that ISN'T logical.

She called me last night 25 times when I was asleep and sent a barrage of text messages. It was over nothing. It was over something I said I'd drop by her place this morning and she wanted to make sure I was going to do it. I'm so glad I had my phone turned to silent. And she threatned in two of the texts to call the police... but no one heard any knocks on the door last night. So it WAS an empty threat that time.

*

Spring Butterfly

  • Spring Butterfly
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • 17177
  • You can be free and heal ❤️‍🩹
    • One Key to Better Boundaries
Jenn you are doing amazingly well! I'm so glad you had the phone shut off last night and got some good sleep as you deserve. You need sleep in order to cope with the crazy and life in general.

That level of control with a just a tone or a look is difficult to fathom. Looking back it boggles my mind there was that level of control into my fifties. Most of us were groomed from birth to respond to that level of control, groomed to believe the all knowing adult in charge of our care. There was no reason as a child to think otherwise but now we know, and we can not unknow. Once our eyes see the fog it's only a matter of time before there is no fog. The fog, the fear obligation guilt, exists only in our head if we allow it. Now that we're adults and we see it we have that choice. You are making great choices!
Every interaction w/ PD persons results in damage-plan accordingly, make time to heal
Individuation is one key to emotional freedom
It's foolish to expect of others what they have no capacity to give
my Empowered Growth blog

*

Houstorm

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 125
Jenn, thank you for being so brave and sharing your story on your thread.  I've learned so much from you and the responses, and I can relate to a lot of what you experienced (crisis mode being exciting, mean girl bonding with mom, etc).  I want to respond to your original post where you describe how your mom steamrolled over others in conversations.  That is my mom, too.  For years I thought it was so strange how anything at all for my mom would be a starting point for an uninterrupted long story about herself.  I was so starved for genuinely connecting with people, that I would listen to mom's never-ending story about her so we could connect, and I modeled her behavior in friendships (though it felt unnatural), believing that one way to forge connections with people and show them that you understand and empathize was to respond to their story with a story about yourself.  Finally I realized that people just want you to listen, validate, support, empathize, not to talk about yourself.  My mom seems to have zero capacity for empathy and she loves to talk about herself.  She can't listen to anything, just wants to talk about herself (one exception being scandalous gossip about other that she loves to hear and repeat).  Oh the repeat stories about how hot mom was (with showing a picture of her in a bikini, while she shamed my body as a child and teen), and what an amazing student she was, all A's.

I hope you are feeling good today.  You are very strong and making great progress re-circuiting your thinking.  I'm inspired by your story, and I hope your mom leaves you alone and stops the phone calls and empty threats.  Thank you for your story and everyone's response.  I am learning from all of you.  I worry my parents might try to pull some threats involving lawsuits etc. regarding access to my kids.  But for now they're giving me ST in response to my boundaries and I am working on emotionally detaching from them, and learning from this wonderful community about possible responses to threats.  Thanks everyone!

*

VividImagination

  • Fear is not real; it is a product of the thoughts you create. Danger is very real, but fear is a choice. - After Earth
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 7491
  • Vivid the Blunt
And she threatned in two of the texts to call the police... but no one heard any knocks on the door last night. So it WAS an empty threat that time.

I'm so glad she did this....what a great lesson for you. She is well aware that you are fine. She has no intention of calling the police, CPS, or anyone else because she knows she has no basis. You can ignore these threats in the future.

A word of warning, however...Once she realizes her control is slipping, she will most likely ramp up this behavior in what's called an extinction burst. It's very similar to the way a toddler will increase tantrum behavior in order to maintain attention. Like with a toddler, you must ignore it completely. She may even escalate to calling the police in a fit of anger, but we all know how that will end.

" Officer, I'm so sorry you've been bothered. My mother has been acting very erratic lately and I've had to pull back from most of my contact with her. She's angry about that and has threatened calling you multiple times as punishment. You must get this kind of thing all the time."
There are three solutions to every problem: accept it, change it, or leave it. If you cannot accept it, change it. I f you cannot change it, leave it.

Sometimes you're damned if you don't and damned if you do, so damn well do what's best for you.

*

SeaSalt

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 257
Jenn take some time for yourself and work on your feelings. Right now you can not say anything nice since your throughs have not been heard and you have a need to express it, a need for her to knowledge it. She will probably never acknowledge anything unless she has no other means to get to you. But she will never mean it. Dont give her anymore the power over your feelings. They are yours and by taking responsibility of your feelings, you take back the power of changing them if you want. You can acknowledge your truth and other people and this can give you peace. Also working on yourself and letting go of the guilt that is not yours( she does not take responsibility for her actions, so you might be doing it instead of her without even realizing it). She is not making you sick, your thoughts about what she does make you sick. So control your thoughts. Its much better explained in this text, take a look, it changed my life http://www.innerbonding.com/DearGodHowCanIHeal.pdf  One  day she will be doing the same bad things but they will not affect you the same way anymore. That is the goal of our journey. You can not change her, nor allow her anymore that your happiness depends on her behavior. One day when it will all depende entirely on you, she will be powerless over you. My mother says such a nasty things to me now and i do not care anymore. I tell her, no its not true, i go now, dont want to listen to your nonsense and i go and i continue my day like nothing happend and she says these things less and less since she sees that it does not work the way she wants. And I think: its a shame, but my mother is sick and she is saying these nonsense because she has this disorder, its not me, i did not deserve it, and it useless to waste more time trying to understand it, there is no logic in what she says and does. and i continue my day normally, like nothing happened. i wish you that. its a true freedom, true power. Even though i know i can not hear her more then once a month and see her more then once a year otherwise i would not be able to handle it so well. You need to see what is the time you can spend around her without getting affected too much and out that as a boundary.

what you said about the crisis, resonates a lot with me. i have never understood this before. Thank you. I have always secretly hoped for kind of war or earthquake to happen but i had no idea why. now i finally understand. we lived a war and other tragedies and in those times, i was left in peace, my mother was distracted and i had the time of my life. thank you so much for clarifying this to me.

*

SeaSalt

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 257
I did not see many answered that others and you wrote. If you are worried if she can use something against you, then do not give her any material anymore. do never write ugly sms or say something against yourself. dont fall in her traps. remaining calm is a super power and you can work on developing it. if you are not doing anything illegal, she has nothing on you. she can try to lie but she will not since you can bring many testimonies that would prove that its a lie. you can also see different doctors that will prove that you are not mentally ill. when she accuse you, she is actually talking about herself. she drops nonsense non stop to see what are you going to react to then she will stick to that. dont react ever in front of her. react after if you need when she is gone but dont give her anymore info on what upsets you. like that you will take power over you away from her. if you are paranonic, then record one conversation in which she acts crazy and you calm. that will be your secret weapon. you dont need to ever use it, but knowing that you have it, will make you feel safer.

*

MLR

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 721
Is there any way at all you can have someone with you as a witness so she will behave?   You are always alone with her when she gets nasty.

Start printing out or saving your monthly phone bill that shows all calls to and from your phone.  Calling someone TWENTY FIVE times in one evening is NOT normal.  Get a highlighter and mark all her calls and texts.

It may not feel like it, but things are getting better.  You are gaining your freedom.

*

jennsc85

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 404
Printing out my phone bill is a great idea- I hadn't thought of that. When I woke up this morning and saw all the text messages and missed calls, my heart was pounding. I was literally shaking as I was getting ready for work. And why??? I mean, obviously she didn't call the police, nothing happened, I'm an ADULT... there's no reason for me to be that shaken up and nervous but I am! I want to get to the point where I can wake up to 25, 50...shoot, 200! missed calls and not feel extremely paranoid that something bad is going to happen from me having not answered. I am really glad that I took to the turning my phone off at 8 every night. At first when I heard the suggestion I thought it wouldn't make much difference, but last night proved otherwise. If I'd had my phone on I would have been up all night worried to death over absolutely nothing. At least I was sleeping peacefully instead!

*

jennsc85

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 404
Jenn, thank you for being so brave and sharing your story on your thread.  I've learned so much from you and the responses, and I can relate to a lot of what you experienced (crisis mode being exciting, mean girl bonding with mom, etc).  I want to respond to your original post where you describe how your mom steamrolled over others in conversations.  That is my mom, too.  For years I thought it was so strange how anything at all for my mom would be a starting point for an uninterrupted long story about herself.  I was so starved for genuinely connecting with people, that I would listen to mom's never-ending story about her so we could connect, and I modeled her behavior in friendships (though it felt unnatural), believing that one way to forge connections with people and show them that you understand and empathize was to respond to their story with a story about yourself.  Finally I realized that people just want you to listen, validate, support, empathize, not to talk about yourself.  My mom seems to have zero capacity for empathy and she loves to talk about herself.  She can't listen to anything, just wants to talk about herself (one exception being scandalous gossip about other that she loves to hear and repeat).  Oh the repeat stories about how hot mom was (with showing a picture of her in a bikini, while she shamed my body as a child and teen), and what an amazing student she was, all A's.

I hope you are feeling good today.  You are very strong and making great progress re-circuiting your thinking.  I'm inspired by your story, and I hope your mom leaves you alone and stops the phone calls and empty threats.  Thank you for your story and everyone's response.  I am learning from all of you.  I worry my parents might try to pull some threats involving lawsuits etc. regarding access to my kids.  But for now they're giving me ST in response to my boundaries and I am working on emotionally detaching from them, and learning from this wonderful community about possible responses to threats.  Thanks everyone!

Thank you so much for this! Everyone on this site has been so very helpful to me. From the time I can remember I always felt like something with my mother was not right but I had no idea what it was and I felt so alone in it. I'd tell my friends stories about what was going on at home and they'd look at me like I had two heads. Then they'd meet my mother and think she was fun and nice and I'd wonder if it was really me who was crazy. It was only recently well into my adulthood that I realized there was a real problem in the form of a serious personality disorder that was the reason behind all of this.

The steamrolling and incessant narcissistic talking is something that I got to be so uncomfortable with once I realized what was going on. I'd hear the other person trying to say something and my mother would just keep talking, not even acknowledging them! After their interaction ended I remember trying to tell her that the other person wanted to say something but she accused me of God-knows-what and eventually I stopped trying to help her and tell her about it, instead I just cringed for her and tried to look apologetic to the other person so they knew that I wasn't like that too. I made such an effort to be a listener and not interrupt people and not center on myself. I'm actually really uncomfortable talking about myself too much, even when people ask questions! I feel like I'm being a bother or annoying and can hear my mother in my head, talking and talking.

*

VividImagination

  • Fear is not real; it is a product of the thoughts you create. Danger is very real, but fear is a choice. - After Earth
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 7491
  • Vivid the Blunt
When I woke up this morning and saw all the text messages and missed calls, my heart was pounding. I was literally shaking as I was getting ready for work. And why???

Because your reptilian brain remembers that missed calls and texts trigger a rage from your mother. Rage = terror and trauma, and your reptilian brain flooded your body with adrenaline to invoke a fight, flight, or freeze response to protect yourself. It will take a while before your body rids itself of cortisol, the hormone that helps your brain remember the trauma and stimulates that response. Each time this happens and no rage or trauma follows, your body will have this reaction less and less until it no longer occurs. Your reptilian brain has no logic and doesn't care what the facts are - it just knows that in the past when Mommy gets angry that means Jenn gets hurt. Your body is trying to send you a message to protect yourself. Just breathe, meditate, pray, whatever...I find that exercise is the best way to get through these responses.

You're doing amazing. Has she tried to contact you since?
There are three solutions to every problem: accept it, change it, or leave it. If you cannot accept it, change it. I f you cannot change it, leave it.

Sometimes you're damned if you don't and damned if you do, so damn well do what's best for you.

*

VividImagination

  • Fear is not real; it is a product of the thoughts you create. Danger is very real, but fear is a choice. - After Earth
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 7491
  • Vivid the Blunt
My mother did the incessant talking thing too. It was so humiliating. I would actually wait until she was momentarily distracted and whisper, "Run while you can...seriously!" Some just smiled like I was being funny, but most...ran. Fast and far.
There are three solutions to every problem: accept it, change it, or leave it. If you cannot accept it, change it. I f you cannot change it, leave it.

Sometimes you're damned if you don't and damned if you do, so damn well do what's best for you.

*

jennsc85

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 404
She sent me a text on my lunch hour and said that she was very worried last night but made no mention of anything else. I responded an hour or so later and told her that I was asleep. She asked what would have happened if she'd had a medical emergency. I didn't respond (but my answer in my head is-- if it was really an emergency you'd call an ambulance not your daughter!)

*

VividImagination

  • Fear is not real; it is a product of the thoughts you create. Danger is very real, but fear is a choice. - After Earth
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 7491
  • Vivid the Blunt
Tell her next time. That's a ridiculous excuse.
There are three solutions to every problem: accept it, change it, or leave it. If you cannot accept it, change it. I f you cannot change it, leave it.

Sometimes you're damned if you don't and damned if you do, so damn well do what's best for you.

*

Spring Butterfly

  • Spring Butterfly
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • 17177
  • You can be free and heal ❤️‍🩹
    • One Key to Better Boundaries
Yup dial 911 seriously you're not the right number for medical emergency. You're doing so great! Hang in there.

What Vivid calls reptilian brain I call the trained inner child, programmed to monitor the mood to avoid harm. Pete Walker calls this emotional flashback, the emotions are real but displaced in time. Whatever you call it give the brain time to build new synapses and neural pathways and the body time to heal. Limiting contact allows room for that healing.
Every interaction w/ PD persons results in damage-plan accordingly, make time to heal
Individuation is one key to emotional freedom
It's foolish to expect of others what they have no capacity to give
my Empowered Growth blog

*

stasia

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 756
She asked what would have happened if she'd had a medical emergency. I didn't respond (but my answer in my head is-- if it was really an emergency you'd call an ambulance not your daughter!)

Jenn, I fantasize about saying this to my M too. She says this all the time, that I have to be reachable at all times in case of medical emergency, and BTW how dare I live an hour away from her and not own a car because "what if I needed you here in a hurry in an emergency?" Of course, she would decline all medical intervention and she has refused to let paramedics help her before, so the chances of her calling 911 are zero. She would just want me to go there and maintain her house and take care of her zillion cats.  :stars:

Funny how they think that we're medical professionals capable of dealing with health emergencies!

At some point I'll probably end up saying it out loud to her.