"you're just jealous of your sister"

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daughter

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"you're just jealous of your sister"
« on: July 31, 2017, 11:24:04 AM »
"You're just jealous of your sister" is NBM's oft-expressed rationalization of her bad behavior towards me.  When I've flagged her blatant favoritism, her obvious malice towards me, not just NBM's lopsided gift-giving, but also her obvious lack of emotional support and absence of any affection towards me, that's what I'd hear:  "you're just jealous!".  I'd calmly respond with fact: "no, you treat us very differently", to no avail.  If I flagged NBM's malevolence towards me, her blatant favoritism towards GC "princess" nsis and her coexisting mistreatment of "Cinderella" me, I'd get blame-projection: I am The Big Problem.  That's how NBM rationalizes her disrespect and disdain towards me, and towards others: they're all just jealous of her, or of my GC "princess" nsis, her BFF "mini-me", her alter-ego.  It's also how NBM rationalized her obvious not-nice demeanor towards my long-suffering SG maternal aunt, who NBM abused for years in my presence; projection: my aunt's just jealous of NBM.  I see many many similarities in our relationship and NBM's relationship with her only sibling, "Aunt SG"; in both instances, we're  "just jealous", rather than designated easy-target SGs of NBM, a self-entitled virulent NPD personality.  And in same manner I'm nsis' SG too, given that GC nsis is NBM's empowered BFF "mini-me", learning by example.  It's all delusional thinking, but impossible to redirect or challenge.   

This weekend oldest DS told me: "Grandma says you're jealous of Aunt Nsis", as "reason" for our estrangement.  NBM has blamed my NC decision to that falsely-perceived "jealousy" character-flaw in ME.  (After all, my parents' lack of fairness, respect, and kindness, their bad behavior, disdain, and disregard, can't be acknowledged as real problems, even if NF often told me: "your mother doesn't like you", as if these are perfectly normal parental-behaviors.)  So I asked DS if NBM has ever said anything kind about me; to which DS noted - "no, mom, never".  I'm entirely to blame; I'm "just jealous".  Again, impossible to redirect or challenge.   
« Last Edit: July 31, 2017, 12:02:01 PM by daughter »

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blacksheep7

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Re: "you're just jealous of your sister"
« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2017, 12:22:01 PM »
Hi Daughter,
Even though my Mother is not BP, I can relate with your Mother's words of jealousy.  I'm sorry that you have to go through that, not pleasant at all.  I had a conversation with Mother about 2 weeks ago and she told me that she has a very good relationship with my sister (the lost child) saying that they have a good time when they are together, laughing and so on. They both live in a Fantasy Land, where babies and animals are cute.    All this was said as I talking about my relationship with her.  I tried once again to be understood and have  some emotional support, instead she compared me with sis.  She told me I was secretive. It just bugs the hell out of her and always did that I was/am independent.  My sister is a submissive wife, has no life, no friends and is enmeshed with Mother.  I am completely the opposite.
I wonder why our parents ask us " how are you" but can not listen if we tell them and then to top it off I will be told that I never tell her anything :stars:
All I heard was that sis had it harder in life than me, really?  After that conversation, I finally realized that I will Never, Ever get anything from her Unless I am a Dutiful Daughter and attend to her needs.  She has described my sister as "easy" to our cousins who were visiting from Europe. 
My relationship with her is no relationship, not interested!  I just can not have any feelings for that woman when all I feel is conditional love.
Take care
I may be the black sheep of the family, but some of the white sheep are not as white as they try to appear.

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practical

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Re: "you're just jealous of your sister"
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2017, 01:14:43 PM »
It is a dead end, an accusation you cannot argue with especially when leveraged against you by a PD parent. The amazing think is that at the same time she is saying you are jealous, she is saying I'm better, I'm special (and so is your Sis/mini-me) and that is why Daughter is jealous. Nobody is jealous of Jane Doe, but she is extra special in her grandiose delusions, coupled with blaming and shaming. Sorry she is telling the same crap to your DS, I hope he can see through it.

My M used to try to incite jealousy between B and me, friends and me. She didn't get that jealousy isn't a feeling for me, it isn't how my mind works. It played such a large part in her life including being jealous of me.
If Im not towards myself, who is towards myself? And when Im only towards myself, what am I? And if not now, when? (Rabbi Hillel)

"I can forgive, but I cannot afford to forget." (Moglow)

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Bloomie

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Re: "you're just jealous of your sister"
« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2017, 01:24:22 PM »
Quote from: daughter
impossible to redirect or challenge
Truly impossible to penetrate the brick wall of denial and self aggrandizement you are up against in this thinking. That blatant mistreatment and outright favoritism has no net effect, one parent normalizing another parent's dislike of their child and so much more has pushed you to this point and their take is it is all due to YOUR jealousy....:no:

Quote
So I asked DS if NBM has ever said anything kind about me; to which DS noted - "no, mom, never".

And there is the crux of the matter and what a wise question to ask your DS. Something I am sure he will ponder in all of this.

The repeated pattern of malevolence toward other female family members - your aunt and yourself - and the engulfment of your sister who validates your mother's life choices as serves at her pleasure it would seem - a telling generational template.

My own uBPD/NPDmother would be the sun, moon, and stars in all of her family's universe. Period. If she was not given that role in our lives and we didn't orbit around her and allow ourselves to be used and manipulated, abused and pitted against each other, we were also deemed selfish and jealous.

Something that came out of the blatant and often malicious overt favoritism was I accepted it as her choice even as a young child. I realized it was wrong, but something I couldn't change and wanted no part of. In doing so, it somehow freed me from struggling with jealousy or envy in my own life.

But my mother... oh so grandiose and oh so eaten with jealousy and paranoia that others wanted what she had, and others wanted to be who she was, wanted her favor, her attention, to be like her. Um... nope. Not one little bit.

Also interesting, in my own mother's case, this world view and having only a few select people she showed favor to, and the airs of superiority that permeated her thinking made her incredibly vulnerable to being taken advantage of by these favored ones, and taken advantage of she was.
"You can understand and have compassion for someone and still not want a relationship with them."
Amanda E. White, LPC @therapyforwomen

Bloomie 🌸

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newme_whodis

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Re: "you're just jealous of your sister"
« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2017, 09:45:54 PM »
"Aunt SG"; in both instances, we're  "just jealous", rather than designated easy-target SGs of NBM, a self-entitled virulent NPD personality.

Every time, I'm amazed by what people with NPD/BPD will say to children. This is awful, and I hope DS' exposure to NBM/Nsis "mini me-ing" and splitting is low.

This jealousy-as-blame dynamic has permeated my FOO too. Having oscillated between being both SG and GC as an only child, I've been accused of jealousy of uBPDm, AND have been the object of other people's jealously when convenient for parents. Both are extremely limited objectifications, reducing people to characteristics that mirror only what PD wants them to mirror, to protect their fragile, empty self-concept. It's completely frustrating, and not worth challenging: you'll have all the evidence of mistreatment, but no matter how it's presented, their inner PD-jury will never absorb it. Good on you for letting out some frustration here. Take care of yourself.  :)

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all4peace

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Re: "you're just jealous of your sister"
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2017, 10:39:31 PM »
I'm not sure what it is, exactly, but I alllllllways feel  :mad: when I read about how your parents and sister have treated you. It is galling that they still try to manipulate your son's affections and opinions.

I am soon to be in shoes similar to yours, sending children into adulthood, and possibly into the waiting arms of family who have built up a deadly amount of blame and hate. With my own NC with DH's family, one thing I have worked on is ridding myself of bitterness. Not only is it deadly to me, but I don't want it poisoning my household. I have also begun recently to talk again about Dh's family, as in funny anecdotes or remembering times we have had together. I very much don't intend to confuse our children, as there is no movement in our relations with them, but one thing I hope to accomplish is make it very clear that this breach isn't over such things as jealousy, hate, bitterness or anger. I hope to make it clear that we are happy in our lives, and wish them happiness in theirs, but that they are not safe for our family at this time and therefore our interactions with them will be very carefully chosen, brief and (at this time) not include me.

So.... to the point.... one thing I'd be tempted to tell your son is something along the lines of "I'm sorry to hear that gma is still talking about my relationship with aunt X. When people have behaved themselves well with their children, they generally don't need to keep justifying themselves decades later."

As for jealousy, how about something along the lines of "Jealous? What an interesting thing to think. No, I'm not jealous of aunt X but I am very sad that my parents weren't able to be fair and kind to both of us. It does terrible damage to a family when parents play favorites."

My point is that it's hard for these kinds of messages to reach our children's hearts when they actually know us to be very different from what the PDs are claiming us to be.

I guess you didn't ask for advice, so may I ask how you do handle messages like these? And I do believe that one intention may be that these words are very much intended to reach your ears.

I'm sorry for you that they reach out from NC to try to hurt you anyway. And so very sorry that they're still in your son's life. :bighug:

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enufbs

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Re: "you're just jealous of your sister"
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2017, 01:23:23 AM »
This is disturbing. I have read many postings by you, daughter. Your writing is some of the most insightful and articulate writing on this site. This is a difficult one. I suggest you say nothing. Maybe "Hmmm" or "oh" and then, just nothing. This is an attack. And you don't have to respond to it. We don't always have to be in defense mode. And, I'm not sure there is anything you can say that will mitigate anything. Just let your mother self destruct. She sounds like she's her worst enemy.

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footprint

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Re: "you're just jealous of your sister"
« Reply #7 on: August 01, 2017, 02:15:36 AM »
This is disturbing. I have read many postings by you, daughter. Your writing is some of the most insightful and articulate writing on this site. This is a difficult one. I suggest you say nothing. Maybe "Hmmm" or "oh" and then, just nothing. This is an attack. And you don't have to respond to it. We don't always have to be in defense mode. And, I'm not sure there is anything you can say that will mitigate anything. Just let your mother self destruct. She sounds like she's her worst enemy.

 :yeahthat:
Honestly, daughter, you've been through so much.  I've also read your posts over the past few years and they are so insightful, perceptive and just fully aware of the situations you and many of us here are going through. I'm saddened to think that your NPDM has access to your daughter and can influence her in any way. But actually, I think that perhaps your daughter is aware of what's going on.

This weekend oldest DS told me: "Grandma says you're jealous of Aunt Nsis", as "reason" for our estrangement.  NBM has blamed my NC decision to that falsely-perceived "jealousy" character-flaw in ME.  (After all, my parents' lack of fairness, respect, and kindness, their bad behavior, disdain, and disregard, can't be acknowledged as real problems, even if NF often told me: "your mother doesn't like you", as if these are perfectly normal parental-behaviors.)  So I asked DS if NBM has ever said anything kind about me; to which DS noted - "no, mom, never".  I'm entirely to blame; I'm "just jealous".  Again, impossible to redirect or challenge.   

Your response to your DS really seems perfect, and I'm not sure what more you could say.  You did redirect, asking her if anything positive was said.  She reflected and said that no, nothing positive was ever said.  The question that you asked truly was the perfect one.

Another point that I would make is that it's perfectly natural and normal for the scapegoated sibling to be "jealous" of the GC.  I feel that we SGs often feel that we have to deflect the criticism that we were jealous.  I'm no longer in contact with NPD parents so don't deal with their criticisms of me in this way straight ahead (they also say that I am a jealous person and have always been envious of my two loser brothers). However, I have started to tell other people, including my own children, that I was mistreated from a young age, and that NPD parents' favoritism of my brothers naturally made me feel that things were unfair, and sure, that I wanted things my brothers got, especially love, and so was jealous of them because I did not get those things. One thing that put this all into perspective for me was having my own two children. I've told my kids, "imagine if I gave everything to DS/DD, how would that make you feel (DS or DD, depending on whom I'm talking to)?" They are now ages 8 and 6, and they always tell me that they would want those things too, that they would be "jealous." 

Big hugs to you, daughter.  I know you've really been through the ringer with your NPD parents and NPD GC sister. I wish you much peace and hope that your DD is able to comprehend some of what you went through when you were young, to validate you, and to love you.

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footprint

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Re: "you're just jealous of your sister"
« Reply #8 on: August 01, 2017, 02:34:56 AM »
oops, meant your DS in my response, not your DD!

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Danden

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Re: "you're just jealous of your sister"
« Reply #9 on: August 01, 2017, 11:48:40 AM »
I have gotten the same thing from my FOO.  Blacksheep7, much of what you said I can say the same.  It's so funny how they think I am jealous of my sister, when she is not as pretty, thin, smart, educated or wealthy as I.  I must be really insecure (really it is they who are insecure.)

Daughter, I think what you said to your son is very wise.  Good for you.  What I explained to my children when they were younger is that we should not envy others because it destroys relationships.  I related it to the ten commandments.  One of them says do not steal and another one says do not covet.  Personally, I was always confused by this, because isn't it the same thing?  I mean, when we want something someone else has, we may decide to steal it.  So doesn't it stem from the same emotion?  I thought about it and realized no.  Stealing is dealt with in the law.  One could steal from one's neighbor or one's employer, a person one doesn't have a personal relationship with.  But envy is something that makes trust very difficult, and destroys relationships.  What I said to my kids is that if you have a friend and you envy him because he has a toy or thing you want, it may make him uncomfortable if he thinks you resent him for having that toy.  You should realize that the toy doesn't really matter, but the friendship does.  Play with the toy when you are at his house and enjoy your time with the toy and with the friend.  And look forward to seeing the friend again and playing with the toy again.  If we resent what others have, we greatly diminish our chances of having a loving friendship with the other person.  They may become afraid you will take from them what they have.  God wants us to love each other.  That is what I told my kids as to the reason we don't have a relationship with their aunt and cousins anymore.  It still makes me sad for my kids though.

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overitall

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Re: "you're just jealous of your sister"
« Reply #10 on: August 01, 2017, 11:58:01 AM »
Daughter,
My childhood is so similar to mine that it is eerie.....I have been NC for over 6 years, and I have one son who still has contact with uBPDm and uNPDf.....I have had to endure my parents endless crap as well...the smearing "it must be awful to have overitall as your mother",  "we have no idea why overitall won't speak to us", etc., etc.  My other children ended contact because they realized what my parents were all about...yet my one son hasn't yet experienced it....it seems as if they realize he is the only connection to "get me" and they are very careful about what they say and/or do to him....my son is an adult and I really try to stay out of it...but, I have warned him and told him that he is definitely "playing with fire"  I think he understands that they are truly messed up, but he still wants to have a semi-relationship with them as long as they don't hurt him....it's difficult for me because it feels wrong that they have treated me so badly and still have a relationship with my child.... :stars:

My GCsis is now a complete and identical replica of my uBPDm....same mannerisms, same scathing attitudes, everything is black and white....oh ya, and she is perfect and she knows more about everything than anyone else in the world....she has been smothered in adulation for her entire life.  While I was growing up, everything had to be about GCsis, and I mean EVERYTHING...what we ate for dinner, watched on television, etc. 

When GCsis had kids, it had to be about her kids....suffice to say, there is NO relationship with the cousins..ZERO....when uBPDm took GCsis and her kids to Disneyland, Disney World, Europe, etc., and brought back $5 trinkets for my kids, they weren't too happy...my uBPDm's response...their just jealous of their cousins...Um, ya, you just spent thousands of $$ on GCsis and her kids and brought home $5 trinkets and wonder why they aren't happy?  Clueless....absolutely clueless.

All of my uBPDm siblings are NC with her....they figured her out a long time ago....I strongly suspect that my aunts and uncles completely understand why I am NC....I really believe that people are not that blind and they DO understand the situation...

As far as your son goes, he will understand it in time....remember that your parents are PD's.....they cannot help themselves...they will screw up and he will have the veil removed from his eyes....it WILL be painful for him, but he will then truly understand....it's tough to stand by and watch the destruction, but you literally cannot control your Son....I am sending you only the most positive thoughts.....be strong and take care of you.... :applause:

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Danden

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Re: "you're just jealous of your sister"
« Reply #11 on: August 01, 2017, 03:27:58 PM »
One of the worst things I find, in being NC is that my children could decide or be persuaded to have contact with my FOO.  So far they haven't done that and I hope they never will.  My M has disinherited me so that helps.  Otherwise I think it would be important to keep explaining to your son why things are the way they are.  It is a little scary to me because my children would have an independent relationship with my M that does not need to have the negative connotations (since I am primarily the "bad" one).  It is important that the children know and understand the truth.