"The Body Keeps the Score" by Bessel Van der Kolk MD

[mdana]

Bessel van Der Kolk--- is/was the past president of the international trauma society..

The book is fantastic!  The body never lies -- by Alice Miller is less scientific, easier to read and is similar...

M

[all4peace]

It's on my end table now.

[mdana]

AH... good to hear!

It can be re-traumatizing (reading it-- if you have had certain unprocessed trauma)... just an FYI. 

[Liliuokalani]

Yes it is a long read. And it isn't very self-helpy. But I kind of like that, I tend to be a little suspicious of the self-help books because I have read some that were really very detrimental in their advice. I think it does briefly address chronic pain, but I have a couple of books that focus very specifically on chronic pain that helped me. I struggled a lot with a sudden bout of very severe pelvic pain. Turns out it's fairly common for women. And, not surprisingly, it could be linked with the fact that many women are victims of sexual abuse. I am one of them. In more ways than one.

I want to read this book again, I think I could use a brush-up, and this really helped me the first time around. It just really gave me a lot of insight into my own trauma.

[SonofThunder]

 I'm fascinated in my reading of this book.  One of the overlying feelings I have when reading it, and knowing what I know and experience(d) about growing up with and now living with a person who has a uPD, is how MANY people I am aware or suspect has/have had trauma in their lives, including this wonderful and large group of people here on Out of the FOG. 

The book educates and builds a strong case for a reconnectivity between mind and body in the healing process, instead of a predominant focus on the mind only. It's fascinating how trauma can cause a disconnect between parts of the brain and the body causing havoc on the body and therefore, even if the 'mind' is being professionally treated in therapy, the body can still remain disconnected from that therapy resulting in trauma continuing to show up in physical symptoms, therefore the body 'keeping the score' in a variety of ways.   (Perfect title)

In the later half of the book, there is a section on talk therapy and it's benefits in conjunction with therapy aimed at reconnecting the mind and body.  Maybe the author talks later about the internet's ability to allow fellow trauma survivors to gather together in anonymity and talk openly about their experiences, but I have not crossed it yet.  There is a comment made about victims of the 9/11 and how they coped by going to yoga, acupuncture and other physical therapies but mainly avoided seeing a T for talk therapy and the T's were baffled a bit by that.  I wonder if online resources played a potential role, allowing survivors to gather and discuss their experiences? 

I've never seen a T and probably will not now, with the tremendous gains I have made by reading books and discovering things here on Out of the FOG, and by talking with you wonderful people.  I am fully for seeing a T, but feel for myself, don't feel it's needed. 

There is this paragraph from the book; 

"...finding words where words were absent before and, as a result, being able to share your deepest pain and deepest feelings with another human being. This is one of the most profound experiences we can have, and such resonance, in which hitherto unspoken words can be discovered, uttered, and received, is fundamental to healing the isolation of trauma—especially if other people in our lives have ignored or silenced us. Communicating fully is the opposite of being traumatized."

I personally believe that forums such as Out of the FOG are serving such a wonderful purpose in this way, in improving lives and I want to personally the folks who work hard at making Out of the FOG happen and all those who gather here to share 'their deepest pains and deepest feelings". 

SoT

[all4peace]

"...finding words where words were absent before and, as a result, being able to share your deepest pain and deepest feelings with another human being. This is one of the most profound experiences we can have, and such resonance, in which hitherto unspoken words can be discovered, uttered, and received, is fundamental to healing the isolation of trauma—especially if other people in our lives have ignored or silenced us. Communicating fully is the opposite of being traumatized."

SOOOO important and true! Someone who is traumatizing another person is heavily invested in simultaneously silencing them. For me, talk therapy was vital as I desperately needed someone to listen, listen and listen some more. I had 4 decades of words that needed to come out, memories, feelings. I needed someone to witness all of them, to validate them, to empathize and then help guide me out of the pain and darkness. It was THE most important thing I needed to do: Have my voice be heard again. And I've noticed in myself more assertiveness in all situations. Not only has my voice been set free to speak about the trauma, but my voice is also now free in all my relationships and in all situations. I have a voice, and I'm learning to use it to be an advocate.

There were things I always knew about trauma from childhood, at a gut level, but the act of finally saying them out loud to a professional who could truly validate them was the most healing thing I've done. When I finally talked about the sexual abuse, I left that office with sheer exhilaration. That soon crashed into more of a sense of being out of my body, and then terrible grief and pain, but I let it all come out. And from that day forward, my poor, poor guts have for the first time in many years completely normalized. I cannot fully understand why, but having my experience witnessed and confirmed finally healed me.

I have this book but haven't fully read it. It's dense and long and for some reason I'm not fully ready for it yet. Soon.

[carrots]

I personally believe that forums such as Out of the FOG are serving such a wonderful purpose in this way, in improving lives and I want to personally thank the folks who work hard at making Out of the FOG happen and all those who gather here to share 'their deepest pains and deepest feelings". 

[SonofThunder]

"...finding words where words were absent before and, as a result, being able to share your deepest pain and deepest feelings with another human being. This is one of the most profound experiences we can have, and such resonance, in which hitherto unspoken words can be discovered, uttered, and received, is fundamental to healing the isolation of trauma—especially if other people in our lives have ignored or silenced us. Communicating fully is the opposite of being traumatized."

SOOOO important and true! Someone who is traumatizing another person is heavily invested in simultaneously silencing them. For me, talk therapy was vital as I desperately needed someone to listen, listen and listen some more. I had 4 decades of words that needed to come out, memories, feelings. I needed someone to witness all of them, to validate them, to empathize and then help guide me out of the pain and darkness. It was THE most important thing I needed to do: Have my voice be heard again. And I've noticed in myself more assertiveness in all situations. Not only has my voice been set free to speak about the trauma, but my voice is also now free in all my relationships and in all situations. I have a voice, and I'm learning to use it to be an advocate.

There were things I always knew about trauma from childhood, at a gut level, but the act of finally saying them out loud to a professional who could truly validate them was the most healing thing I've done. When I finally talked about the sexual abuse, I left that office with sheer exhilaration. That soon crashed into more of a sense of being out of my body, and then terrible grief and pain, but I let it all come out. And from that day forward, my poor, poor guts have for the first time in many years completely normalized. I cannot fully understand why, but having my experience witnessed and confirmed finally healed me.

I have this book but haven't fully read it. It's dense and long and for some reason I'm not fully ready for it yet. Soon.

Hi all4peace,

Thank you for sharing your story in reply.  I am so excited for you, in reading of your road to recovery and hear of your progressing healing, both in the mind and body as you continue your journey in the healing process, and now proactive also in the advocacy department, which is wonderful! 

Stories like yours are joyful to read.  I feel like I am a member here of a battle hardened, heavily scarred and fully determined army of warriors, where we are each fighting our own personal skirmishes, but also together are collectively battling an ongoing global war on the mostly hidden abuses that take place on the front line battles of personal relationships.

I am energized to be a part of this Out of the FOG community, where through interaction with my fellow warriors, am gaining education, skills, comrades in understanding, encouragement and a purpose for my life experiences that have and will continue to train me and make me better in loving others. 

Insight from books such as this are also opening my eyes to the multitude around me who may also be fighting the hidden battles that are mostly kept silent from the outside world, but who's physical symptoms cannot be hidden.

Thanks again for sharing your story with me and I am encouraged by you. 

Your fellow battle buddy,

SoT.

[all4peace]

Hi all4peace,

Thank you for sharing your story in reply.  I am so excited for you, in reading of your road to recovery and hear of your progressing healing, both in the mind and body as you continue your journey in the healing process, and now proactive also in the advocacy department, which is wonderful! 

Stories like yours are joyful to read.  I feel like I am a member here of a battle hardened, heavily scarred and fully determined army of warriors, where we are each fighting our own personal skirmishes, but also together are collectively battling an ongoing global war on the mostly hidden abuses that take place on the front line battles of personal relationships.

I am energized to be a part of this Out of the FOG community, where through interaction with my fellow warriors, am gaining education, skills, comrades in understanding, encouragement and a purpose for my life experiences that have and will continue to train me and make me better in loving others. 

Insight from books such as this are also opening my eyes to the multitude around me who may also be fighting the hidden battles that are mostly kept silent from the outside world, but who's physical symptoms cannot be hidden.

Thanks again for sharing your story with me and I am encouraged by you. 

Your fellow battle buddy,

SoT.

I, like you, am starting to see the armies of traumatized around me. I'm starting to wonder if there are far more wounded than whole. But what a beautiful and encouraging battle, the one that many of us are taking back to health! We will be those who are most aware of the other wounded around us, of those whose minds and bodies are showing the signs of trauma. Already, even "surface" friends have spontaneously opened up to me about their own trauma histories.

I didn't choose this journey. My heart, mind and soul would have kept the status quo, but my body was screaming for help. I'm so thankful for that, as I wouldn't have changed anything if left to my own choices. Now I try to respect all parts of me, including my body, and as I honor what needs to come out, fully acknowledge and grieve it all, cry when I need to cry, anger when I need to anger, it is healing.

I would never have linked my guts and sleep with the specific trauma I spoke about in therapy. I never expected them to heal. And they did, instantly, so incredibly linked to what I shared that there was no way I could miss the link.

So, my respect for the mind-body connection continues to grow. I see my siblings and their own chronic gut and back issues, and I just wait. They are on their own journeys, at their own pace.

Thank you for your very kind and connecting words, sonofthunder! I love this phrase of yours: "purpose for my life experiences that have and will continue to train me and make me better in loving others." I am also coming to see a vision of my future, and I do believe it will be related to helping others Out of the FOG and into a path of healing. Take care, my friend.

[SonofThunder]

Hi all4peace,

Thank you for sharing your story in reply.  I am so excited for you, in reading of your road to recovery and hear of your progressing healing, both in the mind and body as you continue your journey in the healing process, and now proactive also in the advocacy department, which is wonderful! 

Stories like yours are joyful to read.  I feel like I am a member here of a battle hardened, heavily scarred and fully determined army of warriors, where we are each fighting our own personal skirmishes, but also together are collectively battling an ongoing global war on the mostly hidden abuses that take place on the front line battles of personal relationships.

I am energized to be a part of this Out of the FOG community, where through interaction with my fellow warriors, am gaining education, skills, comrades in understanding, encouragement and a purpose for my life experiences that have and will continue to train me and make me better in loving others. 

Insight from books such as this are also opening my eyes to the multitude around me who may also be fighting the hidden battles that are mostly kept silent from the outside world, but who's physical symptoms cannot be hidden.

Thanks again for sharing your story with me and I am encouraged by you. 

Your fellow battle buddy,

SoT.

I, like you, am starting to see the armies of traumatized around me. I'm starting to wonder if there are far more wounded than whole. But what a beautiful and encouraging battle, the one that many of us are taking back to health! We will be those who are most aware of the other wounded around us, of those whose minds and bodies are showing the signs of trauma. Already, even "surface" friends have spontaneously opened up to me about their own trauma histories.

I didn't choose this journey. My heart, mind and soul would have kept the status quo, but my body was screaming for help. I'm so thankful for that, as I wouldn't have changed anything if left to my own choices. Now I try to respect all parts of me, including my body, and as I honor what needs to come out, fully acknowledge and grieve it all, cry when I need to cry, anger when I need to anger, it is healing.

I would never have linked my guts and sleep with the specific trauma I spoke about in therapy. I never expected them to heal. And they did, instantly, so incredibly linked to what I shared that there was no way I could miss the link.

So, my respect for the mind-body connection continues to grow. I see my siblings and their own chronic gut and back issues, and I just wait. They are on their own journeys, at their own pace.

Thank you for your very kind and connecting words, sonofthunder! I love this phrase of yours: "purpose for my life experiences that have and will continue to train me and make me better in loving others." I am also coming to see a vision of my future, and I do believe it will be related to helping others Out of the FOG and into a path of healing. Take care, my friend.

all4peace, I simply agree with everything you stated about folks around you beginning to open up to trauma and the 100% connection between trauma and physical symptoms. As well It is also a joy to be called 'friend', so thank you.

You said:  "I didn't choose this journey. My heart, mind and soul would have kept the status quo, but my body was screaming for help. I'm so thankful for that, as I wouldn't have changed anything if left to my own choices. Now I try to respect all parts of me, including my body, and as I honor what needs to come out, fully acknowledge and grieve it all, cry when I need to cry, anger when I need to anger, it is healing. ".   Amen and Amen.  Oh my, how that is so truthful with my story as well.

When I began to see the connection between physical and mental health/trauma, I was not only relieved but also angry that others have had such a profound negative effect on my physical health.  Being PD's, I know that my anger needs to be channeled in another direction than toward them, so I put that anger-energy into boundaries to protect myself, education to arm myself, and a renewed spirit to begin finding joy everyday in things that cater to my mental and physical healing. 

Caretaking PD's consumed my time and I have officially resigned from that role, with the help of strong boundaries on my time, fervor toward hobbies, reading, quiet time and finding new reasons to love my occupation and enjoy hard, but balanced work.  Mentally, I now let the PD's in my life flounder around in their own handiwork, while I simply care for them, as my fellow human beings, but not caretake the PD. 

My psoriasis has reduced on my extremities by 50%: I am sleeping SO much better; my IBS is almost totally gone and reflux as well.  Those last two have alllowed me to once again enjoy a passion of good coffee, which is part of my relax, read and quiet time.   

At the same time, as you said, I am seeing the signs of trauma in others and being compassionate to them in friendship, as they are beginning to open up about the difficulties in their life, beginning the healing process.  I am so excited for them, but must let them progress at their own slow place and not get myself wrapped up in their situations either, simply being a friend who is near and available and one who has understanding through experience. 

Thanks again for all your insight...and friendship.  . SoT

[openskyblue]

This book sat on my shelf for years, and I have just now started reading it. I'm glad I did.

Like so many people here, I've had CPTSD for most of my life. For years I've bounced back and forth between panic, anxiety, depression, exhaustion, odd aches and pains, morning headaches, muscle weakness, hormone and thyroid imbalances, etc. I don't think I really understood the relationship between all this and the abuse I suffered for years from my ASPD ex husband.

The part of this book that made me sit up and say "aha!" was the description of how the brain can't distinguish between the event of the trauma and the flashback or triggering event that happens years later. It's all the same in terms of emotional and physical reactions and where the brain gets active. That's really helped me understand how important it is to take actions that pull me back into the here and now, to soothe myself, etc. when I'm getting triggered. And learn that I can get triggered by such small things--and do!

The other big aha moment was the explanation of how trauma that you were trapped in, unable to escape is what causes PTSD and CPTSD. When events happened for people and they were able to take action to save themselves, the trauma passes and doesn't result any or only short-lived PTSD. I'm seeing now that even though I was trapped for 20 years in a marriage with an abusive spouse, I did take one important action to save myself--leaving my ex and going NC. I don't think I realized or valued how much those actions meant, not just in terms of the tremendous efforts it took at the time, but also it was a direct action to save myself. I remind myself of that everyday now. It really helps.