would love some advice.....

[my1wish]

So, to make a very long story short, I'm going through my 3rd divorce.  3rd cheating, lying husband.  After several years of emotional abuse and me trying everything humanly possible to "fix" and "save" the marriage, I got a phone call from his long term mistress and suddenly it all made sense.  I left him, actually somewhat grateful for my "get out of jail free" card.
After a LOT of therapy, self discovery, books, etc.....  I am trying to identify how I end up in destructive, abusive relationships.  I am just now starting to understand.....personality disorders, narc/codependency relationships, etc.  I am working so hard on MYSELF.  I am determined to not get into a relationship like that again and would love any advice/ tips/ insight any of you may have.  I have also identified other relationships in my life that fall into the pattern of being destructive, abusive, being manipulated, used, exploited and have successfully walked away from a couple of "friendships" in the past year or so.  These are HUGE steps for me!  It goes against every grain for me to say "no" to someone or risk "offending" them.  However, I am learning that it can be very refreshing to just stand up for myself and what is best for me!"
So now, I have learned some things and "survived" this last break up, done the self work, got the kids off to college, faced the empty nest.  But I find myself isolating, avoiding social situations.  At first I allowed myself to "cocoon" after the kids left as it was difficult for me, but I need to start getting out there.  Building my new life.  I have a plan.....start exploring new career opportunities, explore new hobbies and interests, get more involved in church and volunteering......
I would love to make some new friends and some day even consider dating again.  But I am wondering if I can figure out how not to attract that kind of relationship.  I feel like I don't trust my own judgement (with good reason!)   I have literally been told by friends, family and even a psychic (whom I just saw one time at a party where she was the "guest") that I attract "every kind of ------------ and -----------.  I guess you can fill in the blanks as name calling is not allowed here.
Any advice for how to weed that out in the future?

[bruceli]

Why do think you attract and choose these types of individuals?

[Whiteheron]

Kris Godinez (youtube) talks about this a lot. It's her belief that we need to work on our 'original wound' before we are able to break out of our patterns. There's something we were missing/lacking in one of our caregivers and this is the hole we are trying to fill with out partners (for me- angry and controlling men). She recommends a lot of books to help - one is called "The Inner Child Workbook" I've taken the first step of buying the book, but it's been months and I haven't yet cracked it open.

I brought this subject up to my T. I expressed my concerns that after two bad relationships (one two years, the other a 20 year marriage), that I would attract and fall for the same type of man again. She said "well, you're self-aware now..."    I'm not entirely sure that being self aware is the only step. But I think it's a start.

Best of luck to you!

[dreamtree]

I think that given the amount of damaged people in the world, its pretty hard not to attract them. If you are kind and a good listener, you will attract ANY and EVERYone.

The attracting part is NOT the problem, its the pattern of, for example, accepting someone violating your boundaries, for whatever set of reasons.

Attracting is different from engaging with someone, and engaging is not a commitment or even a relationships. Somewhere between engaging and relating is probably where the fork in the road presents itself and you will learn to decide if you see red flags or not.

Unfortunately, the real red flags tend to come out during the relating and getting involved phase. And then the big bad stuff happens in the actual relationship.

Dont worry so much about what you attract as what you actually allow to happen. Anyone can attract anyone else at anytime.

[SonofThunder]

So, to make a very long story short, I'm going through my 3rd divorce.  3rd cheating, lying husband.  After several years of emotional abuse and me trying everything humanly possible to "fix" and "save" the marriage, I got a phone call from his long term mistress and suddenly it all made sense.  I left him, actually somewhat grateful for my "get out of jail free" card.
After a LOT of therapy, self discovery, books, etc.....  I am trying to identify how I end up in destructive, abusive relationships.  I am just now starting to understand.....personality disorders, narc/codependency relationships, etc.  I am working so hard on MYSELF.  I am determined to not get into a relationship like that again and would love any advice/ tips/ insight any of you may have.  I have also identified other relationships in my life that fall into the pattern of being destructive, abusive, being manipulated, used, exploited and have successfully walked away from a couple of "friendships" in the past year or so.  These are HUGE steps for me!  It goes against every grain for me to say "no" to someone or risk "offending" them.  However, I am learning that it can be very refreshing to just stand up for myself and what is best for me!"
So now, I have learned some things and "survived" this last break up, done the self work, got the kids off to college, faced the empty nest.  But I find myself isolating, avoiding social situations.  At first I allowed myself to "cocoon" after the kids left as it was difficult for me, but I need to start getting out there.  Building my new life.  I have a plan.....start exploring new career opportunities, explore new hobbies and interests, get more involved in church and volunteering......
I would love to make some new friends and some day even consider dating again.  But I am wondering if I can figure out how not to attract that kind of relationship.  I feel like I don't trust my own judgement (with good reason!)   I have literally been told by friends, family and even a psychic (whom I just saw one time at a party where she was the "guest") that I attract "every kind of ------------ and -----------.  I guess you can fill in the blanks as name calling is not allowed here.
Any advice for how to weed that out in the future?

Hello my1wish,

I'm sorry you are once again finding yourself in this pattern.  I want to highly recommend the book 'Stop Caretaking the Borderline or Narcissist' by Fjelsted.  We non's have adapted/learned (some like me from a very young age with a uNPDf) to become a 'caretaker'.  These caretaker attributes can be very desirable attributes in many life circles, but when not in check (which I was not, before coming Out of the FOG), can be detrimental to ourselves when they are not balanced with truth, understanding and protective boundaries.   

PD's, on the flip side of the coin, are searching for a caretaker type, because we caretakers typically allow them to irresponsibly live-out, yet also hide-out their disorders within the sheltering and overworking attributes of the caretaker.  PD's literally thrive off of feeding on a caretaker; like a parasite needs a host.  At the front end of a relationship, a PD will recognize the caretaker attributes and mask their PD by 'love bombing' the caretaker into a relationship.

Once the caretaker-host has been acquired, the PD is then free to begin removing the mask and using, controlling, hiding, projecting (and all the other PD attributes) onto the caretaker.  Because PD's cannot even tolerate themselves, they need a caretaker-host to tolerate them, cater to them, prop up their internal self-loathing  and lick the wounds of others who get runover by the PD. 

I'm of the opinion that us caretaker types really don't know what real love is, because we have been groomed by a PD parent or other PD person in our lives, and therefore we should consider putting more emphasis (when finding ourselves in a transition stage, through divorce, death, NC, etc..) on the areas you stated when you wrote..... "Building my new life.  I have a plan.....start exploring new career opportunities, explore new hobbies and interests, get more involved in church and volunteering......I would love to make some new friends...". 

But, I don't feel we are suited for additional "....some day even consider dating again".   I know that's a strong opinion, but as you can see, we caretakers are (like a PD) also pattern-filled, and I'm of the opinion that if I'm ever in a permanent transition phase (married to my uPDw for 27+ years), that I will not date/marry again, but rather pour my time into your words  "Building my new life.....start exploring new career opportunities, explore new hobbies and interests, get more involved in church and volunteering....make some new friends".   

Again, I believe we caretaker types must first discover ourselves and learn to balance, be firm in our self control and be very sensitive to the traits of PD's and our own caretaking traits first, before we ever attempt to forge new friendships.  If we don't, we leave ourselves wide open to another parasite finding its host and the pattern repeats.  Again, I recommend the book and that you take the time to learn a lot about yourself first, which will teach you volumes about the PD's you attract. 

SoT

[1footouttadefog]

Stick with this website.  Read the stories of others.  Read the common behaviors threads also.  The tool box materials and the books suggested will all be of help.

For me refocusing the addictive pull towards these people then backing up and slowing things down does well to screen them from my life.

I no longer jump into help etc. I know longer belive a person can be all that in a single meeting g or two.  This fast paced connection is no longer a thing of wonder for me but rather a red flag someone is playing me.

I have learned much about the trick of the pd trade and can now see them
.I have an understanding about my family of origin and why I feel the environment set me up to be vulnerable to people with pds.

I hope you figure your stuff out and can avoid abuse in the future also.

[athene1399]

I learned to love myself. That helped me to stay out of the bad relationships. And I thought logically about my next partner because I always would get so wrapped up in the emotions of meeting someone new. It was like a high and I couldn't see their BS/reg flags through it.

[Boat Babe]

Reading your post, the word that springs to mind is boundaries. I am slowly getting my head round this important concept and tool for healthy, successful living. I read that it's a good idea to sit down and make a list of deal breakers in all your dealings with people.  So, a good one for me would be something like "I won't spend my valuable time and energy with anyone who confuses me and leaves me feeling off balance."   
I think that the process of writing them down would be an interesting activity in itself and very beneficial. Boundaries are your force field, keeping you safe from the Klingons (and they do!)

I feel very lucky in my life that despite a violent father, a waif bpd mum,  some bullying bosses and two relationships with guys who for sure had PDs, most of the people I have met, and most of the guys I have loved, have been good people, often excellent ones. So, don't give up on love but focus on yourself right now and see yourself as a totally good enough person who has boundaries that protect and enhance your well-being.

[JollyJazz]

Hi My1wish,

After a LOT of therapy, self discovery, books, etc.....  I am trying to identify how I end up in destructive, abusive relationships.  I am just now starting to understand.....personality disorders, narc/codependency relationships, etc.  I am working so hard on MYSELF.

The first thing I would say is to give yourself a big pat on the back for the work you've done so far! Some people never get Out of the FOG and its so good that you are on this healing journey.

I remember having anxiety and sometimes feeling a bit short on hope after seeing the pattern of abusive relationships happening to me again and again (I also had 3 emotionally abusive partners).

I have also identified other relationships in my life that fall into the pattern of being destructive, abusive, being manipulated, used, exploited and have successfully walked away from a couple of "friendships" in the past year or so.  These are HUGE steps for me!  It goes against every grain for me to say "no" to someone or risk "offending" them.  However, I am learning that it can be very refreshing to just stand up for myself and what is best for me!"

But it sounds like you're already healing and seeing some changes in your relationships!

Okay, so here are some things that I found personally helpful and may be of interest to you:
-taking a break from intimate relationships. I read one author (Beverly Engel who wrote 'the emotionally abusive relationship) who recommends a minimum of a one year break from relationships after leaving an abusive relationship, to allow enough time for healing to change patterns. I did this and it did help me.
- I found at first a time of solitude was what I craved because as I was doing my healing work (therapy, work in books and meditation) I was changing inside. There is a special place by the sea I would go to on weekends by myself just to read and go for walks and to meditate.
- working through the exercises in good self help books - I found 'Children of the Self absorbed' by Nina W Brown very useful.
- Meditation - I learned vipassna meditation which really helps me to release trauma and come to terms with the truth of my emotionally abusive childhood.
- Lots of affirmations, writing down all the things I liked about myself. Reminded myself I deserve to be loved over and over, I grew up feeling like love was a conditional thing, if I did things 'right' I could be loved
-Therapy each week - I didn't have the best therapist at first - she did help me, but once I changed to a better one I made more progress. It helped so much!
-And self care - for me the thing that heals me above all else is spending time exercising (hiking) in nature
-I've also started taking a bit more pride in my appearance, part of growing my self esteem and sense of self confidence.

As I've done this work I've found that my relationships have shifted, I've seen the people around me in new ways, I've learnt to establish boundaries, how to be more assertive, what is okay in healthy relationships and how to value myself more. Its sometimes been hard, but its an enormously rewarding process.

As you keep doing the work you WILL move towards healthier relationships. You sound full of determination, and it sounds like you are doing a great job of healing already. Best wishes to you!!!

[GentleSoul]

Helpful sharing in this thread, thanks all.

I am in similar position to My1Wish, on my third relationship with PD/alcoholic.  I am working on myself so I do not do it again!

[treesgrowslowly]

This is such a helpful thread.

Dreamtree's post on attracting everyone is spot on. The whole thread is really helpful regarding our new relationships and our future self.

[gettingstronger1]

One thing I did was to try to be more vigilant about looking out for red flags of inappropriate behavior before I made a commitment.  Look to see if they have a temper, call people foul names, or any other type of inappropriate behavior.  How do they treat others such as their mother, family, friends, or people in the service industry (such as a waiter or waitress etc.)?  If they treat others poorly they will treat you poorly eventually.  Are they love bombing you? Do they give you the silent treatment? Are they overly enmeshed with their family of origin?  All of these things are red flags.  Also take a long time to date and get to know someone before making commitments. Get to know them in various types of situations.  Depending on your values, you may also want to wait to become sexually active with a person.  A sexual relationship can cloud your judgement.  Being sexually active can also create emotional bonds and unspoken commitments before you really know someone or are ready to be committed. (No moral judgements here.  It's just that sex can cloud judgement.)  In the meantime, work on your own emotional health.  Spend periods of time where you don't date.  Develop emotional strength and independence. Become financially independent and self supporting.  When the right emotionally healthy person comes along, then you will be ready.  Only form friendships and serious dating relationships with people who are emotionally healthy.  If you find along the way that they are abusive, don't be afraid to leave the relationship.  At any rate, I hope these are good practical things you can do to protect yourself from getting into an emotionally unhealthy relationships.

[JunaidRaza]

So, to make a very long story short, I'm going through my 3rd divorce.  3rd cheating, lying husband.  After several years of emotional abuse and me trying everything humanly possible to "fix" and "save" the marriage, I got a phone call from his long term mistress and suddenly it all made sense.  I left him, actually somewhat grateful for my "get out of jail free" card.
After a LOT of therapy, self discovery, books, etc.....  I am trying to identify how I end up in destructive, abusive relationships.  I am just now starting to understand.....personality disorders, narc/codependency relationships, etc.  I am working so hard on MYSELF.  I am determined to not get into a relationship like that again and would love any advice/ tips/ insight any of you may have.  I have also identified other relationships in my life that fall into the pattern of being destructive, abusive, being manipulated, used, exploited and have successfully walked away from a couple of "friendships" in the past year or so.  These are HUGE steps for me!  It goes against every grain for me to say "no" to someone or risk "offending" them.  However, I am learning that it can be very refreshing to just stand up for myself and what is best for me!"
So now, I have learned some things and "survived" this last break up, done the self work, got the kids off to college, faced the empty nest.  But I find myself isolating, avoiding social situations.  At first I allowed myself to "cocoon" after the kids left as it was difficult for me, but I need to start getting out there.  Building my new life.  I have a plan.....start exploring new career opportunities, explore new hobbies and interests, get more involved in church and volunteering......
I would love to make some new friends and some day even consider dating again.  But I am wondering if I can figure out how not to attract that kind of relationship.  I feel like I don't trust my own judgement (with good reason!)   I have literally been told by friends, family and even a psychic (whom I just saw one time at a party where she was the "guest") that I attract "every kind of ------------ and -----------.  I guess you can fill in the blanks as name calling is not allowed here.
Any advice for how to weed that out in the future?

I think you need a lot of guidance - you may call it - counseling. You must consult with a counselor. I think after counselling you will be better able to chose someone with whom you may have better relationships. I have my ideas on making a relationship better with your partner, but, first of all, you should work on your side. Sounds good?

[1footouttadefog]

I have learned to stay in tough with my logical brain during good emotions in the same way a person should do through negative emotions.

For example, if you are angry or annoyed by a bad driver you contain that and stay safe.  If you live with a pd you likely understand seeing past the anger they cause and staying in control and maintaining your role as parent, employee or whatever else.  You work and carrying normal tasks and interact with folks while feeling betrayed, put down and and other manner of emotions

One can avoid pds if you maintain your cool and stay logical  even when you feel a wave of positive emotion over being loved, admired, validated etc.

Look through and last this for truth and details. Don't mesh, or jump in so suddenly.

[Spygirl]

Wish,

I believe its wonderful that you recognize  what you have been doing through your own behaviors. Now you can actually move beyond attracting those people again. It is hard. Lonely often. I am doing this now. Its also so rewarding to avoid the obligation trap.

I finally figured out how i was asking for, and willing to accept, abuse to have what i thought was love. Since i get now, i started to make alot of changes in the way i deal with people. I even did the dramatic of all things and found another company to wk for that would treat me better, in a small town with nice people. I have no desire for a relationship. Dont know when or if i will. Just caring for myself is a full time occupation.

I think you will find that you are the only person who can control how your life goes. You can do anything or nothing if you choose. No one is to blame for continued circumstances but yourself. By the same token, you deserve all the credit for making changes and doing better for yourself.

Change is at once hard, and very simple. It took a year for me to wrap my head around my own victimhood fleas, and see that i was responsible for tolerating mistreatment, rather than just boo-hooing about the evil pd. The pd after all, is also wounded, damaged, and trying to cope with life. The difference is that its not my job to rescue or fix them, nor is it to hang around forever waiting for them to figure it out.

Two people, ying and yang, in a toxic dance they cant hear the music to.

[athene1399]

I agree with Spygirl. I had to find out why I was only attracted to people who treated me badly and then figure out how I could make the change going forward. And I also stayed in abusive relationships far longer than I should have. so I had to look at why for that too.

For me, I realized growing up I was expected to tolerate emotional abuse without question. So when people were nice to me, I felt uncomfortable and didn't know how to react. I was more comfortable in abusive relationships. At first, there was a high I craved at the intense-ness of it. So knowing this is what attracted me to someone helped me to change the pattern.  Looking inward is a part of the healing process. It looks like you are already making changes. Like learning you can say "no" to people is huge!

[Blodyn]

Have you checked out Ross Rosenberg's channel on YouTube.  He's done loads of videos on the subject of why we keep choosing the wrong people for us.  He's coined a new term for codependency - he calls it Self Love Deficiency (SLD), and he says that until we can learn to love and provide self care for ourselves, we are doomed to repeat the mistakes from the past.  His channel provides a link to his website where he runs various therapeutic courses.  He's a trained psychotherapist who specialises in codependency relationships.

He's also the author of the book The Human Magnet Syndrome.