Settlement conference

Liftedfog · January 23, 2019, 06:51:11 PM

So I had a settlement conference on Monday and waste of money because there is nothing to settle. We are far apart on any agreement. I'm asking for child support lump sum because he is unemployed and I'm not about to chase him monthly when I have a restraining order against him. He wants spousal from me. He is homeless because he refuses meds for his mental Illness leaving him "disabled". A judge in our conference said expdh is entitled to spousal indefinite because of 20 years of marriage. The question is how much? Other side is asking for 290,000 !! That will leave me bankrupt with two kids and no hope of ever buying a home. We are with my parents in a tiny home. I sleeping on a couch the last five years. I'm forever glad my parents took us in. We !ost our home. If you don't recall my story, expdh started showing signs of psychosis. He choked me and kids and I left family home. He remains dripping with psychosis and can't be forced to take meds. Rendering him disabled. Don't get me started on that!!! Because we can't agree on this issue a mediator has been assigned to help us. I can't imagine what real help they can give. Has anyone experience with mediation helping. If this fails I have two options. 1. Go to trial which will cost me 60,000 in legal fees and I'm advised I will lose. Or. 2. Agree to pay him a lesser amount for ten years so he can go away. Trouble is he can come back after ten years and ask for more spousal. My lawyer says it's the best option. In ten years, my financial situation will be worse so I won't have means to pay anyway. So option 2 is suggested. I'm fuming mad. I don't want to pay him one cent!!! He should take his meds and go get a job!!! I'm so angry. I don't make a shitload of money but since he is unemployed I make way more than him.

Hikercymru · January 24, 2019, 04:45:10 AM

Hi Lifted.
It is so, so unfair. I don't know anything to advise. So, there is you who were the victim of his abuse and who is working, sleeping on the couch and looking after the children. And him bleeding you dry. Unbelievable. The justice system is not just.
I am so sorry.
Hugs

Liftedfog · January 24, 2019, 06:33:41 AM

The thing that really opens my eyes is how marriage is a legal binding contract for life even after divorce if it was a long term marriage. Meaning there is a risk you may NEVER be free of an exspouse. So why the hell would anyone ever get marrried. Just why do it??? Makes no sense to risk being financially responsible for another grown ass. Definitely not what I signed up for and most people have their heads up in the clouds planning a wedding and don't quite understand the ramifications of what they are about to sign up for. And I don't care that I'm only talking this way because it didn't work for me. And I don't care some marriages work out. Yes that is true but knowing the risk is enough. I will never date or marry again ever. I want no part if it. I just can't believe how some people after a failed marriage and going through the agony of the divorce process get remarried. Never again for me. I'm not even talking about the emotional pain. That's the easy part to get over. Emotionally you will recover but never financially. You lose so much money that you will never recover. That part sucks the most.

Hattie · January 24, 2019, 01:21:32 PM

I'm so sorry, LiftedFog. This is just awful. Is it worth getting a second legal opinion or seeing if a domestic abuse charity can help? Thinking of you.

October99 · January 25, 2019, 09:02:59 AM

Good grief, I am so sorry to read this update. That seems so completely unfair. Have you had some way to run the numbers yourself or are you relying on what the attorneys are saying? I just know that when I was worried about the alimony part of things I ran the numbers (my state has an online calculator) and because I was providing full care and housing for both children he would owe me child support and then it would cancel out the alimony or even the cost of the children being with me burdened me with expenses that limited any alimony.

I hear you on marriage being legally binding and people don't understand that and how it affects getting out. In my state if you are married for more than 16 years then you can be on the hook for alimony for life. I was he!! bent on getting that divorce final last summer before we hit that anniversary. We had been separated for years and tried to make it work a time or two. He was/is a slacker though and was living off of me and being miserable to be around. He still lives off me some (long story, but I'm divorced) and I figure until the kids are raised I will prop him up. My ex is underemployed and has a very expensive college degree with loans to prove it. The financial side of things was a HUGE part of why I learned that I will not be doing THAT again.

I hope things work out for you and you don't have to pay him to be a lazy bum. If he is on disability then he should have income, right? And if the govt won't consider him disabled then he should be able to work, right? Either way it seems that you shouldn't be paying for him to live and supporting yourself and the kids. SMH. The system is so broken.

Yael924 · January 27, 2019, 03:31:27 AM

It's in the interest of the state (gov't) not to have a dependent. Varies state to state. Some only do spousal if one parter was a long-term non-working (house wife).

Silly question. Can you two agree to pay spousal on the condition that he take his meds/gets teatment?

You would have to most likely pay a bit more monthly to sweeten the pot for him....but if he fails a drug test, you could halt the payments.

The upside is, if he takes his meds he can work and get treatment, he can become self sufficient. Which is better for the kids.

Don't go in angry. You will get no sympathy that way. Go in concerned as to how you will support your kids and yourself in addition to an ex-spouse who non-compliant in his meds. Ex-spouse has a history of violence when not compliant with the meds. How can you keep your kids safe if he his non-compliant. You Stbx is a public health risk.

And as I'm sure you've been told: document, document. document.

Rose1 · January 27, 2019, 06:05:49 PM

Very frustrating. Dh lived in a state that had compulsory alimony especially in case of mental illness.

It's very tough. However the following was taken into consideration: child support offset, and income attributed (potential earning of his ex) this made the alimony come out to more manageable. However it it a bit of a 2 edged sword as you know. They can come back at you and there was little provision for his change in circumstances.

He was advised to change jurisdiction before the divorce was final which was good advice, to a state that allowed alimony for a fixed term only. (Ex was being supported by very wealthy parents while dh was living in a trailer -not taken into consideration).

This may not be possible for you but the alimony offsets should be taken into consideration. Dh found that the legal profession in his case were pretty clueless to the point where he seriously believes there was collusion and corruption and to be honest that conclusion is the only one that makes sense of some of the weird stuff that happened.
Imo paying that kind of money for a useless trial only serves the legal profession, no one else. Therefore there is no incentive for the legal system to come to a conclusion. I seriously would get a second opinion. Maybe high conflict institute?

sevenyears · February 01, 2019, 10:10:35 PM

Liftedfog, I'm so sorry. It is unfair and certainly frustrating.

KFel024 · February 18, 2019, 05:12:22 PM

Dear Liftedfog,

Am so sorry to hear about your situation.

I have used mediation before with success, but not in a situation like this. Mediation is helpful for obvious reasons, could save a lot money that would potentially be lost to lawyer fees. It does sound like a lose-lose though all the way around (i.e. having to support someone that could support themselves if they really wanted to).

That being said, is there a way for you to reasonably reduce the amount of assets you have without doing anything nefarious/criminal? For example, you mentioned that you were fortunate enough to stay with you folks. Have you been compensating them accordingly for rent/overhead commiserate with the area you live in? If not, maybe they charge you a onetime fee to recoup those monies and store them away for you to recover as a gift at a later date.

Also, like others have mentioned, if your partner is truly disabled, they should be eligible to collect or should be collecting monies from the government, which hopefully would reduce any potential amount you would owe or be liable for.

On a side note, I do agree with your stance on marriage. Why anybody would want to do it in this day and age is beyond me at this point. I would be surprised if I ever got officially married again. Too much risk for too little reward.

Mintstripes · February 27, 2019, 10:38:31 PM

My thoughts are with you, Lifted!!!!

I agree with you re marriage. Never again lol

Liftedfog · March 04, 2019, 07:44:16 PM

So I am heading to mediation. This means I will most likely have to give in somewhat and pay him some spousal for this bullshit to end. I have to pay HIM or I go to trial and risk 60,000 in legal fees and I may still lose. Yup. This is our family law court. Mentally ill spouse who refuses meds. I can argue at trial that he is keeping himself disfunctional by not complying with meds and he should not be my problem but its a $ 60,000 risk. Like who has this kind of money sitting around??? I said it before in whiteherons post ....the system in broken.😬

hhaw · March 09, 2019, 09:57:36 PM

Liftedfog:

Just bc attorneys SAY something, doesn't mean it's the truth, IME.

I always say everyone EVERYONE starts pressuring the reasonable litigant once they realize the PD is pathologically unable to agree to ANYTHING, which brings me to PD's request for $290K and the fact he'd likely refuse to sign ANY agreement, no matter how much time, and effort you put into crafting one, IME. Attempts to avoid litigation usually wastes resources you'll need for litigation, IME.

Make an offer that's do able, sane, and reasonable, then go to trial when it fails is my advice, which isn't worth much considering I don't know everything about your situation.

As they say... you can't get blood out of a turnip. How much money is left for spousal support once you've provided a home for your children, food, clothing, and basic other needs?

My friend was divorced after 35 years of marriage, and the Judge gave her a tiny amount of money, for 2 years only! Because, at 65 years of age, she should count on her degree to earn her living. 2 years. After 35 years of marriage, running her dh's business, and raising 3 boys.... and the husband cheated on her. 2 years. You can't know what a Judge or Jury will do until you're in that courtroom. You're the one who was assaulted, with no choice but to raise children on her own, without help or support from your mentally ill stbx. You didn't make him ill, and you can't make him take his meds. I'd find out all I could about the Judge you're going in front of. I'd wait to decide about settling till I had more information. This Judge may turn out to be the best possible Judge to hear your case. That Judge might GET what you're up against. You might consult with a couple other attorneys as well.

I wouldn't assume your stbx CAN agree to a settlement, even if he believes he can. He might not be able to agree to sign anything, even if you gave him the $290.00 or whatever it was. I really hate going round and round arguing, then giving in, then paying attorneys to bicker over details for 2 weeks only to have the PD shrug, and say they want to go to trial anyways.

I still owe an attorney $30.00 to craft an agreement I TOLD HIM NOT TO waste any time going over with opposing counsel. I TOLD HIM NOT TO DO IT, and he still had the audacity to present me with a threat and a bill for $30K when what I said would happen HAPPENED.

You need more information than what you have, IME, to make your mind up on this one.

Good luck,

Liftedfog · March 10, 2019, 03:01:58 PM

He has been deemed "special party" by the government after a pschology assessment was court mandated on him few years ago when my nightmare started. . Meaning he is not mentally fit to direct a lawyer. Etc. So he has been appointed a public guardian trustee who is a govt appointed lawyer who acts on his behalf. Expdh has no voice in the proceeding. It's his pgt that is taking blood from a stone. His pgt that is claiming spousal and is a heartless a***hole. Of course expdh stands to gain from every dollar his pgt takes from our children. It makes no effen sense.

hhaw · March 10, 2019, 06:27:06 PM

Golly, Liftedfog:

It's not in the best interest of the PD to waste all family resources fighting over an unfair settlement that likely brings zero benefits the PD at the expense of his children, or to the detriment of his children even.

PD's court advocate is asking for the moon, hoping he'll get half, but half to be spent on what? Treatment? Housing? Who becomes stbs's keeper if you give him a pile of money?

And, you're the poster who had to litigate to get your husband tossed out of the family home, bc he was destroying it, right? And you fixed up the house to sell it, right?

Did you sell it, or lose it to the bank?

How are the boys doing?

Are you afraid the PD will harm you or the boys in any way, at this time?

I'm wondering if you can drop the divorce, put a legal separation in place, then plan a move far far away, where he can't find you.

You filed for the divorce, right?

Or did the PD file?

Liftedfog · March 10, 2019, 09:26:51 PM

Yes, I had to get a court order to get him out of the family home. He was homeless since 2014 but just secured a basement apartment for rent. He remains umedicated and still doesn't think he is sick. So I have a restraining order in place as I am afraid of him. He can only see kids at a supervised center. But he hasn't seen them since I filed for separation because he doesn't want to be supervised. I need to keep children emotionally and physically safe from him. The judge ordered me sole custody. Expdh gets $2000 a month from a trust fund but apparently it's not enough for him to live on. The pgt wants to secure money for him indefinitetely because he is considered disabled. But he has no medical certificate proving this because he refuses medical care. It runs into his paranoia that doctors are trying to control him. I'm guessing by his symptoms that he has schizofrenia. The house was sold and after line of credit was paid and other expenses there is barely anything left. Lawyers are eating that up. Not enough for me to even buy another home or even rent. I am legally separated but I can't file for divorce until the issues of spousal are resolved. The pgt is supposed to be the guardian of his money. I'm so done. The money that I am blowing is putting me further and further in a financial hole. I am being financially crippled. That is not in the best interest of my kids. But the other side doesn't see that. I'm so angry. My kids are doing well. The youngest doesn't really remember his dad. He was only 4 when we left and the other was 9. I dont speak badly of their father. No negative words about him. I only speak about how much he loves them. This is helping to keep them stable and well adjusted. I am doing all I can. They are my priority always and they know this. I am present for them. I am always with them unless I am at work. My only focus is their mental and emotional well being.

hhaw · March 10, 2019, 10:28:30 PM

The PD gets 2K a month from a family trust? Is this trust in place for the PD's lifetime?

He has an apartment he can afford with that money, and food, and presumably he won't need mental health care bc he won't accept it.

And...it sounds like that court advocate should be hooking the PD up with someone who can help him access disability. This man should be on disability.

It's crazy that the PD has an income, zero responsibility for supporting his children, is still a threat to you, and you're being asked to support him in his continued ability to be a threat, bc he refuses mental health care.

This is just nuts.

So sorry, Liftedfog.

You're an amazing mama bear, and I'm relieved to hear your boys are doing well.

::sending Liftedfog tsunamis of energy, and prayers for the best possible outcome for her and her children::.