After 5 years NC, Dh and I will meet in laws briefly - Please Help

Started by Love, February 08, 2019, 09:21:54 AM

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Love

I think I am ready for this.  We will be meeting in a public place, we will keep it brief.

I will try to summarize why we are doing it - briefly.  I am doing it for my husband and because of my faith.  My husband is doing it because of his faith. 

To clarify the meeting is simply to extend a kindness - opening a small avenue of conversation or opportunity for conversation between my husband and his parents.  So, for example, they can call and ask how a week went.  Or perhaps they will communicate if a death in the family occurs (such as DH's grandmother) - this was a concern of my Dh as he would want to feel he could attend her funeral or of other people he cares about without an all-out brawl.  However, Dh and I are aware that all of this can backfire and a brawl could most definitely still occur.  I'm resigned to the fact that it will probably always be awkward, messy and uncomfortable - this helps me tremendously - because I'm not allowing myself to set unrealistic expectations of interaction with them. 

Admittedly I will be nervous but I'm will employ gray rocking and medium chill to this situation.

Can you guys please give me and my Dh advice on how to approach this.  Although we know why we are doing it, we don't know how to do it.  My thoughts are like a business meeting - like greet them and ask how life is?   :wacko:  Honestly I don't really know!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Please give me a game plan or lines that I can say that will allow me to look calm and collected - PLEASE. 

Please tell me about a time you did something similar and how that event worked.  I really need some insight. 

The only time we saw my inlaws and granted it was at a birthday party for our daughter (and I invited a huge crowd) so that I could avoid any intimate contact - (that was my thought at the time at least) MY inlaws acted as nothing had ever gone bad, it was like we had hung out all the time.  Admittedly that bothered me but in retrospect what else would they have done amongst all the people.

Dh and I do not plan to go over any list of egregious atrocities against us, we will not engage in telling them what they did because usually, that is what they do - play the utter and complete victim.  We plan to say that we wanted to extend an invitation to talk with Dh on the phone and maybe him and them will occasionally meet for a cup of coffee, but that their will be no interaction between them and our kids, we will not invite people to participate in any of our family events or holiday.  Our intent was to be clear.  You can tell me if we're crazy!

Please help - we are going to go through with this and honestly I don't know how to do this or what this really is - so already awkward.  I just want to come out acting like a mature, calm adult, both I and my DH want that.  So please please help - any advice or examples will really help.






boots40

I can only reply from my point of view and my ILs but I wouldn't be meeting up with them for 2 seconds.  I leave all that to my H.  I like the idea that you are basically going to set your boundaries out, think carefully though because you may need to stick very firmly to them.  PDs react, on the whole, better to consistency - even if it is disagreeable to them, than things shifting and changing.  Make your rules and just persist with them.

You have decided to not have any contact and you include your child in that.  Have you a plan of action for possible consequences with ILs?
"What you say about me isn't nearly as bad as what I know about you"

bloomie

Hi Love - I say this gently to encourage... you are a mature and calm, centered adult. Not just someone acting like one. You have strategies and tools in your tool belt that you carry with you and that you have done the very hard work of developing for yourself so that you can handle whatever comes your way using those strategies. You and your DH are united and empowered and are offering an opportunity for your in laws to have some contact going forward based on deeply held values and beliefs. If they have even a shred of common sense they will take this opportunity and make the very most out of it.

Having had this kind of a meeting after years of funerals/weddings only contact certain uPD in law family members I was grateful to find I was on solid ground and so emotionally detached I could hold a very neutral position and stay in the zone as DH's wife and my children's support. I didn't have to fix anything, answer to anyone, help another understand themselves or the issues, repair the fractures, bear the burden of the brokenness of the relationships. I simply was there to love and support my DH and follow what we both believed was ours to do in these relationships.

I truly and earnestly believe when we have done the work and removed ourselves from the cumulative damage of constant contact with toxic behaviors from PD family members we develop a deep well of strength and resolve from which to draw from in times like these. I had developed confidence and made choices and established internal and external boundaries, built a united and trustworthy alliance with my DH, well before entering into the lion's den and I was safe no matter what happened.

I knew things I didn't know before. Things like familial connection and contact is a privilege not a right.  :yes: I don't have to engage in any discussion that is not productive or on topic. I am kind and firm, clear and consistent in my messaging to my in laws around contact going forward because that is what love and honor and respect looks like for us.

Other of our wise members will weigh in soon I am sure and may see this very differently, but I am all for shining the light on the reality of the current situation between you all from the get go by generally acknowledging at the beginning of the meeting - the relationship is fractured, this is uncomfortable for everyone, there remain unresolved issues and we are not here to rehash those issues, this is our attempt to build some kind of a bridge between us to be able to have a limited amount of connection and contact between DH and parents.

Some things that were helps for us were to determine before hand the goals of the meeting.. for us we were there to attempt to reestablish some kind of connection, to communicate clearly where we stood in terms of what that contact could look like going forward, acknowledge the relationship was still unrestored and trust broken (we were dealing with highly entitled rug-sweepers who would interpret this meeting as us throwing open the doors to a return to close, intimate relationship and absolving them of all wrongdoing), and to listen.

We were not there to make any commitments or promises, listen to a litany of our wrongs, justify, argue, defend, or explain ourselves or to rug sweep and welcome these in laws back into the heart of our home. :no:

I don't think you are crazy at all. It is very hard to be NC in the grander scheme of life with family members as there are so many other important relationships and complicated aspects to all of this and for most of us, we will be together at times.

Sending you wisdom and strength as you do this. :hug:
The most powerful people are peaceful people.

The truth will set you free if you believe it.

Unvitation to Drama

I'm not sure of your faith, but should it be christianity of some sort, I would recommend checking out the Luke 17:3 ministries webpage. (Admins I hope that recommendation is ok)

Love

That you so much I do love that site and go to it often when I feel confused at "how to" or really "IF we" should continue to pursue a relationship with them.

Here is an update on last weekend:

My Dh decided he did not feel ready to meet them, especially because he said we had set the boundaries already and that his parents haven't reached out to us at all and just felt there was no upside to that kind of meeting.

So INSTEAD of the meeting, Dh decided to call his dad.  Which for all intents and purposes seemed to go well (FIL pretended like nothing was wrong) but said he was busy and ask if he could call Dh back (and Fil gave him a time period in which he would call him back - Fil offered that up).  SOOOOO.... Fil has not called him back. 

Fil I believe is showing us that he and Mil are still playing their old games and are furious with Dh and more with me that we have not allowed them in our lives.  So now they are going to show us and it's back to if we want anything with them Dh and I have to do all the work AND we are not going to do that for many many reasons that all of you are familiar with. 

We will not jump back on the merry go round of dysfunction.  I feel bad for my Dh, definitely not for me because they just proved they are exactly who they always were, unfortunate, but I would rather deal with the truth than pretend they've changed and squint my eyes really hard to try and see some ounce of humanity and love within them, there is none. 

Is it safe to think that this may be something like a final discard?  Dh has offered up a million opportunities to some kind of relationship with his parents.  Because as Bloomie mentioned -
QuoteIt is very hard to be NC in the grander scheme of life with family members as there are so many other important relationships and complicated aspects to all of this and for most of us, we will be together at times.

I do think in the long run some little contact - limited could and would be better than full NC.  I think it is also hard for Dh to really see that in all this time it was the FM contacting us and begging, scolding, lying to him, but never really his parents.  My inlaws have never tried to find common ground or rectify any type of relationship.  The inlaws do not call Dh unless he initiates, the inlaws only really communicate through the FM's.  So can you help me here?  What is this?  I mean because of our faith we continue to try and love our enemy but our enemy doesn't want to be loved, doesn't want to be forgiven, ISN'T sorry about anything. 

I actually do not believe that they would tolerate a relationship with us.  They are too angry that we do not accept their behavior towards us and their treatment of us if this makes any sense.  I can see my Mil saying "we will not just talk to him any time he wants."   Talking about or thinking about my inlaws, any interaction with them is 100% crazy making.  It seems like we will never get beyond the games and the test and the unrealistic relationship goals they have Dh and I just do not have the energy, time or ability to keep doing this.  All4Peace you always help to remind me that my children and marriage come first and deserve our full attention and energy.  Thank you for that. 

I do not think there is anything else to do at this point, perhaps there was nothing to do in the very beginning because they never tried.  The only thing my inlaws ever did in the very first few months before Dh and I really started to separate was try and divide my Dh from me, try to tell him things they thought were bad about my character, told him he's not a man.  All the inlaws have ever done is fight against the truth and try to rewrite history, which they continue to try to do today.  In fact, I think the times Dh and I have said we forgive them has just further pissed them off.  What a completely confusing and crazy-making group of people they are.  Soo  tired and ready to just take a cue from the inlaws and trust what their behavior and words are saying which is, they don't want a relationship with us. 

bloomie

Love - Well, you do have a clear answer and way forward I'm thinking. And the radio silence is very sad. I am so sorry.

Your DH found a level of contact that was best for him and tested the waters and you got important information from that effort. I see this as you both shaking the dust off of your feet and moving on with your happy lives.

You have done all you can do here it seems and yes, I agree with you and all4peace, your FOC and marriage come first. Always.



The most powerful people are peaceful people.

The truth will set you free if you believe it.

jbtalt6

Hi there! Your ILs sound like mine...telling DH he's not a man, only a "by-product of (me)." Putting me down and trying to split us up. Been there, seen it, felt it, want NO MORE of it!

Your heart is in the right place, and I hope you and your DH can find some peace.

We tried two reconciliation periods with my narc-ILs over the past 33 or so years. Neither worked. DH has very limited contact (his choice) with his mother. His father cut him off a couple of years ago because he wasn't treated or "respected" the way he felt he deserved to be. DH is at peace with that he says, because he tried. I am done and have been done, but I DID try. Sometimes too many bridges can be burned, and the damage irreparable. I think that it's okay and necessary to let it go. (still working on that emotionally, btw)

Good luck!

Breakthrough

Well, Bloomie gives such insightful advice as usual.

Love, I am not sure if you are a Christian, but I am and I struggled with settting boundaries with my uNMIL and enFIL (who can be very demanding and controlling too, which was surprising to me).  They are both Christians and before I got to know them as my inlaws, I thought really highly of them.  Things changed with MIL as soon as she found out that I wasn't on board with her agenda for her son (which was never going to happen anyway because he self sabotaged and couldn't have done what she wanted him to do, didn't have the qualifications).  Things changed with FIL after we had kids (but I feel his behaviours are more bossy inlaw/flying monkey rather than PD).  I struggled so much because of my faith, but then realized the difference between forgiveness and reconciliation.  Forgiveness is for ourselves to be at peace.  That doesn't need to involve the person that wronged you, and setting healthy boundaries with them is appropriate.  Reconciliation with a PD is near impossible, because for that to happen, the party at fault must truly apologize and want to make amends for their wrong doing.  PDs, as you well know, aren't really capable of acknowledging their wrong or taking responsibility for their actions.  So yes, reconciliation is pretty much impossible, and not gonna happen with most PDs (unless they recognize their illness and get help, which is rare). 

We are LC with uNMIL.  My husband is still fogged about her, though he acknowledges to some degree she is not normal and very difficult.  I have NC with her unless we are visiting them with our kids, or attending a family function.  MIL and FIL want to see the kids and my husband wants them to have a relationship, and so do I, for his sake.  I am very careful about limiting time (which is pretty easy because they live far, though not when they demanded to stay at our house every month, that was when I really started to notice the toxicity).  I have to just go along with their rug sweep, their is no point discussing what happened, because it would just be upsetting and she would just pretend like nothing happened.  She has never apologized (unless you count a non apology apology, which was "I am sorry you are upset"), basically I am upset and that is my problem in her mind.  I had to become ok with never talking about any wrong doing again.  I am ok with it as long as I also don't have to deal with her.  It's my husband's job.  He makes very little effort, which is partly why they swooped in on me when we got married.  Basically, there is no point talking about it with them.  Even enforcing boundaries, there was no point.  Telling them what our boundaries were actually led to worse behaviour for a while.  As much as I hoped as fellow Christians we should and would discuss the wrong doings, they are not capable of that.  So we have a superficial, limited relationship because that is all that is possible with someone who is a PD.  I told my husband that communication must go through him, I am too busy to deal with her.  She still continued to txt me.  He thinks it's nothing but It was a control thing on her part.  I didn't block her in case of emergencies, but I do essentially ignore her txts (unless it's an "accidental" chain she adds me too, then I pipe up so I don't keep getting those txts).  My husband always has and excuse, but it's definitely Hoover attempts.  My husband phones them.  We only have relatively short visits with them (my husband's choice, he says he can't stand his mom for longer than that).  We have stopped having them to our house because her behaviour is amped up for some reason (though recently I asked my husband if he wants to invite her again, my daughter has a Grandfriends day at school).  Our kids love her (they do not remember her horrid behaviour).  I am supportive of that too, as long as we create boundaries so she can't swoop in and take advantage of them when they are older.  For example, when they are old enough for phones, I am not going to give her their numbers.  I don't want any unmonitored contact, which she definitely will try. It will get harder as they get older, but I also hope as they mature, they can understand grandma is not right in the head so we need to be careful around her.  We reestablished LC after a period of about a year of VLC (and NC for me, which was heaven).  Again, just enforce your boundaries, you do not have to tell them.  And unfortunately very little to no chance of reconciliation.  Peace to you, it was very freeing to recognize that healthy boundaries aren not just ok, they are needed.  No need to feel guilt over that (though of course I did for years).  For my interactions with them, I keep discussion superficial.  Any knowledge about me has always been used against Me in the past, so I refuse to give them ammo.  There are definitely other ways to go about this, but we tried the talking to the approach and it backfired.  The pretending nothing ever happened, but then having very limited interaction seems to be working well for me (and the kids) so far.