Controlling behavior, even when chatting

[countrygirl]

Hello,

I am noticing everything with PD friends now.  I have been thinking about how one friend likes to "give with one hand and then take away with the other."  As I write this, I am remembering countless examples, but will spare anyone who might read this post!  Will just give the most recent example.

I am laid-up, and so the only way I can see this friend is when she visits me.  In the past, I would go visit her most of the time.  When she does come over, I treat her to lunch and rent a film for us to watch.  This is the plan for today.  I called her this morning to confirm, which is what I'd said I would do.  I was feeling upbeat so started chatting with her for a bit, when she said, "I'm gong to go (meaning get off the phone), because I want to get some reading done before I come over."  That is fine, but the way she said it was extremely cold and controlling; I felt as if I were the proverbial friendly puppy who was getting pushed away.  Then I started thinking about how she almost always has to be cold right after she's done anything the least bit warm.  Actually, a perceptive friend first pointed this behavior out to me.

She is not working now (by choice), doesn't have a relationship, doesn't even have a pet--no friendly puppy; in fact, not even a houseplant!  So it's not as if she doesn't have time to read!  But of course this wasn't about the reading, it was about pushing me away.  And this is who she is.  It's a way to control and to keep me off-balance.  It's as though when she does something warm, I'm not supposed to think that she really cares.  I am sure there is a psychological reason for this, and I think I know what it is, but I am past the point of caring.  It's as various forum members said when I started the post about whether PDs are responsible for their behavior:  Ultimately, it doesn't matter.  What matters is not being abused by them. 

Now, I don't feel much like having a visit from this friend.  I am worn out from my physical problems, and I do have a couple of people who have been true, caring friends, who have treated me in a consistently warm manner--as they have always done.   Of course when this friend detects any hesitation on my part, she is extremely reactive and sensitive, but she never seems to consider that my hesitation is because of how she has treated me.  Here, I was about to ask what I should say to her, but what's the point?  I can't change her personality,  and I have enough work to do on myself without taking on her work too!  (By the way, she is violently opposed to therapy and psychology in general; I don't think she wants to change, or even to admit that there's a need to do so.)

[clara]

People like her, countrygirl, never "help", not really.  They can even hinder your recovery because of the energy you have to spend on dealing with them when you need to be dealing with yourself.  Their actions might constitute what looks like help, but the aftermath negates any perceived good.  I wonder if she's also having unrealistic expectations from you due to her self-perceived generosity.  Since she's done some "giving," she expects a lot of gratitude and thanks in return.  She extends the performed warmth, then sit back waiting for you to appreciate what she just did.  The behavior isn't genuine or coming from a place of sincerity.  It's manipulative and, as you suspect, actually controlling.  But of course, you can't ever respond in a way that will suit her, so no matter what you do, she'll still switch into "cold" mode when she's done with her performance.  That's her signal  you're not doing enough for her.   And you're supposed to feel bad about it!  I've come to regard it as interesting (if nothing else) how PDs can switch their emotions on and off so quickly.   

[countrygirl]

Hi clara,

Thanks for your reply!  As usually, your analysis is spot on.   

Yes, it can be amusing to observe PDs in action, especially NPDs, who seem to behave in predictable ways. 

I seem to engage in a form of magical thinking in regard to them, however, because I am always surprised by their behavior, even when it is predictable.  I have a lot more work to do, even though I've already managed to withdraw from the most extreme one of these friends. 

   

[treesgrowslowly]

Hi countrygirl,

I totally agree with clara.

I have to say, I feel happy for you that you are 'past the point of caring' to analyze their behaviours. The reality is that you have been assuming they think the way you do and being exhausted bt that means you'll be much better off as it is exhausting dealing with immature people no matter what their specific deal is.

As a kind person you will attract all sorts in this world including people who are like the person you describe in your post.

I have come to believe they are everywhere. The next time someone with that approach to friendship tries to befriend you, you probably won't be very interested in what they offer because they will lack the sincerity or true generosity that you seek. You'll see through people and how a lot of what people do is try to charm you and mature people who are worth your time do not bother trying to charm you they are themselves and have boundaries that you find easy to respect because you feel respected by them. That's what we deserve in our friendships.

Here is what I've shifted my thinking after years of the magical thinking you describe. I look at how well the person treats the friendship. Not me, the friendship. I'm now looking only for friends whose behaviour says to me "I'm mature enough to behave in ways that foster respect and reciprocity between us over time." Others need not apply. LoI.

Your post has reminded me of how a lot of women friends have behaved towards me over the years. In hindsight I look back and i outgrew them by getting to a point where I didn't want to keep waiting for them to become nicer, more considerate and more respectful. I wanted them to stop treating the friendship with me as assumed, as something to just take for granted, and I also see in hindsight how little they ever helped me despite me being there for them very often.

[StayWithMe]

I am kind of friends, I guess, with someone in another city.

Whenever I visit that city, I'll email her and suggest getting together.  She'll always start with "I'm so busy now" but then somehow she finds the time to meet up with me.

IT does get annoying.

[countrygirl]

Hi treesgrowslowly and StayWithMe, 

All that you've said rings true, treesgrowslowly.   When I look back at some of the friendships I've had, I too feel that some of the people didn't enrich my life, even though I was a good friend to them.  I am certainly far from perfect, but I do always try to treat others with
kindness and am always there for my friends.  I definitely need to be more selective going forward, and I think that I am.  The people I'm posting about here are friends I met years ago. 

I don't think I'm expecting too much in a friendship, just normal reciprocity, as you describe in your post.

StayWithMe, I can so relate to having the friend who is always "busy," but who always manages to find the time to see you.  I think that is a power play on her part.  The friend I'm writing about has told me that her first response when asked to do something is "no."  What amazes me about people like this is that they still expect you to keep asking, and expect you to be happy to see them.  In the past, this friend has been dumbfounded when I've sometimes no longer been interested when her no has turned to a yes and Her Majesty has graciously agreed to mingle with the commoner.   I guess the commoner is not supposed to change her mind.  But I'm not living in a monarchy.

[StayWithMe]

I knew someone who married a Sri Lankan and lived in the US.  She said for a while when his family would visit, she would ask them if they would like something to eat before going to bed....... especially in view of their long journey to come visit.  When they said no the first time, she would put everything away and they would go to bed hungry.

Now she knows to ask at least 3 times before making a move.

[countrygirl]

Hi StayWithMe,

I have encountered that sort of behavior in people from another country too.  When they visited, and I asked what they wanted to do, they would not say.  Then I had to suggest things, and whatever I suggested, they would reply, "I don't mind."  I realized that thought it rude to suggest any preferences, but whenever we did anything I wondered whether they were really enjoying it.  (Of course this isn't true of people from another country in general.  I am definitely not saying that!)

There are cultural differences for sure, as with your friend's Sri Lankan in-laws.

But I don't think my friend always saying "No" when asked is something cultural, it is about her need to control.  And it may be the same with your friend who is always "busy." 

[treesgrowslowly]

Hi Countrygirl,

I'm not surprised that these are friends that you met a longer time ago. As we move Out of the FOG, we change. As we get older we change. When we are generous with people - giving our time and attention to them, they are unlikely to ever get sick of us. It's important that we find people who enrich our lives with their friendship. I'm very careful now compared to in the past. I need to get to know someone slowly so that I can see how they behave over time. There are a lot of charmers out there who pretend to be the real deal but time always tells....

Thanks for your posts. I feel better knowing there are other people thinking about this stuff and moving in similar directions.

[countrygirl]

Hi treesgrowslowly,

I agree with all that you say.  One of my good friends has told me that he really takes his time before becoming friends with someone, and he doesn't have these problems.

I think this site is wonderful, and am so appreciative when people take the time and energy to respond.  I am grateful for people's patience, because I make changes at a glacial pace.  But I have ended a longterm friendship with someone who was draining so much energy that I barely had any left for anything else.  It took several years, but eventually happened.   

Thank you for so much for your post!