When you're still together but distant as we come Out of the FOG - normal?

Blackbird11 · April 09, 2019, 10:41:20 AM

Hi everyone,

First - huge thank you to the forum moderators and support for keeping everything running and keeping us updated! This is such a gift and I feel so much gratitude for you all and for this space.

So - my issue today: It's been about 5 months since I found this site and realized that I'm in the FOG. I know I still have a lot of personal work to do with detaching, looking into setting the groundwork if I decide I want to leave, and ultimately getting to work on healing.

I will be honest: Between work and kid and general energy it takes to maintain a relationship with a PD, I have been too tired and worn out to get my documents copied/stored and talk to a law professional. Yes - this is an excuse. I know I SHOULD do these things just in case. But despite logically knowing this is the smart thing to do, I feel a lot of inner resistance towards these tasks. And I feel...GUILT!! Is this normal?

Also - has anyone else been on the fence with their PD relationship and evolved into a place where you and PD significant other are going through the motions mostly and not really talking anymore?

My PD and I are on different schedules so we don't interact in person too much, and if we do our child is there and we are usualy tending to the child. But now I've been so distant that it's getting to the point where he will ask me what is going on and honestly I don't know what to say. Is this normal?

coyote · April 09, 2019, 12:02:38 PM

Blackbird I really can't say what is normal or not. I think relationships go through different stages whether with a PD or not. I don't think there is any prescribed course either for the routes relationships go. My relationship with my DW is so different than most here I wonder sometimes is she is truly uPPD or just has a lot of fleas from FOO. And then she will pull something out of the air that verifies; yes PPD for the max.

I try to avoid the use of the word SHOULD. There is no real law that says we should do this or that. Yes it might be nice if we did this or that; but do we really have to put that much guilt on ourselves by saying we "should", or "gotta", "have to", etc.? Just my 2 cents worth. I hope it goes better for you though. We all deserve to be happy.

Crushed_Dad · April 10, 2019, 03:24:15 AM

Quote from: Blackbird11 on April 09, 2019, 10:41:20 AM
Hi everyone,

First - huge thank you to the forum moderators and support for keeping everything running and keeping us updated! This is such a gift and I feel so much gratitude for you all and for this space.

So - my issue today: It's been about 5 months since I found this site and realized that I'm in the FOG. I know I still have a lot of personal work to do with detaching, looking into setting the groundwork if I decide I want to leave, and ultimately getting to work on healing.

I will be honest: Between work and kid and general energy it takes to maintain a relationship with a PD, I have been too tired and worn out to get my documents copied/stored and talk to a law professional. Yes - this is an excuse. I know I SHOULD do these things just in case. But despite logically knowing this is the smart thing to do, I feel a lot of inner resistance towards these tasks. And I feel...GUILT!! Is this normal?

Also - has anyone else been on the fence with their PD relationship and evolved into a place where you and PD significant other are going through the motions mostly and not really talking anymore?

My PD and I are on different schedules so we don't interact in person too much, and if we do our child is there and we are usualy tending to the child. But now I've been so distant that it's getting to the point where he will ask me what is going on and honestly I don't know what to say. Is this normal?

Exactly in this place too and generally quite happy about it. Talking generally leads to conflict, having the kids around means conversations are geared towards them and their wants. Anything I'd like for the family or future I tend to sort completely myself, get all he ducks in a row and then just get pdw to just rubber stamp or reject with minimal fuss. She then gets the control she craves andI've done the work I want to.

Blackbird11 · April 10, 2019, 06:36:16 AM

Thank you both for your responses.

Crushed dad, I have realized that my uPD does not understand how to communicate at all without conflict. I came to this realization when I put the brakes on JADE-ing with him. It's not always rage and yelling. Those incidents are few and far between. Our conversations on the surface seem calm and "normal" - which means anyone observing them probably wouldn't notice how he constantly tries to get me to JADE. It's frustrating to say the least.

I am obviously still in the FOG and in re-reading what I wrote I realize that the guilt portion is a given - but it almost felt like a different kind of guilt/resistance to getting my ducks in a row. I guess it's the same and all related to my entanglement with the PD.

As my T says, there's no exact rulebook for how to proceed from here.

11JB68 · April 10, 2019, 11:43:45 AM

I've been working with the tools for about a year now.
Positive: less conflict, less abuse
Negative: I'm lonely. Eliminating the negative has also eliminated a lot of interaction and back and forth. I've realized I can't rely on uPDh for support. I feel very alone.

safehead · April 10, 2019, 02:19:39 PM

My updgf have a good time doing recreational stuff, and she does a lot of nice little things for me ,but when there's life issues it's hard to problem solve together. With more serious stuff like health, money, and work problems, she'll take my advice if the issue is purely logistical, but she's been doing a lot of that on her own now, so it comes up less and less. If the problems are more personal or value based, it's really hard to offer help because if she doesn't like my input she reads its like an attack on her. It makes it hard to be honest with her and it gets to me, so I try my best not to offer too much insight if I can identify those situations, but I think she senses my resentment. We each have our own life goals and I just feel like she's not realistic about pursuing her own. She gets stumped on something, I can't offer substantive help, I'm reduced to being a cheerleader meanwhile I'm sidetracked from pursuing my own goals. recently I try to focus on recreational stuff more and more to reduce the resentment

Blackbird11 · April 10, 2019, 02:54:15 PM

11JB68: Yup. I feel the lonliness too. All of the time now. And anger comes in every now and again.

Safehead: Same. I can't make suggestions without my uPDh getting extremely defensive and/or attacking me in retaliation for what he perceives as attack.

safehead · April 10, 2019, 04:46:35 PM

I echo the loneliness sentiment. I have friends and coworkers to express to, but my udpdgf gets jealous about me talking to anyone else too much. It's exhausting and idk if I can do it anymore.

Kaneda8888 · April 19, 2019, 03:46:33 PM

Not an active poster on this website but I am so glad to have read this thread. I identify with the posts. Only realised my uNPDw was exactly that about 6 years ago. I was struggling with my alcoholism at the time. Fortunately got through that and with a clear mind, realised what sort of environment I was in. I started practicing a combination of JADE (which for me is silence) and grey rock whenever I remember. There are times when I will slip. Which usually leads to the same old arguments. Nowadays I can see the path quite clearly and will shut down the 'conversation' quickly. Not only do I practice JADE/GR but I also make sure that I am physically separate. Our interactions are very limited and mostly revolve around our children and transactions. I rarely let her know what I am doing. Pointless to tell her how I feel as that doesn't register at all. So, it works but it is very lonely. That causes me to slip every now and then as I have no one to share intimate details or problems. Even then I know its of little value as she simply shoots back a biting remark about my inadequacies or brushes it off as inconsequential. I do have good friends who I can share a bit but there is a limit to that.

I guess I am biding my time until my last child grows up. Is this normal ? I don't know what normal is but I can certainly relate to what you are experiencing, Blackbird !

1footouttadefog · April 19, 2019, 09:02:57 PM

Yep, separate and waiting for last kid to grow up.

It's lonely not having the friend to talk about your problems and feelings with as you should be able to do with a spouse, that you get negativity and devalued is even worse than neutrality you might expect from a stranger.

In reality a random stranger from the grocery store might feel more warm and connected than a spouse with a pd who had devalued us.

musttryharder · April 23, 2019, 05:54:44 PM

Blackbird11 - I am in a very similar situation, although I have no children in the mix. When it became obvious that she was not the person I thought she was (way too late) and things became unpleasant, I withdrew as much as possible for self preservation, but now we are essentially room mates. I cringe on the rare occasions she tries to hug me out of nowhere. I know that an innocent question could escalate rapidly, so I keep my thoughts to myself. I do my own thing in my free time. We haven't been on any kind of fun day out for nearly 2 years.
She acts as if everything is fine, and she has added a bunch of new shallow friends. I, on the other hand, am just miserable. Guilt has kept me here - guilt and the "what if it's me" thoughts that come from the gaslighting and crazy-making. I know I need to go.
Is it normal? I'd hate to say that any of this is in any way normal, but my experience is similar to yours. I am taking one small step out the door at a time. Copy some documents one day, look at apartments another. They add up and it feels less overwhelming that way.

GentleSoul · April 28, 2019, 02:54:18 AM

Love and warmth to all posting in this thread.

uPD H and I are to together but apart. I realise lately I am lonely too. Can only talk certain topics to H. The defensiveness and conflict in him comes straight to the surface. He perceives everything as criticism of him. He has also re-written history as to why he is so ill and house bound. His alcoholism is killing him right now.

I am very grateful for this safe space. Deep thanks to the people who run this healing site.