Validation from myself is good enough

[JayBird]

My husband's aunt and uncle just had a two-day visit with us. And when they finally left I felt exhausted and drained.

I used to think that this aunt was pretty ok and I preferred her to uNmil .  However, this last year, as I have come out the FOG, I can no longer "not see" the NPD behavior when it is before me. Coming Out of the FOG for me meant working with therapist to identify and validate how NPD negatively affects me and why I need to distance myself from NPD people (specifically H's FOO). I have been able to use toolbox skills such as using VLC, no JADEing, MC and no self-disclosure to my H's clan.

After this visit with my H's aunt and, I realized she has high uNPD and I need to re-evaluate my relationship with her. I observed how she dominated every conversation, drew attention back to herself at every occasion and manipulated the group to make sure her needs were meet and worse. And...of course...self-aggrandizement. None of this was new behavior.

Narc Aunt found a way to dismiss and devalue a significant accomplishment of mine (she did this several times) and took a stab at my appearance during my wedding that occurred 15 years ago (I was pregnant at my wedding- but non-the-less, I felt blessed at the time and still do). Aunt was oh-so-subtle and covert in her digs.

This had a triggering affect on me as H's nAunt looks so much like my uNmil (who I have gone vvvlc with) and I realized that I can no longer tolerate this under-cutting and need for one-up-manship. The hard part is that I cannot have a conversation with my husband to help me validate these feelings of mine, nor does my husband witness or interpret N behavior as being an issue. H is deep in the FOG (deeply conditioned by his FOO Narc matriarchs). H will always gaslight me into feeling like I am over reacting and misinterpreting what is going on. But these days I am trusting my gut instincts. I know now that it is enough for me to validate my own feelings.

But thankfully this forum is full kindred spirits who understand.

[Pepin]

The hard part is that I cannot have a conversation with my husband to help me validate these feelings of mine, nor does my husband witness or interpret N behavior as being an issue. H is deep in the FOG (deeply conditioned by his FOO Narc matriarchs). H will always gaslight me into feeling like I am over reacting and misinterpreting what is going on. But these days I am trusting my gut instincts. I know now that it is enough for me to validate my own feelings.

  I totally align with you on this.  My PDmil is a class cluster C with an underlying cluster B current that fills her sails.  She is a master waif keeping DH under her thumb with her demands of helplessness....yet somehow manages to do it in a way that seems like she really doesn't know any better.  She just doesn't want to give up her son, refusing to see that he is a husband and father and that is where is priorities are.  But because DH is brainwashed into believing that the "matriarchs" need to be served and cared for, he does their bidding without batting an eye.

I too, also deal with DH's aunt...who for the most part seems ok but also has some pretty undesirable PD traits as well.  Overall her behavior is better than PDmil though she often times gets frustrated with PDmil's helplessness....but won't admit that she is of the same wavelength.  For whatever reason, both PDmil and her sister just didn't evolve very well in the maturity department....unlike their brother who keeps his distance and deals only with facts.  The fact is that all PDs have choices....they just choose not to accept responsibility for what they do and take it out on anyone or anything around them. 

[JayBird]

Pepin, thank you!

Isn't it amazing how strong NPD runs in some family systems? Certainly, my uNmil and her sister are cut from the same cloth. You can see how this behavior is passed down from one generation to another.

Interestingly, I have an old friend from my past who has always been very self centered and interactions are only ever one-side and quite draining (my history of attracting NPD's began early!)  My H will state that it is difficult for him to listen to a person just ramble on and on about themselves without any meaningful interaction or balance in conversation. H has no problem identifying this behavior as being very N in this old freind. But his blinders are on with his FOO who exhibit same N behaviors for decades. He just cannot/will not see what I see in regard to his FOO's behavior.

[Call Me Cordelia]

I said this recently on another thread, but writing down the details of all these interactions was such a fruitful exercise. When things are written down in black and white it's so much harder to gaslight. Like with the covert digs my MIL took at me about being a spoiled housewife... It's easy enough to say, "oh she didn't mean it like that," about one statement, but much harder for DH to ignore when I have half a dozen or so, written down, within a few days of each other, and he heard most of them himself. It was a lot of work but so validating to myself. DH still challenged some of my recollections, but there was enough there to establish once and for all, for both of us, that I was not making things up!

Even if this doesn't work for your DHs' level of FOG, I still recommend the exercise. DH did think it seemed over-the-top, and like I'm just trying to make trouble with his M, but he accepted that my T recommended it. I said if her words were kind and loving I would record that too. What I remember from this visit is entirely up to MIL.

What I remember led us straight into NC, but there you go. Logical actions based on solid evidence!

[JayBird]

Cordelia- I really like the approach you took to include written documentation of BOTH positive comments and negative comment made toward you by your PDmil. I bet the list was WAY off balance.

Sometimes, I gain traction in regard to my H understanding me and my perceptions, yet inroads towards any "united front" has not materialized. When I list out for my H a history of uNmil abuse tactics aimed in my direction, it's like it's too much for H to take and he refuses to listen (disappointing for me-  a defense mechanism of his). So I turned to finding a good T, and its been helping. What I need to do (and continually remind myself)  is to absolutely prioritize my mental health and well being and no longer be a people pleaser to my H's N FOO. vvvvvvlc.