So bothered- am I making a mountain out of a molehill

[Stepping lightly]

So- we've had a lot more time with the kids lately, and there has definitely been some interesting conversations dynamics happening.  I'm writing this post, not necessarily for advice, but because the experience is bouncing around in my head.  DH and I are so deeply disturbed by it, neither of us can actual speak about it.

We were playing cards with the kids last night, and DSD starts telling us about a dream she had last year while on a trip with BM/BF.  Both kids are laughing- DSS remembers the dream.  They gave the ending of the dream from the start, so I was extremely uncomfortable during the detailing of it.  I even said at one point, "This is making me so uncomfortable, I can't even look at you while you are telling us this".  DH's face was super grim.  I didn't stop her, because to some extent, I thought DH wanted to know what she was going to say.  I should have gotten up and walked out of the room- I regret it.  It was basically a dream about DH and all of the horrible lies BM tells the kids about him manifesting in very odd dreamlike ways.  The end of the dream- DSD killed DH in a very disturbing way (that I won't say, but I...just...can't...even...believe she said it out loud!).  After telling us how she killed him, laughing...she said, "I'm not actually sure if I dreamed that or i just made that part up".

So- they laughed, even with our horror stricken faces, "Oh SL, it's just a dream".   Deep down, I know BM/BF had a good laugh about it too.  Maybe I'm making too big a deal out of it, but all of the representations in the dream of BMs lies, the callous retelling, it seemed so incredibly cruel.  They kept talking, and I finally told them to stop.  DH said, "I can't tell you how many levels this disturbs me on"

[Penny Lane]

Oh my gosh, I would be horrified as well. I'm so sorry.



I don't know if this helps at all but here is my guess from a total outsider's perspective of what's happening: DSD had this dream because she was having a hard time reconciling what she knows about her dad vs the lies her mom tells her. When she had the dream she probably was really disturbed by it. (I wonder if in the dream she was maybe more like killing the made up dad that her BM lies about, in order to make more room in her life for the good real life dad she knows?) Then she relayed that dream to BM and the BF, and they thought it was HILARIOUS. And they gaslighted the kids into also thinking it's hilarious. Now she's totally forgotten that it was initially a hurtful or thought provoking thing. And she's totally substituted how she was "supposed to" react per BM, which doesn't leave any room for her to consider whether it might be a cruel thing to share with her father.

I do NOT think this means she wants to kill her dad or that she thinks it would be funny. It sounds a lot more like a stress dream to me - I've been having those lately and the whole tone of it sounds familiar to me.

All that said, I really don't think you're making too big of a deal about it. I do think there's not much you can do. This isn't new information per se - you know how cruel BM is about H and how bad that is for the kids. but this is just one more example of how harmful it is for them (both in the dream and the inappropriate reaction).

Take care of yourselves, this kind of thing is so so hard to deal with and there's no real solution other than keep doing what you're doing.

[athene1399]

I'm sorry, SL! I find dreams are generally symbolic, so i agree with what Penny is saying. They also sometimes say your brain throws together random stuff from 3 days ago, but it does sound more influenced by BM saying things about DH. You could always ask DSD what she thinks it means, but that could be opening up a can of worms. All that aside though, with the "disturbing killing", that would disturb me even if it is symbolic, like what is she watching on tv over there for her mind to create that?

I don't know if this helps, but was it a nervous laugh? Maybe the kids wanted to know how you two felt about it since they knew how BM/BF did. And they know how crazy it sounds so were trying to make light of it by laughing.

I don't think you're making a big deal out of nothing. I would be worried as well. I am sorry you had to go through this. 

[Stepping lightly]

Thanks ladies.  I know it doesn't mean she wants to do it, but to find it funny was really extremely odd to me. There could be symbolism, I'll about believing our brains reconcile things in our sleep.   I've had dreams where family members died, and I couldn't even talk about it, it bothered me so much.  So to see the other extreme, was unnerving.  Not to mentioned, this was like a 10-15 minute thing, and not one time did DH or I look like we were enjoying it much less laughing.

The part I just don't even want to put in writing- is the most disturbing part.  It was certainly some type of symbolic component, but 1- the fact that she said it out loud, and then after the even in her dream she had a "message" for her father based on what she did 2- if she made it up- that just makes me nauseous it was so horrifying.

I don't even know what my emotion is for this- with a PD/custody thing worry is always there, but this is sort of more.....heartbreak/disbelief really.

[Penny Lane]

Hang in there. This is so hard. Maybe once the shock wears off you can process your feelings a little more deeply. But you might just have to feel your awful feelings for awhile.

[Whiteheron]

Sometimes my DS will make up horrid things and tell them to his dad because his dad encourages it. stbx thinks it great, DS gets a great reaction and suport, comes home to tell me and I don't give the same reaction. It's obvious DS is not thinking about what he's saying, only that it will get him some attention from his dad (both kids desperately crave stbx's attention).

I'm thinking that your DSD embellished on her dream quite a bit in her telling it to BM/BF, who encouraged her to stretch it out a bit (or more than a bit...), she got a great reaction from them, so wanted to tell you so she could get the same reaction from you, not fully realizing that it wasn't funny and was actually hurtful to your DH.

[Stepping lightly]

Thanks all!  This was really helpful in sorting through this!

WhiteHeron- I think you may have nailed it!  So sickening to think of them sitting around laughing like Jakals over something so cruel.  Based on the details, it does seem like it was something that DSD created for BM's benefit....especially the PS note of "I may have just made that part up".

This dream was apparently a year ago, so weird it came up now.  I just can't imagine them not understanding that someone doesn't want to hear about someone's dream of you killing them.  They are 12 and 14, so we aren't dealing with small children that can't read the room.

[Whiteheron]

stepping lightly - My DS is 15 and is well aware of other's reactions to what he says. He does it anyways, desperate for the attention it gets him. I think the kids around their age are so focused on the attention it gets them that they just don't stop to think. It's not easy for them to navigate this PD manipulation (DS thinks he's a master at realizing when he's being manipulated by stbx...he's not even close).

Weird that the dream came up a year later - I'll bet there was a topic of conversation that sparked her memory and she said something along the lines of "I had a dream about..." and that's all the opening they needed.

[Magnolia34]

Oh gosh, I'm so sorry you're having to process this. I have noticed that my DSD15 is often inappropriate in social (or even just around our family) situations. She's not always great about reading a room or having the empathy to look at someone's reaction and think "I should probably stop talking about this, they don't think it's funny." I think she feels committed to whatever she's saying. From what I can tell her uBPDmom doesn't have a ton of social skills. She prides herself on being "antisocial and introverted" and DSD15 will often make comments like "I hate people" because she thinks it's cool to be that way.

I think some of the other comments have hit the nail on the head. He dream was reinforced with BM/BF and even while telling you the story her sibling was laughing and encouraging her. Maybe she just got committed to the story even with your discomfort and thought somehow she could recover at the end.

Maybe revisit this whole thing with her later and ask her some questions "how do you think that made your dad feel to hear you say that?" etc?

Good luck!