Making friends

[Amadahy]

Hi! I think this is the first time I've posted here — I usually post about Nmom under the "elderly pd" section.

I've been thinking about how to make friends. Good, healthy friendships. I've had two recently that felt close, but ultimately crumbled, in part due to trauma bonding. I have many good acquaintances and casual friends, so maybe that's good enough? IDK. Trauma is a pain in the a$$.

One article I like and have found helpful: https://medium.com/@joshuaburkhart/traumatic-bonding-why-relationships-fall-apart-1abbb6c2b9ca

Anyone have ideas or experience to share? Thanks,

[P&K]

I can relate and appreciate what you've shared here. I don't have experiences I want to share at this point but I want to acknowledge your post and say I've gained more clarity for my own growth. It helped me word something I felt but couldn't even explain  to myself. Now that the issue which brought me to this site is no longer that stressful, I've really been looking inward and learning things about myself which I'd been rather oblivious to until recently.
For a time, I too felt that friendships where I couldn't share my deeper stories  weren't as close as the trauma bonded friendships I had/have. Gratitude and radical acceptance have been very liberating for me.

Thank you for sharing and I hope your journey brings you peace, lightness and happiness. 

[notrightinthehead]

I think of it as that longing for someone who makes me whole. Because of that longing, normal friendships with people who share my interests and are easy to chat to, feel superficial as the linked article describes.
I have decided that every time I feel that (unfulfillable?) longing for deep closeness with another person, which makes my actual connections in real life look shallow and frustrates me, I will attempt to self nurture and soothe. My hope is that eventually I can fill that hole inside me enough that I will be happy with normal, adult relationships.

[capybara]

Thank you for this post! The article is so helpful. I also feel like regular friendships are "shallow" - something I used to look down on in high school. I am learning to accept more normal relationships.

[clara]

When I was in group therapy, I saw and experienced a number of "trauma bonds" that were among the worst so-called friendships I've ever had.  If we weren't discussing all the ways in which our lives were a mess, we weren't discussing anything.  We were looking for deep and "lasting" friendships where we knew each other's secrets and faults so could thereby be honest and "real" with each other.  Our therapist actively discouraged such friendships and warned us against them, but we ignored him.  We thought the only people we could be true friends with were each other.   Other friendships were shallow and not worth the time.  And boy, were we wrong.  Fortunately, the friendships didn't last very long because after awhile you wear each other out.  I finally realized how dysfunctional these relationships were and how much I was starting to dislike being around these people.  But for awhile it felt great, yet only for a while and a short one at that!  So, I had to re-think friendships all over again and it actually took a long time to sort them into "types" and to be okay with each type.  I had to learn to lower my expectations, or not have them at all, and to just enjoy the person for who they were and for what brought us together.  Honestly, it took a long time to get to that point but you get there!

[TriedTooHard]

Thank you Clara for this insight into the brief connections you made in your group therapy.  I think I went through something similar with a couple of support groups I was in.  I need to learn more about trauma bonding in potential friendships, but in the meantime, after those experiences, I've realized the hard way that maybe a shared non-traumatic interest is the way to go.  Also, another thing I'm realizing the hard way is that developing new friendships requires time - so someone who is super busy might be a good person, but maybe can't be a good friend at the moment.  And something I realized long ago that co-workers may be potential friends, but its probably a good idea to wait to get close until you or they have changed jobs.

[Call Me Cordelia]

I tend to enjoy friendships with "normal people" when my imposter syndrome doesn't flare up. I'm starting to feel like, "Wow, so this is what it's like to just belong and take it for granted! You're comfortable and don't even necessarily notice it. Amazing!"

[Amadahy]

Thanks everyone for responses and ideas! I'll further share something interesting that happened just last night.

I am part of a walking group.  I was walking and one of the female members, I'll call her Z, and I fell into pace and we walked together. Convo was pleasant at first, but very quickly Z told me about an abusive former husband, a homeless friend, an abusive mother and demented grandmother who nearly burned down the house. All of this was told rapid-fire, as if stored up with no one to help process or understand, which I totally get.

In the past, I would have felt extremely helpful, and run headlong into a deep friendship with Z. I'm not ruling out friendship, she seems lovely in ways, but I'm taking it easy.

I'll be honest, too... in the past, I would have been proud of my approachability and ability to listen, but lately I am more annoyed with folks who sort of word vomit (even though I have compasssion) because I feel objectified, which I admit could be a trauma response in itself.

So, DH saw our (her - lol) talking and later suggested we get together, etc. but I was able to explain to him my caution and he got it!  I feel like this is progress for me!

[Drawing_boundaries]

From the article

My desire for stability made me think their reserved nature was emotional mastery. My need for acceptance saw in their aloofness the discernment that would guarantee I have value if they would just declare it.

That has struck a cord with me so deep I have had to stop reading to really filter what that means. This article is able to go some way in helping me understand why I have always been alone in the world. FOO is the starting point but my traumatised psyche has ensured I repeat this pattern

[newlife33]

Thanks everyone for responses and ideas! I'll further share something interesting that happened just last night.

I am part of a walking group.  I was walking and one of the female members, I'll call her Z, and I fell into pace and we walked together. Convo was pleasant at first, but very quickly Z told me about an abusive former husband, a homeless friend, an abusive mother and demented grandmother who nearly burned down the house. All of this was told rapid-fire, as if stored up with no one to help process or understand, which I totally get.

In the past, I would have felt extremely helpful, and run headlong into a deep friendship with Z. I'm not ruling out friendship, she seems lovely in ways, but I'm taking it easy.

I'll be honest, too... in the past, I would have been proud of my approachability and ability to listen, but lately I am more annoyed with folks who sort of word vomit (even though I have compasssion) because I feel objectified, which I admit could be a trauma response in itself.

So, DH saw our (her - lol) talking and later suggested we get together, etc. but I was able to explain to him my caution and he got it!  I feel like this is progress for me!

Well done!!! I feel this is huge for people like us who struggle with boundaries and other issues. It was completely inappropriate for her to dump all of that emotional baggage onto you, awkward and a bit rude.  You noticed this, noticed your old habit and then made a change!!!! That is brave, incredible and intelligent.  Now that you are more skilled with this it will hopefully become natural and you will attract healthier people and make healthier small talk.  Best of luck.

[freddyb]

question: did you work at one time in a helping profession?  I find people who are needy can find these people like a beacon at midnight to dump all their stuff upon.  Try not to take it personally, these kind of people tend to be naturally drawn to givers or empathic people. 

I found my longing for these same type of deep type relationships after years of doing the same wondering of why they never seemed to develop is because I was so deprived and neglected of any kind of caring or love by my emotionally dead family that I literally looked for it everywhere, including mostly places where it never would have developed anyways, or wasnt appropriate or a reasonable expectation to make of the other person.  And I later learned because my family were so neglectful of my emotional needs it miswired me to be attracted or drawn to unavailable people because thats who I was trying to get attention from: my parents, people who never gave two s***s about me as a human being.

its a bit better for me - I do have a wonderful supportive and loving partner who gives back to me emotionally - learning not to be confused by someone wanting to meet my emotional needs is still something I struggle with - and I don't really have any friends other than a series of tenuous acquaintances who don't seem terribly interested in meeting me where I am.  But I do understand myself way more than I used to and I am grateful for that.  I am way on the introvert scale and find other people mostly draining/annoying.  This off puts people, who get offended, quite understandably, but they don't understand that this is the way I am wired, theres nothing I can do about it other than be aware of it, and I'm not going to see it as a flaw like I used to, as it is not a flaw.  My cup fills up so fast one conversation a week with someone outside of my partner is enough to keep me going for another week.  I just don't need others to the degree that most others do.  (if only the world stopped shaming introverts, but alas that will never happen).  But it is what it is, and I am understanding why I had relationships I had and why they didnt work out (they never would have) and I'd rather it be this way (have the knowledge) than continuing to wonder why I never was able to connect with many other people. 

try to go easy on yourself and be patient with yourself.  accept your feelings about your predicament even if they aren't good ones, acknowledge their presence and let them go.  keep your expectations low and set the bar to a more reasonable expectation like just having a friendly conversation with another person and work your way up to bigger goals from there. maybe a meet up or a different meet up group (there are bad ones), or find another activity group to do something that you like to do, doing all these things Ive found have really helped me. 

[Amadahy]

Freddyb,
I am a chaplain. Lol. The vibe must be powerful — I had an elderly man approach me at Walmart yesterday and tell me about his wife's passing while I was looking at protein powders. Of course, I felt compassion, and said, "I'm terribly sorry."

So.... yeah. This realization is something I'm trying to enjoy. I feel freed up from having to have deep, meaningful, heavy discussions to feel a connection. It is a lightness I've longed for. I do have a DH I can discuss anything with and a couple of "deep" friends and that helps, I'm sure.  Thanks, again, y'all for responses. Peace ~~