Dying - why is it okay not to go?

[Freetolive]

I've been non-contact now for three years and have been helped massively by reading all the posts on here, to reassure me that it wasn't me going mad.

My only regret it that I didn't do it sooner. First year was awful, second, I was still on edge, but now I hear virtually nothing.

The only thing that still bothers me, is how to handle getting a message to say one of my parents is dying.

I absolutely, totally and completely do not want to see them. I have nothing comforting to say to them and I know it won't go well.

But would that make me selfish, evil, lacking any morals?

I think it kinder for them to think I am the most horrible person on the planet than to hear what I have to say. I have never explained why I went NC - they would never have accepted it could possibly be anything to do with them and they didn't deserve an explanation. I simply cannot lie for one more second and try and say something comforting.

Is it okay to deny a dying person if they ask me to go? They'd all be there. It would be horrible. Am I being weak?

They are elderly and it's a definite possibility at some point.

Thank you in advance for your thoughts/x

[GettingOOTF]

I went to see my mother when she was dying. At the time I was fully in FOG. I'm not sure I would do it now. It was pretty awful. It was a stressful time and it magnified all the family dysfunction. There were also a lot of conflicting feelings and no space or support to work through them.  I used to say that I didn't regret going but now I'm not sure.

I will not go see my father. He would take the opportunity to get in one last dig.

My personal view on this subject is that anything you do during the dying/funeral process is to ease your own transition. If you feel not going would be most beneficial/least harmful, then don't. I don't think you owe anyone anything.

We get a lot of "it's the right thing to do" advice from people not familiar with the circumstances during these times. My experience has been that when someone tells me something is the right thing to do it's never to right thing for me.

You are not weak. There is nothing stronger than standing up for our selves and walking our own path.

[lotusblume]

Such a personal decision and a very difficult one.

My narcissistic grandmother and I were always extremely close. When I was coming Out of the FOG, I still hadn't realised that, and felt that she was still one of the people who loved me and was happy for me. I confided in her about the situation that was unfolding with my parents and siblings, and she was sympathetic, and said she was shocked they behaved that way. She told me that when she spoke with them, she would let them know that they were in the wrong.

We spoke again a few days later (at this point we were still very enmeshed.) She told me that she had spoken with my parents and told me she had said "I think lotus misses you and needs her mom and dad." I was appalled!!! I felt very uncomfortable and betrayed and don't remember exactly what I said next, but I started to defend myself, and then she called me stubborn. She became critical and I ended the conversation crying, and she called me back a few minutes later to tell me she didn't mean to make me cry and that I should just forget about it. She gave me so many mixed messages during that time, telling me in the previous conversation that my FOC (fiance) was what was important and not to worry about my parents.

My father played victim and recruited her as a flying monkey. I maintained minimum contact with her for a few months, and she guilt tripped me all the time.

I wonder sometimes if her original sympathy was true empathy for the inner child in her via me, and then she shut that door abruptly because it could mean that she could be upset with her (long gone idealised) parents, and my mother could be upset with her.

She began calling, emailing, texting everyday. We spoke a few more times but it got so intense that I finally blocked her as well, felt terribly guilty at the time. I started to examine her behaviours with my mother and with me in my childhood, all the intergenerational stuff, and realised she has behaved quite narcissistically.

She was begging for me to call her, asking if I was mad at her, and I ignored it all. I couldn't handle it. After a few months hiatus, (when I spoke again with my FOO), I sent her a medium chill email. I never confronted her about all I realised and went VLC.

Fast forward to now, she is currently in the hospital. I still have a lot of anger towards her but also have been feeling some sympathy. My FOO went full anxiety mode and called and messaged multiple times about this, and they are asking if I've called her. I haven't answered. I keep in touch with one relative about the situation, my uncle, who has been the only person not to go flying monkey on me about my parents. He seems aware of the dysfunction, but still in it. Now that I have not called her and it's been over a month, I struggle with grief. I don't know if she will pass away in 3 weeks or 3 years, but I haven't called. I made a plan that if I get news she is in critical condition I will call. I have also decided that I will probably call her in a few days or weeks, when I'm feeling strong and the hoovering calms down.

I don't know if I will tell her the truth, that she hurt me and betrayed me, and tell her I hope she is well and not suffering. Or if I skip the truth.

I apologise for hijacking this post with such a long comment, but maybe you can relate. It is an extremely tough decision (and she is not my parents). I think it's good that you think about these things now so you can prepare mentally and emotionally for the inevitable.

Its strange to think about these things as we become emotionally detached, but I think the questions are very important to stay emotionally level.

I wish you the best. Lots of support and empathy.

[SerenityCat]

Taking good care of yourself does not make you selfish, evil, or lacking in morals.

Freetolive, you aren't being weak.

In my own case, I'm NC with my elderly father. I can't be around him. Even if I was told that he didn't have long to live, I would not be able to go see him.

This is not because of revenge or anger or to try to punish him at all. I even have some distant compassion for him. I just have had to choose my own well being.

NC has been a great choice for me. My anxiety level is now less and I'm not re-traumatizing myself.

I wish my father well. I hope that he has an easy passage when his time comes. Whenever I do hear that he has died I'll probably do a little something to memorialize - light a candle, go to the beach and toss in a rose, anything that helps me through the changes.

[gettingstronger1]

I absolutely, totally and completely do not want to see them. I have nothing comforting to say to them and I know it won't go well.

But would that make me selfish, evil, lacking any morals?

Only you can make this personal decision.  Go with your gut feelings.  If your gut is telling you that you absolutely don't want to see them, then you should honor your gut instincts.  If your gut feeling is telling you that NC is the right decision and you wish you had done it 20 years ago then you should honor that feeling.

You are not bad, selfish, or evil for setting boundaries.  I too wish I had quietly decreased contact with my mother 20 years earlier.  I did not visit my mother on her death bed.  She didn't love me and she didn't want me there so I didn't go.  I have no regrets about that. 

[Fiasco]

I think we've been sold the idea of a dying person being somehow still lucid and in control of their actions and feelings by too many tv shows and movies. My dad, who had issues but divorced my BPDm 40 years ago, died this year. Yes I went to see him and was lucky enough to make it to his bedside before he passed. BUT: there were no goodbyes, since I knew he was dying and he really didn't. There were no heartfelt chats, there was just dying.

I think being raised by PDs we have the impression that we can save the PD from their tortured life, but we can't. We can't fix their life or their dying. So you have to do what works for you and the people who care about you.

[Call Me Cordelia]

Sounds like you are certain that reconciliation is not a possibility. That's absolutely fine. And if so not attending at their deathbeds is simply consistent behavior.

I too don't see the point of showing up to see a dying person if you are certain it would be unpleasant. It's not fair to you or really to the dying person and other family members either. Your being there would open up all the ugliness of the past. If they were wanting to ask forgiveness, they would have done it before the deathbed scene. So much drama and supply, and last chance to get it! And who would dare put responsibility on a dying person?!? It would likely have some rugsweeping at play. Opting out is perfectly reasonable.

All of us will leave this world with unfinished business. It's not your job to ease anyone's passing at the expense of your own well-being. Especially if it would put you on the spot to tell comforting lies, potentially accept blame and shame that doesn't belong to you, etc. That's really NOT an act of kindness, to enable them to the grave. Neither is one "last word" spoken in hurt and anger from either of you. To what purpose? If you believe in sin, judgment, heaven, and hell, you're just as likely giving them a final opportunity to be obstinate in their sin! They have their remaining time on earth to make their peace within themselves and with God whether you are there or not. When/if the time does come you may decide it's right for you to go, and maybe I will too. It's ok to change your mind. But you are definitely not obligated.

[hhaw]

Of course it's OK not to go to your PD parents, Freetolive.

You've already suffered more than any child should have to suffer for PD parents.

Now that you're grown, you can protect yourself.  You made that choice when you went NC.   

It's self preservation, and you have no duty to sacrifice yourself to your parents.  None.

You still need protection, and care,  and that has to be your priority.

It's your God given right to protect yourself, and it's your duty, IME.

[Call Me Cordelia]

Coming back to add that an unsent letter might be helpful to you.

I think it kinder for them to think I am the most horrible person on the planet than to hear what I have to say. I have never explained why I went NC - they would never have accepted it could possibly be anything to do with them and they didn't deserve an explanation. I simply cannot lie for one more second and try and say something comforting.

Maybe they don't deserve an explanation, but you deserve to hear what you have to say. And to get it all out. Deathbed scene not required. There's clarity in writing, many of us find.

[overitall]

I personally will not attend my dying uNPDf's funeral...he has been very ill for the past two years...I have been NC for over 8 years, but I have had to attend certain events where he has "shown up".  For me, I have found that the PD's in my life have zero  accountability for what they have done.  Funerals tend to ramp up the emotions and I feel like it would be a very toxic environment for me.  Do I feel guilty?  Not really.  Neither of my parents have ever shown one bit of accountability for their actions...there is nothing there anymore....at this point in my life I have one primary goal, keeping myself and my adult children safe from my very dysfunctional PD infested FOO...attending a funeral would just blow open everything I have worked toward to keeping us safe.  Take care of yourself first and you'll do what is right for you...

[Starboard Song]

Is it okay to deny a dying person if they ask me to go?

It is definitely OK to deny that death bed visit, and to not respond at all, even.

We've talked about this a great deal in my home, and we've even seen this play out in a dear friend. I'd like to share with you her solution, for I found it inspiring. I think her approach was healing and wise, and I hope we choose one day, to follow her lead.

Like you, my friend didn't want to lie. And didn't want to share that room. And didn't want to breach that NC wall. But her father was in his last few days, and she felt it was an opportunity to do her own heart some good.

She sent a letter via third-party family member, to be read to her father. Now, we don't quote people's communications here, but this has been a few years and my memory is bad. So I'm going to offer this fictionalized version that well-conveys her tone, and what she tried to accomplish.

I understand your time is short. As you hear these words, I hope you have dear people by your side. Life is long and complex, but seems very short and very simple at the end. I am on my own complex story, and I want you to know that my life -- the one you gave me -- is very good. You were a loyal husband to mother all these decades, and that is a good example for men who fail in that regard.

This week, I wish for you a peaceful heart. I wish for you a warm hand, squeezed close by someone who loves it. I wish for you confidence, calm, and ease. For those are the things I have found in my life, I treasure them, and gladly share a measure with you today.

A letter sort of like that -- but not remotely that -- was read out loud to this man. He died a day or two later. I think she did a beautiful thing for him and for her own heart.

[Free Rebel]

You are not selfish or terrible for not wanting to be there at your parents' bedside or at their funeral.  They made their decision to harm you on purpose, and like you, I wish I had gone no contact decades before I did.  I used to feel guilt about going no contact and not sending them cards on their birthdays and Mother's/Father's Day, but now I don't. 

I think losing my only sibling, my sister, last year and breaking no contact with them (she and I both were no contact with both of our parents) so I could attend her funeral showed me even more so that they were still evil and everything was about THEM.  They focused on themselves instead of my sister at her own funeral.         I was NOT surprised but again, it validated my decision to go no contact.  I wouldn't sit with them even though my narc mother asked me to.  I didn't go to their home afterwards either although my narc mother asked me.  I told her "no" both times.  I knew what she was doing and she wanted it to look like we were close and all was well although they knew that both my sister and I had walked away from them before she died.

My sister and I talked about what we would do if we got word from other family members about them dying.  I told her that I would NOT go to their bedside and I would NOT go to their funeral.  The funny thing is they wrote us hateful letters demanding to know if we would be at their funeral or not, ROFL.  We never answered them and let them figure it out with our silence.  My sister said she would only go to their funeral if her only child, her daughter, asked her to.  Our parent had/have turned her against us but my sister couldn't let go, naturally, since that was her child.  Her child treated her horribly but she still loved her.  She, my sister, wanted to tell our narc mother in particular a message on her deathbed, LOL.  I told my sister that I was not going to be there with her because our parents would use it to harm me and I was done with that. 

Society will try to make you feel like a terrible "child" if you don't go to their bedside or to their funeral, but society also doesn't know the torment and hell on earth that we went through with them our entire lives.  Don't feel guilty about it, THEY are the ones who should feel guilty for destroying a chance of a good relationship between child and parent but they don't feel one bit of it.  They projected that guilt on to us since we are not like them and actually feel remorse and guilt.  I also and my sister never told our parents why we walked away, we figured they would play the victim if we explained it and we were right as they still sent us horrible letters when we both walked away.  Nothing changes with narcissists except they get worse the older they get.

[Freetolive]

Thank you all for your wonderful replies and sharing your own stories. It has really helped me enormously, because as I read, I can see where my story fits and why I must do what I must do - or rather not do.

It has reminded me why I broke contact in the first place and that they didn't do any of the things that they 'ought' to have done and were 'obligated' to do, so why am I torturing myself about my obligations.

I think the letter was lovely and I wish that was a solution for me, but that would be read as me being sorry for breaking contact and might encourage the rest of the family to start harassing me  again and I can't risk that. And I think that is the most important thing I realise - being left alone in peace. So, I won't be going and thank you all for making me feel very sure and positive about that decision.

[biggerfish]

Dear Freetolive, boy do I know what you mean. My uPDm just passed away a few weeks ago after a brief hospice stay. I had been NC with her for four years. When she went into hospice, everyone was visiting her except me. I didn't want to hear anything she had to say and I didn't want to explain anything or be fake.  I also didn't want to risk hearing her slosh over about how she has missed me.

Everyone's situation is different, but here's what worked out for me: My husband and I went to visit her at hospice a few times, but I didn't go in. I stayed outside. On the third visit, while I waited outside, he texted me that she was sound asleep. I decided I felt comfortable to go in and see her. I tiptoed so as not to wake her up. I annointed her with some holy oil, and then slipped back out of the room.

So there. I visited her.  She passed away a few days later.  I'm at peace, but truth be told, if it hadn't worked out for me to go in the room, I still would be at peace. I just went with circumstances that worked for me and were on my terms.

Maybe a good thought for you is that whatever you decide along the way, keep it on your terms. Doing so will give you diginity and peace. You deserve that. (Oh and if you're not used to doing things on your terms, start practicing now. It's a muscle that has to be exercised. When I first started doing things on my terms, I wasn't even sure I understood what that meant.  )

The truth is you are not weak -- you are STRONG! So stand your ground, and hold your head up high.  Instead of focussing on black and white morals, focus on your inner wisdom. In case you haven't been told this enough, you have inner Freetolive-Wisdom. It's right there inside you.

[Freetolive]

Dear bigger fish,

Thank you very much for sharing your experience - I'm so glad it worked out so well for you and you can feel at peace.

I guess I can only decide at the time if I want to change my mind, but as I have no way of knowing their health without making contact (as I'm not in touch with any of them) it will still require breaking no contact with those left behind and all the consequences of that.

They could have passed already for all I know and it doesn't worry me at all that I don't know (which is a bit awful, but that's how I feel).

I just want to be ready if I get 'the call' or a text.

Sorry for the delay in responding - I've only just come back on.

Many thanks

[JustKat]

It's okay not to go.

I was about three years NC with my mother when I was told she was dying of cancer and had "four weeks to live." Four weeks became four years, during which time my enFather sent countless letters trying to guilt me into a visit. I was torn about it and posted in a different forum, where other members told me they had made the death bed visit only to have the parent stick it to them one last time by telling them what a disappointment they had been.

In my case, Nmother helped me make the decision to remain NC when she had my father disinherited myself and my GC brother conditional on things we could do to please her before she died. At that point I went NC with my father as well. When my mother died I was informed by a terse email sent by my sister. I was 55 when she died and had endured a lifetime of suffering at her hands. To be completely honest, I was happy to get that email. I was finally free.

My enFather is now 88 and will probably die without ever seeing me again. He knows I was abused and has yet to show any remorse or offer any kind of apology, so NC is permanent at this point. This may sound cold but you reap what you sow.

Every situation is different, but for me, not doing the death bed visit was the best thing I could have done. I knew my mother well enough to know she would have twisted the knife one more time. It's been five years now and I've never felt any guilt over not going.

My advice would be to do what you think is best for you. If you choose to stay NC, please don't feel guilty or think you're being selfish. You're not. Our parents abused us and never showed remorse. They are the selfish ones and the only ones who should feel guilty.