Nothing to talk about...

[Marinette]

Hi all
I am just looking for advice since many of you can relate...
Recently, I put on some boundaries with my mother. She used to call me , and her only topics of conversation were her horrendous health, her terrible luck, odd, impolite, antisocial friends of our family (very few who are still in touch). There is nothing positive in life bla bla bla.  So I put some firm boundaries in place and we do not talk about someone dying, someone else's diseases, and the fact that everything is terrible in the world. However I have nothing to talk about with her anymore! The pattern has been  going on for so long that we literally have nothing to say to each other except for some standard phrases. I don't know what to do as every phone call is such a torture.
I would love some advice!

[StayWithMe]

Don't feel bad. Many of us are in similar situations.  There is very little I can say that my mother won't use as a platform for useless or ridicule.

Think of this  as a challenge as you learn how to navigate a conversation; redirect it and get it in track to something, at best , is neutral.

Learn how to segue, transfer and so on. Just think how mastering these skills can finely hone your networking capabilities.

Good luck.

[Adrianna]

Since I set boundaries and don't want to hear her whine, we have very little to talk about. Phone conversations are very short.

The nephews wife who visits her is in the same situation. She doesn't want to hear her bitch either so there's nothing really to talk about.

It's not like nana has any interests in us or our lives. We don't bother discussing ourselves with her and she rarely asks. She just wants an audience to listen to her misery filled guilt tripping rants. 

[SerenityCat]

Marinette, can you now shift to having less conversations with her?

You can present yourself as being busier. You can be the one to end each  conversation, you can keep them brief.

Maybe think through the purpose of the conversations. Are they check in times? Are they a habit that isn't needed anymore?

Congrats on setting such clear boundaries!

[Call Me Cordelia]

Reminds me of my “relationship” with my grandmother as an adult. The only question she ever asked me is, “How is school?” Well, now that topic is gone, it never occurred to her to ask about my FOC, never knew or cared what my hobbies were, etc.

She wanted to moan about her health, my terrible aunt and cousins, my father not doing enough for her, blah blah blah. After hearing all that as a child and having her expect ME to rescue her, I decided I simply wasn’t going to listen to that anymore, same as yourself. I would ask her what good things are happening in your world and she would say, “Nothing.” Even remarks about pleasant weather were dismissed. So we too had nothing to say to each other. I would talk about my life to fill the silence and she would say she had to go. Eventually she stopped answering all together when I made my “call of duty” every month or so, and I gave up too. When she passed away we hadn’t spoken for over three years.

No advice, but solidarity. Some people are just incapable of relationship or caring.

[Xena]

Marinette,

I was in the same boat with my mom (engulfing narcissist) after I set boundaries. Before boundaries, she would call me multiple times a day & want to know everything going on in my life (which I overshared with her:doh:). She was also very negative w/family gossip, her complaints, etc., during these calls. When I started sharing less & trying to keep my boundaries intact, it was really hard to talk on the phone with her. My gameplan: let her calls go to voicemail, call back when I was ready (usually before making dinner - see hints below) & keep the calls short (10 - 15 minutes is about all I could do). I slowly stopped calling back as much & I made a list of things to talk about so I could review it ahead of time:

*remember grey rock/medium chill*
- What the weather is like where I live, ask about the weather where she lives
- Run-of-the-mill news (not violent or controversial, just news about sports, local happenings, etc.)
- What I planned to make for dinner (this created a transition for why I needed to end the call - I have to go start dinner, pick up something from the store for dinner, etc.).

Was it work? Yes. Did I enjoy the call? No, but it was to stay in contact while keeping my sanity. Hope this helps - hang in there!

[mazenavigator]

Wow, this thread was pretty interesting.  My mom doesn't handle boundaries well either.   The "walking on eggshells" around my mom was they way me and my dad have behaved for my entire life (I'm in my late 40s now).

Setting boundaries with my mom, and dad as well, has definitely shifted the "blame" to me.  My conversations now are even more superficial as neither of them can really handle a truly honest and intimate conversation.  Both of my parents have an undertone of anger but it comes out as avoidance really.  In all honesty, I probably project a little anger as well because I am still a bit pissed off they don't take any responsibility for taking care of their own emotional needs.

At this point I really don't have much to talk about with them and I'm becoming more and more ok with that every day. On the one hand it seems sort of sad, but on the other hand it's really liberating and it feels a lot more functional. My parents are more than free to learn how to have a functional conversation with me, but I don't believe they are honestly interested.

As a dysfunctional relative of mine actually said, "I don't want to change the way I think".  I believe that is the way my whole family lives. It's crazy making.

[Marinette]

Thank you all so much for your advice!
I do agree that keeping topics very neutral and stick to the weather and what's for dinner works best. However, it makes for  a very boring conversation,  and I can't last more than 15 minutes.  But, it is what it is and this is significantly better than listening to how awfully depressing everything is, how bad her health is and the rest of her mental garbage. 

[nanotech]

I'm having the same issues too, with my dad.
He's just one long winded complaining machine.
I never realised how awful it was till I put up boundaries.
There's precious little to talk about now.
I shut down the negative chat as it occurs,  and the conversation nosedives bigtime
My goodness, I used to indulge and enable all the complaining and criticising! Eek!

Sometimes I try to imagine I'm his friend, not his daughter. This helps keep the chat light and my dad in friend mode is a nicer person to talk to.
So we talk sport.
The weather
What's good on the TV.
Supermarket offers!
What's in his freezer! He likes to discuss this!
( this one can get a bit button pushing but I strive to keep it light and jokey. It also helps me know that dad has food in without my suggesting he's losing it!)

Same with my NSIS.
After my boundaries went up, she decided she ' hates talking on the phone' .
Hmm well you loved it throughout most of the 1980s and 90s  when I'd listen to her tales of woe about her marriage.
Advice fell on deaf ears. I suggested not doing anything drastic. She had an affair with someone half her age.
I frequently gave up precious time to be her
' fixer' only to be later devalued and discarded, then love -bombed and the cycle would start  all over again.
Now? No calls!
No normal stuff allowed I guess. ( shrugs shoulders) 🙂😜
I can live with that!

[BreakAway]

Wow... same here. If you take away the complaining and judgmental criticisms, they have almost nothing to say. And I have to be careful about sharing any details about me or my family, because that is just fodder for judgmental criticisms in conversations with others.

Even the weather isn't safe these days, as any hint of "climate change implications" lead to their demented political ranting. Same with even local news or events -- all of it leads down that path. I refuse to listen to that toxicity and trying to reason with them is useless. I have no interest in sports. Sometimes a movie or TV show will work, but NM usually watches game shows and old reruns.

[Spring Butterfly]

I do agree that keeping topics very neutral and stick to the weather and what’s for dinner works best. However, it makes for  a very boring conversation,  and I can’t last more than 15 minutes.

actually 15 minutes is fine for a phone conversation. How often do you talk?

Within my circle of non PD people phone conversations with people I have regular contact with are nonexistent. We actually spend time together and meeting up is arranged via text. Long-distance friends catch up as news happens in their life either via text or phone call or even just social media messaging in response to a post. There's no set schedule, no routine, no expectation, no set length for a phone conversation if and when it does occur. We talk until we run out of things to say and then the conversation is over however long or short it is. Non PD people don't have rules generally speaking.

Back to your topic though when I was in more frequent contact I actually had to prepare conversation topics ahead of time. My T recommended this in addition to the toolbox here. Finding non controversial common interests was a challenge. Gardening was pretty safe so I would read an article or two from an online blog for gardening in our area.

Another topic was my local news so I look up an article or two about some neutral local happenings, completely boring stuff but it was a topic. Actually the more boring the better - like the local donation center was struggling or the community center was having such and such an event.

The only thing about my life that I shared was funny things the kids in my life or the pets did, my garden, how the grass was growing, etc but other than that my health was fine and everything else was fine.

Eventually though between the fact that every passive aggressive snipe was gently questioned and the conversation wasn't nearly dramatic enough contact is only as often as I reach out to them which isn't very often these days.

[Amadahy]

Cats, pups, work, rinse, repeat (with her memory issues). If I made a tape of "uh huh," "yeah," "okay," Nmom would not know the difference. Pitiful.

[marizabet]

I can relate. H says my mom and I don't do much actual talking to each other.

[Seven]

One of the few times we went to see uNPDm in IL, my DH was excited to tell her we had an employee.  He was so proud.

Her response (after having lived at this place for 3 months)..."I don't even have my own stove"

WTAF?!

This may or may not have been the same day she told me my hair and makeup were God-awful at my sons wedding, and how she was just so gorgeous at hers because "if Dad didn't love her natural beauty" then he wasn't worthy of marrying her (or something to that affect).