Ruminating

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Roza

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Ruminating
« on: November 07, 2019, 09:59:34 AM »
Can anyone tell me how to stop ruminating? I feel like I am stuck in a loop. Being the SG for all my life, being the responsible one,  being the adult from the age of 6 is when I learned to speak English.  I am tired of being the family doormat. I would like apology for the way they have treated me. I know it will not happen but I keep hoping.  But I want to stop ruminating.  Any and all help would be great. I have been going to therapy for 3 months, I do meditation and I try to distract myself from my thoughts.  But more help is necessary.  Thank you in advance.

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Bloomie

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Re: Ruminating
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2019, 12:29:00 PM »
Roza - I have been a ruminator myself and I get how frustrating it is.

It sounds really simple, but I have learned that I have authority over the domain of my mind and the ability to filter my thoughts. So, when a thought comes in I filter it... is this what I really believe? Is this my thought? Is it healthy and edifying or distracting and causing confusion and chaos?

If it is something good, worthy, lovely, uplifting or helpful I go with it. If it is something untrue, destructive, upsetting, I simply say to that thought..."No! Go!" I hope this helps you.

Some really helpful podcasts about how to detox our minds that have helped me a lot are by Dr. Caroline Leaf, a neuroscientist who has done extensive study and teaching about the brain/body connection, and they may be of help to you too. Here is a link to give a listen if you are interested: https://drleaf.com/pages/podcasts
"You can understand and have compassion for someone and still not want a relationship with them."
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PeanutButter

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Re: Ruminating
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2019, 05:13:15 PM »
Roza, I too am a ruminater.
May I ask you is there a particular time of day or night when it is worst?
When I learned the term ruminate I finally had a way to describe what for me was a huge issue of what had been going on in my mind for as far back as I could remember.   
Years of ruminating instead of sleeping (I could not fall asleep while ruminating) also left me with symtoms of sleep deprivation, which made stress so much harder to deal with.   :pissed:
 The ruminating and insomnia exaserbated pain in my body, especially in my neck and shoulders. This is severe pain!  :bawl:
 I'd get totally stuck and stuck for a long time in a state of mental and physical tension. My mind would not stop trying to attribute love where there was none. My body was never relaxed.
Ive tried to not only address the ruminating, but I also worked to elliviate the insomnia and pain too.
I started doing checks throughout the day to see if and when I was holding tension physically. I learned simple breathing exercises from the internet to force my body to relax. (I can do this breathing anytime anywhere) I had to do it over and over again.
I listen to audios of binural beats and isochronic tones to get to sleep.( they change your brain waves) I still do this almost every night.
I also recently started taking a supplement for stress and sleep. Its called gammaaminobutyricacid. It is working miracles on my ability to relax. :zzz:
 "Gamma aminobutyric acid (GABA) is a naturally occurring amino acid that works as a neurotransmitter in your brain. Neurotransmitters function as chemical messengers. GABA is considered an inhibitory neurotransmitter because it blocks, or inhibits, certain brain signals and decreases activity in your nervous system." HEALTHLINE
It sounds like you are using multiple tools and sticking with a plan. I hope you are going to get more releif as you put this time and effort in. You are strong! Your are courageous! You are worthy of love. You have the right to want, need, and hope for an apology for all that you suffered.
My heart still wanted an apology long after my mind understood I would not ever get one.
 :hug:
If there is a hidden seed of evil inside of children adults planted it there -LundyBancroft  Self-awareness is the ability to take an honest look at your life without any attachment to it being right or wrong good or bad -DebbieFord The greatest of faults is to be conscious of none -Thomas Carlyle

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Roza

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Re: Ruminating
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2019, 11:38:17 AM »
Thank you for the wonderful responses.  I have taken it to heart and I am working on the breathing techniques and it does help somewhat, I am watching the youtube vidoes which are also helpful.  I guess I just have a problem with people hurting others and NOT feeling anything.  I must feel too much. Thank you again.

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PeanutButter

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Re: Ruminating
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2019, 05:26:26 PM »
Thank you for the wonderful responses.  I have taken it to heart and I am working on the breathing techniques and it does help somewhat, I am watching the youtube vidoes which are also helpful.  I guess I just have a problem with people hurting others and NOT feeling anything.  I must feel too much. Thank you again.
YES! Absolutely you probably do. IMO You may be deeply empathic. IME you are probably 'feeling' EVERYONES stuff in addition to your own pain too. It is a huge weight and has been your burden for a long time from what I understand of your story.
I have a similar experience and I believe that is why it can take us so long to get into recovery. We have been 'used' from as far back as we can remember as the scapegoat. Which means EVERYONE dumped their negativity on us. It was an extrememly painful existence. We could never imagine doing the same to someone. LET ALONE DOING IT TO SOMEONE WHO LOVED US AND NOT BEING REMORSEFUL!
Now , even if we disconnect from those abusers we still have their 'baggage' as well as our own to carry.
I like what bloomie said , "when a thought comes in I filter it... is this what I really believe? Is this my thought? Is it healthy and edifying or distracting and causing confusion and chaos?
If it is something good, worthy, lovely, uplifting or helpful I go with it. If it is something untrue, destructive, upsetting, I simply say to that thought..."No! Go!""

And I would only add to the "No!  Go!" "No it does not belong with me! Go back to the originator!"
If there is a hidden seed of evil inside of children adults planted it there -LundyBancroft  Self-awareness is the ability to take an honest look at your life without any attachment to it being right or wrong good or bad -DebbieFord The greatest of faults is to be conscious of none -Thomas Carlyle

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Healing Finally

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Re: Ruminating
« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2019, 12:17:16 AM »
Hi Rosa  :wave:;

If you haven't done this already, I recommend checking out the sister website "Out of the Storm" which helps people with Complex PTSD.  I did not know I had this until I found the "Out of the FOG" website that lead me to the "Out of the Storm" website.  You can find it under Resources, above.

In regards to ruminating, I also do this, but now understand, for me, it's more of what is referred to as an "emotional flashback" as I can get triggered by an action that will remind me of past emotional trauma due to my being the SG in the family (with (u)NPD sister and enmeshed mother.)  If your mind is saying the same stuff over and over again, you could be experiencing an emotional flashback, which are complex and not easy to shake.  :hug:
Keep walking, though there's no place to get to.  Don't try to see through the distances.  That's not for human beings.
Move within, but don't move the way fear makes you move.”
~ Jalaluddin Rumi

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Spring Butterfly

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Re: Ruminating
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2019, 01:07:06 PM »
Thank you for the wonderful responses.  I have taken it to heart and I am working on the breathing techniques and it does help somewhat, I am watching the youtube vidoes which are also helpful.  I guess I just have a problem with people hurting others and NOT feeling anything.  I must feel too much. Thank you again.
meditations have helped me manage thought ruminations. On "feeling too much" - emotions is another thing for me and Karla McLaren blog helped me learn our emotions contain messages we need to hear, how to feel emotions and let them flow through.

My mind goes ruminating trying to figure out unsolvable puzzles like why one human would want to hurt another. I'm coming to the conclusion I don't need to try to solve the unsolvable puzzles.

cloud and Townsend in the book boundaries liken boundaries to a fence with a gate and we get to say who enters, who cannot enter, and who can stay interacting with us depending on whether or not they can respect are individual boundaries and treat us the way we wish. We don't need reasons or excuses for our boundaries or our feelings or our wishes. We have every human right to them.

Another member here recently said it's like we've found or are finding peace and it's unfortunate some we invited along could not attend. Some people are just not able to interact peacefully and with respect.
· Every interaction w/ PD persons results in damage. Plan accordingly, make time to heal
· Individuation is the key to emotional freedom
· It's foolish to expect of others what they have no capacity to give
· If others were self observant, introspective, this forum would not exist

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MyEyesROpen

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Re: Ruminating
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2020, 05:22:54 PM »
I've just realised that I also have a problem with ruminating. It's dominated my life since I went NC with my toxic family of origin. I began to look into recently.

The issue seems to be that it's a natural response to experiencing trauma. It's part of the natural grieving process. But sometimes we can get stuck in a cycle of trying to rationalise what is essentially irrational. We'll never understand why broken people have hurt us.

If we spend our time ruminating, we allow the people who have hurt us to dominate our lives even when they are not present and we are far removed from their influence.

Distraction works to a certain extent, but if you're like me, there will be millions of triggers in your everyday life that can set you off. In my case, it's seeing others talk about their loving parents or their considerate family.

Saying no, and being firm with yourself also works to certain extent, but I saw something recently......I think it was a TED talk....that said we had to turn the ruminating into active problem solving to crack it. So when you find yourself ruminating, ask yourself how you can move on from this stage of your life. Actively consider, what you need to do to progress.......and then if you can answer that let me know 😂, but it sounds like good advice.

There are two kinds of people in this world: those who fill your cup, and those who drain it. —Joe Navarro

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athene1399

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Re: Ruminating
« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2020, 10:30:31 AM »
For me I've noticed I get stuck ruminating when there's an aspect of the memory that I haven't fully processed yet. I've only recently realized my childhood was far more messed up than I knew, so I get flooded with anger over some of the things that happened. Some I am angry for a bit but others I am stuck on. LIke I want to tell my FOO how messed up it was. But I know they will just have excuses or brush it off like I am being too sensitive. But I think letting myself feel the emotions of the situation that I suppressed for so long helps a bit. If I am really stuck, I will discuss it on here and that helps a lot as well.

When I ruminate at bedtime, I meditate or practice mindfulness. Focus on the breath. I also have a sound machine to focus on. That helps me to sleep.

I've noticed at times when I ruminate I am getting headaches. When that happens I work on being mindful so the memories and headache go away. Like It's my signal to work on being present instead of stuck in a memory. Sometimes scents help to keep me focused. Like I breathe in and focus on a pleasing scent. I know someone who keeps scents in her purse for this. sometimes I wear a bracelet and when I touch it, I focus on how it feels to keep me present.

I think sometimes it's just so much that floods out mind at once, it can be overwhelming. Especially with all the anger and "why/how could you do this to your child?" It feel so unfair sometimes. When that happens ,I just sit with that feeling. I was never allowed to feel that is was unfair as a child, so I let myself feel it now.

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theonetoblame

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Re: Ruminating
« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2020, 09:31:41 PM »
A couple points about what has worked for me.

First, I have different types of remembering, one that is associated with arousal and a healthier version that is not. Reflecting can be useful, ruminating with physiological arousal is totally toxic for me. One of my early warning signs that I'm starting to do this isn't the thoughts so much as my behavior. In particular, that I'll start to fixate my gaze. EMDR is about constant eye movement as a means of breaking attention on the thought, I've learned that breaking my stare and intentionally shifting my gaze around also helps me shift my thinking.

The other part was understanding how neuroplasticity works and that the more I practice ruminating the better I will get at it (a bad thing!). I have memories that I won't forget, but I definitely don't need to practice remembering them, which is a lot of what rumination became for me. The flip side is that the less time I spend ruminating on these topics, the better able I will be to switch my attention from the rumination and to stop. It's the 'unlearning' side of the plasticity equation. I started to think of it as a type of 'brain gym' activity and practiced, repeatedly (and still do) shifting my attention to something else. 

A third thing to consider is that when you're experiencing the sympathetic nervous system arousal associated with traumatic memories the hormones dumped in your system facilitate 'locked in' sustained attention and impair our ability to set shift and to change what we're thinking about. Awareness about the arousal and insight into how it influences how our brains work was also helpful for me. When I'm trippin' on a bad memory, it's simply harder to think about something else and all the more important that I manage my arousal (exercise etc.) so I can better set shift.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2020, 09:33:40 PM by theonetoblame »

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WinterStar

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Re: Ruminating
« Reply #10 on: February 08, 2020, 04:46:34 PM »
Roza,

I too have a huge problem with ruminating. I've worked through depression and generalized anxiety disorder. I can set healthy boundaries and stick to them. I'm more assertive. I'm free from obligation, most fear and a lot of guilt. But I cannot stop ruminating.

I came to the realization very recently that for me, ruminating was a coping mechanism that saved me. My NPD dad and probably BPD mom rewrote history over and over again. They still do. My dad's rewriting is pretty consistent and basically a Hallmark card. My mom still to this day rewrites the history of my childhood every couple of years. (Though, she doesn't talk about it as my childhood but the time she was married to my dad and can only speak about how it affected her.)

Ruminating allowed me to remember events in vivid detail. It was a useful tool that allowed me to come Out of the FOG, something my brother hasn't been able to do. I'm now grateful for the ruminating. Instead of getting upset when it comes up again, I'm more accepting and don't get upset with myself. It's helping to keep me out of a ruminating spiral.
I am only resolved to act in that manner, which will, in my own opinion, constitute my happiness, without reference to you, or to any person so wholly unconnected with me. -Elizabeth Bennet

Treating a Bengal tiger like a kitty cat is a good way to get mauled. -Eric Barker

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WinterStar

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Re: Ruminating
« Reply #11 on: February 08, 2020, 04:55:38 PM »
Also, I recently found a website for sensitive souls. I've always been sensitive and told that it was a defect. The site takes the position that sensitivity has an upside and encourages sensitive and empathetic people to embrace rather than fight that part of themselves. It was a new idea for me and very helpful. It also says that empathetic people are usually very reflective, which can be a positive trait but can also lead to ruminating.

https://www.eggshelltherapy.com/
« Last Edit: February 08, 2020, 05:43:00 PM by ElizabethAnne »
I am only resolved to act in that manner, which will, in my own opinion, constitute my happiness, without reference to you, or to any person so wholly unconnected with me. -Elizabeth Bennet

Treating a Bengal tiger like a kitty cat is a good way to get mauled. -Eric Barker