Family Therapy

[Whiteheron]

Thanks PL,
Yes, by "they" I meant stbx and his L. They started firing off letters that I didn't see until I got home from a very long day yesterday (this entire week is jam packed). Thankfully, I've been keeping my L aware of each step I make, so she was able to craft a response without needing my input. I'll find out what the new judge thinks about all of this sometime next week. I think.

[athene1399]

It seems to me that they may be trying to get you rattled so you come off as the crazy one. Like they are trying to get you so frustrated that you may seem like the one with the issues. It is frustrating though, so maybe try to find an outlet for your frustrations before you have to be back in court. There's probably a lot on your mind, but hopefully you can find something that will get you nice and chilled out for court. Like a self-care day (or hour). And if they say anything ridiculous in court, remember to breathe and think before you talk (You may not have a problem with this. I'm just picturing how I  would feel in that situation and basing my advice off that).

They are doing things that are blatant disregards of your current agreement, yet trying to blame you. Maybe they are hoping you get defensive.  I'm going to quote Hhaw and say "just stick to the facts" if that other appointment (or anything else of their crazy-making) comes up. "As we discussed back on xxdate with xxjudge, this apt is a health related appointment for xreason." IMO it's so dumb they would act confused. I mean, isn't it a part of court record now if you talked about it in front of the last judge? For them to now say they had no idea what this apt is about, so they decided to make a family T session without consulting you just sounds stupid IMO. I could be wrong (since I am not a judge), but I would think that almost any reason is not a good reason to break an order (unless there is a safety issue, which this is not that). So I would agree with PL that this excuse will not be well received.

Hang in there. 

[Penny Lane]

I know their letters are stressful and scary but can you think of them as just noise? You don't want to bury your head in the sand, of course, you want to be able to use the record to your advantage. But the contents have no bearing on reality and really very little bearing on what a judge will do.

When H was really deep into court this would often happen. His lawyer would send a short, reasonable, fact-based request to her lawyer. (Like, please stop driving by my house every day, you are harassing me.) Her lawyer would respond with pages of diatribe that BM had clearly written that barely made sense, weren't true and contained outrageous allegations (nine pages of how it's H's fault she drives by his house and she's certain the kids aren't safe and the house is about to be condemned). We would type up a factual rebuttal to send to his lawyer, and every time she was like, don't even bother, this doesn't matter at all. None of the letters made it into the court record. Really the only purpose they served was to let us know where her head was at and how delusional she was on this particular topic. Usually, despite her protests, she did the thing - like, she stopped driving by our house at least until the conclusion of the court case.

So, like I said, it's all noise. What's actually happening: he's violating the court agreement, you are very reasonably pointing it out, either he will insist on violating it or he will back down. Anything he says about it is really just a manipulation designed to upset or scare you. If you can treat it as such it might help you ease your stress level slightly as well as be more strategic about court stuff. Sometimes when BM writes something really awful I have to step back and ask, what is she getting out of this or what is she trying to get out of this?

This is a sidenote and I know that this is NOT your main focus right now. But maybe this helps someone else reading. For birthday parties when H gets the invite,, he scans it and sends it to BM with no request, just like, here you go. He doesn't even offer to take the kids because I think that would make her not want to let them go. He also always makes sure to tell the kids about any invite that comes to our house. She usually ends up taking them. I think if H didn't tell them about the invite, she wouldn't either and they'd end up not going. It works out OK for the kids and we try not to worry about whether or not she'll let them go, I think that's one of those areas where we've made peace with giving up control. (What does get me is that when she gets an invite at her house she doesn't tell H about it. We know this for sure because once a mom texted DH and said she'd been trying to reach BM for weeks about a party that was the following weekend on his time and BM hadn't responded that whole time. That incident worked out great, though - that mom and H are now pretty good parent friends and her kid comes over pretty regularly.)

Anyway, Whiteheron, I don't think you're going to need the advice about birthday parties because I really believe that your stbx is going to come out of this with VERY limited parenting time. And you suggested on another thread that you think after all this is over that he might just take off with his gf - I think that's probably a pretty good assumption.

[Whiteheron]

Family T is on hold for right now. Unless one of DS's professionals thinks it's the best way forward. Although the new judge believes in T, and even suggested that perhaps stbx and I would benefit from couples T, since we are joined together for the rest of our lives because of the kids.  (Insert anxiety and silent cursing here-more on that below) Judge suggests this because stbx's latest diatribe is all about how I refuse to communicate with him. So I can only assume the impression is that I schedule things on his time without telling him, which is completely untrue. I do not know if this is what the judge truly believes or if it's a way of placating stbx.

Met with all of us in the room - lectures on good parenting and communication. Tells us about how God doesn't give us more than we can handle, which I'm sure made atheist stbx bristle. I inwardly smiled because that's one of my mantras. I'm being given what I can handle.

At the end, as we were wrapping up, stbx loudly addressed me and put me on the spot in front of everyone. Something along the lines of how we haven't spoken in over a year, perhaps we should get together to talk.  F*@k no.
Half a blink went by, as I was stunned into silence, when my L said we would talk about this separately, that this wasn't the time or place to discuss this. I was so grateful, because if I had to respond in that moment, I would have probably said something along the lines of: after being abused and controlled by you for 20 years, I am finally free of you and you want me to sit down to talk with you?! On a regular basis? I am still dealing with the anxiety that stirred up. Judge suggested maybe that I might be more comfortable with a third party, such as a T, present. I nodded my head to appear agreeable, but inside, just hell no. Judge even suggested that some parents get along better after separation and hopes this is the case with us. Sure, we'll get along great as long as I do what he says.

Afterwards, my L pointed out that it was funny that in the conference between L's and the new judge not ten minutes prior, my L spoke about how controlling of me stbx was and is attempting to still be, then he goes and tries to control me in front of the judge by essentially attempting to force me into meeting with him one on one. I told her that I hope the judge noticed and I thanked her for brushing it off so quickly.

[athene1399]

Good Lord, WH. I know SO and BM do way better when they talk less. And as you said, they get along swimmingly if he does whatever she wants without question. BM wishes he would respond more, but if it's just going to cause an argument, he just leaves it alone. Probably too much sometimes, but that's his choice.

I know couples T with an abusive partner is bad. I honestly don't know about T with an abusive ex. It sounds awful though. Not very understanding of trauma or anxiety to suggest this. But I guess the judge feels he is being helpful and not insensitive.

Maybe if he feels communication is a problem, gather evidence to prove it's not. LIke show you don't schedule things on stbx's time without telling him. Show what stbx says that makes you not want to respond. Like do you ignore his messages when they are abusive or ridiculous? But if they are about something legit, so you respond then? Are there time limits on when he can text you? LIke if he texts you after 9 pm, is that when you don't respond? I know we take a while to respond with BM when what she said upset us (and we need to be calm before responding) or we don't agree and are trying to come up with a way to tell her that that doesn't end with her flying off the handle. Maybe judges don't think this happens, but I know we have a ton of text threads we could print up to show it does. Maybe you do too.

And this is just stuff to think about. I don't know if it's even helpful. But if communication comes up in the future, I'm sure you can show you communicate when it's necessary. The snarky me whats to give this judge a book on parallel parenting. lol

But I'm glad the family T is on hold for now.

[Whiteheron]

Update:

Judge finally read some (if not all) of the case file and actually apologized to my L (and asked that it be passed on to me), that she (judge) would have never recommended T or increased communication between myself and stbx if she had read the file beforehand. I assumed this had been the case, but you never know.

I've posted before about how stbx keeps pushing for family T between DS and himself. The judge, GAL, and L's left it up to DS's professionals to either recommend T or not. GAL tells the L's and judge (conference call between judge, L's, GAL) that she will compose a letter and send it to DS's professional "team". GAL sends letter, then speaks to the professionals involved. Said professionals do not recommend "family" T between DS and stbx because DS is not in a good place. It's suggested that a re-evaluation of this proposal takes place sometime next year.

I am relieved beyond belief. It was my opinion that T with his dad would absolutely break DS. He is in no way prepared to counter the manipulation and attempted control stbx would be engineering behind the scenes.

I thought that was the end of it, until I received a cryptic email from my L last week saying that the GAL is very angry. I've been radio silent so I know it's nothing I've done. Turns out that after the GAL sent her letter to the professionals, stbx either sent his own letter or contacted them in some way - before they made their decision about the T. stbx's L calls mine and starts demanding to know why T isn't going forward, since tsbx believe it's the best path to follow, and claims the professionals are wrong (PD anyone?). My L replies that we had all agreed that the professional recommendation would be followed, and that while whiteheron does not agree with the T being proposed, whiteheron would go along with it if it's what was recommended. stbx's L asks my L where we go from here since stbx is demanding T. My L (astounded), replies that if stbx believes he's more competent than several mental health professionals, then we can go to trial and see if a judge agrees with him.

An hour or so later my L gets a phone call saying they agree to all of the language in the settlement agreement. Of course it's still not signed, and stbx will likely not sign it unless forced to. But it's a step froward. I think.

[Penny Lane]

Wow, that sounds great, it sounds like everyone is into him here. You stayed strong for your kids even when it was unbelievably hard, and you're seeing the benefits! You've done amazing. And it's almost over!

[hhaw]

Well done, WH!

You documented your case, hired good advocates for your kiddos, and allowed the court to SEE who your exPD truly is by keeping your head, playing your cards right, and letting the PD show his true colors.

If the PD forces a trial...... be thinking what it is you'd change to strengthen the Agreement.  You'd likely get it, and perhaps be awarded your legal fees. 

Writing a bullet proof AGREEMENT can be the difference between calmer sailing, and more Court drama, IME so don't assume going to trial would be a bad thing.

It might be the very best thing in the long run.

Well done!

[athene1399]

I am so glad, WH! What a relief that they aren't forcing DS to attend T with stbx. I'm so glad the judge decided to read the file and understand the background of your case.