My own blinding anger

[Grahamcracker]

ubpdW and myself have reached a point of stasis -- we don't want to physically separate because of our needful young adult son (though I must admit I have a pending application to rent a room nearby).

Big sigh.

It's my own feelings and words that concern me right now.  I feel okay and tolerant about her in the abstract, have things I want to say to her, gently, to set out my boundaries and such.   But I literally cannot speak with her right now in any meaningful sense.  It's as though pent-up rage and anger and frustration are welling out, now that I have reached the point where I realize she has no power over me but what I had given her, and that power is now gone.  My voice grows cold and I respond curtly to anything she says, and sometimes simply walk out of the room when she keeps going on, a sort of gray rock on wheels,

At this point in our relationship I have the power to say what I want, but I don't know what I want to say.  Sometimes she'll say something reasonable, but I simply do not want to engage, because that usually covers the entrance to some rabbit hole I don't want to go down.

I think in my heart I am so angry at her for what she's done to me over the years, and over her blind refusal to see any wrong on her part.  I know I "should" accept that she is BPD (my own therapist made that diagnosis) and she cannot do or be different than she is, but still, she took away years of my life and continues to do so, yet I'm she will not acknowledge any of that.

Sometimes I want to back off a bit, admit there has been some wrong on both sides, but I know that will be seized upon and exaggerated, then used against me, either now or in the future.

[A bit of background:  The triggering issue, again, is the fact that I retired impulsively, deciding in my heart that at age 67 I had the right to seize that much control over my life.  We had a big blowup then, and I told her I would no longer lie to her or cover up my feelings, and that she needed to accept that part of me.]

It's been two and a half years of acrimony since then; mostly I've managed to escape into the sanity of the gym or my basement man-cave or outside on my bicycle in good weather.  But when we encounter each other inside, it's awful.

The immediate issue for me is this:  she wants a legal separation, and wants to incorporate an agreement we made dividing finances.  Because I'm a retired attorney, she wants me to draft it, so save us money from lawyer fees.  But as I began to draft it I realized that she has me "working" for her, and the agreement we made earlier is unfair to me, that I let her badger me into giving up things that would otherwise be mine.  She is using me, and I let her push me into that like so many other things -- that's the way she gets things done in her life, she badgers people into giving up and giving in.  And here I am (or rather was) sitting there being her toady.  So when she asked me for a "status report," I simply blew up and said I wasn't her employee and it would be ready if and when it is.

Now she says "all you have to do is apologize for retiring without consulting me. " I won't do that -- as I have explained to her, I won't apologize for something I had to do;  deeper inside, I feel like uttering those words would be giving back my hard-won independence, which she cannot tolerate.

Bottom line for this post:  I am simply boiling over now, mentally and verbally, in my contacts with her and it's not the me I want to be.

NOTE:  There is no risk of physical action on my part, believe me.  I have not lost control in that sense.

[Pepin]

I think in my heart I am so angry at her for what she's done to me over the years, and over her blind refusal to see any wrong on her part.  I know I "should" accept that she is BPD (my own therapist made that diagnosis) and she cannot do or be different than she is, but still, she took away years of my life and continues to do so, yet I'm she will not acknowledge any of that.


The immediate issue for me is this:  she wants a legal separation, and wants to incorporate an agreement we made dividing finances.  Because I'm a retired attorney, she wants me to draft it, so save us money from lawyer fees.  But as I began to draft it I realized that she has me "working" for her, and the agreement we made earlier is unfair to me, that I let her badger me into giving up things that would otherwise be mine.  She is using me, and I let her push me into that like so many other things -- that's the way she gets things done in her life, she badgers people into giving up and giving in.  And here I am (or rather was) sitting there being her toady.  So when she asked me for a "status report," I simply blew up and said I wasn't her employee and it would be ready if and when it is.

Now she says "all you have to do is apologize for retiring without consulting me. " I won't do that -- as I have explained to her, I won't apologize for something I had to do;  deeper inside, I feel like uttering those words would be giving back my hard-won independence, which she cannot tolerate.

Bottom line for this post:  I am simply boiling over now, mentally and verbally, in my contacts with her and it's not the me I want to be.

Several things going on here that I am picking up...and I am so sorry that you are going through this.

Simply, yes, she is a PD.  You say that you are angry at her for being who she is and how is it that she cannot see that she is hurting you?  Actually, by having the expectation that she can hopefully one day realize that she is hurting you and apologize is what is hurting you the most.  You are allowing her to remain in your life doing things that she has and is always going to do.  And it seems that you really have come to a point where there is nothing left to go forward with by living under the same roof.  You have changed so much that you just cannot live the way you used to -- and this is good!  But I know....it is difficult when there is a history that has some good things peppered into it.

As for writing up the legal docs...separate yourself from the situation and do it as if you had a new client.  Absolutely bill her half to her and pay yourself for your services -- especially if she wants things to be divided equally.  It is your time regardless if you are retired or not.  If she wants a status report, fine, prepare one and add that to the bill.

And finally, in my opinion it is absurd that you owe her an apology for retiring.  67.  You made it farther than most and deserve to end when it is good for YOU. 

[NumbLotus]

It's my own feelings and words that concern me right now.  I feel okay and tolerant about her in the abstract, have things I want to say to her, gently, to set out my boundaries and such.   But I literally cannot speak with her right now in any meaningful sense.  It's as though pent-up rage and anger and frustration are welling out, now that I have reached the point where I realize she has no power over me but what I had given her, and that power is now gone.  My voice grows cold and I respond curtly to anything she says, and sometimes simply walk out of the room when she keeps going on, a sort of gray rock on wheels,

This sounds to me like the anger stage of grieving. It's a healthy stage to go through.

I was angry a couple of years ago. I probably can't articulate the whole thing, but I think fundamentally it was about all the falsehoods clearing away. "It's not happening, it's normal, it's me, it'll get better," etc. All those things I was surviving with fell away, and once that happens, what am I left with? Yeah, something that made me really angry.

It's not permanent. It leads to acceptance. Not acceptance of abusive behavior but just that the person is what they are and it's up to us to decide how to handle it. But it's okay to be angry. There's good reason to.

At this point in our relationship I have the power to say what I want, but I don't know what I want to say.  Sometimes she'll say something reasonable, but I simply do not want to engage, because that usually covers the entrance to some rabbit hole I don't want to go down.

You don't trust her. And for good reason. The scales have fallen from your eyes. You will eventually be able to MC her reasonable efforts. But trust her reasonable efforts? Probably not.

I think in my heart I am so angry at her for what she's done to me over the years, and over her blind refusal to see any wrong on her part.  I know I "should" accept that she is BPD (my own therapist made that diagnosis) and she cannot do or be different than she is, but still, she took away years of my life and continues to do so, yet I'm she will not acknowledge any of that.

I think you will be able to get there, it's just a process. Although the more you are entangled in it (eg living with blowups on a frequent basis) the harder it will be to detach. But still, possible to some extent, especially with gray rock and MC.

Sometimes I want to back off a bit, admit there has been some wrong on both sides, but I know that will be seized upon and exaggerated, then used against me, either now or in the future.

I have found it incredibly worthwhile to work on myself. So acknowledging my shortcomings and improving them have been valuable to me even though I did not cause the PD, the issues are not 50-50, and eorking on myself does not cure the issue. Still, I feel like it's the one silver lining, not enough to make up for it, but something I really am gaining.

BUT. That's for US. It's not for the PD to use against us. So we think about ourselves and work on ourselves, but we don't need to throw them ammunition.

[NumbLotus]

Also, maybe you might consider hiring your own lawyer and she can do the same. Having outside counsel really makes a difference in perspective. And it would put things on more even ground for both of you.

[notrightinthehead]

In addition to the excellent replies you have received above, I want to add something from my experience concerning your sentence.... " I am simply boiling over now, mentally and verbally, in my contacts with her and it's not the me I want to be.".... It took me  two years after I was out of my marriage and mostly NC to not be furious at the mere mention, thought, memory anything that had to do with NPDh. I believe the amount and length of anger we have to work through is proportional to the anger we have suppressed while in the relationship. I really feel for you. I got so tired of feeling so enraged. 

[Grahamcracker]

Thanks for the good and supportive answers. 

It just occurred to me that at least part of my anger is fear -- right now the balance of power is in my hands, but if I let her build up steam I may be facing a real rage or meltdown, and even now those are just so painful. 

The sensation is like she's giving me latitude, but only so far, conceding lesser issues but ready to explode if I cross one of her lines.

Like she's playing me. 

[mdana]

We initially decided to hire the mediator (same one)-- in an effort to contain the costs.

That did NOT work for me--- because of the ongoing manipulation, harassing, guilt-tripping drama on behalf of my PD exh that I was trying to free myself from. It gave him an ongoing excuse to "talk" about things with me. 

You may find the aggravation is not worth it?  Although, everyone is different. 



m

[Wilderhearts]

The pwPDs in my life taught me that I was not entitled to be angry.  In fact, I wasn't entitled to any emotion that didn't serve them.  Repressed anger will eventually bubble up as rage - I've accepted that much. 

Gabor Mate lists anger as one of the "Seven A's of Healing" in "When the Body says No: The Cost of Hidden Stress."  While experiencing and expressing anger is health promoting and healing, the unregulated outpouring of anger, which he refers to as rage, causes a lot of physical stress and disease.  So repressing anger and raging are two sides of the coin of not being able to experience anger.  Rage isn't experiencing anger, funny enough, but a reaction to the fear of genuinely experiencing anger and a response to suppressing anger.  "The real experiences of anger 'is physiologic experience without acting out.  The experience is one of a surge of power going through the system, along with a mobilization to attack. There is, simultaneously, a complete disappearance of anxiety."  The section is about 5 pages long but maybe that captures the key points.

I used to be terrified of expressing anger, and repressed it so deeply I actually lost the ability to feel anger.  What I've learned through bio-feedback trauma therapy that is most helpful is learning to identify the physical sensations that accompany anger - or that physiologic experience of anger.  I can now just focus on those physical reactions I have, and sit with those feelings, instead of raging in my head.  Taking a moment to feel the ways anger is surging through your body may also allow you to respond in a way that benefits you more, rather than snapping or using the silent treatment, even if it just gets you a "I don't feel like discussing it."

The other thing useful for me, if you find yourself ranting and raging  to yourself in your head as if you're in an argument, is to pretend I'm talking to an empathetic friend instead of going on an angry rant.  My therapist also suggested that.  And using imagination - imagine something hilarious but awful happening to your ex.  A massive divine hand reaching out of the sky and through your house when she asks for a "status update" and flicking her right out of the window.

It may be important for you to work out what is actually most beneficial to you, in terms of your separation, and truly feeling entitled to that.  It's seems you're still wrapped up in the tangle of your uBPDw's entitlement, and pwPDs often operate as if only one person can be entitled to anything and everything, and it's them.  And most importantly, seething with resentment is a normal reaction to dealing with a pwPD, someone told me.  My friend told me a while ago "It's normal to be angry when people treat you like shit" and it was exactly what I needed to hear. We shouldn't have to judge ourselves for feeling rage and resentment for being abused, we just need to change it into something that's healthier for us.

[Crushed_Dad]

I did so many things I regret out of anger and frustration especially in front of my kids. Things that mean my standards of myself aren't what I believed them to be and things I need to make sure I'm never in the position where they could happen again.

As much as I think of my kids every day and only get to be with them 32 hours in every 336!!! I would never want to return to her.

[Laurie]

My mother received lots of support through Parents without Partners when she and my dad split up.  She said she met so many people who were treated poorly and said their egos were "on the floor" who later blossomed with support.  If things do lead to a legal separation, I'd suggest reaching out to this organization. 

I also think you should consider consulting a lawyer to make sure things are done fairly.

[hhaw]

Graham Cracker:

Your wife is in your head, leading you to believe you can control her rages and outbursts, but you can't, IME.

The quickest way I've found OUT OF COURT with PDs is through a trial. 

If you end up settling, typically it's on the courthouse steps after intensive trial prep with the PD DOING ALMOST NO trial prep.  The PDs IME don't do well at trial, particularly those who feel very entitled, angry and unable to control these feelings in the courtroom.  Sometimes their attorneys do just as much dage, IME by cheating, lying, and manipulating witnesses and other court officers, which is pretty common.

What's not common is for the PD to manipulate everyone or enough people to shove their agenda through the court. 

So, you do your trial prep, get your court dates set, pretend to settle what your PD is likely pathologically unable to settle as I find they're unable to settle ANYTHING in my dealings with them, never ever ever put off a court date or hearing and keep moving steadily to that final trial date.  The final trial date is where you lay out all your evidence and your PD falls apart at the seams, unable to disprove the facts.

You'll likely be disproving many untrue accusations the PD made without thinking her strategy through, IME.

Spending lots of time attempting to settle is a waste of time, energy and resources, which serves no one, including your son and the PDstbx.

IF you have to spend time at settlement discussions... first make the understanding, up front, that any agreement willl be written out by hand, signed, walked to the clerk's office, filed and stamped with everyone receving a filed stamped copy for their file.

Have a list of things you can't live without, make sure it's super reasonable, stay focused on your son and his needs, call off the meeting when the PD refuses to budge and be reasonable too.

Don't ever allow the court officers to pressure you into giving up more than you can do without.  Sometimes this happens, particularly if your attorney is weak, lazy and wants to get out of the case and is used to settling everything and trying nothing.  Your own attorney might put pressure on you to settle bc he understands you're the ONLY reasonable litigant in the room, which is BS, but it happens.

So, put together the list.  Be prepared to attend settlement conferences provided everyone agrees to hand write out the agreement and have it filed.

DO NOT EVER EVER EVER cancel court hearings and trials UNLESS you have that filed and stamped AGREEMENT in your paw.

Often, any settlement the PD will allow will be just before court, which sucks bc you did all the trial prep and she spent her time spinning lies and really awful sounding accusations against you and your character (she can't prove.)  It's scary, but he with hte best records usually does better in the courtroom.... always always, if only eventually, that was the case for me.

One thing to avoid is false confidence and relief trial can be avoided.  Most of the time the PD has everyone jumping through hoops, acting like they'll settle, wasting tons of time and money haggling over details then, when true agreement is reached, they say the decided they want a trial after all. 

Lots of dashed hopes is demoralizing and difficult to overcome again and again, IME.  We bend over backwards attempting to appease someone who can't be appeased, doens't want anything we give them, will only be happy when they TAKE from us what they feel entitled to... and mostly they feel entitled to gut and harm us emotionally.  They want to harm our standing in our community and with our children, family and friends.

Nip it in the bud by heading straight for the courtroom, setting a trial date, getting on and over with it.

You save EVERYTHING... time, trauma and resources you'll need.  The PD doesn't care, bc they're not thinking straight, IME. 

I think it's important to avoid believing we can control what the PD does... I don't think they settle very often... at least in my cases and there have been many.

What I do find important is listening to your gut...... how far do you believe your stbx PD will go? There are PDs who employ a scorched earth policy and those who don't. 

Those with scorched earth policies are willing to destroy themselves, their children and entire lives in order to WIN or feel they're destroying you.

In any case, steer clear of the PD, don't speak to her.  Communicate by e mail or family wizard or texts... some way you can control letting her in your head all the time.  Time away from her will have a steadying affect on you, IME.  You'll beging feeling the way you used to feel... you'll have access to your true self and feel empowered and more level with distance.

Push, don't fool yourself and get jerked around with dreams of settling this.  Avoid tons of time ane money wasted and use that time and money to get through any trial quickly and witih economy of motion...... don't let the PD make demands and promises to give you an easier time if you just (insert demands designed to weaken your position.)

Your PD will likely do a lot of that.  You might recognize it or not.  I invite you to pay attention to your inner world. IF THE PD makes a promise that relieves your tension in a HUGE way...... know she's targeting your weaknesses, fears and aversion to conflict in order to manipulate you. She'll likely never follow through with any promises, and she knows you're upstanding and earnest... you're someone she can count on to do as you say, hence......limit contact, and go through your attorney only if you can afford it perhaps.

Good luck,