Strange "evidence"

[athene1399]

I've been trying to stay out of the triangulation started by uPD M and sis with fleas. M said the strangest thing to me last night. Instead of getting upset, I'm trying to laugh it off. I've never noticed she uses the strangest "evidence" to back up her thoughts. I'm going to try to see if I notice her doing this in the future. I wasn't sure if anyone has noticed other PDs doing something similar. I'm also not sure if I stayed out of it as much as I could. I was so thrown off, maybe I JADEd. So looking for input there as well.

[anything in quotes is paraphrased] M called me last night. She asked me how my internship was going. I said well and I really like it. M: "That's strange. I heard it wasn't going well." me: "Where did you hear that from?" M; "Sis said you asked her to take down the Christmas decorations."  I politely asked what this had to do with my internship. M said she assumed I was crabby so took it out on sis by demanding she take down the decorations (as a side note, I told sis she can leave the decorations up if she wanted as long as she had them down by March since she put them up herself. The next day they were taken down so I didn't say a thing). So I told M all I said was I didn't want sis leaving them until March and explained that last year when she decorated she didn't take them down and I had to clean up after her.

So I'm not sure if I handled the last part well. Now I am wondering if I triangulated M against sis or JADEd. Maybe I shouldn't have explained a thing.

At any rate I am trying to laugh it off. It was such a random thing to say. But I guess it makes sense to M since if she is having a bad day she takes it out on everyone. I just was dumbfounded for a second and thought she was changing the subject. I almost didn't know what to say.

[LemonLime]

I've found that PDs can connect dots that none of the rest of us do.
I call them Wild Ass Conclusions.

[Penny Lane]

BM does this all the time. I'm working from home one morning = I got fired. I got a promotion = I can't pick the kids up from school occasionally anymore. A guy who went to DH's (large) undergrad was arrested = DH hangs out with criminals. And so on.

I think it's projection. SHE was about to get fired, HER job was becoming less flexible, SHE was spending time with unsavory people.

[athene1399]

I think you're on to something, Penny, with the projection. M was just having issues at work. So maybe that is a part of it too.

Good point, Kat!

[Wilderhearts]

I also see this as projection, but because your M would probably be demanding towards someone randomly, as a result of some kind of unrelated stress.  Their behaviour isn't logically connected to the triggers, so they project and make cases as to why ours isn't either.

On the note of projection and evidence, I had a pwPD scream "you're just collecting evidence!" at me, when I illustrated how she had a pattern of manipulative and controlling behaviour (I didn't know about JADE then).  She had regularly dug for information so she could tie together unconnected things and use them against me and she thought that was fine, but when I just observed and saw actual patterns in her behaviour, I was doing some crazy-making theorizing! It seemed to me she was quoting someone when she said that - as if someone had once said it to her in an argument.  It sounded like a total non-sequitur.

Soooooo much nonsense - logic is the opposite of what it actually is when they're functioning from the PD'd part of their minds.

[StayWithMe]

Don't laugh off things your mother says to you.  It can sometimes look like acceptance.  When my mother says stuff I don't agree with and think her intent is to be abusive, my response is to show disassociation. 

You could shrug your shoulders and say "I don't agree" and then leave the room.  Or give a strange look.  some people can do a very cutting glare.  Don't have a discussion about anything.  You will only be giveng her her supply.

[BeautifulCrazy]

Strange Evidence
Wild Ass Conclusions
Improbable Assumptions
and the Threads of Delusion that weave them all together into the smothering Blanket of Irrefutable Truth!
Interacting with a PD can be like being trapped in a David Lynch film! Today I had a conversation with my PDh that made perfect sense.... If we were in parallel but vastly different universes! At no point did our realities intersect, despite my husband telling me (loudly and repeatedly) that we were talking about the same g-damn thing. For about the millionth time I wished I had recorded audio of this stuff. I could probably make money, it's a comedy goldmine!
I really don't mean to diminish anyone's experience of these behaviors....    if I hadn't been able to giggle out some tension about today, I would definitely have cried savagely in frustration.

[SparkStillLit]

I agree!! The lack of any logic tying any of it together really drives me bananas, too. It really IS like a total non sequitur sometimes and you're left going......*what*?!?!? We went from A to a letter not known in any language in this universe!
That's how I feel about the illogic jumps and the Wild Ass Conclusions. Strange Evidence, indeed.
The other thing is that my updh often makes the same ones over and over. After I've heard it the first time, I know what's coming. Strange Evidence is cited, Improbable Assumptions are made, and Wild Ass Conclusions are drawn, but it's exactly the same as before!
I just can't with all that. I either walk off or stay silent or offer things like "no" and nothing else. Depending if I'm trapped or not.

[SparkStillLit]

He's usually obsessing over whether I've been with another man/want to be with another man/would be with..../have tried to be with..../am with..../etc every permutation you can possibly think of and any number that you can't think of....

So you folk that think of projection, it does make a lady wonder, does it not????

[athene1399]

I like the idea of saying "I don't agree" and ending the conversation. That would defiantly help me to stay out of it.

I never realized this happens to so many people. I wasn't even sure if it was a PD thing when I started the topic or with M was just being irrational for no apparent reason.

[Stepping lightly]

I agree that it's not really worth even justifying with a PD.  It's hard in the moment though, because you have only just stepped into the trap and it's hard to see it so clearly. 

BM has done a similar thing to us.  A comment came back to DH/I from the Parent Coordinator to his T to us, "The kids have reported that SL is traveling a lot lately and while she is gone DH is really mean to the kids".  We sat there stunned because not one part of that statement even made sense.  I had literally been out of town less than 24 hours in the previous six months.  It took a few days to put together what I assume happened- I found out BM's BF was working in the office building directly across from me and must have been stalking my car in the parking lot.  I had been working from home almost everyday as I was helping DH take care of his dying father.  SL not at work=SL traveling=opening to accuse DH of something terrible without a witness to disagree.   It's kind of funny now, but I started parking behind bushes in other building lots to throw them off when I was in the office :-). 

It could be a number of different things- Projection, need to create chaos in the relationships, put you in a weird spot.  Triangulation for the benefit of chaos sounds likely.  My MIL used to try and triangulate me/her against DH until I told her in no uncertain terms, "I married DH, I will always pick him in these discussions".

[Call Me Cordelia]

Oh yeah, not just your mother. Long story, but once I was accused of eavesdropping on my mother's phone conversations because I asked my father if we had any mints.

[athene1399]

Wow. Everyone has such bizarre accusations based on the most random "evidence". I'm sorry this has happened to so many people. It really throws you off sometimes. I think I need to practice the "not discussing this" and "i don't agree" to help stop being a part of the triangulation with sis and M.

[PeanutButter]

Wow. Everyone has such bizarre accusations based on the most random "evidence". I'm sorry this has happened to so many people. It really throws you off sometimes. I think I need to practice the "not discussing this" and "i don't agree" to help stop being a part of the triangulation with sis and M.

"What a strange thing to say Mother" in response to her ASSumption that you were crabby about work not going well or respond with "hummhh" instead of asking her where she heard that it wasnt going well and just keep repeating that to whatever she sprouts off with "humh"    acting bored to tears about what she is saying or
remain completely confused and react like 'huh"   "nah"     "yeh? Sure."   
I agree that she was projecting. Good job for recognising the manipulative intentions. She imo was baiting , gaslighting, and definately triangulating  as you suspected.
IME you are a mirror to both your M and S. Who you are shames them.

[athene1399]

Good advice, PB. I'm good with others who employ these tactics, but usually get sucked in with M and sis. I need to work on the one worded answers.